Re: Wlad to fight again in Novermber or December
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Without Haye's shit-talk Wlad would've never made his huge career high payday.
The worst thing possible for the Klits was the Haye-Chisora press conference fight. Haye-Vitali, Chisora-Wlad were by far their highest profile bouts.
Now Wlad will be praying Chisora beats Haye.
So you're agreeing with me that Haye didn't deserve the hype by saying "Haye's shit talk" made the fight big. Quick question, did Holyfield shit talk Tyson? Was the fight still big?....just saying.
Why would Wlad hope Chisora beats Haye? It doesn't matter to Wlad he'd easily beat them both no matter who he chose to fight IF he actually chose to fight either of them. Haye certainly has done nothing to warrant another shot, Chisora hasn't done much either other than act like he belongs in a damn zoo.
Memphis, you know what gets old? People hating on The Klitschko's, that gets old. But you go right ahead and watch the Chav and the retard fight (what title is on the line again?) and make them millionaires for being fucking wankers.
Can I ask one question Lyle my old mate? I'm not disagreeiing with anything you're saying BUT, do you think Haye will lose to Chisora? I genuinely want to know!
As a fellow fan of the HW's, I do value your opinion on this matter. I'm expecting an early KO from Haye with him moving, making Chisora miss clumsily and then making him pay. If not very early (1st or 2nd) then latest 8th or 9th!
I know you hate Haye and I 100% understand why but I also hope you can look past that and give an honest opinion on the matter.
Re: Wlad to fight again in Novermber or December
Quote:
Originally Posted by
rjj tszyu
Can I ask one question Lyle my old mate? I'm not disagreeiing with anything you're saying BUT, do you think Haye will lose to Chisora? I genuinely want to know!
As a fellow fan of the HW's, I do value your opinion on this matter. I'm expecting an early KO from Haye with him moving, making Chisora miss clumsily and then making him pay. If not very early (1st or 2nd) then latest 8th or 9th!
I know you hate Haye and I 100% understand why but I also hope you can look past that and give an honest opinion on the matter.
Certainly, I will be glad to answer this question in detail. In my UNBIASED opinion Haye has the athletic ability and 1 punch power to make life difficult for anyone. Dereck Chisora is a hard nut to crack (pun intended). Chisora seems to have mental issues, whether he's autistic as his trainer says, or mildly retarded, or bipolar or whatever the case is Chisora is just a little "off". All that being said I think based on recent fights and IF Chisora shows up in shape, then Chisora is liable to win a decision due to his effort and higher output of punches as David Haye fights a negative fight throwing under 20 punches a round. I figure if Helenius & Vitali can't hurt Chisora then David Haye will have a hard time as well. Haye does has a different kind of power, a quicker, less heavy kind of power that would be more along the lines of a Ferrari than a Mack Truck (to use a Teddy Atlas analogy) and maybe Chisora doesn't take that as good as the more deliberate shots. If David Haye is to win and look good doing it he needs to pump the jab, make Chisora work his way in, make Chisora pay for real estate, circle out and repeat. Haye will need to tire Chisora out and lure him in to a check hook or an uppercut (or both) in order to hurt and perhaps stop Dereck. To win the fight Chisora just needs to get into Haye's chest, make Haye run, do work to the body to slow him down, and muscle up on him to make things uncomfortable in there because David Haye will look for a way out when put under constant pressure.
I see this going the distance and Haye getting a very close controversial decision, perhaps having survived a knockdown or two.
I wonder if there are any longshots to challenge Wlad, Liakhovich, Maskaev, Valuev, Golota, Ruiz? Anyone Willing and able to come out of retirement to fight him and allow the youngsters to get prepared.
Re: Wlad to fight again in Novermber or December
At this rate it will be Haye v Wlad 2 because no one is ready.
Re: Wlad to fight again in Novermber or December
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
Without Haye's shit-talk Wlad would've never made his huge career high payday.
The worst thing possible for the Klits was the Haye-Chisora press conference fight. Haye-Vitali, Chisora-Wlad were by far their highest profile bouts.
Now Wlad will be praying Chisora beats Haye.
So you're agreeing with me that Haye didn't deserve the hype by saying "Haye's shit talk" made the fight big. Quick question, did Holyfield shit talk Tyson? Was the fight still big?....just saying.
Why would Wlad hope Chisora beats Haye? It doesn't matter to Wlad he'd easily beat them both no matter who he chose to fight IF he actually chose to fight either of them. Haye certainly has done nothing to warrant another shot, Chisora hasn't done much either other than act like he belongs in a damn zoo.
Memphis, you know what gets old? People hating on The Klitschko's, that gets old. But you go right ahead and watch the Chav and the retard fight (what title is on the line again?) and make them millionaires for being fucking wankers.
1. I'm saying Haye's "shit-talk" produced Wlad his most lucrative and high profile ever contest. Do you think Wlad was NOT happy about making $21 million due to his opponents brilliant promotion?
2. Tyson was a money making global phenomenon. Every corner of the world purchased a piece of him. Wlad is a nobody outside Germany/Eastern Europe so is helped by controversial characters.
