Have never seen barrera as a legend nor morlaes like a chavez

Flame me but both are good to great fighters but by no stretch legends. like julio cesar chavez.I picked pacquio over barrera for a reason. barrera has good power not great, hes bevcome a good counter puncher not great, against another fighter with power (not morlaes whos just tought but does not have huge power) and pressure you could get barrera out of there, i really think juarez who is not world beater himself can beat him mabey ko him. barrera also can be outboxed, outside of morlaes who is the best up and coming fdighter hes beaten prince naseem who i said from the beginning is way overated.

Yeah, I see Chavez as far and away the biggest Mexican legend...MAB was good but he was at such light weights we didn't really get many questions answered. I mean who's the best guy he beat? Then compare that to who Chavez or Sanchez beat and they hands down are better

lyle thats a cool click. People seem to miss that point outside of naz hes been living off that win for too long, morales was an entertaining trilogy but there are better fighters up a bit and down a bit but thats not really barreras fault, i think however he picks his spots

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pacdog

lyle thats a cool click. People seem to miss that point outside of naz hes been living off that win for too long, morales was an entertaining trilogy but there are better fighters up a bit and down a bit but thats not really barreras fault, i think however he picks his spots

---

I totally disagree...Barrera's record reads like a who's who list for his division & the two surrounding where he made an impact.

Just because all the names don't hit you like light bulbs don't mean it's wrong.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wacko3205

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pacdog

lyle thats a cool click. People seem to miss that point outside of naz hes been living off that win for too long, morales was an entertaining trilogy but there are better fighters up a bit and down a bit but thats not really barreras fault, i think however he picks his spots

---

I totally disagree...Barrera's record reads like a who's who list for his division & the two surrounding where he made an impact.

Just because all the names don't hit you like light bulbs don't mean it's wrong.

---

but would you consider him a legend? I consider him a really good fighter and one of the best in his era...not the best...does that qualify for legend status?

NO, hes an excellent fighter but not a legend, hell he wanted to quit against pac

and chavez looked like he wanted to quit against Kosta Tyszu too

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by bigragu

but would you consider him a legend? I consider him a really good fighter and one of the best in his era...not the best...does that qualify for legend status?

---

Let me ask you this...what do you consider a legend?

What does it take to make a fighter legendary?

They have to take on pretty much everyone that's available...they don't necessarily have to beat all in the game...but as many as possible & they have to do it with style & they have to rule their divisions.

So the fact that Barrera has been on & off top for so long doesn't make any sense to you? Super Flyweight, Super Bantamweight, Featherweight, & Super Featherweight have been pretty much under his thumb for years. Hard to argue with that.

The fact that he beat Morales, Hamed, Ayala, Kelley, Maurin, Tapia, & Sanchez mean something...they may not all be names that you know...but they were great fighters...some of the better that he could face.

The fact that he beat the top names & all his mandatories doesn't make sense to you?


Then you just don't wanna face facts.

So yeah...I respect the man & consider him to be one of the great legendary fighters of my time.

chavez was what 40 dude,

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pacdog

NO, hes an excellent fighter but not a legend, hell he wanted to quit against pac

---

always comes back to this with you. 8)

JCC has quit before now.


So bascially your argument rests on the fact that both him and Morales fought at too light a weight ::**

I'd happily see them sit along side people like Chavez and Sal Sanchez. But is it a matter of what the people want or the boxing community. Regardless of how good anyone is now or will be fact is the time was right for Chavez and the people took him in. I'll ask you this are Roy Jones, OLH, PBF legends?

Im no tfaulting him for that dude but heres another example johhny tapia was way past it dude way past it. Barrera is a great fighter but he picks his spots a bit, he satyed within his comfort zone he took calculated risks not risks, he took a risk against pac and what happened. he is a great fighter but a legend transends what he is supposed to do, conquer a divison a bit higher than his natural weight etc, Im not faulting barrera he took on mostly all comers but he he is not a legend he got totally blown out by pac totally he wasnt in the fight, legends dont get dominated like that or there aching for a rematch if they do, hes showed a pssing interest in getting back with manny at best

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pacdog

chavez was what 40 dude,

---

Is Duran a legend? Lots of people think so, he also quit. I think you're a hater. 8)

Shall I post how this will go. Pacdog will refuse to comment on the points we make then continue with pacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpa cpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacp acpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpac pacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpa cpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacp acpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpac pacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpa cpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpac.

