Re: One-Hit Wonders in Boxing History
Quote:
Originally Posted by
marbleheadmaui
Quote:
Originally Posted by
THE THIRD MAN
Rocky Graziano ( a great warrior, he won the 2nd fight of 3 great battles with Zale but never successfully defended his title, being KO'd in 3 in the 3rd and deciding fight, somebody up there certainly did like him)
Ingemar Johannson (The hammer of Thor hit Patterson with thunder and lightning and that was it, he was a good fighter and might have given Ali trouble, but it was all too brief.)
Tom The Bomb Bethea (KO's Middleweight champ Nino Benvenuti in a non title match up who was 80-3-1 at the time, then promptly gets KO'd just 2 months later in a shot at the title)
Billy Backus (beat the great Jose Napoles on cuts then was easily disposed of in the rematch)
Leon Spinks (A lethargic Ali let Spinks win this one, no other explanation, see Holmes destroy Spinks and you see the class difference)
Buster Douglas (It's probably the number one of the lot)
Nice list. The only one I'd quibble with is Graziano. He drilled a series of good fighters in Freddie Cochrane twice, Billy Arnold, Bummy Davis, Marty Servo and Charlie Fusari. My gripe with Graziano is he was a middle whacking out welters in many cases.
I agonised over Graziano, he is a favourite and IMO had what is known as the boxing spirit in him, but he did only win the one fight at the elite level, (granted the man of steel Tony Zale was a great Middleweight champion), his one match up with SRR saw him KO'd in 3. The thread does say One hit wonders and if not for that win against Zale Graziano's career and legacy takes a complete u turn and no one would remember him.
I'm glad we all do.
Re: One-Hit Wonders in Boxing History
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Liston is the worst suggestion on this list (apart from what I hope were jokes about Duran & Pacquiao). He fought just 2 opponents with sub .500 records his whole career & was beating up on experienced guys from his 6th fight. Avenged his first loss, which he fought with a broken jaw. Apart from Patterson, he beat some really credible guys in Summerlin, Cleveland Williams, Folley & Machen. He's much more than a 1 hit wonder, he just happened to get defined by his losses to probably the greatest HW of all time.
I'm gonna stick with Liston being a 1 hit wonder, like I said earlier in this thread, he won the HW title from Floyd Patterson, defended it against Patterson 10 months later, then lost the HW title to Ali 6 months later. His main claim to fame at the Championship level was his two 1st round destruction's of Patterson which made everyone believe he was fuckin' superman.
Was Liston a feared above average HW, and did he have a few nice wins besides Patterson? Sure, but what he was actually able to accomplish in ring wasn't really all that special, especially in title fights. Remember, Ali was far from being a "legend" when he fought Liston, he was a 22 year old kid with 19 pro fights and was something like a 7 -1 underdog before their first fight.
Re: One-Hit Wonders in Boxing History
Liston is a good example. How about INgemaar Johanssen.
Re: One-Hit Wonders in Boxing History
Quote:
Originally Posted by
brocktonblockbust
Liston is a good example. How about INgemaar Johanssen.
Ingemar Johansson, was pretty much a one hit wonder in the sense that like Liston, he beat 1 man for the HW crown, then never owned a title again. The Swede did have some serious power in that right hand (he called Thor) and he did own a 5th round KO over Henry Cooper in 1957, and a 1st round KO over Eddie Machen in 1958. This was before he fought Patterson the 1st time in 1959, and long before Ali fought both these guys.
"Thor" in action. Ingemar Johansson - Tribute Video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GxWE2EFMwY
Re: One-Hit Wonders in Boxing History
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mars_ax
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Liston is the worst suggestion on this list (apart from what I hope were jokes about Duran & Pacquiao). He fought just 2 opponents with sub .500 records his whole career & was beating up on experienced guys from his 6th fight. Avenged his first loss, which he fought with a broken jaw. Apart from Patterson, he beat some really credible guys in Summerlin, Cleveland Williams, Folley & Machen. He's much more than a 1 hit wonder, he just happened to get defined by his losses to probably the greatest HW of all time.
I'm gonna stick with Liston being a 1 hit wonder, like I said earlier in this thread, he won the HW title from Floyd Patterson, defended it against Patterson 10 months later, then lost the HW title to Ali 6 months later. His main claim to fame at the
Championship level was his two 1st round destruction's of Patterson which made everyone believe he was fuckin' superman.
Was Liston a feared above average HW, and did he have a few nice wins besides Patterson? Sure, but what he was
actually able to accomplish in ring wasn't really all that special, especially in title fights. Remember, Ali was far from being a "legend" when he fought Liston, he was a 22 year old kid with 19 pro fights and was something like a 7 -1 underdog before their first fight.
