Re: Tszyu hints at return.
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Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
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Originally Posted by
rjj tszyu
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Originally Posted by
THE THIRD MAN
I love all the overrated opinions of a guy who fought almost 50% of all of his pro fights against World Champions. If that is overrated then how do we rate fighters at all? He won't comeback, he was done after the Hatton fight, injuries, inactivity and age had taken it's toll. People also forget he never turned pro until he was 23 with 270 amateur fights behind him. I think we only ever saw glimpses of his true brilliance in the ring. DLH, Mosley and even Mayweather had the greatest respect for him and whenever his name was mentioned as a possible opponent i reckon they were all a little wary about taking him on.
Apparently uncle Roger told Floyd to leave Tszyu alone. I actually think Floyd would have won but that in itself shows how fearsome he was.
That's odd then considering they reportedly had a deal in place to fight assuming Tszyu beat Hatton & Mayweather beat Gatti ;)
Tszyu also had a deal set up to face Oscar only to lose to Vince Phillips.
I do feel Tszyu gets overrated a bit, particularly by Aussies, but then I also quite liked him as a fighter & feel for him that he was unfortunate to miss out on the two biggest paychecks of his career.
The option was available for him to take Tszyu first but he took Gatti and hasn't looked back since.
Also he'd have never lost to Phillips again and had he fought Hatton when he was younger (like when he fought Judah younger) he would have beaten any version of Hatton.
Re: Tszyu hints at return.
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Originally Posted by
eagle
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Originally Posted by
generalbulldog
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Originally Posted by
eagle
Just a good fighter?
World Champ in 14th fight.
16 Title defenses.
A unified division.
There are better fighters with better resumes around no doubt but who is overrating him? Who? Show my all these threads where he is overrated? I havent seen any threads lately where people have said he is better than what he was. Tszyu travelled everywhere to fight as well, quite often taking on challengers on their turf. How many champs do that?
Judah was seen as a future P4P star 27-0 and was the favourite going into their fight. He also went on to be unified welter champ afterwards.
In hindsght yes he maybe should have gone to welter but he was a medium to small 140 pounder.
I said some people tend to overrate him, and I'm not the only one in this thread that feels the same way. Like I said, if Zab Judah is the biggest name on his resume then that's pretty weak.
As for as not going to welter because he's seen as medium to small, well that didn't stop
Floyd and Manny for venturing into that division now? Those 2 are small welterweights, not natural welterweights at all by the general consensus. Hell even Hatton ventured into the 147 division and he was pretty small too.
If Tszu wanted the big payday and glory, he should have went there when the likes of Quartey, De La Hoya, Mosley, Trinidad, Whitaker were there. Those were the big fights that were on the horizon for him if he had dare ventured into the 2nd most glamorous division in boxing. But then he was smart, because he for sure would have went 0-4 against those guys.
Depends on whom you're asking if they think Tszyu was great. Some do while others don't, it's all subjective for a fighter like Tszyu, because his resume was really weak. A 40 year old Chavez and a Zab Judah are his biggest wins.
Thats the point. Floyd and
Manny are better fighters than Tszyu. There is no denying that. You said he is overrated, well im asking by whom? Who overrates him? He doesnt overrate himself like 99% of fighters, he doesnt have many fanatical supporters who overrate him like some other fighters, and i dont see many media people talking him up as better than what he is. So who is he overrated by?
Actually most of the people in this recent thread said Tszyu was the better fighter than Pacquiao in terms of a mythical prime fight between the 2 and skill level and talent. http://www.saddoboxing.com/boxingfor...ac-140lbs.html The posters in this thread are long time posters here at Saddo, so it's not like it's some troll posters.
So if Kostya Tszyu not only wins an mythical battle by KO, who supposedly has more skills/talent level than Pacquiao, then why didn't he moved to Welterweight (1 division) to pursue big fights with Oscar, Whitaker, Trinidad, Quartey, Mosley?:shrug03:
A guy like Pacquiao where people say he has less talent/skill/ability than Kostya can move through the weight classes, surely a guy with that has greater skill/talent/abilities can move up 1 weight class?