$1 socks mate. Leave it alone. 8)

Pbf no you have to stand the test of time dude to even be a great fighter, pbf big win is against who? Zab judah? I dont rember getting excited at one opponent pbf fought meaning there was no fear hed lose, even if youd put him in with oscar theres doubt and that would be a big win for floyd. Hell I love Mike tyson but coming up sure he anihilated his opponents but do i rember being excited by spinks tyson? No spinks had nothing to make me think twice, against holyfield i wasnt so sure, as i wouldnt have been so sure agianst bowe, lewis etc.

To be a legend you have to be either:

1) American

2) Retired

!!

duran is a legend, his skills are way better for one and he fought way above his weight and was succesful. he quit and that forever hurt his legacy it was a dumb move. I understand what you guys are saying but to me barrera is not a legendary fighter by any stretch, he got layed out twice by junior jones. Duran got layed out by tommy hearns a vicious right handed puncher and avoce his natural weight, barrera ill go as far to say is great fighter ::** but a legend give me a break

Could not disagree more hell There are more no american boxing legends in my book easily, barrera just has never impressed me as on

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pacdog

duran is a legend, his skills are way better for one and he fought way above his weight and was succesful. he quit and that forever hurt his legacy it was a dumb move. I understand what you guys are saying but to me barrera is not a legendary fighter by any stretch, he got layed out twice by junior jones. Duran got layed out by tommy hearns a vicious right handed puncher and avoce his natural weight, barrera ill go as far to say is great fighter ::** but a legend give me a break

---

Wrong. It's pointless posting since you're only doing it to run a fighter down.

I suppose you think Pac is a legend?

well, if your picking one's opposition here........ then who has Duran beaten apart from SRL?

and Duran has lost too much worse opponents than Junior Jones

Im waiiting to hear who duran lost to worse than junior jones and in a more devastating fashion

MAB and Morales are bona fide legends. they can box and brawl, have fought the best of their eras and always seem to bounce back after losing thats a mark of a legendary fighter.

barrera has not avenged his defeat to pac though, hes bounced back but against whom... pac lost and koed morales. A legend fights even when victory is not assured

I told you all it would come back to pacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpacpac ;D

Lets put it too rest i respect your opinions but too me Barrera is a great fighter Not A legendeary One, you wont here his name 20 eyars from now ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pacdog

Lets put it too rest i respect your opinions but too me Barrera is a great fighter Not A legendeary One, you wont here his name 20 eyars from now ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

---

I have to disagree, barrera and morales are always going to be mentioned when speaking of great trilogies, speaking about mexican fighters, when naming the best fighters of this era, when speaking of exciting action packed fighters and also of the best fighters at the lower weight classes.

yes a great trilogy but legendery fighters??? Youll hear something like this a fighter form the ninteis named barrera a great little mexcain fighter... etc once did this...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pacdog

Im waiiting to hear who duran lost to worse than junior jones and in a more devastating fashion

---

Kirkland Laing outboxed him silly

yeah and he was um just a bit past his prime and um did not get koed in a brutal embarrsing fashion and um was also above his um natural weight and ........

barrera is a hell of a legend. he's a guaranteed hall of famer. he's been dominating for years and has bounced back shit loads of times and always looks better from a loss. i mean if your trying to suggest that a fighter could never taste defeat to be recognised as a legend. then who the fuck is a legend? marciano? i cant see what more barrera could do to become a legend. avenge his loss to pac man (who is one of the best fighters around these days). that might even happen yet.
and the way you keep going on about manny pacuiao is wierd. he's been stopped. he's been knocked out and did he avenge any of those losses?

IMO They will both go down as Legends, but fighters are usually seen as legends after they are gone from the sport.

