Manny Pacquiao Is Unbelievable.

Manny Pacquiao proves his worth against Joshua Clottey - ESPN

Pacquiao proves worth against Clottey


It was the third-largest indoor attendance in U.S. boxing history, beaten only by the 63,350 who attended the 1979 heavyweight title rematch between Ali and Leon Spinks at the New Orleans Superdome and the 59,995 who attended the 1993 welterweight championship fight between Pernell Whitaker and Julio Cesar Chavez at at the Alamodome in San Antonio.

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Originally Posted by Pavlik

Regardless of what naysayers would think about PAC. PAC was able to manage to be involved in a fight which is regarded as the 3rd most attended fight in the US for the past 50 yrs. I'd say most of these people are PACFANS:)

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I'd say it's about time Filipinos supported their fighters in the US. For years, fighters like Luisito Espinoza, Gerry Penalosa, Jose Salud couldn't get the attention of their fellow kababayans to go see them fight. Promoters wondered where were the Filipino fans ?

Then there were the fighters who came over from Pinoyland who were thrown to the wolves and mismatched against bigger and more experienced fighters, mostly Mexican, and were never heard from again. Some were flown in from the Philippines the day before a fight !

After years of angst and frustration for Filipino boxing fans, Manny finally brought them out, even though it looked like he might be yet another piece of meat until he was able to get new management and be given a chance that no other Filipino boxer ever seemed to get in the USA.

Pacmania is ok, if one understands the history, but the enthusiasm needs to channeled to the new group of fighters with support from their fans to insure that they aren't victimized by the promoters and managers who sell them out for a cheap buck.

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Originally Posted by djcione

Off the top of my head I can think of at least 10 fighters, in divisions Pac has fought, that were MUCH better: I have limited this list to just fighters I have seen live or on tape which eliminates older all time greats such as Leonard, Greb, Gans, Walker, Ross, Attell,etc. and any fighter middleweight or above. There are also others like Arguello, Whitaker, Chavez, Ortiz who I feel were better, but don't rank as high as these 10.

Sugar Ray Robinson
Aaron Pryor
Sugar Ray Leonard
Thomas Hearns
Roberto Duran
Joe Brown
Sandy Saddler
Willie Pep
Henry Armstrong
Eder Jofre



Let's not forget that all of those who say that Floyd has ducked some tough fighters, Manny has ducked a few also like:Shane, Cassamayor, Campbell and Guzman.

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I would favour Pacquiao to have beaten Pryor and he is a greater fighter no doubt.

However, any judgements on Pacquaio's career should be delayed till his career is over. He's doing amazing things right now, but an assessment needs to be made only after his career is definitively over.

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Originally Posted by TheBranMan

Unbelievable. I see the same old yells of 'PACMAN'S' greatness are still audible around here.

With a mediocre recent showing and questionable methods, I'd wait before pinning him as an ATG. the only thing that Aaron Pryor and Pacquiao's careers have in common at this point in time is the amount of scrutiny they've recieved over the possibility of utilizing illegal substances.

That being said though, I highly doubt Pryor would've declined a fight with Arguello over a couple blood-tests aimed at fair-play... then go into his next fight and throw more punches than some pressure-fighters... landing at a minuscule percentage (while spin-doctors/commentators billow on about how 'great' he is).

I realize I'll get flamed for this so while I'm at it I'll also mention that I give him no credit for the Cotto win either. I believe a win over Cotto two years earlier and 2lbs heavier, with his old team, prior to the Margarito fight would've been impressive. The recent showing was just a ploy to squeeze the last of the juice from Cotto's following. God, for Cotto's sake I hope Pac isn't a juicer. Margacheato (...most probably...) cheated the guy into early retirement, Pac stomped out what was left. Big whoop.

Go ahead and say I'll never appreciate Pac's "greatness". The fact is, he doesn't even have to beat Mayweather for me to call him great; he just has to be honest. If he would've just agreed to the tests in December/January, we'd know he's not a sham... I don't know that I'd be his biggest fan (biggest Pactard?), but I would definitely be a supporter - although regardless, I'd bite my tongue before EVER mentioning his name in the same breath as Robinson or Ali (most definitely not under current circumstances).

