How Important is a Good Trainer?

I was having an arguement with a buddy of mine about trainers...He tried to say that the trainer does not matter...once the fighhter knows how to fight the trainer is just there more or less for workouts etc....

I tried to argue the fact that many of great fighters have been brought to new levels by a great trainer...and explained the importance of certain trainers knowing how to get the most of a fighter...

He continues to disagree...Just wondering what some of eveyones opp is on how important a good trainer is for a fighter at any level be it on a physical or mental level

Depends on both the trainer and fighter. Look at Manny with JT. Obviously Manny is a legend, but he can't seem to crack that shell known as JT's mental state. JT's got all the tools but doesn't listen, and no trainer can make him, unless they legalize firearms in the ring so Manny can stick a gun in JT's face and wake his a** up. Look at Judah, I think that is a case of bad training and weak mentality. Zab looks for sympathy with his family and seems to zone out or something, I don't know. Would be interesting to see if a different trainer could be beneficial or even more detrimental to Zab. I believe though the fighter has to want it and listen to the trainer, or it's all for nothing. Talent without focus and desire is still just talent. Just look at Balboa after Mick died ::** May be off base, just my thoughts.

Trainers are usually very important, but it also depends on the fighter. Some fighter are just disciplined and know how to train right and can correct their own mistakes most of the time. The majority of fighters need a trainer to pick up on things that the fighter may miss at the very least.

CC's to both

Yes Legion Rocky Balboa is a fine example ::** ;)

Youve got more chance with a good one than a bad one.

I think it's very important for most of your career but becomes less important after a certain level of success has been reached.

Once your level of greatness has been determined than it becomes more clear how long you need to stick with one trainer or if you are good enough to bounce around and still maintain your skill level.

I think of weight training. The idea is to have a trainer teach you how to train so that eventually you can do it on your own. A lot of people never gain the confidence they need to proceed without a trainer overseeing the entire process. I see training for fights the same way, except for sparring and hitting the mitts, you need another body for that.

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Originally Posted by Scrap

Youve got more chance with a good one than a bad one.

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Originally Posted by BoxingGorilla

I think it's very important for most of your career but becomes less important after a certain level of success has been reached.

Once your level of greatness has been determined than it becomes more clear how long you need to stick with one trainer or if you are good enough to bounce around and still maintain your skill level.

I think of weight training. The idea is to have a trainer teach you how to train so that eventually you can do it on your own. A lot of people never gain the confidence they need to proceed without a trainer overseeing the entire process. I see training for fights the same way, except for sparring and hitting the mitts, you need another body for that.

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CC's for the input

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Originally Posted by BoxingGorilla

I think it's very important for most of your career but becomes less important after a certain level of success has been reached.

Once your level of greatness has been determined than it becomes more clear how long you need to stick with one trainer or if you are good enough to bounce around and still maintain your skill level.

I think of weight training. The idea is to have a trainer teach you how to train so that eventually you can do it on your own. A lot of people never gain the confidence they need to proceed without a trainer overseeing the entire process. I see training for fights the same way, except for sparring and hitting the mitts, you need another body for that.

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Probably most experienced fighters could pretty much train themselves in as much as getting into the physical conditioning they need for a fight, providing they were motivated at least, but a trainers input is surely invaluable for coming up with a fight plan to beat a specific opponent, sort out what and when your going to eat, give you motivation and encouragement and to instill confidence.

For any up and coming fighter a decent trainer is probably really important, however I think a lot of what makes a good boxer is just the basics, heart, discipline, eat well, train hard, don't do drugs, smoking, alcohol, and get the basic boxing fundamentals in place.

Therefore I don't think you need an elite trainer to do well, but rather one who is committed to you and who ingrains in a fighter all the basics.

However to my mind the best advantage of having an elite trainer would be the sparring available. If you're a young featherweight, training with Manny Pacquaio and a host of developing Asian stars with Team Roach will bring you on a whole lot more than training in Hartlepool and sparring with Michael Hunter for example.

You should be looking to learn new things all the time, anyone that thinks they got it all down and they dont need to improve, well they are setting themselves up for a rude awakening. Even guys like Hopkins admit they dont know it all, he claimed to have picked up a few things working with Roach. Thats a 42 y.o. still learning.

However to my mind the best advantage of having an elite trainer would be the sparring available. If you're a young featherweight, training with Manny Pacquaio and a host of developing Asian stars with Team Roach will bring you on a whole lot more than training in Hartlepool and sparring with Michael Hunter for example. Bilbo


EXCELLENT Point!