Well, if he won twice, surely he would be a two hit wonder ;D
You've also got to remember that he beat the shit out guys like Folley & Machen who the Champ really wanted no piece of. It's like saying that Charley Burley wasn't great because he never fought at Championship level. Beating everyone available is all that a guy can do. He lost to Ali, but he was somewhere between 34 & 39 by that point. I see him as the Tyson of his day. Just with a much worse publicist.
Re: One-Hit Wonders in Boxing History
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mars_ax
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Liston is the worst suggestion on this list (apart from what I hope were jokes about Duran & Pacquiao). He fought just 2 opponents with sub .500 records his whole career & was beating up on experienced guys from his 6th fight. Avenged his first loss, which he fought with a broken jaw. Apart from Patterson, he beat some really credible guys in Summerlin, Cleveland Williams, Folley & Machen. He's much more than a 1 hit wonder, he just happened to get defined by his losses to probably the greatest HW of all time.
I'm gonna stick with Liston being a 1 hit wonder, like I said earlier in this thread, he won the HW title from Floyd Patterson, defended it against Patterson 10 months later, then lost the HW title to Ali 6 months later. His main claim to fame at the
Championship level was his two 1st round destruction's of Patterson which made everyone believe he was fuckin' superman.
Was Liston a feared above average HW, and did he have a few nice wins besides Patterson? Sure, but what he was
actually able to accomplish in ring wasn't really all that special, especially in title fights. Remember, Ali was far from being a "legend" when he fought Liston, he was a 22 year old kid with 19 pro fights and was something like a 7 -1 underdog before their first fight.
Well, if he won twice, surely he would be a two hit wonder ;D
You've also got to remember that he beat the shit out guys like Folley & Machen who the Champ really wanted no piece of. It's like saying that Charley Burley wasn't great because he never fought at Championship level. Beating everyone available is all that a guy can do. He lost to Ali, but he was somewhere between 34 & 39 by that point. I see him as the
Tyson of his day. Just with a much worse publicist.
Hey, it's all good, this topic is subjective, I just believe that Liston was a very good but over-hyped/overrated HW, and much of his fearsome reputation was based mainly on his 2 demolitions of Patterson, who was a blown up crusierweight with bad chin.
As for the comparison to Tyson, perhaps Liston needed a better promoter/publicist, but I don't see it, Mike faced and defeated much better competition, and accomplished much more. Mikes reign of terror lasted for the better part of 10 years, Liston's began with Patterson and ended with Ali 2 years later.
Re: One-Hit Wonders in Boxing History
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mars_ax
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mars_ax
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Liston is the worst suggestion on this list (apart from what I hope were jokes about Duran & Pacquiao). He fought just 2 opponents with sub .500 records his whole career & was beating up on experienced guys from his 6th fight. Avenged his first loss, which he fought with a broken jaw. Apart from Patterson, he beat some really credible guys in Summerlin, Cleveland Williams, Folley & Machen. He's much more than a 1 hit wonder, he just happened to get defined by his losses to probably the greatest HW of all time.
I'm gonna stick with Liston being a 1 hit wonder, like I said earlier in this thread, he won the HW title from Floyd Patterson, defended it against Patterson 10 months later, then lost the HW title to Ali 6 months later. His main claim to fame at the
Championship level was his two 1st round destruction's of Patterson which made everyone believe he was fuckin' superman.
Was Liston a feared above average HW, and did he have a few nice wins besides Patterson? Sure, but what he was
actually able to accomplish in ring wasn't really all that special, especially in title fights. Remember, Ali was far from being a "legend" when he fought Liston, he was a 22 year old kid with 19 pro fights and was something like a 7 -1 underdog before their first fight.
Well, if he won twice, surely he would be a two hit wonder ;D
You've also got to remember that he beat the shit out guys like Folley & Machen who the Champ really wanted no piece of. It's like saying that Charley Burley wasn't great because he never fought at Championship level. Beating everyone available is all that a guy can do. He lost to Ali, but he was somewhere between 34 & 39 by that point. I see him as the
Tyson of his day. Just with a much worse publicist.
Hey, it's all good, this topic is subjective, I just believe that Liston was a very good but over-hyped/overrated HW, and much of his fearsome reputation was based mainly on his 2 demolitions of Patterson, who was a blown up crusierweight with bad chin.
As for the comparison to Tyson, perhaps Liston needed a better promoter/publicist, but I don't see it, Mike faced and defeated much better competition, and accomplished much more. Mikes reign of terror lasted for the better part of 10 years, Liston's began with Patterson and ended with Ali 2 years later.
Wait does this mean we're not accepting as gospel that Tyson suddenly grew old overnight just before the Douglas fight?
I think Liston was the Tyson of his day, but I do rate Tyson above him. That said, he has going for him a few things Tyson did not. He beat really tough guys on his way to the title shot & once there he beat a great prime HW. You also have to remember how old Liston was. Officially (according to boxrec) he was 32 when he faced Ali, but most believe that he was at least 3 or 4 years older than that. Bearing in mind his style & that it took him 9 years of fighting tough motherfuckers to get a title shot, he had far less ability to have longevity than even Tyson did.