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Are you serious about what you just posted...Seriously mate look it over a few times and think about it....You say yourself you are not a lover of Pacquiao (And last time I checked you need not be a fan of a fighter to give proper due) so anything he does do well you are not giving him credit for....

You can't give credit for the Cotto win why?...Because Cotto lost to Margarito?...Some how long before him and Manny fought?......Funny thing is people swore Cotto would break Manny down....BUT I guess that is different because the old..... "well we found out how far he was really gone in that fight"...phrase can be issued....WHAT CURRENT CIRCUMSTANCES?....He told Floyd to F*** himself for not taking the blood test?...I mean seriously now....There have been ZERO test before or after a fight to show Manny has been on even asprin......PBF is the ONLY one to ever make these assumptions......

I mean that take an out of the world outrageous scenario of something that could be seen on a show like Jersey Shore..

Your/Anyones womans ex boyfriend from 3 years ago and pops up saying you have a small wanker so that is why he came around to give your woman the love she needs...To prove him wrong you gonna pull out your wanker?....OR can you care less because you know she is with you and loves you and is not going to cheat on you etc especially for this clown....BUT just to prove to him and those around him you pull it out...Regardless of the fact there is nothing to prove because the woman is where she wants to be and there is no chance of her leaving for a jerk....I don't think it would happen...(I hope not anyhow)

Well then why should Manny give Blood to a guy who walked away from the sport only to come back for a chance to make a big buck for himself real quick?...You think Floyd came back because he felt the sport really needed him? OR could the money trouble be a little more realistic?......I know if I was the hottest fighter in the world and could have any fight I wanted I will be DAMNED!!!!!...If I will just succumb to what some guy who USED to be number one wants...He needs me I don't need him.....You ever walk into a McDonalds and see the assistant manager telling the manager how to cook fries?.Then why should the #1 fighter in the world do what someone else tells him?

Anyone think MAYBE Floyd has seen what happened to DLH, Hatton, Cotto etc and said to himself....."This Mother F***** is walking through these dudes that I could not....Before I fight him I need to make sure this dude is for real".....I promise it is not for the good of the sport because Floyd never hade any worries about a CLEAN sport before....Wasn't worried if Marquez was CLEAN was he?......Had to request Shane be tested or he would look like a fool...

Thats not to say Floyd is scared ducking or any of that nonsense just that maybe he does not believe what he is seeing could be true...He has a HUGE ego and does not like to admit there could be a chance boxing has flourished and someone else has taken his throne since he willingly vacated it...Does he want proof for himself? Maybe...I mean hell every traveling salesman who stays at second rate motels would love to know the $50 hooker he gets for the night is disease free and his wife won't find out but she is not giving guarentees for his satisfaction....Floyd didn't get his either...

To say you will never give a man any credit because he refused a test
ORDERED hell not even asked but ORDERED by Floyd.....I wouldn't hail him or anyone else a cab if they ORDERED me to.......I don't care if they said they would take the cab with me and pay......

If I knew this was logical reasoning before this I would have used it long ago....That has the same reasoning as 1700 pilgrim laws...

Hans- Rebecca is a witch

Rebecca- No I am not

Hans- Prove it by letting us burn you

Rebecca- NO

Hans- See told you she was a witch...Burn her

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Originally Posted by JazMerkin

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Originally Posted by djcione

Off the top of my head I can think of at least 10 fighters, in divisions Pac has fought, that were MUCH better: I have limited this list to just fighters I have seen live or on tape which eliminates older all time greats such as Leonard, Greb, Gans, Walker, Ross, Attell,etc. and any fighter middleweight or above. There are also others like Arguello, Whitaker, Chavez, Ortiz who I feel were better, but don't rank as high as these 10.

Sugar Ray Robinson
Aaron Pryor
Sugar Ray Leonard
Thomas Hearns
Roberto Duran
Joe Brown
Sandy Saddler
Willie Pep
Henry Armstrong
Eder Jofre



Let's not forget that all of those who say that Floyd has ducked some tough fighters, Manny has ducked a few also like:Shane, Cassamayor, Campbell and Guzman.

