Re: Wow, that is a horrible decision
Is that like a Fantana style post Bilbo:confused: Or did you actually in fact go back and watch rounds in reverse and slow motion.... Lol. Because it's not as though the judges have the luxury of doing that and seemingly it would be the way to score if for Williams:rolleyes:. Lara was so clearly the ring general and landing all the more telling punches to me, Williams head was being snapped back the entire fight and his footwork was so poor in comparison. I'll admit I only watched it live in real time though, but it was almost impossible to give Williams more than 2 rounds after the third(when I started watching).
Re: Wow, that is a horrible decision
Quote:
Originally Posted by
OumaFan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Actually watching the fight back tonight with the sound off and in slow motion I can see why the judges gave it to Williams.
I had him winning 7 rounds, they were close and Lara's rounds were more impressive but when you total them up they got the right man imo.
There were one or two rounds where I initially though Lara had won them, but in these I decided to watch them frame by frame both running forwards and backwards and when you run it in slow motion, backwards, frame by frame William's seems to be taking less shots than I though originally. I found in those rounds most of the punches that I had thought were landing flush when replayed backwards actually go away from his face.
So in all a very good call by the judges, in what was admiteddly a tought fight to score.
By any chance did you pay attention to which guy's hands looked faster in super slow mo?
They both looked pretty slow to be honest.
Re: Wow, that is a horrible decision
Quote:
Originally Posted by
p4pking
Is that like a Fantana style post Bilbo:confused: Or did you actually in fact go back and watch rounds in reverse and slow motion.... Lol. Because it's not as though the judges have the luxury of doing that and seemingly it would be the way to score if for Williams:rolleyes:. Lara was so clearly the ring general and landing all the more telling punches to me, Williams head was being snapped back the entire fight and his footwork was so poor in comparison. I'll admit I only watched it live in real time though, but it was almost impossible to give Williams more than 2 rounds after the third(when I started watching).
No, they don't. But they are trained professionals and like chess masters can see at a glance what ordinary players would take several minutes to calculate, if at all.
With the introduction of frame by frame reverse play it's possible to be completely objective and I often find such post fight analysis actually confirms the judges intuition during the live fight.
The trouble is most people watch the fight live in normal time, going forwards, and with sound, which I believe to be a mistake.
Re: Wow, that is a horrible decision
I just can't buy that at all. Of course a fight is going to look different replayed back in slow motions from different angles etc, but at the end of the day you can only go by real time in a live fight, the same way the judges see it. And I doubt you would even claim to have watched a real majority of the fight in slow motion, played both ways:confused:. It would be like my going back and saying I think the Miami Heat actually should have won the NBA finals this year because Lebron and Wade look soooo much cooler in slow motion than that big ugly German Nowitzki does, all there points should have counted for like 15:rolleyes:. Lara was consistently landing more big punches that looked great in real time, with a lot more frequency. Williams face was absolutely mangled as a result, and he clearly looked dejected in the corner between every round past halfway. It was a terrible decision imo.
Re: Wow, that is a horrible decision
Not to mention you comparing the average boxing judge to a chess master for christs sake;D. It's a terrible analogy in terms of the level of expertise; and there is nothing subjective about who wins a game of chess.
Re: Wow, that is a horrible decision
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by
p4pking
Is that like a Fantana style post Bilbo:confused: Or did you actually in fact go back and watch rounds in reverse and slow motion.... Lol. Because it's not as though the judges have the luxury of doing that and seemingly it would be the way to score if for Williams:rolleyes:. Lara was so clearly the ring general and landing all the more telling punches to me, Williams head was being snapped back the entire fight and his footwork was so poor in comparison. I'll admit I only watched it live in real time though, but it was almost impossible to give Williams more than 2 rounds after the third(when I started watching).
No, they don't. But they are trained professionals and like chess masters can see at a glance what ordinary players would take several minutes to calculate, if at all.
With the introduction of frame by frame reverse play it's possible to be completely objective and I often find such post fight analysis actually confirms the judges intuition during the live fight.
The trouble is most people watch the fight live in normal time, going forwards, and with sound, which I believe to be a mistake.
Not just this, but the judges have also have to deal with ringropes obscuring their view & ringcard girls distracting them. The only way to properly score a fight is in hooters holding some string in front of your eyes, whilst playing the fight backwards frame by frame with no sound. I shall re-watch the fight as such & then see what happens.