But the reality is this, the 140 pound division, for most of it's existence has been terribly weak. Beating a 40 year old Chavez and Zab Judah doesn't make 1 great, okay I'll throw in Hurtado (who got ko by Whitaker who's not known for power), it might make 1 look awesome and where people come up with stuff that other elite fighters like say an Oscar, Floyd, Mosley avoids him or that he beats a prime Pacquiao easily because he's another Zab Judah.;D
If that ain't overrating a guy's abilities than I don't know what is. good fighter Kostya was, just not an ATG, too weak of an resume.
Re: Tszyu hints at return.
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Originally Posted by
generalbulldog
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Originally Posted by
eagle
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Originally Posted by
generalbulldog
I said some people tend to overrate him, and I'm not the only one in this thread that feels the same way. Like I said, if Zab Judah is the biggest name on his resume then that's pretty weak.
As for as not going to welter because he's seen as medium to small, well that didn't stop Floyd and Manny for venturing into that division now? Those 2 are small welterweights, not natural welterweights at all by the general consensus. Hell even Hatton ventured into the 147 division and he was pretty small too.
If Tszu wanted the big payday and glory, he should have went there when the likes of Quartey, De La Hoya, Mosley, Trinidad, Whitaker were there. Those were the big fights that were on the horizon for him if he had dare ventured into the 2nd most glamorous division in boxing. But then he was smart, because he for sure would have went 0-4 against those guys.
Depends on whom you're asking if they think Tszyu was great. Some do while others don't, it's all subjective for a fighter like Tszyu, because his resume was really weak. A 40 year old Chavez and a Zab Judah are his biggest wins.
Thats the point. Floyd and
Manny are better fighters than Tszyu. There is no denying that. You said he is overrated, well im asking by whom? Who overrates him? He doesnt overrate himself like 99% of fighters, he doesnt have many fanatical supporters who overrate him like some other fighters, and i dont see many media people talking him up as better than what he is. So who is he overrated by?
Actually most of the people in this recent thread said Tszyu was the better fighter than Pacquiao in terms of a mythical prime fight between the 2 and skill level and talent.
http://www.saddoboxing.com/boxingfor...ac-140lbs.html The posters in this thread are long time posters here at Saddo, so it's not like it's some troll posters.
So if Kostya Tszyu not only wins an mythical battle by KO, who supposedly has more skills/talent level than Pacquiao, then why didn't he moved to Welterweight (1 division) to pursue big fights with Oscar, Whitaker, Trinidad, Quartey, Mosley?:shrug03:
A guy like Pacquiao where people say he has less talent/skill/ability than Kostya can move through the weight classes, surely a guy with that has greater skill/talent/abilities can move up 1 weight class?
But the reality is this, the 140 pound division, for most of it's existence has been terribly weak. Beating a 40 year old Chavez and Zab Judah doesn't make 1 great, okay I'll throw in Hurtado (who got ko by Whitaker who's not known for power), it might make 1 look awesome and where people come up with stuff that other elite fighters like say an Oscar, Floyd, Mosley avoids him or that he beats a prime Pacquiao easily because he's another Zab Judah.;D
If that ain't overrating a guy's abilities than I don't know what is. good fighter Kostya was, just not an ATG, too weak of an resume.
How can he not be an all time great when he ruled a division for 10 yrs? He beat everyone who was there to beat. I think you will find alot of people have picked tszyu to beat pac in his prime coz Tszyu had unbelievable timing and was a boxers worst nightmare especially if you were a southpaw(tszyu was also very good against southpaws). Tszyu didnt do well against smotherers which Pac isnt, he stays at a distance and throws which in his prime was Tszyus ideal opponent as he could time them and connect with his right hand from the outside as most of the power was at a distance and not in close. Tszyu was looking at fighting at welterweight before the Hatton fight and just after the Mitchell fight. He was rumoured to fight Cory Spinks for the Undisputed Welterweight title but then signed to fight Hatton and then Judah beat Spinks.