To secure their legacy they both need to beat Pac - MAB has 2 unavenged defeats, Pac & J Jones legends usually avenge their defeats

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lyle

Yeah, I see Chavez as far and away the biggest Mexican legend...MAB was good but he was at such light weights we didn't really get many questions answered. I mean who's the best guy he beat? Then compare that to who Chavez or Sanchez beat and they hands down are better

---

AWWW MAN!!!! Now that would have been an F'ING dream matchup if I ever heard of one Chavez Vs Sanchez..........

Barerra will go down as a legend he has only lost to world caliber Opp...And was always a fighting champion....I would pick him over Morales to be considered one ( and not because he beat Morales 2 out of 3 but because of the opp)

The thread starters main objective was just to hate on Barrera . Simple as ::**

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GAME

The thread starters main objective was just to hate on Barrera . Simple as ::**

---

I'd have to agree,I have not seen any constructive points to suggest MAB and EM are NOT legends. Both multiple weight champs,one of the greatest trilogies ever and both have fought the best available competion sooo...??? If they are not legends then there are none from this current generation. Also,add to this the fact that both are great great boxers,front and backfoot,can go to war and outbox most so this point seems quite pointless.

i think your missing th epoint pac aint hating on eithe rin fact in the past he praises both, I think what he is saying is that a legend is reserved for the absolute few kind of like what the hall of fame for baseball used to be, now its watered down a legend is an icon there are few and far between its thrown around too much

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jonesfan

i think your missing th epoint pac aint hating on eithe rin fact in the past he praises both, I think what he is saying is that a legend is reserved for the absolute few kind of like what the hall of fame for baseball used to be, now its watered down a legend is an icon there are few and far between its thrown around too much

---

Yeah but that is the same in the majority of sports,boxing is not how it used to be therefore the boundaries of who is a legend will clearly be lowered but even if the were not,for the points i mentioned above,these 2 would be legends.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pacdog

Flame me but both are good to great fighters but by no stretch legends. like julio cesar chavez.I picked pacquio over barrera for a reason. barrera has good power not great, hes bevcome a good counter puncher not great, against another fighter with power (not morlaes whos just tought but does not have huge power) and pressure you could get barrera out of there, i really think juarez who is not world beater himself can beat him mabey ko him. barrera also can be outboxed, outside of morlaes who is the best up and coming fdighter hes beaten prince naseem who i said from the beginning is way overated.

---

The only people to have put Barrera down are among the hardest punchers of the last 15 years and only one of them stopped him and that was when his corner stepped in.

Juarez is not on the level of either of the fighters who have given Barrera problems with their power.

Barrera by KO in 9

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pacdog

NO, hes an excellent fighter but not a legend, hell he wanted to quit against pac

---

No, he didn't. You've pulled that out of your ass. His corner stepped in. Barrera would never have made the decision to quit.

And yes, I feel he qualifies as a legend. He has been a constant in the P4P lists, beating some of the very best fighters of his era and is a world champion at multiple weights.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pacdog

duran is a legend, his skills are way better for one and he fought way above his weight and was succesful. he quit and that forever hurt his legacy it was a dumb move. I understand what you guys are saying but to me barrera is not a legendary fighter by any stretch, he got layed out twice by junior jones. Duran got layed out by tommy hearns a vicious right handed puncher and avoce his natural weight, barrera ill go as far to say is great fighter ::** but a legend give me a break

---

Laid out twice by Jones? He won the second fight but didn't get the decision. He got floored in the first fight and lost by DQ JUST AS the bell went at the end of the round. His corner were stupid and we'll never know if he could have recovered.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pacdog

Lets put it too rest i respect your opinions but too me Barrera is a great fighter Not A legendeary One, you wont here his name 20 eyars from now ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

---

Guess what? Both of those fighters will stand the test of time. Pacquiao is no legend and I have doubts he ever will be.

I've always said Barrera would beat him handily if they ever got back into the ring. Say what you like, Pac on his best day couldn't do what he did to a focused Barrera.