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I would favour Pacquiao to have beaten Pryor and he is a greater fighter no doubt.

However, any judgements on Pacquaio's career should be delayed till his career is over. He's doing amazing things right now, but an assessment needs to be made only after his career is definitively over.

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Whilst in theory I agree with you Jaz to do so makes forums such as this redundant, the whole point of a forum is to stimulate discussion about our favourite subjects and whether it's correct from a long term historic perspective has no relevance.

What matters is people bantering with each other, and me knowing that my views are the right views. :)

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Originally Posted by DaxxKahn

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Originally Posted by TheBranMan

Unbelievable. I see the same old yells of 'PACMAN'S' greatness are still audible around here.

With a mediocre recent showing and questionable methods, I'd wait before pinning him as an ATG. the only thing that Aaron Pryor and Pacquiao's careers have in common at this point in time is the amount of scrutiny they've recieved over the possibility of utilizing illegal substances.

That being said though, I highly doubt Pryor would've declined a fight with Arguello over a couple blood-tests aimed at fair-play... then go into his next fight and throw more punches than some pressure-fighters... landing at a minuscule percentage (while spin-doctors/commentators billow on about how 'great' he is).

I realize I'll get flamed for this so while I'm at it I'll also mention that I give him no credit for the Cotto win either. I believe a win over Cotto two years earlier and 2lbs heavier, with his old team, prior to the Margarito fight would've been impressive. The recent showing was just a ploy to squeeze the last of the juice from Cotto's following. God, for Cotto's sake I hope Pac isn't a juicer. Margacheato (...most probably...) cheated the guy into early retirement, Pac stomped out what was left. Big whoop.

Go ahead and say I'll never appreciate Pac's "greatness". The fact is, he doesn't even have to beat Mayweather for me to call him great; he just has to be honest. If he would've just agreed to the tests in December/January, we'd know he's not a sham... I don't know that I'd be his biggest fan (biggest Pactard?), but I would definitely be a supporter - although regardless, I'd bite my tongue before EVER mentioning his name in the same breath as Robinson or Ali (most definitely not under current circumstances).

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Are you serious about what you just posted...Seriously mate look it over a few times and think about it....You say yourself you are not a lover of Pacquiao (And last time I checked you need not be a fan of a fighter to give proper due) so anything he does do well you are not giving him credit for....

You can't give credit for the Cotto win why?...Because Cotto lost to Margarito?...Some how long before him and Manny fought?......Funny thing is people swore Cotto would break Manny down....BUT I guess that is different because the old..... "well we found out how far he was really gone in that fight"...phrase can be issued....WHAT CURRENT CIRCUMSTANCES?....He told Floyd to F*** himself for not taking the blood test?...I mean seriously now....There have been ZERO test before or after a fight to show Manny has been on even asprin......PBF is the ONLY one to ever make these assumptions......

I mean that take an out of the world outrageous scenario of something that could be seen on a show like Jersey Shore..

Your/Anyones womans ex boyfriend from 3 years ago and pops up saying you have a small wanker so that is why he came around to give your woman the love she needs...To prove him wrong you gonna pull out your wanker?....OR can you care less because you know she is with you and loves you and is not going to cheat on you etc especially for this clown....BUT just to prove to him and those around him you pull it out...Regardless of the fact there is nothing to prove because the woman is where she wants to be and there is no chance of her leaving for a jerk....I don't think it would happen...(I hope not anyhow)

Well then why should Manny give Blood to a guy who walked away from the sport only to come back for a chance to make a big buck for himself real quick?...You think Floyd came back because he felt the sport really needed him? OR could the money trouble be a little more realistic?......I know if I was the hottest fighter in the world and could have any fight I wanted I will be DAMNED!!!!!...If I will just succumb to what some guy who USED to be number one wants...He needs me I don't need him.....You ever walk into a McDonalds and see the assistant manager telling the manager how to cook fries?.Then why should the #1 fighter in the world do what someone else tells him?

