Re: Who's next for Wladimir?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
generalbulldog
I think title defenses should only count when they are recognized as the universal champ or lineal champ. Tyson only has 3 or 4 as the recognized 'man' in the division. Quite a few people out there don't recognize him as being the youngest champ over Patterson or that Tyson was not really champ until he beat the lineal champ in Spinks.
Wlad could get to 25 title defenses for his ABC straps and it would not be recognized as great as Joe Louis 25 title defenses. And I don't even need to get into the reason why, especially in a era of 4 champs per division by the ABCs.
OK so what are we not counting yet? Or do we start when Wlad beat Sultan? Do we start when Wlad beat Chagaev?
ono....fine whatever you say, without fighting ANYONE Chicken Little and now Audley Harrison could beat EVERYONE....fucking comical how that works out. Who beat these guys before Wlad? Who stopped them? Who dominated them? You know why Ruiz and Valuev never fought Wlad? Because Don King knew they would lose and Don King had no piece of Wladimir and wasn't going to have a piece of them and so he chose not to put his fighters in with guys that would beat them.
The point is title "defenses" today are almost meaningless unless one is the universal champ of the division because of the 4 champs per division. When Louis or Ali were HW champs, it wasn't even disputed, although the WBA did strip it's portion of the title from Ali when he beat Liston the 1st time, Ali was still recognized as the universal champ from boxing circles and the public.
So the question needs to be asked, when was Wlad recognized as the universal champ? And start counting his defenses from there.
ANd people need to stop bringing up performances that 1 fighter did to another in the amateurs, it doesn't mean jack in the pro game. By that logic Tillman should have beaten Tyson and Holyfield easily because he beat them in the amateurs, but reality was he got brutally knockout by both in the pros.
Re: Who's next for Wladimir?
I think you guys that are defending wlad just need to give up, its obvious haye is the heavyweight savior and we should be in awe of his powers. All opponents that wlad has fought have been shit and not basically the top rated at the time, every opponent he has ever fought have been handpicked bums and however long it took wlad to beat them, haye would have done it in a round...:rolleyes:
Re: Who's next for Wladimir?
Ono Audley has the talent to beat Peter for sure but he has done NOTHING as a pro to make anyone believe he would actually do so. With Thompson, Chambers and Chagaev, it's not even a question if they beat Audley imo. Raw talent isn't everyone, you have to be there mentally and Audley has never been there.
Re: Who's next for Wladimir?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
generalbulldog
I think title defenses should only count when they are recognized as the universal champ or lineal champ. Tyson only has 3 or 4 as the recognized 'man' in the division. Quite a few people out there don't recognize him as being the youngest champ over Patterson or that Tyson was not really champ until he beat the lineal champ in Spinks.
Wlad could get to 25 title defenses for his ABC straps and it would not be recognized as great as Joe Louis 25 title defenses. And I don't even need to get into the reason why, especially in a era of 4 champs per division by the ABCs.
OK so what are we not counting yet? Or do we start when Wlad beat Sultan? Do we start when Wlad beat Chagaev?
ono....fine whatever you say, without fighting ANYONE Chicken Little and now Audley Harrison could beat EVERYONE....fucking comical how that works out. Who beat these guys before Wlad? Who stopped them? Who dominated them? You know why Ruiz and Valuev never fought Wlad? Because Don King knew they would lose and Don King had no piece of Wladimir and wasn't going to have a piece of them and so he chose not to put his fighters in with guys that would beat them.
I never said either of them could beat anyone. I said you could make a case for Harrison beating Peter, as you could for him beating Thompson and Chambers. I also said you could make a case for him losing against all 3. The reason i said this, is because the difference in quality between all 4 fighters seriously isn't that great, and i believe Harrison is a more dangerous opponent for Haye, than any of the above 3 are for Wlad.
Re: Who's next for Wladimir?
Eh I guess we're just going to disagree then on everything but your last point. Of course there is a case to be made for Harrison beating those guys but it would be a huge upset imo. I mean none of those guys are going to be losing to Dominic Guinn or Michael Sprott anytime soon, just don't think Audley is mentally capable of beating a top 20 heavyweight.
I will say though that because he at least has a size advantage that he is more dangerous to Haye then any of those guys were to Wlad. That's because he has a size advantage only though. No way he wins though.
Re: Who's next for Wladimir?
[QUOTE=Rantcatrat;903438][QUOTE=Hornfinger;903431]
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Originally Posted by
El Kabong
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Originally Posted by
Hornfinger
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Originally Posted by
Master
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Originally Posted by
Hornfinger
Well peter is pretty shit
Areola, fat and crap.
Thompson
Chambers
Moli
Even Corey Sanders was meant to be an easy ass fight on paper it just backfired.
#1 Wlad didn't defend any title vs Moli, he didn't have a title at that time. It was a comeback fight after the Sanders loss.
#2 All those guys would beat or be competitive vs Chicken Little much less Audley.
Bullshit.
Horn. They would all beat Audley. Every one of them. And all would be better fights against Haye than Audley by a ton. Where is Audley ranked right now? Where were those guys ranked when Wlad fought them?
I disagree those guys are just as shit as audley harrison, I also find it funny that after all the threads damning the alphabet title organizations all of a sudden you want to start taking their rankings seriously.
Re: Who's next for Wladimir?
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Originally Posted by
Hornfinger
I disagree those guys are just as shit as audley harrison, I also find it funny that after all the threads damning the alphabet title organizations all of a sudden you want to start taking their rankings seriously.
