Non-British perspective: Froch easier to like than was Calzaghe

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Originally Posted by TitoFan

Duly noted. From one non-British to another. You enjoyed watching Calzaghe fight.... I didn't. Especially later in his career when he was supposed to be having those "career-defining" fights. Instead, I was treated to a sideshow against Manfredo, and a forgettable, controversial affair against that OTHER fighter I've always loved to watch... Bernard Hopkins. Not the stuff legends are made of.

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Tito, Joe was a quality fighter just watch him beat an unbeaten Kessler, it was close at first but Joe adjusted and handly beat him. Joe beating Eubanks was also good to watch and beating up Omar Sheika.

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Originally Posted by Master

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Originally Posted by TitoFan

Duly noted. From one non-British to another. You enjoyed watching Calzaghe fight.... I didn't. Especially later in his career when he was supposed to be having those "career-defining" fights. Instead, I was treated to a sideshow against Manfredo, and a forgettable, controversial affair against that OTHER fighter I've always loved to watch... Bernard Hopkins. Not the stuff legends are made of.

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Tito, Joe was a quality fighter just watch him beat an unbeaten Kessler, it was close at first but Joe adjusted and handly beat him. Joe beating Eubanks was also good to watch and beating up Omar Sheika.

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Point taken, bro. I have to admit I didn't watch the Kessler or the Eubank fights. I'd like to... and maybe see a different side of Calzaghe. It's just that the few fights I did see left a bad taste in my mouth. Finishing your career undefeated is not easy to do. Mainly you gotta know when to hang up the gloves. But I also feel there's fighters out there with two or three losses on their record, who IMO have had greater careers and greater resumes than an undefeated fighter such as Calzaghe. It all boils down to quality of opposition, and quality of wins.

You havent even watched his 2 probably most defining fights but you can judge?;D

So Manfredo and Hopkins were not vintage Calzaghe?
Had he used "it" up already?

;D

This is when Calzaghe was a puncher. See the difference between the later stage of his career where he would throw fast light combinations and here where he is thumping in hard hooks but still lots of them!

YouTube - Joe Calzaghe Vs Mario Veit - Knockout


YouTube - Calzaghe vs Eubank Highlights

Kessler was by far Calzaghes most impressive win.
Lacy was a better performance but it was Jeff Lacy ffs..

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Originally Posted by Althugz

Kessler was by far Calzaghes most impressive win.
Lacy was a better performance but it was Jeff Lacy ffs..

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Calzaghe destroyed Lacy and then Lacy's own body turned on him thus explaining all of his post Calzaghe showings.

I don't understand how anyone thinks that Calzaghe wasn't fun to watch. He was cracking fun. He was someone who would let his hands go and take a punch in the process.

Give me Calzaghe over the likes of Mayweather and Ward anyday of the week and I think he was a better fight than them both too.

Hopkins was a dull fight granted, but every Hopkins fight in the past 10 years has been dull. Calzaghe cannot be blamed for the ultimate spoiler.

[QUOTE=Gandalf;1075125]

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Originally Posted by Althugz

Kessler was by far Calzaghes most impressive win.
Lacy was a better performance but it was Jeff Lacy

Give me Calzaghe over the likes of Mayweather and Ward anyday of the week and I think he was a better fight than them both too.

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Wow...just wow. A better fighter than Mayweather? This is what I mean by unreasonable Calzaghe fans ;D

Also Ross, thanks for those Eubank highlights. Never saw that fight apart from the first knockdown. I never thought this before but I think Eubank would have done him in his prime. That was Eubank on 2 weeks notice at the tail end of his career..hitting him with some big shots. Calzaghe was out on his feet in that 12th round with Eubanks last shot.

I actually think the later style of Calzaghe fares much better against any version of Eubank..But his early gun-ho style, prime Eubank would have knocked him out.

Shame Joe never went after the boring but fight controlling German at the time it would of iced the cake.

I genuinely believe it. Calzaghe for me is the best fighter I have ever seen and like others on here I have seen my share of fights and fighters. You put him in with someone who will trade and he will beat you to the punch and get more off, put him in with someone who will spoil and he will outwork you. He will adapt to any fighter and also be better looking to boot. I rate Calzaghe over Mayweather and always have. Mayweather is cute, but Calzaghe will still throw 80 punches a round your way. If Cotto and DLH can win rounds Calzaghe takes far more. Mayweather loses on points and there is nothing he can do.

