Re: Cotto's welterweight belt is on the line!!!
Alright I had to come back from the dead to chime in on this one...Heres the thing, a welterweight fight can and should be within the Welterweight limit. Manny and Cotto can both weight in at 145, fine. BUT, Manny and Cotto should be able to weigh in at 145 and 147, respectively. Both scenarios are within the limit. The greater problem is the ethical dillema: What if tommorow WBA Welterweight Champion Shane Mosley announces that he is defending his tiltle against...Clottey for instance, but states that he will only defend it if he and Clottey both weight in at 142. Is that fair and is that acceptable. The answer is, no. At least in my opinion. What if Valuev stated that he will only defend his title at 330 pounds, is that fair and should the WBA accept that?
Re: Cotto's welterweight belt is on the line!!!
Also you have to think, if you are ,Fighter A, the rightful mandatory to fight for the Welterweight strap, and that belt changes hands in a 145 clash between Fighter B and C,that could have gone another way if Fighter C came in at 147, should you be able to demand that your title shot with Fighter B be at 145 too. I would think so, and that is a problem because where does it end?
Re: Cotto's welterweight belt is on the line!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BoomBoom
Also you have to think, if you are ,Fighter A, the rightful mandatory to fight for the Welterweight strap, and that belt changes hands in a 145 clash between Fighter B and C,that could have gone another way if Fighter C came in at 147, should you be able to demand that your title shot with Fighter B be at 145 too. I would think so, and that is a problem because where does it end?
You're misunderstanding, its NOT the WBO who are sanctioning a 145 lb fight, its nothing to do with them. Their weight limit is 147 lbs and Cotto CAN weigh in at 147 if he wants to. He won't be breaking any contract with the WBO but just with Manny and his team.
The fight would still go ahead, he'd just have to pay Manny the agreed retribution money.
As for other fighters demanding a fight takes place at 145, they would have negotioate that with the other fighter seperately, its NOTHING to do with the WBO.
Re: Cotto's welterweight belt is on the line!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CGM
Quote:
Originally Posted by
generalbulldog
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Originally Posted by
Diane
There you have it. So now the people can go back to b-itching about the catchweight instead.
Hah!! The problem now is that Cotto fans are gonna see that their boy still has a belt even after he gets thumped, and it will bother them because they will know in their hearts that PAC really should be champ.
Wow, it must be nice to be such an authority on Cotto fans. Did you go to school for that? :dontknow:
You know exactly what we are going to think. How did you do that? :rolleyes:
Look everyone, it's The Amazing Kreskin!! :bowdown:
Obviously I'm a Cotto fan, but I am also a fan of Manny's, and to me, this is the kind of fight that I hate that someone has to lose. If Manny comes out as the winner, and if he wins fairly, I will have no problem with it, and I will congratulate him.
And no, I won't know in my heart that Manny should be the champion "if" he wins.
They are fighting at 145, fine, I have no problem with that. Miguel feels he can make that weight comfortably, and I have to trust in his judgement, but Miguel is the one that holds the belt, and the title, and if Manny really wanted that title, then he, and his fans, should of had no problem with him fighting at the weight that the champion Cotto defends it at, which is 147.
That is all. ;) ;D
Re: Cotto's welterweight belt is on the line!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Diane
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CGM
Quote:
Originally Posted by
generalbulldog
There you have it. So now the people can go back to b-itching about the catchweight instead.
Hah!! The problem now is that Cotto fans are gonna see that their boy still has a belt even after he gets thumped, and it will bother them because they will know in their hearts that PAC really should be champ.
Wow, it must be nice to be such an authority on Cotto fans. Did you go to school for that? :dontknow:
You know exactly what we are going to think. How did you do that? :rolleyes:
Look everyone, it's The Amazing Kreskin!! :bowdown:
Obviously I'm a Cotto fan, but I am also a fan of Manny's, and to me, this is the kind of fight that I hate that someone has to lose. If Manny comes out as the winner, and if he wins fairly, I will have no problem with it, and I will congratulate him.
And no, I won't know in my heart that Manny should be the champion "if" he wins.