Anyway we should stop before this becomes a Tyson thread. My feeling he is not a 1 hit wonder, at worst he is a 2 hit.
Kirkland Laing is best example of a 1 hit wonder I've seen. One great fight & then disappeared.
Re: One-Hit Wonders in Boxing History
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mars_ax
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Mars_ax
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Liston is the worst suggestion on this list (apart from what I hope were jokes about Duran & Pacquiao). He fought just 2 opponents with sub .500 records his whole career & was beating up on experienced guys from his 6th fight. Avenged his first loss, which he fought with a broken jaw. Apart from Patterson, he beat some really credible guys in Summerlin, Cleveland Williams, Folley & Machen. He's much more than a 1 hit wonder, he just happened to get defined by his losses to probably the greatest HW of all time.
I'm gonna stick with Liston being a 1 hit wonder, like I said earlier in this thread, he won the HW title from Floyd Patterson, defended it against Patterson 10 months later, then lost the HW title to Ali 6 months later. His main claim to fame at the
Championship level was his two 1st round destruction's of Patterson which made everyone believe he was fuckin' superman.
Was Liston a feared above average HW, and did he have a few nice wins besides Patterson? Sure, but what he was
actually able to accomplish in ring wasn't really all that special, especially in title fights. Remember, Ali was far from being a "legend" when he fought Liston, he was a 22 year old kid with 19 pro fights and was something like a 7 -1 underdog before their first fight.
Well, if he won twice, surely he would be a two hit wonder ;D
You've also got to remember that he beat the shit out guys like Folley & Machen who the Champ really wanted no piece of. It's like saying that Charley Burley wasn't great because he never fought at Championship level. Beating everyone available is all that a guy can do. He lost to Ali, but he was somewhere between 34 & 39 by that point. I see him as the
Tyson of his day. Just with a much worse publicist.
Hey, it's all good, this topic is subjective, I just believe that Liston was a very good but over-hyped/overrated HW, and much of his fearsome reputation was based mainly on his 2 demolitions of Patterson, who was a blown up crusierweight with bad chin.
As for the comparison to Tyson, perhaps Liston needed a better promoter/publicist, but I don't see it, Mike faced and defeated much better competition, and accomplished much more. Mikes reign of terror lasted for the better part of 10 years, Liston's began with Patterson and ended with Ali 2 years later.
Man I dunno about that. Sonny was the #1 ranked challenger for three years or so before he got his title crack. Prior to beating Patterson he took out a whole series of ranked guys like Bethea and DeJohn and Nino Valdes and Eddie Machen and Harris and Zora Folley.
Re: One-Hit Wonders in Boxing History
Oh yes, Earnie Shavers didn't just have some strong beard, he had some one-punch-power too.
Re: One-Hit Wonders in Boxing History
How about Tomas Molinares , cold coked Marlon Starling after the bell then , did nothing ?
Re: One-Hit Wonders in Boxing History
Quote:
Originally Posted by
marbleheadmaui
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jonesjrmayweather
buster douglass. Zahir raheem.
And jut to get a rise out of cutmemick
duran....
not just our of mick. [banging head on desk]
i realize i am being played but i can't help myself!
Ken buchanan
esteban dejesus (twice)
ray lampkin
carlos palomino
ray leonard
pipino cuevas
davey moore
iran barkley
[back to banging my head on desk] i hope my concussion pleases you!
lol
Re: One-Hit Wonders in Boxing History
One of my favourites: Max Baer. Maxie KO'd Primo Carnera and in his first title defence 364 days later lost the decision to Jim Braddock. He may have been a "one hit wonder", but he was also a great fighter.
Re: One-Hit Wonders in Boxing History
Baer landed some decent shots on a 21-yr old Brown Bomber as well, with good speed behind them.
Re: One-Hit Wonders in Boxing History
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dave Hughey
One of my favourites: Max Baer. Maxie KO'd Primo Carnera and in his first title defence 364 days later lost the decision to Jim Braddock. He may have been a "one hit wonder", but he was also a great fighter.
Don't forget Max also destroyed Max Schmeling in 1932 or 1933.
Re: One-Hit Wonders in Boxing History
OK wait...
See for me one-hit wonders are boxers who had 1 big win and then never followed it up with another big win or won a title.
I'm not expecting Turpin to beat someone better then SRR.
But certainly beating a "champion" would merit for me, not falling into this list.
I just don't consider the opponents they beat after good enough not to have them as one hit wonders.
Frankie Randall defended a title several times.
No where near the caliber of JCC but he was a champion and defended it.
That to me does not say one hit wonder.
I'd like to add Nino Valdes.