I am a Calzaghe fan and am proud of it. The man was ballet, he was poetry, he was a druggy and he could cut up the space time continuum with effortless grace and was also a bit Welsh sounding. He was like nothing before and nothing to come and will live on within You Tube until the eventual ending of man and the return back to pre digital harmony. He will also likely live for several decades more and continue to be a fine looking man with a bigger penis than ElFinito.

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Originally Posted by Gandalf

I genuinely believe it. Calzaghe for me is the best fighter I have ever seen and like others on here I have seen my share of fights and fighters. You put him in with someone who will trade and he will beat you to the punch and get more off, put him in with someone who will spoil and he will outwork you. He will adapt to any fighter and also be better looking to boot. I rate Calzaghe over Mayweather and always have. Mayweather is cute, but Calzaghe will still throw 80 punches a round your way. If Cotto and DLH can win rounds Calzaghe takes far more. Mayweather loses on points and there is nothing he can do.

I am a Calzaghe fan and am proud of it. The man was ballet, he was poetry, he was a druggy and he could cut up the space time continuum with effortless grace and was also a bit Welsh sounding. He was like nothing before and nothing to come and will live on within You Tube until the eventual ending of man and the return back to pre digital harmony. He will also likely live for several decades more and continue to be a fine looking man with a bigger penis than ElFinito.

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I'm sorry, I like you and all that Miles but that first paragraph made me sick in my mouth a little. That would never, ever, ever happen.

1) Calzaghe would never fight Floyd if they were in the same weight class and both prime.
2) Floyd would make Calzaghe look absolutely stupid. You can throw punches in bunches against most fighters and land the odd slap, but if Manfredo was riding and slipping those shots, what the hell do you think Floyd would do with those counter hooks and uppers? P4P it's a huge mismatch.
3) Calzaghe adapts? Floyd is the master at adapting..You wanna brawl? He'll counter the shit out of you ala Jesus Chavez. You wanna throw 100 punches a round? He'll make you miss and win the round by throwing 30-40 accurate shots. You wanna box? Don't be stupid. You mention Cotto and DLH - Both fighters lost and the same would happen to JC. I guarantee his output falls against Floyd when he realises throwing a hundred hand slap like E.Honda doesn't work against Floyd.

Long, stiff jabs work against Floyd. That's where DLH and Cotto were successful. JC has nothing of the sort.

lol at people slagging the shit out of Calzaghe then revealing they haven't even seen his fights ;D

Makes sense. Fact.

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Originally Posted by Althugz

Also Ross, thanks for those Eubank highlights. Never saw that fight apart from the first knockdown. I never thought this before but I think Eubank would have done him in his prime. That was Eubank on 2 weeks notice at the tail end of his career..hitting him with some big shots. Calzaghe was out on his feet in that 12th round with Eubanks last shot.

I actually think the later style of Calzaghe fares much better against any version of Eubank..But his early gun-ho style, prime Eubank would have knocked him out.

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2 weeks notice to make 168. He was already fighting on the bill against Mark Prince.

Calzaghe had never been past 8 rounds and was taking a huge step up in class.

Lets get things in perspective.

i was actually interested when i read the title of this thread because I agree that, although I am/was a calzaghe fan, I think i am a bigger froch fan for various reasons

then i open the thread and it is just some stupid retarded view on how calazaghes carear was crap

yawn

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Originally Posted by Fenster

lol at people slagging the shit out of Calzaghe then revealing they haven't even seen his fights ;D

Makes sense. Fact.

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Glad you see it my way. Give me the name of any fighter for which you've seen all of his fights. Of course you'll lie and name a few. I've been a fan of boxing for many years, and have never claimed to have seen every single fight of any fighter. Then again, I don't lie just so I can be popular.

Let's just say that the few fights I did see... I didn't like. Just like you don't like some of the fighters I like... I happen not to like Calzaghe. Don't like Hatton, either. And before you say it's a British thing, I'll say that I do like Froch, was a big fan of Lennox... and like to see Khan fight (until he opens his mouth to say his ridiculous things).

You may have a lot of pull around here. But you still come across as irritating and obnoxious.
Fact.

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Originally Posted by Andre

Shame Joe never went after the boring but fight controlling German at the time it would of iced the cake.

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That is exactly the criticism I would have with Joe, he could have beaten Sven Ottke easily in Germany with one hand tied behind his back. He should have done it and left no doubt.