Re: Tszyu hints at return.
tszyu was one of the top 10 fighters of his generation. no doubt. but talk of him coming back is farcical. he would get pasted by any top fighter. hatton pasted him for crying out loud...
Re: Tszyu hints at return.
If the comeback is just a last hurrah against another aging champion, or C grade fighter to make a little dough and go out on a win its ok. But any attmpt at a serious comeback should be nipped in the bud early....
I can see Mundine calling him out haha....
Re: Tszyu hints at return.
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Originally Posted by
Snakey
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Originally Posted by
generalbulldog
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Originally Posted by
eagle
Thats the point. Floyd and Manny are better fighters than Tszyu. There is no denying that. You said he is overrated, well im asking by whom? Who overrates him? He doesnt overrate himself like 99% of fighters, he doesnt have many fanatical supporters who overrate him like some other fighters, and i dont see many media people talking him up as better than what he is. So who is he overrated by?
Actually most of the people in this recent thread said Tszyu was the better fighter than Pacquiao in terms of a mythical prime fight between the 2 and skill level and talent.
http://www.saddoboxing.com/boxingfor...ac-140lbs.html The posters in this thread are long time posters here at Saddo, so it's not like it's some troll posters.
So if Kostya Tszyu not only wins an mythical battle by KO, who supposedly has more skills/talent level than Pacquiao, then why didn't he moved to Welterweight (1 division) to pursue big fights with Oscar, Whitaker, Trinidad, Quartey, Mosley?:shrug03:
A guy like Pacquiao where people say he has less talent/skill/ability than Kostya can move through the weight classes, surely a guy with that has greater skill/talent/abilities can move up 1 weight class?
But the reality is this, the 140 pound division, for most of it's existence has been terribly weak. Beating a 40 year old Chavez and Zab Judah doesn't make 1 great, okay I'll throw in Hurtado (who got ko by Whitaker who's not known for power), it might make 1 look awesome and where people come up with stuff that other elite fighters like say an Oscar, Floyd, Mosley avoids him or that he beats a prime Pacquiao easily because he's another Zab Judah.;D
If that ain't overrating a guy's abilities than I don't know what is. good fighter Kostya was, just not an ATG, too weak of an resume.
How can he not be an all time great when he ruled a division for 10 yrs? He beat everyone who was there to beat. I think you will find alot of people have picked tszyu to beat pac in his prime coz Tszyu had unbelievable timing and was a boxers worst nightmare especially if you were a southpaw(tszyu was also very good against southpaws). Tszyu didnt do well against smotherers which Pac isnt, he stays at a distance and throws which in his prime was Tszyus ideal opponent as he could time them and connect with his right hand from the outside as most of the power was at a distance and not in close. Tszyu was looking at fighting at welterweight before the Hatton fight and just after the Mitchell fight. He was rumoured to fight Cory Spinks for the Undisputed Welterweight title but then signed to fight Hatton and then Judah beat Spinks.
When did he rule a division for 10 years? He ruled the majority of it due to weak opponents but was interrupted when Phillips ko him. Is Wonjongkam an all time great? He ruled the flyweight division for many years? But no one seems to think so. For the lower weight classes it's all about who you fought. He dropped the ball in not challenging De La Hoya, Quartey, Trinidad, Mosley, Whitaker, whom were all at 147.
And him beating Pacquiao because he's good against fast southpaws, with that kind of logic might as well say he beats a prime Pernell Whitaker because he's another fast southpaw.
Any ways I brought up that thread because the people there said Tszyu was the better fighter in talent and skills than Pacquiao, then how come he can't even move up in 1 weigth division to challenge a bunch of hall of fame fighters at welterweight? We all know the answer to that.The funny thing was people have been saying for years that Oscar, Floyd, Mosley and whatever great fighter that just passed through 140 was scared of him. Come on, he had preliminary deals in place to fight them but ended up being ko by Phillips and Hatton.
Re: Tszyu hints at return.