3. Wlad hopes Chisora beats Haye because the fight is already sold to the public with Chisora's antics and performance against Vitali.
You need to get this into perspective - Wlad-Haye got 16.5 million viewers on German TV. Wlad-Thompson got 6 million. If you think Wlad is unhappy about these "badboy" characters boosting the interest in his fights you are mad.
Re: Wlad to fight again in Novermber or December
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
rjj tszyu
Can I ask one question Lyle my old mate? I'm not disagreeiing with anything you're saying BUT, do you think Haye will lose to Chisora? I genuinely want to know!
As a fellow fan of the HW's, I do value your opinion on this matter. I'm expecting an early KO from Haye with him moving, making Chisora miss clumsily and then making him pay. If not very early (1st or 2nd) then latest 8th or 9th!
I know you hate Haye and I 100% understand why but I also hope you can look past that and give an honest opinion on the matter.
Certainly, I will be glad to answer this question in detail. In my
UNBIASED opinion Haye has the athletic ability and 1 punch power to make life difficult for anyone. Dereck Chisora is a hard nut to crack (pun intended). Chisora seems to have mental issues, whether he's autistic as his trainer says, or mildly retarded, or bipolar or whatever the case is Chisora is just a little "off". All that being said I think based on recent fights and IF Chisora shows up in shape, then Chisora is liable to win a decision due to his effort and higher output of punches as David Haye fights a negative fight throwing under 20 punches a round. I figure if Helenius & Vitali can't hurt Chisora then David Haye will have a hard time as well. Haye does has a different kind of power, a quicker, less heavy kind of power that would be more along the lines of a Ferrari than a Mack Truck (to use a Teddy Atlas analogy) and maybe Chisora doesn't take that as good as the more deliberate shots. If David Haye is to win and look good doing it he needs to pump the jab, make Chisora work his way in, make Chisora pay for real estate, circle out and repeat. Haye will need to tire Chisora out and lure him in to a check hook or an uppercut (or both) in order to hurt and perhaps stop Dereck. To win the fight Chisora just needs to get into Haye's chest, make Haye run, do work to the body to slow him down, and muscle up on him to make things uncomfortable in there because David Haye will look for a way out when put under constant pressure.
I see this going the distance and Haye getting a very close controversial decision, perhaps having survived a knockdown or two.
I wonder if there are any longshots to challenge Wlad, Liakhovich, Maskaev, Valuev, Golota, Ruiz? Anyone Willing and able to come out of retirement to fight him and allow the youngsters to get prepared.
I do think people are reading too much into the Vitali fight. He was clearly injured and had he not been I think Chisora would have been stopped in the middle rounds. Add to that the fact he is 40 and to be fair has never been the most mobile and Chisora is made to look better than he actually is. As for Helenius, I never really rated the guy anyway to be honest though I did expect him to beat Chisora (by that I mean without the controversy). Also Haye has at the very least quite badly hurt every guy he has ever fought barring Wlad and I don't see much changing this weekend, Chisora IMO will fold when he does get hurt.
As for the guys you mention I've always been intrigued by a Wlad vs Valuev fight. I don't for a second think Wlad loses to Valuev (for me it has to be an explosive puncher to beat Wlad or someone with an insane workrate and chin like Evander was), but it's a new set of problems for Wlad to deal with and I think it could make for a semi decent fight as I'm not sure Wlad would be as keen to hold Valuev as he is the smaller guys! Also I'd love to see the big man down properly, I thought Haye was about to put him down in the last round but he just failed. I'm sure someone who isn't particuarly hard to hit like Valuev would be down at some point against Wlad. Also it would be marketable due to his size!
Re: Wlad to fight again in Novermber or December
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
1. I'm saying Haye's "shit-talk" produced Wlad his most lucrative and high profile ever contest. Do you think Wlad was NOT happy about making $21 million due to his opponents brilliant promotion?
2. Tyson was a money making global phenomenon. Every corner of the world purchased a piece of him. Wlad is a nobody outside Germany/Eastern Europe so is helped by controversial characters.
3. Wlad hopes Chisora beats Haye because the fight is already sold to the public with Chisora's antics and performance against Vitali.
You need to get this into perspective - Wlad-Haye got 16.5 million viewers on German TV. Wlad-Thompson got 6 million. If you think Wlad is unhappy about these "badboy" characters boosting the interest in his fights you are mad.
Haye still didn't make the fight vs Wlad interesting or competitive, Tyson-Holyfield was big because Holyfield was a legit threat to Tyson, and I'm sure Wlad doesn't care who wins because all it means is another paycheck it's not like Haye or Chisora have a chance against Wlad.
There could have been 80 million viewers, the fact is David Haye is still a punk and nothing will change that. He talked and talked and didn't deliver or even attempt to make good on his word.
Re: Wlad to fight again in Novermber or December
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Fenster
1. I'm saying Haye's "shit-talk" produced Wlad his most lucrative and high profile ever contest. Do you think Wlad was NOT happy about making $21 million due to his opponents brilliant promotion?
