he beat a prime Evander Holyfield....he was a good solid fighter, he was just stupid vs ForemanQuote:
Originally Posted by LegendBoxing65
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he beat a prime Evander Holyfield....he was a good solid fighter, he was just stupid vs ForemanQuote:
Originally Posted by LegendBoxing65
He never even fought for a title.....he was only 20-0-0 and his career status is built on wins over two guys Byrd and Tua who were PROSPECTS when he beat them.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
People can say he would beat Evander or Lewis or whoever but that's what they base his underrated status on??? I got some news for you OPINION does not equal FACT....and there are no FACTS that say Ike would be the best of that era.....he could have lost to Michael Grant for all we know.
If you are going to say someone is underrated then base it on how they actually did and not what they would have done if they were not a crazed kidnapping rapist.
with a record of 49 wins and 46 kos one cant be over ratedQuote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
sorry 49 fights with 36 kosQuote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
49 wins 43 kos.Quote:
Originally Posted by the duke
This whole thread is based on opinion Lyle ;D Well if we were going by Calzaghe standards then Ike would be one of the best heavies ever.....Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
And Lyle you KNOW Ike was as fundamentally sound as any Heavy we have seen in the past 20 years.. Speed, strength, Stamina, workrate, chin and heart... Not to mention his defense was SOLID and he could Box beautifully. There is no reason not to believe Ike couldnt be up there with the Lewis's Holyfield's and Tyson's of the division... He would beat your Boy Wlad into borsh and you know this man ;D
Let me ask you a question Lyle.... When we are discussing fighters and there abilities, why do you take cheap shots at there outside life.. McClellan, Tyson, Ibeabucchi etc.. we talk about these fighters because of what they do in the ring not what they do outside..... If we were discussing jail time and stuff to that degree this would be a news and law enforcement place. They were fighters thats why we have a purpose to talk about them, not because they were or are criminals ;)
I'm just saying Ike's PRIME was spent in jail....we all know how a boxer can be the hottest thing one minute and then flat on his back the next.
In boxing you don't judge greatness solely on POTENTIAL, that's all I am saying.
Sam Langford was a GREAT fighter he didn't get a title because of racism......Ike has no one to blame for not getting a title but himself......in my opinion there is a HUGE difference
Oh yea he Fuked himself... Thats a no doubter. I voted for Holmes personally, I just dont think Ike's career was overrated only because he did extremely well in his short time... So I praise him only cause he deserves it for what he accompolished up to that point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
I understand your point of view but I just don't like judging fighters on the "what if's"....CC for a good argument
Also when I talk about Tyson, McClellan, and Ibeabuchi's lives outside the ring I don't bring it into how good I think they were as far as hypothetical match ups go. I only bring it up in this case because if you're talking about underrated/overrated Ike didn't have a long enough career to be considered for this....I mean guys who shoot themselves in the foot but have tons of talent are a dime a dozen in boxing
:coolclick: # 1062Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
yea I here you, good convo... Yep hate it when a fighter screw himself. :-\
I never thought Michael Moorer was a good heavyweight at all. Yeah he beat Evander but then he was stopped by Evander after that. Evander does not stop that many guys. His chin was not good enough for this man to be underrated. If anything he was overrated. Even Morrison could stay away from Foreman for 12 rounds.
I think Moorer was good hw very good technical skills just his chin let him down.Quote:
Originally Posted by LegendBoxing65
Not his skills let Moorer down, it was his desire.
At light heavy he was a monster because he had to practiclly starve himself to make weight.
That made him one mean mofo.
He never had that once he started bulking up and adding pounds
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey
Where did you hear that mate?
;) larry homes cos he was in the shadow of the ALI YEARS and allso george forman for the same reason, and look what this guy did after 10 years out off the ring, and still is underrated ;)