Titofan,

Sorry I upset you so much.

I don't care who you like or dislike.

For the record - I've seen the entire career of plenty of fighters ;)

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Originally Posted by Master

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Originally Posted by Andre

Shame Joe never went after the boring but fight controlling German at the time it would of iced the cake.

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That is exactly the criticism I would have with Joe, he could have beaten Sven Ottke easily in Germany with one hand tied behind his back. He should have done it and left no doubt.

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Takes two to tango.

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Originally Posted by Fenster

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Originally Posted by Master

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Originally Posted by Andre

Shame Joe never went after the boring but fight controlling German at the time it would of iced the cake.

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That is exactly the criticism I would have with Joe, he could have beaten Sven Ottke easily in Germany with one hand tied behind his back. He should have done it and left no doubt.

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Takes two to tango.

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Joe should have taken whatever was offered instead of taking on hand me downs from Sven. Ottke got rated higher than Joe after he unified 2 of the titles. That was shameful for Joe, I would have shot myself.

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Originally Posted by Master

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Originally Posted by Fenster

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Originally Posted by Master

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Originally Posted by Andre

Shame Joe never went after the boring but fight controlling German at the time it would of iced the cake.

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That is exactly the criticism I would have with Joe, he could have beaten Sven Ottke easily in Germany with one hand tied behind his back. He should have done it and left no doubt.

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Takes two to tango.

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Joe should have taken whatever was offered instead of taking on hand me downs from Sven. Ottke got rated higher than Joe after he unified 2 of the titles. That was shameful for Joe, I would have shot myself.

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Ottke's reign as a champion was far more shameful than anything Calzaghe ever did. Whether you beat him or not had nothing to do with coming out with the win in Germany, it was an absolute farce. Ottke was a skilled defensive fighter, but there's no way in hell he could have beaten Calzaghe at any point. To hold not taking that fight against Joe is dumb if you ask me, one would also hope Calzaghe would have rather taken on a big name in the States instead, had he chosen to travel at that point.

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Originally Posted by Fenster

Titofan,

Sorry I upset you so much.

I don't care who you like or dislike.

For the record - I've seen the entire career of plenty of fighters ;)

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Again... you give yourself way too much credit. You annoy me briefly, until a more important thought occupies my mind. The entire process lasts a few seconds. Sorry to disappoint you.

:cool:

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Originally Posted by Fenster

lol at people slagging the shit out of Calzaghe then revealing they haven't even seen his fights ;D

Makes sense. Fact.

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I have seen him fight winning ABA titles, and in the pro ranks, remember him then winning ABA's thinking what a great fighter I was right then and now.
Froch is a good fighter at this moment in time,most of the one's that are slagging him off are Froch fan
Calzaghe is a far better boxer and all round fighter.
Point being Calzaghe faced 9 world Champions, and he faced them with bad hand's not bad for someone that was told you should not box again.;)

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Originally Posted by Althugz

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Originally Posted by Gandalf

I genuinely believe it. Calzaghe for me is the best fighter I have ever seen and like others on here I have seen my share of fights and fighters. You put him in with someone who will trade and he will beat you to the punch and get more off, put him in with someone who will spoil and he will outwork you. He will adapt to any fighter and also be better looking to boot. I rate Calzaghe over Mayweather and always have. Mayweather is cute, but Calzaghe will still throw 80 punches a round your way. If Cotto and DLH can win rounds Calzaghe takes far more. Mayweather loses on points and there is nothing he can do.

I am a Calzaghe fan and am proud of it. The man was ballet, he was poetry, he was a druggy and he could cut up the space time continuum with effortless grace and was also a bit Welsh sounding. He was like nothing before and nothing to come and will live on within You Tube until the eventual ending of man and the return back to pre digital harmony. He will also likely live for several decades more and continue to be a fine looking man with a bigger penis than ElFinito.

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I'm sorry, I like you and all that Miles but that first paragraph made me sick in my mouth a little. That would never, ever, ever happen.

1) Calzaghe would never fight Floyd if they were in the same weight class and both prime.
2) Floyd would make Calzaghe look absolutely stupid. You can throw punches in bunches against most fighters and land the odd slap, but if Manfredo was riding and slipping those shots, what the hell do you think Floyd would do with those counter hooks and uppers? P4P it's a huge mismatch.
3) Calzaghe adapts? Floyd is the master at adapting..You wanna brawl? He'll counter the shit out of you ala Jesus Chavez. You wanna throw 100 punches a round? He'll make you miss and win the round by throwing 30-40 accurate shots. You wanna box? Don't be stupid. You mention Cotto and DLH - Both fighters lost and the same would happen to JC. I guarantee his output falls against Floyd when he realises throwing a hundred hand slap like E.Honda doesn't work against Floyd.

