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Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
I've always said that Hearns was good chin short of being better than Hagler and Leonard - and that his long legs let him down by going to jelly when he got hit.
Somebody (Stebs) on the other Hearns thread mentioned that Hearns was well ahead after 12 rounds of the first fight with Leonard, and I think there is little doubt he won their 2nd fight.
So if 12 round fights came in sooner, would history have Hearns above Leonard in the all time great stakes?
I think the answer is YES
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
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Originally Posted by BIG H
I've always said that Hearns was good chin short of being better than Hagler and Leonard - and that his long legs let him down by going to jelly when he got hit.
Somebody (Stebs) on the other Hearns thread mentioned that Hearns was well ahead after 12 rounds of the first fight with Leonard, and I think there is little doubt he won their 2nd fight.
So if 12 round fights came in sooner, would history have Hearns above Leonard in the all time great stakes?
I think the answer is YES
You train differently for different amounts of rounds. What you are saying actually can not be proven because Leonard could of changed his game plan for 12 rounds and beat the shit out of Hearns. ;)
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leon
You're right Snakey, Leonard would have felt the sense of urgency earlier on in a 12 round fight, though it's impossible to tell if he would have pulled it off.
I also agree with Big H, Hearns would have been on a par with the other two if his chin was up to their standard. He still had one hell of a chin compared to regular guys.
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
them three and roberto in the same era ........ best ever group of fighters without a doubt
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snakey
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG H
I've always said that Hearns was good chin short of being better than Hagler and Leonard - and that his long legs let him down by going to jelly when he got hit.
Somebody (Stebs) on the other Hearns thread mentioned that Hearns was well ahead after 12 rounds of the first fight with Leonard, and I think there is little doubt he won their 2nd fight.
So if 12 round fights came in sooner, would history have Hearns above Leonard in the all time great stakes?
I think the answer is YES
You train differently for different amounts of rounds. What you are saying actually can not be proven because Leonard could of changed his game plan for 12 rounds and beat the S*** out of Hearns. ;)
I get your point - but in this particular case I doubt that at anytime Leonard's strategy was to get schooled for 13 rounds and then come on strong with 5 minutes of the fight left. I think he simply had no answer for Hearns and was heading for a comprehensive beating until he hit him with that big shot - fair play to him though, he pulled it out the bag!
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
Hearns had the measure of Leonard in terms of boxing ability IMO, he could have outboxed Hagler too but got his strategy all wrong. Hearns was my favourite fighter of the 80's but I sometimes think that his power actually hindered him at times.
What I mean is that because he knew he had one punch ko power in his right it made him stand his ground when he could actually outbox pretty much anybody & often this would be a better strategy.
Hearns was a little chinny but I still rate him as an all time great.
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
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Originally Posted by Googoogachoob
Hearns had the measure of Leonard in terms of boxing ability IMO, he could have outboxed Hagler too but got his strategy all wrong. Hearns was my favourite fighter of the 80's but I sometimes think that his power actually hindered him at times.
What I mean is that because he knew he had one punch ko power in his right it made him stand his ground when he could actually outbox pretty much anybody & often this would be a better strategy.
Hearns was a little chinny but I still rate him as an all time great.
Click ;)
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
definitely think that if fight one was 12 rounds then leonard would have turned the heat up earlier. thats what makes him in my opinion the 2nd greatest welter of all time behind robinson
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG H
I've always said that Hearns was good chin short of being better than Hagler and Leonard - and that his long legs let him down by going to jelly when he got hit.
Somebody (Stebs) on the other Hearns thread mentioned that Hearns was well ahead after 12 rounds of the first fight with Leonard, and I think there is little doubt he won their 2nd fight.
So if 12 round fights came in sooner, would history have Hearns above Leonard in the all time great stakes?
I think the answer is YES
Maybe, it's impossible to tell... I always thought that they both achieved, or at least showed greatness in each of their fights.. I don't know what your on about how Hearns long legs let him down though... Because if you think about it his long legs and long frame altogether were what allowed him to hit so hard and gave him a massive reach advantage... Without them he maybe would have been more stable but it wouldn't have done anything for his chin and it would take away his biggest strengths.
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG H
I've always said that Hearns was good chin short of being better than Hagler and Leonard - and that his long legs let him down by going to jelly when he got hit.
Somebody (Stebs) on the other Hearns thread mentioned that Hearns was well ahead after 12 rounds of the first fight with Leonard, and I think there is little doubt he won their 2nd fight.
So if 12 round fights came in sooner, would history have Hearns above Leonard in the all time great stakes?
I think the answer is YES
Maybe, it's impossible to tell... I always thought that they both achieved, or at least showed greatness in each of their fights.. I don't know what your on about how Hearns long legs let him down though... Because if you think about it his long legs and long frame altogether were what allowed him to hit so hard and gave him a massive reach advantage... Without them he maybe would have been more stable but it wouldn't have done anything for his chin and it would take away his biggest strengths.
Wot I mean about his legs is that they wobbled and turned to jelly when he got hit late in fights a la Leonard I
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
I doubt it. SRL would have started alot quicker. Alot of SRL's fights, he tried to break down a fighter, and get them late. He would be forced to quicken his pace. I don't like SRL, but he was great, and I can't say Hearns would be greater regardless of 12 or 15 rounds. Maybe, but we'll never really know.
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG H
I've always said that Hearns was good chin short of being better than Hagler and Leonard - and that his long legs let him down by going to jelly when he got hit.