Anyone thing MAYBE Floyd has seen what happened to DLH, Hatton, Cotto etc and said to himself....."This Mother F***** is walking through these dudes that I could not....Before I fight him I need to make sure this dude is for real".....I promise it is not for the good of the sport because Floyd never hade any worries about a CLEAN sport before....Wasn't worried if Marquez was CLEAN was he?......Had to request Shane be tested or he would look like a fool...

To say you will never give a man any credit because he refused a test
ORDERED hell not even asked but ORDERED by Floyd.....I wouldn't hail him or anyone else a cab if they ORDERED me to.......I don't care if they said they would take the cab with me and pay......

If I knew this was logical reasoning before this I would have used it long ago....That has the same reasoning as 1700 pilgrim laws...

Hans- Rebecca is a witch

Rebecca- No I am not

Hans- Prove it by letting us burn you

Rebecca- NO

Hans- See told you she was a witch...Burn her

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Seem like a witch hunt of yore, aint it?

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Originally Posted by KananKrus

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Originally Posted by DaxxKahn

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Originally Posted by TheBranMan

Unbelievable. I see the same old yells of 'PACMAN'S' greatness are still audible around here.

With a mediocre recent showing and questionable methods, I'd wait before pinning him as an ATG. the only thing that Aaron Pryor and Pacquiao's careers have in common at this point in time is the amount of scrutiny they've recieved over the possibility of utilizing illegal substances.

That being said though, I highly doubt Pryor would've declined a fight with Arguello over a couple blood-tests aimed at fair-play... then go into his next fight and throw more punches than some pressure-fighters... landing at a minuscule percentage (while spin-doctors/commentators billow on about how 'great' he is).

I realize I'll get flamed for this so while I'm at it I'll also mention that I give him no credit for the Cotto win either. I believe a win over Cotto two years earlier and 2lbs heavier, with his old team, prior to the Margarito fight would've been impressive. The recent showing was just a ploy to squeeze the last of the juice from Cotto's following. God, for Cotto's sake I hope Pac isn't a juicer. Margacheato (...most probably...) cheated the guy into early retirement, Pac stomped out what was left. Big whoop.

Go ahead and say I'll never appreciate Pac's "greatness". The fact is, he doesn't even have to beat Mayweather for me to call him great; he just has to be honest. If he would've just agreed to the tests in December/January, we'd know he's not a sham... I don't know that I'd be his biggest fan (biggest Pactard?), but I would definitely be a supporter - although regardless, I'd bite my tongue before EVER mentioning his name in the same breath as Robinson or Ali (most definitely not under current circumstances).

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Are you serious about what you just posted...Seriously mate look it over a few times and think about it....You say yourself you are not a lover of Pacquiao (And last time I checked you need not be a fan of a fighter to give proper due) so anything he does do well you are not giving him credit for....

You can't give credit for the Cotto win why?...Because Cotto lost to Margarito?...Some how long before him and Manny fought?......Funny thing is people swore Cotto would break Manny down....BUT I guess that is different because the old..... "well we found out how far he was really gone in that fight"...phrase can be issued....WHAT CURRENT CIRCUMSTANCES?....He told Floyd to F*** himself for not taking the blood test?...I mean seriously now....There have been ZERO test before or after a fight to show Manny has been on even asprin......PBF is the ONLY one to ever make these assumptions......

I mean that take an out of the world outrageous scenario of something that could be seen on a show like Jersey Shore..

Your/Anyones womans ex boyfriend from 3 years ago and pops up saying you have a small wanker so that is why he came around to give your woman the love she needs...To prove him wrong you gonna pull out your wanker?....OR can you care less because you know she is with you and loves you and is not going to cheat on you etc especially for this clown....BUT just to prove to him and those around him you pull it out...Regardless of the fact there is nothing to prove because the woman is where she wants to be and there is no chance of her leaving for a jerk....I don't think it would happen...(I hope not anyhow)

Well then why should Manny give Blood to a guy who walked away from the sport only to come back for a chance to make a big buck for himself real quick?...You think Floyd came back because he felt the sport really needed him? OR could the money trouble be a little more realistic?......I know if I was the hottest fighter in the world and could have any fight I wanted I will be DAMNED!!!!!...If I will just succumb to what some guy who USED to be number one wants...He needs me I don't need him.....You ever walk into a McDonalds and see the assistant manager telling the manager how to cook fries?.Then why should the #1 fighter in the world do what someone else tells him?