Long, stiff jabs work against Floyd. That's where DLH and Cotto were successful. JC has nothing of the sort.

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All just opinions at the end of the day.

1. Yes, he would.
2. Huge mismatch? Like Cotto was thoroughly outclassed, like DLH was thoroughly outclassed, like even Zab Judah who won 3 of 4 before becoming like the Judah we know and love. Calzaghe was leaps above each of these fighters and was unorthodox. Manfredo told us jack squat.
3. I don't see any similarity between Chavez and Calzaghe besides output. Mayweather will only lose by being outworked. Cotto and DLH have no stamina. Calzaghe has more stamina than everyone and is awkward. Chavez wasn't awkward he just threw.

Calzaghe 115-112 decision.

Lol. Why 115-112, dare I ask:-X Joe would probably win 8 rounds but get penalized in the 12th for his slightly Welsh accent and better looks, right?;D He was a great fighter but come on, there is no way in hell he was on Mayweathers level at any point. You merely need to open your eyes and divorce the personal biases to see so.

I can also see Mayweather struggle with the combination of workrate, southpaw awkward agressive style. He spends too much time on the ropes amd unlike other fighters, Joe doesnt hesitate or think twice about taking his chances, if you give him time and space he will be pouring in the punches. Floyd would certainly have the hardest fight of his career on his hands and eould have to work every second as acounter right hand alone will not beat Joe. If it would then Hopkins would not habe done some of the most pitifull and shamefull acting like a wimp in the playground trying to get away from the bully by crying injury;D

Using the Hopkins fight as evidence to Calzaghe being as good as Mayweather is quite frankly hilarious. Floyd would do what Hopkins did in spots only consistently. Who cares though, there is way to much of a weight difference between the two. Floyd is the better fighter who has accomplished a lot more and everyone who doesn't have a Calzaghe poster on their wall knows that.

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Originally Posted by p4pking

Using the Hopkins fight as evidence to Calzaghe being as good as Mayweather is quite frankly hilarious. Floyd would do what Hopkins did in spots only consistently. Who cares though, there is way to much of a weight difference between the two. Floyd is the better fighter who has accomplished a lot more and everyone who doesn't have a Calzaghe poster on their wall knows that.

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noone is saying calzaghe has achieved what mayweather has achieved as far as i can see

if they were around the same weight class it would definately be a good fight tho, i dont see many prime fighters having more of a chance of beating floyd

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Originally Posted by p4pking

Using the Hopkins fight as evidence to Calzaghe being as good as Mayweather is quite frankly hilarious. Floyd would do what Hopkins did in spots only consistently. Who cares though, there is way to much of a weight difference between the two. Floyd is the better fighter who has accomplished a lot more and everyone who doesn't have a Calzaghe poster on their wall knows that.

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Hopkins fight no one looks good fighting that man,imagine Floyd v Hopkins that would be a stinker
you don't judge fighters if they were bigger or smaller I agree.
Bigger fighters have to take bigger punches, so all in all Calzaghe.;D

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Originally Posted by p4pking

Lol. Why 115-112, dare I ask:-X Joe would probably win 8 rounds but get penalized in the 12th for his slightly Welsh accent and better looks, right?;D He was a great fighter but come on, there is no way in hell he was on Mayweathers level at any point. You merely need to open your eyes and divorce the personal biases to see so.

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I have no doubt there would be some trickery involved and Joe Cortez would be in the middle of it.

As I say it is all just opinions and nobody can win in these kinds of contests whence my hyperbole and raving about good looks. Mayweather has never faced anyone with the style of Joe Calzaghe and likewise I see nobody on Mayweather's resume who Calzaghe p4p couldn't beat.

Mayweather is great, but Calzaghe gets put down too easily in the eyes of some.

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Originally Posted by p4pking

Lol. Why 115-112, dare I ask:-X Joe would probably win 8 rounds but get penalized in the 12th for his slightly Welsh accent and better looks, right?;D He was a great fighter but come on, there is no way in hell he was on Mayweathers level at any point. You merely need to open your eyes and divorce the personal biases to see so.

