What if? Floyd Mayweather vs 1981 Ray Leonard

Did I miss something here? Exactly when did Sugar Ray Leonard become the second coming of Gerald McClellan? I have no problem with people saying Ray would win, because that's very much possible, but saying Ray is too strong and would stop Floyd is laughable. Ray Leonard never stopped anyone worth a damn before the 14th round(and no, Duran quit, he didn't get stopped), so people saying he'd KO or TKO Floyd is dumb, just as dumb as a Mayweather fan saying Floyd would stop Leonard. I can't see how anyone can predict knockouts over fighters who have never been close to being knocked out, and further more, against fighters who don't have extremely high knockout ratios to begin with. You people are acting as if Mayweather has gone through all his welterweight fights without being hit one time, it's absurd. He's already taken plenty of shots at 147 and strided on. I admit, I don't know who'd come out on top of this one but one thing I do know for sure, there would be no knockout.

i see it ud for leonard and plus leonard has stopped some good fighters

donnie la londe
wilfredo benitez
thomas hearns
ayub kalule who was 36-0 at the time

there some pretty sweet fighters who he has stopped if u ask me

What did I say? Anyone worth a damn before the 14th. Let's not try to put Donnie and Ayub in the same category with Pretty Boy.

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Originally Posted by smashcrusher

What did I say?  Anyone worth a damn before the 14th.  Let's not try to put Donnie and Ayub in the same category with Pretty Boy. 

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im not putting them in same category but they were decent fighters leonard had more power than mayweather and there speed is pretty equal although i think ray leonard may be shade quicker i still see ud for leonard it would be chess match

Wacko you said it for me, you can see him thinking about it, unfortunatly theres nothing about who can capitalize on it . theres no quality in debt, not his fault. I sound terrible here and remember being told the same thing in the 60s and thinking silly cunt. Ive just got of the phone to a very respected coach and freind and hes just said the same thing. To compete at the highest level he does but the levels have dropped, sad but the truth.Ive become one of those silly cunts

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Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING

i see it ud for leonard and plus leonard has stopped some good fighters

donnie la londe
wilfredo benitez
thomas hearns
ayub kalule who was 36-0 at the time

there some pretty sweet fighters who he has stopped if u ask me

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He isint Knocking out Floyd plain and simple...... Look!! All those Ko's were against guys that had inferior defenses that pale in comparison to Floyd...Not to mention those are Late round TKO's that were caused by accumalative punches not a proverbial 1 punch KO's...

Floyd is a wizard in the ring and fights probably the smartest that we have seen...Leonard is not luring Floyd into anything, Floyd adapts EXTREMELY WELL probably better than anyone.....This is a tough fight because if these guys both fought it would be new territory....Each of them have never faced anyone quite like themselves....IT'S a damn good matchup

I also like how everyone gets on Floyds azz and calls him a runner and garbage but Willie Pep who is rightfully regarded as one of the best PFP EVER said

"MY FIGHT STYLE WAS......HE WHO HITS AND RUNS AWAY LIVES TO FIGHT ANOTHER DAY....SO THATS WHAT I DID FOR 29 YEARS....I GOT AWAY WITH IT...."

Willie epitomised what the definition of boxing was all about... ;D

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Originally Posted by JT Rock

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Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING

i see it ud for leonard and plus leonard has stopped some good fighters

donnie la londe
wilfredo benitez
thomas hearns
ayub kalule who was 36-0 at the time

there some pretty sweet fighters who he has stopped if u ask me

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He isint Knocking out Floyd plain and simple...... Look!! All those Ko's were against guys that had inferior defenses that pale in comparison to Floyd...Not to mention those are Late round TKO's that were caused by accumalative punches not a proverbial 1 punch KO's...

Floyd is a wizard in the ring and fights probably the smartest that we have seen...Leonard is not luring Floyd into anything, Floyd adapts EXTREMELY WELL probably better than anyone.....This is a tough fight because if these guys both fought it would be new territory....Each of them have never faced anyone quite like themselves....IT'S a damn good matchup

I also like how everyone gets on Floyds azz and calls him a runner and garbage but Willie Pep who is rightfully regarded as one of the best PFP EVER said

"MY FIGHT STYLE WAS......HE WHO HITS AND RUNS AWAY LIVES TO FIGHT ANOTHER DAY....SO THATS WHAT I DID FOR 29 YEARS....I GOT AWAY WITH IT...."

Willie epitomised what the definition of boxing was all about... ;D

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i never said he would ko floyd i see 12 round decision for ray leonard and yea if u can go through ur career without getting hit alot well good luck to u i say thats called the smart one  8)

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Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING

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Originally Posted by smashcrusher

What did I say? Anyone worth a damn before the 14th. Let's not try to put Donnie and Ayub in the same category with Pretty Boy.