Anyone thing MAYBE Floyd has seen what happened to DLH, Hatton, Cotto etc and said to himself....."This Mother F***** is walking through these dudes that I could not....Before I fight him I need to make sure this dude is for real".....I promise it is not for the good of the sport because Floyd never hade any worries about a CLEAN sport before....Wasn't worried if Marquez was CLEAN was he?......Had to request Shane be tested or he would look like a fool...

To say you will never give a man any credit because he refused a test
ORDERED hell not even asked but ORDERED by Floyd.....I wouldn't hail him or anyone else a cab if they ORDERED me to.......I don't care if they said they would take the cab with me and pay......

If I knew this was logical reasoning before this I would have used it long ago....That has the same reasoning as 1700 pilgrim laws...

Hans- Rebecca is a witch

Rebecca- No I am not

Hans- Prove it by letting us burn you

Rebecca- NO

Hans- See told you she was a witch...Burn her

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Seem like a witch hunt of yore, aint it?

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Pretty much....The scenario is just as stupid as the reasoning for not giving credit for something unfounded and not even shown suspicion for...

I don't think Rebecca was casting spells turning people into frogs until old Hans finally said she is a witch...

On a real note I actually watched some show on the history channel that said it was easy as that to get someone killed back then....

Your a witch

No im Not

Only witches deny being witches...Hang the bitch

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Originally Posted by DaxxKahn

Hans- Rebecca is a witch

Rebecca- No I am not

Hans- Prove it by letting us burn you

Rebecca- NO

Hans- See told you she was a witch...Burn her

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This is so apt to the Floyd/Pac is on PEDS debacle, summed up perfectly Daxx.

Saying Floyd 'ordered' him is a bit fetched. Floyd made a reasonable request under the circumstances, even altering the testing procedures to suite the diva. Both have huge egos, saying one is bigger than the other is apples and oranges.


Witch: Oh, I don't have to be burned at the stake to prove that I'm not a witch?

Public: No, you just have to take a few easy tests (same as your opponent)

Witch: OH NO! I'm allergic to tests.. I mean.. I'm scarred.. I mean... I won't be dictated to. *Flies away on broomstick (onto the list of ATGs)*

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Originally Posted by Conrad

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DaxxKahn

Hans- Rebecca is a witch

Rebecca- No I am not

Hans- Prove it by letting us burn you

Rebecca- NO

Hans- See told you she was a witch...Burn her

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This is so apt to the Floyd/Pac is on PEDS debacle, summed up perfectly Daxx.

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It's a little off. They didn't test if you were a witch by burning you, they burned you after it was a forgone conclusion.

This is a little more accurate

Officer: Have you been drinking tonight?

Driver: No..

Officer: Prove it by taking a breathalyzer.

Driver: NO!

Officer: Then I can't let you drive home.

Driver: NO!!!! I'll find an officer that doesn't care if im drunk or not! But I'm really not.

So please can anyone tell me what this A-side meth really is? This is the exact drug that Pacquiao is accused of using by some people in the boxing world. A drug that can make you invincible on the battlefield of war against .38 and .45 caliber bullets and was designed by the Filipino military. A drug so powerful that you can keep on moving forward whether on the battlefield of war or in the boxing ring.


This is the site of the New England Journal of Medicine. Use by MDs and medical students for reference and research and I cannot find this super drug. The New England Journal of Medicine: Research & Review Articles on Diseases & Clinical Practice

So if someone can point me in the right direction, I would like to read up about it.