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p.s. "Youre Bias" is such a shit argument

youre bias, no youre bias, no youre bias, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you are

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Originally Posted by erics44

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Originally Posted by p4pking

Lol. Why 115-112, dare I ask:-X Joe would probably win 8 rounds but get penalized in the 12th for his slightly Welsh accent and better looks, right?;D He was a great fighter but come on, there is no way in hell he was on Mayweathers level at any point. You merely need to open your eyes and divorce the personal biases to see so.

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p.s. "Youre Bias" is such a shit argument

youre bias, no youre bias, no youre bias, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you are

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*patiently waits for GreenBean to correct eric's spelling error*

You Calzaghe fans are smoking some reaaaaal good shit..

I don't think Calzaghe would beat Floyd...

Naz on the other hand

Whoomp there it is!

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Originally Posted by Fenster

I don't think Calzaghe would beat Floyd...

Naz on the other hand

Whoomp there it is!

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Calzaghe would have run Hamed right out of the ring.

Would Calzaghe have been unbeaten if he would have faced Froch's level of oppenents, NO WAY

Manfredo jr, a washed up Roy jones, need I say more

No way was Manfredo a washed up Roy Jones Jr. I know Jones Jr got bad, but come on now.

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Originally Posted by Gandalf

No way was Manfredo a washed up Roy Jones Jr. I know Jones Jr got bad, but come on now.

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;D

I was just listing some of the shite that Calzaghe fought

And a prime Manfredo would push a prime Jones

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Originally Posted by Plopeater

Would Calzaghe have been unbeaten if he would have faced Froch's level of oppenents, NO WAY

Manfredo jr, a washed up Roy jones, need I say more

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For fuck sakes...

Calzaghe fought and beat comfortably a young unbeaten, established multiple world champion. Someone that Carl Froch lost to years later :rolleyes:

Also, Taylor and Abraham were middle weights. Dirrell had never fought any world class oposition, Johnson was an old faded drained light heavyweight. Ward made Froch look made of lead and Kessler just fought and tried harder than him cementing everyone with any common senses opinion that if Froch cant beat an older, faded version of Kessler, that Calzaghe would have done pretty much the same to Froch as he did to Kessler.

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Originally Posted by ross

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Originally Posted by Plopeater

Would Calzaghe have been unbeaten if he would have faced Froch's level of oppenents, NO WAY

Manfredo jr, a washed up Roy jones, need I say more

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For fuck sakes...

Calzaghe fought and beat comfortably a young unbeaten, established multiple world champion. Someone that Carl Froch lost to years later :rolleyes:

Also, Taylor and Abraham were middle weights. Dirrell had never fought any world class oposition, Johnson was an old faded drained light heavyweight. Ward made Froch look made of lead and Kessler just fought and tried harder than him cementing everyone with any common senses opinion that if Froch cant beat an older, faded version of Kessler, that Calzaghe would have done pretty much the same to Froch as he did to Kessler.

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Never said Froch would have beat Calzaghe, just think Calzaghe had an easier run of fights than Froch IMO, not taking away that Calzaghe had some good wins

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Originally Posted by Althugz

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Originally Posted by erics44

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Originally Posted by p4pking

Lol. Why 115-112, dare I ask:-X Joe would probably win 8 rounds but get penalized in the 12th for his slightly Welsh accent and better looks, right?;D He was a great fighter but come on, there is no way in hell he was on Mayweathers level at any point. You merely need to open your eyes and divorce the personal biases to see so.

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p.s. "Youre Bias" is such a shit argument

youre bias, no youre bias, no youre bias, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you, no you are

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*patiently waits for GreenBean to correct eric's spelling error*

You Calzaghe fans are smoking some reaaaaal good shit..

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no you non calazaghe fans are

catch my drift?

Its not even a matter of being a Calzaghe fan as years ago I couldnt stand him, much like I couldnt stand Froch but both have won me over, Froch with his willingness to make fights and fight hard and Calzaghe by just being a "fighting machine" as Manny Steward gushed while commentating on the Kessler fight.

There is no denying Calzaghe was just a non stop punching machine. He had a boxing brain to boot and could take a hell of a shot. If you fight him early in his career you get battered with hard punches from all angles. If you fight him late in his career you get beaten to the punch and blitzed by non stop combinations and a fantastic work rate.

He could be an arrogant cock but his fight with Kessler proved he could walk the walk. Even Ward had a rough time with Kessler.