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im not putting them in same category but they were decent fighters leonard had more power than mayweather and there speed is pretty equal although i think ray leonard may be shade quicker i still see ud for leonard it would be chess match

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Nobody, not even Leonard in that time was as quick as PBF PERIOD. As quick boxer myself I can honestly say he is faster than anybody else out there, and in terms of one punch probably the fastest guy to ever box(Zab Judah would follow closely but is also bred for fighting and has much shorter arms). Mayweather doesn't always look fast because he doesn't waste his time shoe shinning opponents, but he throws his punches with his full strength behind them, and they are still a blur. Or he will throw a straight right without his body behind it, and still it will be incredibly fast. The slight edge in speed he would have on Leonard IMO makes this fight because both relied on speed more than anything else.

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Originally Posted by Taeth

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Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING

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Originally Posted by smashcrusher

What did I say? Anyone worth a damn before the 14th. Let's not try to put Donnie and Ayub in the same category with Pretty Boy.

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im not putting them in same category but they were decent fighters leonard had more power than mayweather and there speed is pretty equal although i think ray leonard may be shade quicker i still see ud for leonard it would be chess match

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Nobody, not even Leonard in that time was as quick as PBF PERIOD. As quick boxer myself I can honestly say he is faster than anybody else out there, and in terms of one punch probably the fastest guy to ever box(Zab Judah would follow closely but is also bred for fighting and has much shorter arms). Mayweather doesn't always look fast because he doesn't waste his time shoe shinning opponents, but he throws his punches with his full strength behind them, and they are still a blur. Or he will throw a straight right without his body behind it, and still it will be incredibly fast. The slight edge in speed he would have on Leonard IMO makes this fight because both relied on speed more than anything else.

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i disagree i think leonard was tad faster in my opinion but its close not much in it

No way in handspeed... absolutely no way. Leonard was about the same speed as Hearns in hand speed or Roy JOnes Jr., but not Mayweather. Also in foot speed you see Leonard plant his feet, and the not be on his toes the same way Mayweather is, and he is nowhere near to as quick at movement foreward or backwards. Mayweather gets in alot quicker, and he moves in with his whole body when he punches. His reflexes are definitely better, and he has alot quicker upper body movement. There is no comparison in the two. If you watch the jab Mayweather can get it out as fast as Leonard's when Leonard is firing it straight out, and Mayweather is bringing it from his knee level. Also the little things like Leonard telegraphs his punches, and Mayweather doesn't at all.

Mayweather by SD.

If you look at the Hearns fights, Tommy was significantly faster with single shots than leonard. He outsped him with his jab and right hand. Leonard was quick, but his footspeed and the fact that he threw so many punches in combination are what sticks in my mind about him.

People also seem to forget that boxing had a marketing machine in the 80s and Sugar Ray was the Delahoya equivalent (good looking, articulate, well-behaved). He was a great fighter, but there seems to be a tendency to just accept the hype about him without asking the same questions that modern fighters get asked. Haggler's admittedly a lot more fearsome that Baldomir but Leonard ran and stole rounds by slapping Haggler's guard in the last 30 seconds(masterful, smart boxing etc.) Mayweather employs similar tactics against Baldomir (boring, cowardly etc.)

A lot of the boxing press have a set against Mayweather. He might well be the obnoxious little turd that they make him out to be. At the end of the day, many of those guys are just subsidized fans that also have inflated ideas of their own importance with much less reason for it.

leonard would mop the floor with floyd. leonard had everything. floyd seems to have everything, but he doesn't have heart. leonard would break him down and crush him mid-late fight.

I usually hate these mythical matchups and don't bother with most any of them because debating is pointless since we will never know but this one I actually like. Leonard is one of the most versatile and resiliant fighters in boxing history so I don't think Mayweather would be able to overwhelm him with anything. I think it could be one of those fights where both fighters give each other different looks throughout the fight. As much as people dislike both of them, they were flat out good. The paralels are amazing. I mean, both are two of the best cerebral fighters of their generation. Both have pinpoint accuracy with a fair amount of pop. Both have footwork second to none, moving inside to outside and side to side. Look at the first five or so rounds of the Leonard - Hearns fight, the side to side movement had Hearns completely off his game. Both are perfect fundamentally, and both have athletic ability to go on top of it. The parallels really are mindblowing and thats as much of a testement to Leonard then anything, the guy was 25 years ahead of his time and maybe more.

So really I think picking a winner would be splitting hairs if you don't beleive in the boxing evolutionary theory then it's a toss up. I mean I think when you break it down to the basics, they're even.

I would be inclined to give Mayweather the advantage because of how just technically perfect he is. I mean, antics aside, the guy is this generations all time great fighter.

However, Leonard is one of the more resiliant fighters of all time. I mean he had the odds stacked against him behind on the cards versus some all time great fighters and always found ways to win. It's hard to argue against a fighter who ALWAYS wins, whether the decision is disputed or not. So that's something to bear in mind. There is no way Leonard would be in any way overwhelmed thats for certain.

Leonard and this is the crux of the matter, had better oral perception and balance