You can disagree and that's your OPINION, but the FACT is that they are better than Audley and they would challenge Chicken Little more than anyone he's faced in the division thus far.
Re: Who's next for Wladimir?
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Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Hornfinger
I disagree those guys are just as shit as audley harrison, I also find it funny that after all the threads damning the alphabet title organizations all of a sudden you want to start taking their rankings seriously.
You can disagree and that's your OPINION, but the FACT is that they are better than Audley and they would challenge Chicken Little more than anyone he's faced in the division thus far.
please don't pass your biased opinion off as fact.
Re: Who's next for Wladimir?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Hornfinger
please don't pass your biased opinion off as fact.
OK... let's look at these fighters compared to Audley Harrison
Audley has lost to: Danny Williams, Dominick Guinn, Michael Sprott, and Martin Rogan
Tony Thompson BEAT Dominick Guinn, he beat him easily, Thompson has only lost to Wlad and some dude in his 5th pro fight but he's beaten: Guinn, Timor Ibragimov, and he stopped Luan Krasniqi...those aren't great names but they are better than anyone Audley has beaten.
Eddie Chambers despite being tiny for a heavyweight has only lost twice once vs Wladimir and once vs Povetkin...and big props to him for having the balls to fight both of those guys to begin with.
Cris Arreola is fat and lazy but he's a dangerous fighter (at least when he fought Vitali he was). He's lost to Vitali and Adamek but he's easily beaten better fighters than Audley
Re: Who's next for Wladimir?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Hornfinger
please don't pass your biased opinion off as fact.
OK... let's look at these fighters compared to Audley Harrison
Audley has lost to: Danny Williams, Dominick Guinn, Michael Sprott, and Martin Rogan
Tony Thompson BEAT Dominick Guinn, he beat him easily, Thompson has only lost to Wlad and some dude in his 5th pro fight but he's beaten: Guinn, Timor Ibragimov, and he stopped Luan Krasniqi...those aren't great names but they are better than anyone Audley has beaten.
Eddie Chambers despite being tiny for a heavyweight has only lost twice once vs Wladimir and once vs Povetkin...and big props to him for having the balls to fight both of those guys to begin with.
Cris Arreola is fat and lazy but he's a dangerous fighter (at least when he fought Vitali he was). He's lost to Vitali and Adamek but he's easily beaten better fighters than Audley
Kenny norton beat Muhammed Ali, So really your saying Norton should be heralded as 'the GOAT'
i think you'll also find that aud beat both williams and sprott in rematches. But thats beside the point. Aud's shit but so is tony thompson and eddie chambers and arreola, doesn't matter how much you try to tart them up. You can't polish a turd.
Re: Who's next for Wladimir?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Hornfinger
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Hornfinger
please don't pass your biased opinion off as fact.
OK... let's look at these fighters compared to Audley Harrison
Audley has lost to: Danny Williams, Dominick Guinn, Michael Sprott, and Martin Rogan
Tony Thompson BEAT Dominick Guinn, he beat him easily, Thompson has only lost to Wlad and some dude in his 5th pro fight but he's beaten: Guinn, Timor Ibragimov, and he stopped Luan Krasniqi...those aren't great names but they are better than anyone Audley has beaten.
Eddie Chambers despite being tiny for a heavyweight has only lost twice once vs Wladimir and once vs Povetkin...and big props to him for having the balls to fight both of those guys to begin with.
Cris Arreola is fat and lazy but he's a dangerous fighter (at least when he fought Vitali he was). He's lost to Vitali and Adamek but he's easily beaten better fighters than Audley
Kenny norton beat Muhammed Ali, So really your saying Norton should be heralded as 'the GOAT'
i think you'll also find that aud beat both williams and sprott in rematches. But thats beside the point. Aud's shit but so is tony thompson and eddie chambers and arreola, doesn't matter how much you try to tart them up. You can't polish a turd.
Ken Norton beat Muhammed Ali twice ;)
Re: Who's next for Wladimir?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ICB
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Hornfinger
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Hornfinger
please don't pass your biased opinion off as fact.
OK... let's look at these fighters compared to Audley Harrison
Audley has lost to: Danny Williams, Dominick Guinn, Michael Sprott, and Martin Rogan
Tony Thompson BEAT Dominick Guinn, he beat him easily, Thompson has only lost to Wlad and some dude in his 5th pro fight but he's beaten: Guinn, Timor Ibragimov, and he stopped Luan Krasniqi...those aren't great names but they are better than anyone Audley has beaten.
Eddie Chambers despite being tiny for a heavyweight has only lost twice once vs Wladimir and once vs Povetkin...and big props to him for having the balls to fight both of those guys to begin with.
Cris Arreola is fat and lazy but he's a dangerous fighter (at least when he fought Vitali he was). He's lost to Vitali and Adamek but he's easily beaten better fighters than Audley
Kenny norton beat Muhammed Ali, So really your saying Norton should be heralded as 'the GOAT'
i think you'll also find that aud beat both williams and sprott in rematches. But thats beside the point. Aud's shit but so is tony thompson and eddie chambers and arreola, doesn't matter how much you try to tart them up. You can't polish a turd.
Ken Norton beat Muhammed Ali twice ;)
Exactly, so why anyone even remembers who that Ali guy is is beyond me... :p
Re: Who's next for Wladimir?
I think at some point Harrison will hit Haye on that weak chin, and its over!