I am bitter that I did not think of it ;D

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Originally Posted by Bilbo

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Originally Posted by BoxingGorilla

I think it's very important for most of your career but becomes less important after a certain level of success has been reached.

Once your level of greatness has been determined than it becomes more clear how long you need to stick with one trainer or if you are good enough to bounce around and still maintain your skill level.

I think of weight training. The idea is to have a trainer teach you how to train so that eventually you can do it on your own. A lot of people never gain the confidence they need to proceed without a trainer overseeing the entire process. I see training for fights the same way, except for sparring and hitting the mitts, you need another body for that.

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Probably most experienced fighters could pretty much train themselves in as much as getting into the physical conditioning they need for a fight, providing they were motivated at least, but a trainers input is surely invaluable for coming up with a fight plan to beat a specific opponent, sort out what and when your going to eat, give you motivation and encouragement and to instill confidence.

For any up and coming fighter a decent trainer is probably really important, however I think a lot of what makes a good boxer is just the basics, heart, discipline, eat well, train hard, don't do drugs, smoking, alcohol, and get the basic boxing fundamentals in place.

Therefore I don't think you need an elite trainer to do well, but rather one who is committed to you and who ingrains in a fighter all the basics.

However to my mind the best advantage of having an elite trainer would be the sparring available. If you're a young featherweight, training with Manny Pacquaio and a host of developing Asian stars with Team Roach will bring you on a whole lot more than training in Hartlepool and sparring with Michael Hunter for example.

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Originally Posted by No Contest

You should be looking to learn new things all the time, anyone that thinks they got it all down and they dont need to improve, well they are setting themselves up for a rude awakening. Even guys like Hopkins admit they dont know it all, he claimed to have picked up a few things working with Roach. Thats a 42 y.o. still learning.

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CC's for the input

Can be the missing link between good and great. There are some teams that had the same players but they didn't win titles till they got the new coach. Trainers are extremely important. I think SRL and Ali benefited greatly from working with Dundee. I think there are some that know how to teach a guy the fundamentals and develop a fighter, then there are some that just come up with the right game plan and get the fighter to listen. I think that is a big part of it also. Some guys can make a fighter listen and some can't. I know you can't "force" them, but that's the talent of some trainers.

Also every fighter needs a trainer. You need someone with an outside perspective to tell you what you are doing wrong, etc. You can't see yourself, can't watch yourself, and if you do your not doing the technique right because you are watching yourself instead of fully focusing.

You can really tell the strengths of most trainers also. McGirt is really good with relating with fighters and teaching and improving their skill set, but he's not a good strategist in my opinion. I think Steward is a good fundamentalist and strategist but he's seems to have fighters that consistently don't listen to him. I think its very interesting to see the differences brought about by trainers. To me one of the biggest examples was Tyson with Rooney and without Rooney. Dramatic difference and illustrates the point.

THe sooner the fighter starts with a good trainer the better. IF they group with a great trainer it really helps out, and makes them a better fighter. However, the trainer has to understand what strengths the fighter inherently has, and what weaknesses he naturally possesses as well. Its not just about any fighter going with any trainer, because each trainer likes to train a specific type of fighter. Steward like the tall fighters that have a good jab and right cross, Floyd Mayweather SR. likes the speedy slick fighters, Roy Jones Snr like the incredibly fast fighters (Gainer, RJJ, Mundine). Buddy likes washed up or bad fighters. The one coach who I think can really adapt and train a lot of styles is Freddie Roach, and I think it would be a benefit for any fighter to go to him. He doesn't really train guys to change their style, he integrates pieces into the style they already have which takes a lot of knowledge of both different styles, and training techniques on Roach's part.

Very important.... I mean give Joe C. a shitty trainer who's telling Joe he was loosing the fight coming into the 12th round against Kess and that he needed a KO or else he'd loose? Joes not counting the rounds in his head he's got more important things on his mind that's why he has his trainer to let him know how he's doing so yes a good trainer is indeed very important. I'm gonna give you 2 trainers a good one and a bad one.

Good Tainer: "You gotta fucken get inside of 'em now"

Bad Trainer: "The fight is hanging on this round Mel, this is the last and final round you need it"


A more recent example of how important a trainer can be is Abner watch him pre-Nacho and then watch him post-Nacho see the major difference.
Watch BCD pre-Floyd Sr. and then watch BCD post-Floyd Sr. see the major difference there.

Didn't the great Julio Ceasar Chavez train himself for like his first 80 fights or something?