P4P MMA

You see these all the time in boxing and after watching both Penn and Shamrock win this weekend I was wondering who yall think are p4p the best....since MMA is so young this is not a current list but an ATG list

1. Fedor
2. BJ Penn
3. Frank Shamrock
4. Matt Hughes
5. Big Nogs
6. Wanderlei
7. Chuck
8. Shogun
9. Gomi
10. Sakuraba
hon mention: Yamamato, Royce, Coleman, Bas, Couture, Ken Shamrock, Mirko, Barnett
guys who might make it in : GSP, Gonzaga, Franklin, Sokoudju, Rampage
this isn't in any specific order either


any thoughts

Very good list. How about Sean Sherk? I'd have to put him in the top 10. His resume is stacked and his only losses came from Hughes and GSP (I think), who are naturally larger men.

Yeah Sherk definately belongs in the conversation

No Gracies?

My list.
0. Chuck Norris O0
1. Dan Henderson
2. Fedor
3. BJ Penn
4. Randy Couture
5. Shogun
6. Sakuraba
7. Matt Hughes
8. Big Nogs
9. Quinton Jackson
10. Chuck Liddell

I think these guys deserve mention too
Sean Sherk, Rich Franklin, Bas Rutten, Frank Shamrock, Cro-Cop, Coleman, Tito, Wandy, Gomi

Could be someday
Nick Diaz, Diego Sanchez, Brandon Vera, Roger Huerta

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Originally Posted by VanChilds

You see these all the time in boxing and after watching both Penn and Shamrock win this weekend I was wondering who yall think are p4p the best....since MMA is so young this is not a current list but an ATG list

1. Fedor
2. BJ Penn
3. Frank Shamrock
4. Matt Hughes
5. Big Nogs
6. Wanderlei
7. Chuck
8. Shogun
9. Gomi
10. Sakuraba
hon mention: Yamamato, Royce, Coleman, Bas, Couture, Ken Shamrock, Mirko, Barnett
guys who might make it in : GSP, Gonzaga, Franklin, Sokoudju, Rampage
this isn't in any specific order either


any thoughts

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Having Penn at #2 is a joke. Having Shamrock in the top 10 is somewhat of a joke as well.

I don't think either Shamrock should be on there. Hall of fame maybe for what they did for the sport.

BJ Penn on the other hand, does nothing but dominate both welterweight and lightweight. Its his conditioning problem that lost his fights against Hughes and GSP. Thats why he's not the best welterweight of all but we're talking P4P, and I think he's top 5 easy.

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Originally Posted by Nate17

I don't think either Shamrock should be on there. Hall of fame maybe for what they did for the sport.

BJ Penn on the other hand, does nothing but dominate both welterweight and lightweight. Its his conditioning problem that lost his fights against Hughes and GSP. Thats why he's not the best welterweight of all but we're talking P4P, and I think he's top 5 easy.

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He's 11-4-1, and he hasn't dominated any weight class.

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He's 11-4-1, and he hasn't dominated any weight class.

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His four losses include an undefeated Ryoto Machida(205 lb. light heavyweight), which he took to a decision, and 3 UFC champions, which he lost 2 from decision.

He's beaten some good fighters in both weight classes, including his title win over Matt Hughes, his win over current welterweight champ Matt Serra, and his win over Takanori Gomi, who's the lightweight champ in PRIDE.

If he gets his cardio taken care of he'll be a very dangerous fighter in either weight class, and surely deserves to be considered a true P4P fighter.

i would say bj penn is pfp best but my favorite fighter is gsp becouse of his stand up fighting style of cousre u can't go wrong with fador or sakuraba??

bj is the most talented mma fighter ever

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Originally Posted by Nate17

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He's 11-4-1, and he hasn't dominated any weight class.

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His four losses include an undefeated Ryoto Machida(205 lb. light heavyweight), which he took to a decision, and 3 UFC champions, which he lost 2 from decision.

He's beaten some good fighters in both weight classes, including his title win over Matt Hughes, his win over current welterweight champ Matt Serra, and his win over Takanori Gomi, who's the lightweight champ in PRIDE.

If he gets his cardio taken care of he'll be a very dangerous fighter in either weight class, and surely deserves to be considered a true P4P fighter.

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IF he gets his cardio taken care of, IF he gets motivated, IF this, IF that. Too many ifs for BJ. He is arguably the most talented MMA fighter ever, but mentally he is not there. He doesn't suffer from not being smart enough or having the tools to put it all together, he suffers from thinking he is too good and that he's just gonna run through everyone based on his talent. He doesn't train like he should, and he doesn't get motivated like he should, and it always leads to excuses from his fans. He has had good performances and showed flashes of why he could be the best, but he doesn't have it upstairs. Fedor has what BJ has plus he has it upstairs. He is without question the best MMA fighter to ever fight.

I'm not really a big fan of Penn, but I respect skill when I see it. I've seen him beat people who were supposed to beat him over and over again in both weight classes. He isn't perfect and we all know his big flaw, but thats why I believe while he's not the best in UFC yet, he's a true great P4P fighter.

And yes, I think Fedor is more legit than Penn. He's got a better fight resume than anyone in the game. Thats why I got him over Penn.

2 things

1 - BJ penn belongs NOWHERE near the top of any list

2 - people saying ken shamrock doesnt belong need to realize he was already past his prime by the time he got mainstream, the ken shamrock of pancrase was an all time great

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2 things

1 - BJ penn belongs NOWHERE near the top of any list

2 - people saying ken shamrock doesnt belong need to realize he was already past his prime by the time he got mainstream, the ken shamrock of pancrase was an all time great

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Well we're all entitled to our opinions. I guess Penn's wins over elite competition in 2 divisions amounts to nothing.

As for Shamrock, he was good in Pancrase but the competition was soft. Beating Bas Rutten twice was his only mentionable wins. While he helped pioneer the sport of MMA, I wouldn't consider him a best P4P fighter. I don't think he'd ever stand with the likes of Shogun, Rampage, Silva, Nogs, or Liddell even in his prime. Thats never going to happen though so its all moot at this point.