They are fighting at 145, fine, I have no problem with that. Miguel feels he can make that weight comfortably, and I have to trust in his judgement, but Miguel is the one that holds the belt, and the title, and if Manny really wanted that title, then he, and his fans, should of had no problem with him fighting at the weight that the champion Cotto defends it at, which is 147.
That is all. ;) ;D
oooh sarcasm. OK well if I was a Cotto fan, and Cotto lost at 145 to PAC, I wouldn't feel quite so proud seeing Cotto still parading around with a 147 lb belt. Cause I don't think 2 lbs makes a big difference. But that's just me, obviously some Cotto fans feel differently.
Re: Cotto's welterweight belt is on the line!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CGM
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Diane
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CGM
Hah!! The problem now is that Cotto fans are gonna see that their boy still has a belt even after he gets thumped, and it will bother them because they will know in their hearts that PAC really should be champ.
Wow, it must be nice to be such an authority on Cotto fans. Did you go to school for that? :dontknow:
You know exactly what we are going to think. How did you do that? :rolleyes:
Look everyone, it's The Amazing Kreskin!! :bowdown:
Obviously I'm a Cotto fan, but I am also a fan of Manny's, and to me, this is the kind of fight that I hate that someone has to lose. If Manny comes out as the winner, and if he wins fairly, I will have no problem with it, and I will congratulate him.
And no, I won't know in my heart that Manny should be the champion "if" he wins.
They are fighting at 145, fine, I have no problem with that. Miguel feels he can make that weight comfortably, and I have to trust in his judgement, but Miguel is the one that holds the belt, and the title, and if Manny really wanted that title, then he, and his fans, should of had no problem with him fighting at the weight that the champion Cotto defends it at, which is 147.
That is all. ;) ;D
oooh sarcasm. OK well if I was a Cotto fan, and Cotto lost at 145 to PAC, I wouldn't feel quite so proud seeing Cotto still parading around with a 147 lb belt. Cause I don't think 2 lbs makes a big difference. But that's just me, obviously some Cotto fans feel differently.
Well I guess it's a good thing that you're not a Cotto fan then.
Re: Cotto's welterweight belt is on the line!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BoomBoom
Also you have to think, if you are ,Fighter A, the rightful mandatory to fight for the Welterweight strap, and that belt changes hands in a 145 clash between Fighter B and C,that could have gone another way if Fighter C came in at 147, should you be able to demand that your title shot with Fighter B be at 145 too. I would think so, and that is a problem because where does it end?
You're misunderstanding, its NOT the WBO who are sanctioning a 145 lb fight, its nothing to do with them. Their weight limit is 147 lbs and Cotto CAN weigh in at 147 if he wants to. He won't be breaking any contract with the WBO but just with Manny and his team.
The fight would still go ahead, he'd just have to pay Manny the agreed retribution money.
As for other fighters demanding a fight takes place at 145, they would have negotioate that with the other fighter seperately, its NOTHING to do with the WBO.
Ah, i see what your saying. Still, there are some issues. If there is an agreement outside of the WBO, it would probably be in the form of a contract, and in that contract the WBO Title would be mentioned, so the WBO is involved as it is their title that they are negotiating terms with. So, that said, if they both agree to 145 and the night of the weigh in one of them is 147, the WBO would have no problem. It would be an issue with the other contract. I dont know that the WBO is not involved in this agreement for sure though.
Re: Cotto's welterweight belt is on the line!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Diane
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CGM
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Diane
Wow, it must be nice to be such an authority on Cotto fans. Did you go to school for that? :dontknow:
You know exactly what we are going to think. How did you do that? :rolleyes:
Look everyone, it's The Amazing Kreskin!! :bowdown:
Obviously I'm a Cotto fan, but I am also a fan of Manny's, and to me, this is the kind of fight that I hate that someone has to lose. If Manny comes out as the winner, and if he wins fairly, I will have no problem with it, and I will congratulate him.
And no, I won't know in my heart that Manny should be the champion "if" he wins.
They are fighting at 145, fine, I have no problem with that. Miguel feels he can make that weight comfortably, and I have to trust in his judgement, but Miguel is the one that holds the belt, and the title, and if Manny really wanted that title, then he, and his fans, should of had no problem with him fighting at the weight that the champion Cotto defends it at, which is 147.