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Originally Posted by generalbulldog

So please can anyone tell me what this A-side meth really is? This is the exact drug that Pacquiao is accused of using by some people in the boxing world. A drug that can make you invincible on the battlefield of war against .38 and .45 caliber bullets and was designed by the Filipino military. A drug so powerful that you can keep on moving forward whether on the battlefield of war or in the boxing ring.

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are you serious? you actually believed that myth? ;D

there is this cult "tadtad" or chop chop in english here in the philippines. they claim they cant be hurt by bullets, they wear amulets and stuff. they demonstrate their powers by chopping cult members with a sharp bolo knife. its kinda like laying on a bed of nails trick.

anyway what really gives them powers is faith, the amulets they wear will not work if they dont have faith in god. there was this one vid that happened about 20 yrs ago when a group of tadtad members attacked a bunch of military guys. they where shot at and showed some invincibilty against gunshots but in the end all died.

but the a side meth sr. is talking about is actually a pretty common drug. i bet terrorists and even pinoy soldiers take this when in battle.
Shabu / Methamphetamine / Use in the Philippines: Information Xchange at Stuartxchange

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Originally Posted by mnmc10

Quote:

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Originally Posted by generalbulldog

So please can anyone tell me what this A-side meth really is? This is the exact drug that Pacquiao is accused of using by some people in the boxing world. A drug that can make you invincible on the battlefield of war against .38 and .45 caliber bullets and was designed by the Filipino military. A drug so powerful that you can keep on moving forward whether on the battlefield of war or in the boxing ring.

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are you serious? you actually believed that myth? ;D

there is this cult "tadtad" or chop chop in english here in the philippines. they claim they cant be hurt by bullets, they wear amulets and stuff. they demonstrate their powers by chopping cult members with a sharp bolo knife. its kinda like laying on a bed of nails trick.

anyway what really gives them powers is faith, the amulets they wear will not work if they dont have faith in god. there was this one vid that happened about 20 yrs ago when a group of tadtad members attacked a bunch of military guys. they where shot at and showed some invincibilty against gunshots but in the end all died.

but the a side meth sr. is talking about is actually a pretty common drug. i bet terrorists and even pinoy soldiers take this when in battle.
Shabu / Methamphetamine / Use in the Philippines: Information Xchange at Stuartxchange

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I was being facetious in the post you quoted.

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Originally Posted by TheBranMan

Saying Floyd 'ordered' him is a bit fetched. Floyd made a reasonable request under the circumstances, even altering the testing procedures to suite the diva. Both have huge egos, saying one is bigger than the other is apples and oranges.


Witch: Oh, I don't have to be burned at the stake to prove that I'm not a witch?

Public: No, you just have to take a few easy tests (same as your opponent)

Witch: OH NO! I'm allergic to tests.. I mean.. I'm scarred.. I mean... I won't be dictated to. *Flies away on broomstick (onto the list of ATGs)*

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Are you seriously going to try and tell me Pacquiao's camp is as hard to deal with as Floyds? ....When have you heard of Manny's camp demanding the loins share of all the fights?...

I am going to go looking now but when I remember where the interview was i'll post it...Floyd actually thought before the DLH fight (or if he didn't think he sure the hell was saying it to stir someone up on the opposite side) that he should have the bigger purse in the beginning stating without him DLH could never bring in the money he can with ppv buys etc so he should be the bigger purse winner (think it was like 60-40 PBF favor)...

I mean against DLH??????? The fighter who at one time could pack the house thumb wrestling

Floyd is the most arrogant fighter and difficult to negotiate with since Leonard

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Originally Posted by DaxxKahn

Your/Anyones womans ex boyfriend from 3 years ago and pops up saying you have a small wanker so that is why he came around to give your woman the love she needs...To prove him wrong you gonna pull out your wanker?....OR can you care less because you know she is with you and loves you and is not going to cheat on you etc especially for this clown....BUT just to prove to him and those around him you pull it out...Regardless of the fact there is nothing to prove because the woman is where she wants to be and there is no chance of her leaving for a jerk....I don't think it would happen...(I hope not anyhow)

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HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHA

I didnt even read his post.(It should be about the testing again :p ) but this one is SIgnature worthy LOL