I think Tszyu's biggest downfall was; he will fight the opponents fight because he wants to pass the test of the warrior first.
(Mayweather for instance, is the reverse) and good luck to him,smart fighter.
Kostya had some brilliant skills , controlled angles and pure boxing / countering that could of out pointed or wore down most fighters; he let alot of what he knew slide to be a well timed in your face exciting banger and a Pro Crowd pleaser.
Thats why some people think he is overrated and they are right.
Re: Tszyu hints at return.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
generalbulldog
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Snakey
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Originally Posted by
generalbulldog
Actually most of the people in this recent thread said Tszyu was the better fighter than Pacquiao in terms of a mythical prime fight between the 2 and skill level and talent.
http://www.saddoboxing.com/boxingfor...ac-140lbs.html The posters in this thread are long time posters here at Saddo, so it's not like it's some troll posters.
So if Kostya Tszyu not only wins an mythical battle by KO, who supposedly has more skills/talent level than Pacquiao, then why didn't he moved to Welterweight (1 division) to pursue big fights with Oscar, Whitaker, Trinidad, Quartey, Mosley?:shrug03:
A guy like Pacquiao where people say he has less talent/skill/ability than Kostya can move through the weight classes, surely a guy with that has greater skill/talent/abilities can move up 1 weight class?
But the reality is this, the 140 pound division, for most of it's existence has been terribly weak. Beating a 40 year old Chavez and Zab Judah doesn't make 1 great, okay I'll throw in Hurtado (who got ko by Whitaker who's not known for power), it might make 1 look awesome and where people come up with stuff that other elite fighters like say an Oscar, Floyd, Mosley avoids him or that he beats a prime Pacquiao easily because he's another Zab Judah.;D
If that ain't overrating a guy's abilities than I don't know what is. good fighter Kostya was, just not an ATG, too weak of an resume.
How can he not be an all time great when he ruled a division for 10 yrs? He beat everyone who was there to beat. I think you will find alot of people have picked tszyu to beat pac in his prime coz Tszyu had unbelievable timing and was a boxers worst nightmare especially if you were a southpaw(tszyu was also very good against southpaws). Tszyu didnt do well against smotherers which Pac isnt, he stays at a distance and throws which in his prime was Tszyus ideal opponent as he could time them and connect with his right hand from the outside as most of the power was at a distance and not in close. Tszyu was looking at fighting at welterweight before the Hatton fight and just after the Mitchell fight. He was rumoured to fight Cory Spinks for the Undisputed Welterweight title but then signed to fight Hatton and then Judah beat Spinks.
When did he rule a division for 10 years? He ruled the majority of it due to weak opponents but was interrupted when Phillips ko him. Is Wonjongkam an all time great? He ruled the flyweight division for many years? But no one seems to think so. For the lower weight classes it's all about who you fought. He dropped the ball in not challenging De La Hoya, Quartey, Trinidad, Mosley, Whitaker, whom were all at 147.
And him beating Pacquiao because he's good against fast southpaws, with that kind of logic might as well say he beats a prime Pernell Whitaker because he's another fast southpaw.
Any ways I brought up that thread because the people there said Tszyu was the better fighter in talent and skills than Pacquiao, then how come he can't even move up in 1 weigth division to challenge a bunch of hall of fame fighters at welterweight? We all know the answer to that.The funny thing was people have been saying for years that Oscar, Floyd, Mosley and whatever great fighter that just passed through 140 was scared of him. Come on, he had preliminary deals in place to fight them but ended up being ko by Phillips and Hatton.
I think Tszyu when younger was a better pure boxer than Pac has shown. once apon a time.
But the way Kostya chose to fight once a pro I think Pac would of given him fits unless he got caught and at 140 I think he may well of got caught.
Kt was trained the Russian way,tough old school.slightly dangerous routine of no water. He could dehydrate incredibly to get to the lowest weight possible and is able to rehydrate again to way above fight weight on the day its a large part of why he was king of 140 for so long and chose to remain there and force others to come to him. Quite the balancing act considering he used to walk around at about 170.