Somebody (Stebs) on the other Hearns thread mentioned that Hearns was well ahead after 12 rounds of the first fight with Leonard, and I think there is little doubt he won their 2nd fight.
So if 12 round fights came in sooner, would history have Hearns above Leonard in the all time great stakes?
I think the answer is YES
No..No...NO!...Leonard would have fought completely different...so would hearns.....traing is different and so is the fight plan.....You cannot go by that......well if Zab would have fought PBF in a four rounder Zab would be champ....doesn't make sense....
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG H
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snakey
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG H
I've always said that Hearns was good chin short of being better than Hagler and Leonard - and that his long legs let him down by going to jelly when he got hit.
Somebody (Stebs) on the other Hearns thread mentioned that Hearns was well ahead after 12 rounds of the first fight with Leonard, and I think there is little doubt he won their 2nd fight.
So if 12 round fights came in sooner, would history have Hearns above Leonard in the all time great stakes?
I think the answer is YES
You train differently for different amounts of rounds. What you are saying actually can not be proven because Leonard could of changed his game plan for 12 rounds and beat the S*** out of Hearns. ;)
I get your point - but in this particular case I doubt that at anytime Leonard's strategy was to get schooled for 13 rounds and then come on strong with 5 minutes of the fight left. I think he simply had no answer for Hearns and was heading for a comprehensive beating until he hit him with that big shot - fair play to him though, he pulled it out the bag!
No but Dundee would have told Leonard earlier that he was blowing it maybe inthe 9th round, and Leonard would have turned it on earlier.
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
I here all your points, but I still don't think that any strategy, training or advice from the corner, would've allowed him to be so far behind after 13 rounds, if he actually was able to do anything about it!
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
Hagler was still better than both of them.
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
How do you figure? Hagler had a hard time with Duran, he relied on Hearns weak chin, and lost to a far more aged Leonard... so what exactly do you mean Hagler was better than both?
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
I think SRL showed up to fight the way Calzaghe did with Lacy. Hagler losing to him doesn't mean all that much in terms of how great he is p4p. When one of the greatest fighters of all time shows up with more focus and determination than he's ever had, and you lose a CLOSE decision. Well it's not something I read into a whole lot O0
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
Maybe ,...but try o remember you pace your self differently the 1st 5-6 rnds if you know your goin 15 instead of 12 ....WE"LL NEVER KNOW FOR SURE...but if u just take the fight and stop it at rnd 12 and judge it then maybe
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
This is a case of ifs and buts though. Leonard turned on the heat when he needed to and won the fight. I believe he wouldda done the same in a 12 rounder, he just always seemed to have a way to win any fight.
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG H
I've always said that Hearns was good chin short of being better than Hagler and Leonard - and that his long legs let him down by going to jelly when he got hit.
Somebody (Stebs) on the other Hearns thread mentioned that Hearns was well ahead after 12 rounds of the first fight with Leonard, and I think there is little doubt he won their 2nd fight.
So if 12 round fights came in sooner, would history have Hearns above Leonard in the all time great stakes?
I think the answer is YES
BIG H, just think about this,.....if 12 rds were always the Championship distance do you realize how many major fights would have been changed? Conn would have dethroned Louis, Walcott would have retained his title vs. Marciano, Lamotte would had lost his title to Dauthile, Hearns would have been Undisputed Wwelterweight champ, Cooney would have beaten Holmes, just off the top of my head.
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
Fair point - not sure about Cooney and Holmes though ;)
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
Just checking out some old threads :cool:
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BIG H
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snakey
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG H
I've always said that Hearns was good chin short of being better than Hagler and Leonard - and that his long legs let him down by going to jelly when he got hit.
Somebody (Stebs) on the other Hearns thread mentioned that Hearns was well ahead after 12 rounds of the first fight with Leonard, and I think there is little doubt he won their 2nd fight.
So if 12 round fights came in sooner, would history have Hearns above Leonard in the all time great stakes?
I think the answer is YES
You train differently for different amounts of rounds. What you are saying actually can not be proven because Leonard could of changed his game plan for 12 rounds and beat the S*** out of Hearns. ;)
I get your point - but in this particular case I doubt that at anytime Leonard's strategy was to get schooled for 13 rounds and then come on strong with 5 minutes of the fight left. I think he simply had no answer for Hearns and was heading for a comprehensive beating until he hit him with that big shot - fair play to him though, he pulled it out the bag!
I watched that fight last week and i got that impression. Leonard couldn't cope with Hearns, yet he pulled it out of the bag. Altho a different referee might have let the contest go on...stoppage was a tad premature imo.
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Re: Had 12 round fights been brought in sooner would Hearns be Greater than Leonard
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BIG H
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snakey
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG H
I've always said that Hearns was good chin short of being better than Hagler and Leonard - and that his long legs let him down by going to jelly when he got hit.
Somebody (Stebs) on the other Hearns thread mentioned that Hearns was well ahead after 12 rounds of the first fight with Leonard, and I think there is little doubt he won their 2nd fight.
So if 12 round fights came in sooner, would history have Hearns above Leonard in the all time great stakes?
I think the answer is YES
You train differently for different amounts of rounds. What you are saying actually can not be proven because Leonard could of changed his game plan for 12 rounds and beat the S*** out of Hearns. ;)
I get your point - but in this particular case I doubt that at anytime Leonard's strategy was to get schooled for 13 rounds and then come on strong with 5 minutes of the fight left. I think he simply had no answer for Hearns and was heading for a comprehensive beating until he hit him with that big shot - fair play to him though, he pulled it out the bag!
wow. just like Froch.;D
