Re: Hattons Prime - The myth
I think he was in his prime for the Mayweather fight. You completely overlook the mental effect a loss can have on an undefeated fighter. Especially one with as many fans as Hatton. I dont think he was the same after he got beat. There was a different look and confidence about him pre Mayweather imo.
Re: Hattons Prime - The myth
Actually I seem to recall people, the HBO team especially, already talking about how his between fight drinking and binges were affecting him as early as the Urango fight.
Also, as has been said, the mental affect on a boxer's psyching being knocked out cannot be under estimated. There are countless fighters who were never the same after a beating, they just no longer had the belief deep down.
Pacquaio is clearly a better fighter than Ricky ever was though, no disputing that.
Re: Hattons Prime - The myth
Quote:
Originally Posted by
J_C
I think he was in his prime for the Mayweather fight. You completely overlook the mental effect a loss can have on an undefeated fighter. Especially one with as many fans as Hatton. I dont think he was the same after he got beat. There was a different look and confidence about him pre Mayweather imo.
I disagree. One loss and we are going to talk about mental aspects...so lets say Tszyu wasnt in his prime for the Hatton fight because he lost to Vince Phillips. Both Tszyu and Hatton won fights after the mayweather fight ;) It goes both ways.
Re: Hattons Prime - The myth
Its your opinion of course but I dont see what is difficult to believe about the mental side of things that I described. When youre unbeaten at 40-0 or whatever you probably feel like nothing can stop you and youre an unshakeable Godzilla. Then when you get KO'd you realise youre not and a lot of doubts creep in about your talent and all sorts. It can go both ways depending on how you deal with it of course but a loss can totally ruin a fighter even.
Pac is just a better fighter all round though im not suggesting Hatton beats him if he was still undefeated or anything.
Re: Hattons Prime - The myth
But why does everyone jump straight to the Mayweather loss and his binge drinking for the reason why he was never the same. Why doesnt anyone think that the step up in opposition may be the reason why he never looked the same?
Re: Hattons Prime - The myth
I thought Joe Cortez caused Hatton to break down more than Mayweather himself. Another masterpiece display from the horrid fat bastard and clearly I am not talking about Hatton there as he seemed to be in decent shape.
Hatton was really solid up until Mayweather and afterwards the slide set in. It doesn't take an Einstein to see the obvious.
Re: Hattons Prime - The myth
you must be a pacqiou fan....i love pacman...but seriously...hatton was so out of it by then...he struggled with paulie for christ sake, never said he would win, i just def think itd be a war, dont get offended on pacqious behalf, pacqiou has a ton of credible fights on his resume....hattons not one of them
Re: Hattons Prime - The myth
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Boxer4life
you must be a pacqiou fan....i love pacman...but seriously...hatton was so out of it by then...he struggled with paulie for christ sake, never said he would win, i just def think itd be a war, dont get offended on pacqious behalf, pacqiou has a ton of credible fights on his resume....hattons not one of them
...your kidding right....I picked Hatton to beat Pac. Hatton had just put on a masterful boxing clinic against Paulie and hes suddenly way out of it. Lets be clear, Hattons shit tactics against Pac has more to do with his poor performance than Hatton being past it. He had a bad gameplan, thats why he lost. Pac has dropped Mosley, had Margarito out on his feet, wobbled Delahoya (weight drained none the less) and koed hatton..I think we can all agree Pac has decent power at 140 and 147 so chin has nothing to do with it. A good power puncher can crack anyones chin if they land enough and I do not believe Mayweather hurt hattons punch resistance that much.
Hatton got pissed off with Cortez...yet another bad gameplan, it has nothing to do with hattons physical prime.
JT I agree Mayweather systematically broke Hatton down BUT Hatton wasnt being rocked constantly and wasnt really in trouble until the final round.
Fact of the matter is Hatton started fighting decent opposition after he fought Tszyu and your always going to look a little less dominant when fighting people more on your own level. You cant say you expected hatton to perform like he did against tackie or a past it vince phillips against guys like Collazo and mayweather. Two different levels completely.
FACT (sorry Fenster im borrowing this, you can have it back in the morning ;D) - Hattons gameplan is the reason for his shit performance against Pac (he was supposed to jab and box him...he tried to bull rush him...how can anyone not see this as him going away from the gameplan :-\ :confused: )
Re: Hattons Prime - The myth
Oh and I just thought of another thing.