Re: Wow, that is a horrible decision
Quote:
Originally Posted by
p4pking
I just can't buy that at all. Of course a fight is going to look different replayed back in slow motions from different angles etc, but at the end of the day you can only go by real time in a live fight, the same way the judges see it. And I doubt you would even claim to have watched a real majority of the fight in slow motion, played both ways:confused:. It would be like my going back and saying I think the Miami Heat actually should have won the NBA finals this year because Lebron and Wade look soooo much cooler in slow motion than that big ugly German Nowitzki does, all there points should have counted for like 15:rolleyes:. Lara was consistently landing more big punches that looked great in real time, with a lot more frequency. Williams face was absolutely mangled as a result, and he clearly looked dejected in the corner between every round past halfway. It was a terrible decision imo.
I do agree that the fight should take place initially in real time, in fact it would be impossible with current technology for the fight to take place in anything other than in real time, going forwards.
But I do think that future technology should concentrate on slowing the fight down or maybe have two fights running concurrently, the real time one that the fans can enjoy, and a slow motion fight, ran backwards for trained professional analysis.
Of course, some more progress in physics and quantumn theory would be necessary to run two "parrallel" fights, in two time dimensions and running both backwards and forwards through time so it's a little way off yet admittedly.
Also, it might pose a problem with betting as if hackers were able to get access to the slow motion, backwards fight footage before the live fight (which would be technically impossible if Einstein's theories are correct) then they could know the result before the fight took place.
Maybe on reflection, with the complications that this would bring you are right and we should continue to run fights real time for now until certain safety mechanisms and failsafes have been implemented, although in the event of a dodgy decision, slow mo and reverse should be used to confirm the initial judges decision and uphold the integrity of the sport.
Re: Wow, that is a horrible decision
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CFH
That's absolutely true. I know that I, especially if there is a rematch, will be cheering against Paul Williams and hoping he loses in such a one-sided way that it makes robbery impossible or the scorecards moot. And that's not really fair because he's a great fighter with a great attitude (even if his post-fight interview pissed me off).
So Lara has to score a shutout going off tonight? Or stop him, which certainly looked a possibility. I know people jump on the HBO guys, but I really don't think they were wrong about the scoring or damage. Probably about the dangers to P-Will's life (pot kettle black Roy??), which I felt he'd somehow make it through, but it was so one-sided it was mad. I had it 10-2 & neither rounds I gave to Williams were ones I thought were definitely his. Definitely my robbery of the year (
did you ever post the results last year CFH you useless liberal bastard?).
It took me a long time to figure out what the fuck you were talking about. I don't think I ever did tally anything because Mick said he was going to do it. I just made the thread so people could vote.
Re: Wow, that is a horrible decision
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Hulk
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Quote:
Originally Posted by
marbleheadmaui
People who cried robbery in the Matthysse, Maidana and Kotelnik fights are part of the problem. Those were close fights.
Now when a fight is literally stolen, like tonight? People dismiss it because they've heard the term "robbery" far too often.
I completely agree with this. I'm also wondering what fight Maidana was robbed in :confused:
I thought Matthysse won against Judah & lost to Alexander & Kotelnik just nicked it in St. Louis. However, I could see all of those going to the eventual winner & in one case I clearly did.
Tonight was a flat out disgrace & I can't believe there is no more anger over this. It's been a while since I heard the scorecards & genuinely believed for a short while that the announcer has accidentally read out the wrong guy.
Sorry but how the fuck did you have Matthysse WINNING against Judah and LOSING to Alexander ?
He put on a much more impressive performance against Alexander than he did against Judah.
And in my opinion if a fight is close in rounds, but still a CLEAR victory for one fighter and he doesn't get the decision, then its still a robbery.
If a guy clearly wins 7 rounds and there is no doubt about it, no bickering over those 7, and the judges end up giving it to the other guy, especially with a knockdown involved, then that is still a robbery.
I agree 100%. A fight doesn't have to be an apparent blowout to be a robbery. As long as one fighter clearly deserved to win and did not, I think it's fair to call it a robbery.
Re: Wow, that is a horrible decision
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by
p4pking
I just can't buy that at all. Of course a fight is going to look different replayed back in slow motions from different angles etc, but at the end of the day you can only go by real time in a live fight, the same way the judges see it. And I doubt you would even claim to have watched a real majority of the fight in slow motion, played both ways:confused:. It would be like my going back and saying I think the Miami Heat actually should have won the NBA finals this year because Lebron and Wade look soooo much cooler in slow motion than that big ugly German Nowitzki does, all there points should have counted for like 15:rolleyes:. Lara was consistently landing more big punches that looked great in real time, with a lot more frequency. Williams face was absolutely mangled as a result, and he clearly looked dejected in the corner between every round past halfway. It was a terrible decision imo.
I do agree that the fight should take place initially in real time, in fact it would be impossible with current technology for the fight to take place in anything other than in real time, going forwards.
But I do think that future technology should concentrate on slowing the fight down or maybe have two fights running concurrently, the real time one that the fans can enjoy, and a slow motion fight, ran backwards for trained professional analysis.