That is all. ;) ;D
oooh sarcasm. OK well if I was a Cotto fan, and Cotto lost at 145 to PAC, I wouldn't feel quite so proud seeing Cotto still parading around with a 147 lb belt. Cause I don't think 2 lbs makes a big difference. But that's just me, obviously some Cotto fans feel differently.
Well I guess it's a good thing that you're not a Cotto fan then.
I'm not sure what that's supposed to mean, but I don't really care all that much. Anyways, it's got nothing to do with whether or not I'm a Cotto fan, I'd feel just the same about any boxer I was a fan of. What good is being champ when there's a guy walking around who can kick your ass? Where I come from that means something.
Personally, I don't like to see a champion fighting a non-title bout, unless he's moving up in weight.
Re: Cotto's welterweight belt is on the line!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ClubberLang
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ClubberLang
If future opponents agree to the catchweight then why the hell should anyone care? Nobody has to agree to that, it isn't like they have a gun to their head. It's not like he's Mayweather making small guys come up to him. Manny is still going up to the bigger guys even if it is a catchweight.
Sorry, but name me when Mayweather did this. The only possible name you could throw up is Ricky Hatton who chased the fight. The same Ricky Hatton who was already a world champ at 147. You simply can't name another 'small guy' who he's made come up to him.
Last I checked Marquez fought last at 135 and is coming up to 144 for the fight. That's making a small guy come to you.
back to the fact that Pacquiao is no different, last time i checked Oscar Larios was no featherweight and had just gotten stopped by Vazquez at super bantam
Re: Cotto's welterweight belt is on the line!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BoomBoom
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BoomBoom
Also you have to think, if you are ,Fighter A, the rightful mandatory to fight for the Welterweight strap, and that belt changes hands in a 145 clash between Fighter B and C,that could have gone another way if Fighter C came in at 147, should you be able to demand that your title shot with Fighter B be at 145 too. I would think so, and that is a problem because where does it end?
You're misunderstanding, its NOT the WBO who are sanctioning a 145 lb fight, its nothing to do with them. Their weight limit is 147 lbs and Cotto CAN weigh in at 147 if he wants to. He won't be breaking any contract with the WBO but just with Manny and his team.
The fight would still go ahead, he'd just have to pay Manny the agreed retribution money.
As for other fighters demanding a fight takes place at 145, they would have negotioate that with the other fighter seperately, its NOTHING to do with the WBO.
Ah, i see what your saying. Still, there are some issues. If there is an agreement outside of the WBO, it would probably be in the form of a contract,
and in that contract the WBO Title would be mentioned, so the WBO is involved as it is their title that they are negotiating terms with. So, that said, if they both agree to 145 and the night of the weigh in one of them is 147, the WBO would have no problem. It would be an issue with the other contract. I dont know that the WBO is not involved in this agreement for sure though.
Nope not at all, the WBO title clearly isn't in the contract as Cotto has seemingly elected not to pay the sanctioning fees thus he's clearly under no contract with Manny to defend that belt
Re: Cotto's welterweight belt is on the line!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ClubberLang
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JazMerkin
Sorry, but name me when Mayweather did this. The only possible name you could throw up is Ricky Hatton who chased the fight. The same Ricky Hatton who was already a world champ at 147. You simply can't name another 'small guy' who he's made come up to him.
Last I checked Marquez fought last at 135 and is coming up to 144 for the fight. That's making a small guy come to you.
back to the fact that Pacquiao is no different, last time i checked Oscar Larios was no featherweight and had just gotten stopped by Vazquez at super bantam
larios was the only one who had balls to fight pac in manila. Pac didnt care who he was going to fight that night, Larios got the chance got beat up and got paid the most in his career. Jmm is not the only guy who would love to fight floyd, look at the welterweight roster everybody there would fight floyd but floyd would rather fight a lightweight who hasnt even fought at junior welterweight.