Hatton fans answer me this - Kostya Tszyu was apparently at his peak when Hatton beat him after he demolished Sharmba (you guys say this all the time). This is all based on his performance before his last fight. Hattons last fight was against Paulie which he fought quite well and put on a boxing clinic so how can you now claim he wasnt at his best when he fought Pac? And if you wanna say it was evident against Lazcano that he was going down hill then its only fair that we say Tszyu was going down hill as seen in the Leija fight.
Just some food for thought ;D
(Sorry I know this part has turned into a Tszyu/Hatton thing but I only just thought of this after my last post and just had to ask ;D )
Re: Hattons Prime - The myth
Hatton beat Malinaggi becasue Paulie has no power and he could just walk through his shots. I remember watching the fight thinking how easily Hatton was getting tagged, it wasn't a complete one sided beatdown, it was just (like many of Paulie's fights) one fighter was doing damage with shots, the other wasn't.
Hatton was in his peak against Mayweather, he was in the shape of his life and everything (head, training etc) was in the right place. After the Mayweather loss, he was never the same, the loss hit him hard.
It's not fair to compare Tszu losing to Hatton losing, different fighters cope in different ways and with Hattons mentality, the fact he felt he had let down thousands, if not millions of die hard fans is a different experience to what most boxers will ever be fortunate enough to feel.
If Hatton was in his prime vs Pac, why would he not fight on after? He didn't, because he couldn't and he knew he was over the hill. I'm not saying the Pac fight was ever going to have a different result, but that certainly wasn't Hatton at his best.
By then, his punch resistance had gone, probably because of his out of the ring activities.
Re: Hattons Prime - The myth
I don't think Hatton was at all in his best form, but suspect we saw the same fight we would have anyways. It's more a case of how good Pacquiao actually was on that night, Hatton would've never had a prayer of not being stopped in some fashion imo.
Re: Hattons Prime - The myth
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Snakey
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Boxer4life
you must be a pacqiou fan....i love pacman...but seriously...hatton was so out of it by then...he struggled with paulie for christ sake, never said he would win, i just def think itd be a war, dont get offended on pacqious behalf, pacqiou has a ton of credible fights on his resume....hattons not one of them
...your kidding right....I picked Hatton to beat Pac. Hatton had just put on a masterful boxing clinic against Paulie and hes suddenly way out of it. Lets be clear, Hattons shit tactics against Pac has more to do with his poor performance than Hatton being past it. He had a bad gameplan, thats why he lost. Pac has dropped Mosley, had Margarito out on his feet, wobbled Delahoya (weight drained none the less) and koed hatton..I think we can all agree Pac has decent power at 140 and 147 so chin has nothing to do with it. A good power puncher can crack anyones chin if they land enough and I do not believe Mayweather hurt hattons punch resistance that much.
Hatton got pissed off with Cortez...yet another bad gameplan, it has nothing to do with hattons physical prime.
JT I agree Mayweather systematically broke Hatton down BUT Hatton wasnt being rocked constantly and wasnt really in trouble until the final round.
Fact of the matter is Hatton started fighting decent opposition after he fought Tszyu and your always going to look a little less dominant when fighting people more on your own level. You cant say you expected hatton to perform like he did against tackie or a past it vince phillips against guys like Collazo and mayweather. Two different levels completely.
FACT (sorry Fenster im borrowing this, you can have it back in the morning ;D) - Hattons gameplan is the reason for his shit performance against Pac (he was supposed to jab and box him...he tried to bull rush him...how can anyone not see this as him going away from the gameplan :-\ :confused: )
Good thread for the Hatton bashers, but some googd points raised.
The circumstances around the Pac loss goes a bit deeper than his gameplan. The help he received, or lack of it, from Floyd Snr was a big factor in the way he felt physically going into the fight. Any gameplan went out the window the day before the fight when he felt drained and weak. The training programme Floyd snr set for him didnt agree with him and felt physically weak going into the fight.
Common knowledge Ricky never performed well against southpaw's, you would of thought a trainer in the calibre of Floyd snr would address this - Nope - not one aspect of the training camp focused on this, very strange in my book.
Ricky's dad wanted this fight called off when he saw the state of Ricky when he landed in Vegas a couple of days before the fight. Ricky knew he had 2-3 rnds in him for this fight and went balls out to bullrush him and take him out. He rushed in he got caught, he got Sparked, end of.
In answer to the Prime question, I would say between 2003 -2007, from Phillips till Floyd really, after that personel and outside of boxing issues took a hold of his lif. His inbetween fight binges finally caught up with him.