2. Tyson was a money making global phenomenon. Every corner of the world purchased a piece of him. Wlad is a nobody outside Germany/Eastern Europe so is helped by controversial characters.
3. Wlad hopes Chisora beats Haye because the fight is already sold to the public with Chisora's antics and performance against Vitali.
You need to get this into perspective - Wlad-Haye got 16.5 million viewers on German TV. Wlad-Thompson got 6 million. If you think Wlad is unhappy about these "badboy" characters boosting the interest in his fights you are mad.
Haye still didn't make the fight vs Wlad interesting or competitive, Tyson-Holyfield was big because Holyfield was a legit threat to Tyson, and I'm sure Wlad doesn't care who wins because all it means is another paycheck it's not like Haye or Chisora have a chance against Wlad.
There could have been 80 million viewers, the fact is David Haye is still a punk and nothing will change that. He talked and talked and didn't deliver or even attempt to make good on his word.
Whether Haye is a punk or not is irrelevant.
If you believe a man as intelligent as Wlad doesn't "care" whether he earns $1million or $20million well... (:rolleyes:).
Holyfield was a 25/1 underdog against Tyson (he didn't have a chance in hell according to popular opinion). Many figures in the boxing industry were fearing for his life. It was big because it involved two great fighters, two American's in America and Tyson is one of the most famous people in history.
Re: Wlad to fight again in Novermber or December
So by your rational if Haye wins Wlad won't make big money? And if Chisora wins he will? At this point in time there's no difference in Haye & Chisora. Dereck spit in Wlad's face I guess that is a teeny tiny little storyline, but shit man this is BOXING not the WWE and I'm telling you this whole idea (that 2 fighters from a certain little island have adopted) of "Look at what an asshole I can be" doesn't do well. Sure you can stir up people who will want to see you knocked out, but the regular boxing fans don't pay much attention to shit talking......especially when it wasn't backed up to begin with!!!
Re: Wlad to fight again in Novermber or December
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
So by your rational if Haye wins Wlad won't make big money? And if Chisora wins he will? At this point in time there's no difference in Haye & Chisora. Dereck spit in Wlad's face I guess that is a teeny tiny little storyline, but shit man this is BOXING not the WWE and I'm telling you this whole idea (that 2 fighters from a certain little island have adopted) of "Look at what an asshole I can be" doesn't do well. Sure you can stir up people who will want to see you knocked out, but the regular boxing fans don't pay much attention to shit talking......especially when it wasn't backed up to begin with!!!
Mate your working on the assumption that Haye, Chisora, Wlad etc etc are out to please us hard working loyal boxing fans who spend their days and nights on the forums having verbals on their behalf. They aint!
Re: Wlad to fight again in Novermber or December
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Memphis
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
So by your rational if Haye wins Wlad won't make big money? And if Chisora wins he will? At this point in time there's no difference in Haye & Chisora. Dereck spit in Wlad's face I guess that is a teeny tiny little storyline, but shit man this is BOXING not the WWE and I'm telling you this whole idea (that 2 fighters from a certain little island have adopted) of "Look at what an asshole I can be" doesn't do well. Sure you can stir up people who will want to see you knocked out, but the regular boxing fans don't pay much attention to shit talking......especially when it wasn't backed up to begin with!!!
Mate your working on the assumption that Haye, Chisora, Wlad etc etc are out to please us hard working loyal boxing fans who spend their days and nights on the forums having verbals on their behalf. They aint!
you're*
And no, I'm not these guys are in the BUSINESS of boxing, I know that, but you can sell fights without talking shit, it has been done before.
Re: Wlad to fight again in Novermber or December
making a case for selling a fight without being a cock and your first priority is to point out a typo ;D
Did Wlad Haye sell as well as it did because of Haye's shameless promotion or in spite of it?
Re: Wlad to fight again in Novermber or December
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Memphis
making a case for selling a fight without being a cock and your first priority is to point out a typo ;D
Did Wlad Haye sell as well as it did because of Haye's shameless promotion or in spite of it?
Doesn't matter, Haye is British, you guys will buy anything :rolleyes:
Re: Wlad to fight again in Novermber or December
How about you just answer the question?
Re: Wlad to fight again in Novermber or December
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Memphis
making a case for selling a fight without being a cock and your first priority is to point out a typo ;D
Did Wlad Haye sell as well as it did because of Haye's shameless promotion or in spite of it?
Doesn't matter, Haye is British, you guys will buy anything :rolleyes:
A little harsh Lyle. Haye has sold well over here and hasn't always delivered that is a fact BUT, he has also made history for us as well becoming only the second man to hold genuine world titles at both CW and HW and believe it or not a hell of a lot of Brits actually want to see Haye beaten.
Haye understands this which is why he comes across as a big mouthed bastard. He was never like this before he got famous. At the end of the day boxing is a short career choice so I fully understand him making himself a real love him or hate him guy as they are the ones that people will pay to see. The haters pay to see him lose and his fans (ME) pay to see him destroy bums like Chisora in great fashion.
