^^^are you serious..PBF is no where near top 20
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^^^are you serious..PBF is no where near top 20
I like Ray and believe he is talented but some of his wins are the hugest gifts in boxing one way or another....Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
EG- Ray beat a weight drained unhealthy Duran (Yes Durans fault I know)..and a waaay past his best Duran, The Hagler fight goes the same....He retired with 40 fights, his time was short and his career wins are not all what they seem...
His best wins are over Benitez and Hearns 1...He has a lot of ham and eggers on his resume.....
For a 20 yr career and only 40 fights it does not do it for me.....Just my opp
Well going to have to disagree because for one thing Benitez what ever shape he was in was Leonard first title fight and Duran the first fight i thought was close and i dont think Duran would of won if Leonard did not fight his fight so it goes both ways the way i see it the Hearns win well nothing really to debate about you bring up Hagler being old but the funney thing is that he was active Leonard was not and it was his first time at the weight had not fought top oppent in god knows how long reason he did not have many fights is because of layoffs i dont think we ever got to see a prime Leonard because of the Hearns fight i would say not to mention he held belts in WW,LMW,MW,SMW,LHW that in it self is a good achivement not many have done it and wont be to many more to Wilfred Benitez,Roberto Duran,Marvin Hagler,Donny Lalonde,Ayub Kalule, Thomas Hearns those are the best wins he has had and i just linked them because there are a few people wont know but they had good records Bernard to me fought alot of crap to in his regian daxx i just think that Leonard was the better all around fighter and better in the speed and power and foot work department and had the better wins and moved up in weight and captured more titles so it has to Leonard for me but its just a opion just wanted to see why you rated him so high and no Ray Leonard and you gave me your reason so i rep you for that always nice to hear what you had to say.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
Actually Hagler being old was not what I meant..Though looking back at it sounded that way...I meant by saying ...Hagler fight the same....As in Ray was given a gift...My fault for wording it wrong.....Marvin was still on top of ther world when he faced Ray
And like I said in some other post though Hopkins has had such a long time at the top and has fought sooo many top level fighters./..he is 44 and still a P4P great...He has never been dominated...He has beaten other P4P fighters.....Before hios move to LGW if I had made this list Leonard would have been above him but fact is Bernard has managed to be a kingpin of 2 divisions,,,Moved up 2 divisions in his 40's...won the Ring title...and competed with the likes of Joe Calzaghe and dismantled the man who was feared in Pavlik....
Opps are opps there are no reAl right or wrong answers in these list...(Unless you have Charlie Zelenoff and Kid Thunder as #1 and #2:hypnotized:)...Everyone rates fighters different ways....though most list are the same by people who know the sport it is just position of where the guys are on that changes..
Rep returned
i made some revisions...see my first post
revised list...
1. Sugar Ray Robinson
2. Henry Armstrong
3. Muhammad Ali
4. Joe Louis
5. Sam Langford
6. Harry Greb
7. Ezzard Charles
8. Willie Pep
9. Roberto Duran
10. Archie Moore
11. Benny Leonard
12. Ray Leonard
13. Pernell Whitaker
14. Bob Fitzsimmons
15. Joe Gans
16. Carlos Monzon
17. Barney Ross
18. Jack Johnson
19. Marvin Hagler
20. Jimmy Wilde
21. Mickey Walker
22. Sandy Saddler
23. Julio Cesar Chavez
24. Alexis Arguello
25. Rocky Marciano
26. Gene Tunney
27. Roy Jones Jr
28. Lennox Lewis
29. Evander Holyfield
30. Bernard Hopkins
31. Jack Dempsey
32. Manny Pacquiao
33. Eder Jofre
34. Tony Canzoneri
35. Emile Griffith
36. Barbados Joe Walcott
37. Kid Gavilan
38. Salvador Sanchez
39. Ike Williams
40. Charley Burley
41. Larry Holmes
42. Floyd Mayweather Jr
43. Thomas Hearns
44. Jimmy McLarnin
45. Stanley Ketchel
46. Tommy Loughran
47. Michael Spinks
48. Ruben Olivares
49. Jose Napoles
50. Fighting Harada
51. Dick Tiger
52. Panama Al Brown
53. Tiger Flowers
54. Manuel Ortiz
55. Kid Chocolate
56. Wilfredo Gomez
57. Bob Foster
58. Billy Conn
59. George Foreman
60. Joe Frazier
61. Jake LaMotta
62. Abe Attel
63. Carmen Basilio
64. Carlos Ortiz
65. Aaron Pryor.
66. Terry McGovern
67. Tommy Ryan
68. Jim Jeffries
69. Ricardo Lopez
70. Jack Britton
71. Ted Kid Lewis
72. Carlos Zarate
73. Wilfred Benitez
74. Oscar De La Hoya
75. Felix Trinidad
76. Joe Brown
77. Shane Mosley
78. Luis Manuel Rodriguez
79. Pancho Villa
80. Azumah Nelson
81. Erik Morales
82. Pascual Perez
83. Marco Antonio Barrera
84. Joe Calzaghe
85. Mike Tyson
86. Harry Wills
87. Juan Manuel Marquez
88. Miguel Canto
89. Marcel Cerdan
90. Flash Elorde
91. Holman Williams
92. John Dundee
93. Mike McCallum
94. Antonio Cervantes
95. Nicolino Locche
96. George Dixon
97. Sonny Liston
98. Packey McFarland
99. Khaosai Galaxy
100. Benny Lynch
101. Freddie Welsh
102. Jimmy Bivins
103. Harold Johnson
104. Bob Montgomery
105. Vicente Saldivar
106. Beau Jack
107. Maxie Rosenbloom
108. Gene Fullmer
109. Eusebio Pedroza
110. Lloyd Marshall
111. Lou Ambers
112. Battling Nelson
113. James Toney
114. Jim Driscoll
115. Jeff Fenech
116. Johnny Kilbane
117. Pete Herman
118. Kosta Tszyu
119. Freddie Miller
120. Nino Benvenuti
121. Georges Carpentier
122. Ken Buchanan
123. Duilio Loi
124. Winky Wright
125. Tommy Gibbons
126. Philidelphia Jack O'Brien
127. Jack Kid Berg
128. Non Pareil Jack Dempsey
129. Jack Blackburn
130. Johnny Tapia