Of course, some more progress in physics and quantumn theory would be necessary to run two "parrallel" fights, in two time dimensions and running both backwards and forwards through time so it's a little way off yet admittedly.
Also, it might pose a problem with betting as if hackers were able to get access to the slow motion, backwards fight footage before the live fight (which would be technically impossible if Einstein's theories are correct) then they could know the result before the fight took place.
Maybe on reflection, with the complications that this would bring you are right and we should continue to run fights real time for now until certain safety mechanisms and failsafes have been implemented, although in the event of a dodgy decision, slow mo and reverse should be used to confirm the initial judges decision and uphold the integrity of the sport.
I didn't know that you liked to get high.
Re: Wow, that is a horrible decision
I've been watching boxing since i was 8 years old, i scored this 118-110... i obviously haven't learned a fucking thing:rolleyes:. Williams needs to reconsider his future, he is looking at another serious KO loss and should retire. The judges have done him no favours here.:mad:
Re: Wow, that is a horrible decision
I think Lara clearly one but in my opinion he wasn't as dominant as others have suggested. Whenever he pushed the action he won round, but I felt he rested and let Paul's volume takeover at times during the fight. I had it 116-113 for Lara
Re: Wow, that is a horrible decision
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Quote:
Originally Posted by
marbleheadmaui
People who cried robbery in the Matthysse, Maidana and Kotelnik fights are part of the problem. Those were close fights.
Now when a fight is literally stolen, like tonight? People dismiss it because they've heard the term "robbery" far too often.
I completely agree with this. I'm also wondering what fight Maidana was robbed in :confused:
I thought Matthysse won against Judah & lost to Alexander & Kotelnik just nicked it in St. Louis. However, I could see all of those going to the eventual winner & in one case I clearly did.
Tonight was a flat out disgrace & I can't believe there is no more anger over this. It's been a while since I heard the scorecards & genuinely believed for a short while that the announcer has accidentally read out the wrong guy.
I'm not sure how you can agree with the accusation that the oft cried ROBBERY is actually 'dismissed' by'people'. What people? The casual fans? From what I see, casual fans are dismissing Boxing because of the shit judging. Not shit reactions.
Re: Wow, that is a horrible decision
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jimanuel Boogustus
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Quote:
Originally Posted by
marbleheadmaui
People who cried robbery in the Matthysse, Maidana and Kotelnik fights are part of the problem. Those were close fights.
Now when a fight is literally stolen, like tonight? People dismiss it because they've heard the term "robbery" far too often.
I completely agree with this. I'm also wondering what fight Maidana was robbed in :confused:
I thought Matthysse won against Judah & lost to Alexander & Kotelnik just nicked it in St. Louis. However, I could see all of those going to the eventual winner & in one case I clearly did.
Tonight was a flat out disgrace & I can't believe there is no more anger over this. It's been a while since I heard the scorecards & genuinely believed for a short while that the announcer has accidentally read out the wrong guy.
I'm not sure how you can agree with the accusation that the oft cried ROBBERY is actually 'dismissed' by'people'. What people? The casual fans? From what I see, casual fans are dismissing Boxing because of the shit judging. Not shit reactions.
Well not so much the dismissing bit, I wasn't really focusing on that. But, I do think the fact that the word gets thrown around so easily (one person appears to even be arguing that Khan-Maidana was a robbery :rolleyes:) means that actual robberies such as this are devalued. I don't know I just get the feeling, maybe of my own impressions, that someone who hadn't seen the fight would just assume it was over-zealous fans overreacting again. Fuck you, scrutinizing me agreeing with Marble, can't you just let me complain about the decision?! ;D
Re: Wow, that is a horrible decision
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CFH
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CFH
That's absolutely true. I know that I, especially if there is a rematch, will be cheering against Paul Williams and hoping he loses in such a one-sided way that it makes robbery impossible or the scorecards moot. And that's not really fair because he's a great fighter with a great attitude (even if his post-fight interview pissed me off).
So Lara has to score a shutout going off tonight? Or stop him, which certainly looked a possibility. I know people jump on the HBO guys, but I really don't think they were wrong about the scoring or damage. Probably about the dangers to P-Will's life (pot kettle black Roy??), which I felt he'd somehow make it through, but it was so one-sided it was mad. I had it 10-2 & neither rounds I gave to Williams were ones I thought were definitely his. Definitely my robbery of the year (
did you ever post the results last year CFH you useless liberal bastard?).
It took me a long time to figure out what the fuck you were talking about. I don't think I ever did tally anything because Mick said he was going to do it. I just made the thread so people could vote.
Typical liberal excuse making! Complete failure to take responsibility! Vote Palin!