Re: Cotto's welterweight belt is on the line!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Julius Rain
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ClubberLang
Last I checked Marquez fought last at 135 and is coming up to 144 for the fight. That's making a small guy come to you.
back to the fact that Pacquiao is no different, last time i checked Oscar Larios was no featherweight and had just gotten stopped by Vazquez at super bantam
larios was the only one who had balls to fight pac in manila. Pac didnt care who he was going to fight that night, Larios got the chance got beat up and got paid the most in his career. Jmm is not the only guy who would love to fight floyd, look at the welterweight roster everybody there would fight floyd but floyd would rather fight a lightweight who hasnt even fought at junior welterweight.
what are you talkin about Casamayor, Soto, JMM, Guzman, etc all were calling Pacquiao out, and why the hell did it have to be in Manila? neither one of the two were American so a fight in any of the 50 states would of been in neutral grounds, Pacquiao has never been an avoided fighter, so don't try to play that card
Re: Cotto's welterweight belt is on the line!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Julius Rain
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
back to the fact that Pacquiao is no different, last time i checked Oscar Larios was no featherweight and had just gotten stopped by Vazquez at super bantam
larios was the only one who had balls to fight pac in manila. Pac didnt care who he was going to fight that night, Larios got the chance got beat up and got paid the most in his career. Jmm is not the only guy who would love to fight floyd, look at the welterweight roster everybody there would fight floyd but floyd would rather fight a lightweight who hasnt even fought at junior welterweight.
what are you talkin about Casamayor, Soto, JMM, Guzman, etc all were calling Pacquiao out, and why the hell did it have to be in Manila? neither one of the two were American so a fight in any of the 50 states would of been in neutral grounds, Pacquiao has never been an avoided fighter, so don't try to play that card
you once again prove your level of knowledge, at the time pac wanted a hometown fight and nobody step up so larious was the tune up. Besides JMM those other guys you named made very little effort to actually get in the ring with pac. Larious didnt care, he step up and fought pac nobody else would.
Re: Cotto's welterweight belt is on the line!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Julius Rain
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Julius Rain
larios was the only one who had balls to fight pac in manila. Pac didnt care who he was going to fight that night, Larios got the chance got beat up and got paid the most in his career. Jmm is not the only guy who would love to fight floyd, look at the welterweight roster everybody there would fight floyd but floyd would rather fight a lightweight who hasnt even fought at junior welterweight.
what are you talkin about Casamayor, Soto, JMM, Guzman, etc all were calling Pacquiao out, and why the hell did it have to be in Manila? neither one of the two were American so a fight in any of the 50 states would of been in neutral grounds, Pacquiao has never been an avoided fighter, so don't try to play that card
you once again prove your level of knowledge, at the time pac wanted a hometown fight and nobody step up so larious was the tune up. Besides JMM those other guys you named made very little effort to actually get in the ring with pac. Larious didnt care, he step up and fought pac nobody else would.
dude you're proving to be pretty whacked out cause Pacquiao was never avoided by anyone, he's no Winky Wright or Paul Williams, if he wanted a hometown fight he could have taken on a hometown bum, didn't have to call out a superbantamweight :rolleyes: quit tryin to sugar coat it, it's the same bullshit that Mayweather is doing with Marquez, only difference is that Mayweather is making the effort to go a bit down in weight
Re: Cotto's welterweight belt is on the line!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Julius Rain
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
what are you talkin about Casamayor, Soto, JMM, Guzman, etc all were calling Pacquiao out, and why the hell did it have to be in Manila? neither one of the two were American so a fight in any of the 50 states would of been in neutral grounds, Pacquiao has never been an avoided fighter, so don't try to play that card
you once again prove your level of knowledge, at the time pac wanted a hometown fight and nobody step up so larious was the tune up. Besides JMM those other guys you named made very little effort to actually get in the ring with pac. Larious didnt care, he step up and fought pac nobody else would.
dude you're proving to be pretty whacked out cause Pacquiao was never avoided by anyone, he's no Winky Wright or Paul Williams, if he wanted a hometown fight he could have taken on a hometown bum, didn't have to call out a superbantamweight :rolleyes: quit tryin to sugar coat it, it's the same bullshit that Mayweather is doing with Marquez, only difference is that Mayweather is making the effort to go a bit down in weight
your efforts to discredit pac in anyway is truly pathetic, it is a waste of time responding to you.
