Another Hypothetical Fight, Tommy Hearns vs Roy Jones at 168lbs

Can't help it I like hearing opinions on fights like this, fights we'll never see. To be honest I have not a clue who'd win, so lay it on me

Roy Jones Jr was made to measure for Tommy. Hearns showed time and again, you could not outbox him. If Leonard, Benitez and Hill could not do it, then Jones could not either.

That said, Tommy's legs were going by the time he was up to 168lbs, so if RJJ could entice Hearns into a brawl, he may of had a chance.

But Hearns had his straight right, and there is now way RJJ could of stood up to that punch for 12 rounds...

Hearns off the deck to flatten RJJ in four with a highlight reel straight right ;)

So why couldn't you outbox him? Did he apply too much pressure to be using the jab and trying to move away?

People seem to forget that Hearns was subseptable for punches and straight rights. Doesn't matter that. But the speed of Jones reaching him with that right hand would bother him and Jones was one of theh ardest punching 168 pounders to ever grace ;) Sure you say Benetez didn't outbox Hearns, he still landed shots and leather on him, the kind of shots that if Jonesh it him with Tommy would be KO'd ;)

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Originally Posted by raleights

So why couldn't you outbox him? Did he apply too much pressure to be using the jab and trying to move away?

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He was for a big (lanky) man very cute with superb co-ordination, and when he put his mind to it, his movement, made him very hard to hit regularly with the jab. And because of that right hand, you had to be very brave to fight on the inside.

So the reason you could not out box him, was down to his co-ordination and his great offence, which meant you could never take liberties against him.

JOE CALZAGHE KOed Chris Byrd (in Italy) in one of his last amateur fight - since then all boxers have avoided him. Eubank is the only top boxer who has dared to fight him and he lost at he age of 31 years old - Calzaghe was 34 when he beat Lacy....

ty for clearing that up brit, and go danny....

Who are you?

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Originally Posted by Starr

People seem to forget that Hearns was subseptable for punches and straight rights. Doesn't matter that. But the speed of Jones reaching him with that right hand would bother him and Jones was one of theh ardest punching 168 pounders to ever grace ;) Sure you say Benetez didn't outbox Hearns, he still landed shots and leather on him, the kind of shots that if Jonesh it him with Tommy would be KO'd ;)

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Hearns was never worried about Benitez power, so he took a few extra risks. But that does not hide the fact, he dominated Benitez in a way that not even near prime SRL could.

RJJ has a huge problem taking the straight right, it would haunt him thoughout a fight with Hearns. Sure Tommy would not be able to take the absolute piss, because his legs were on the way out by the time he was a 168lber. But that does not stop him leveling RJJ with a straight right sometime around the fourth, in a hypothetical bout, IMO. ;)

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Originally Posted by raleights

ty for clearing that up brit, and go danny....

Who are you?

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He's Joe Calzaghe himself

Starr don't argue with him, you're good but not that good ;D

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Originally Posted by Britkid

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Originally Posted by Starr

People seem to forget that Hearns was subseptable for punches and straight rights. Doesn't matter that. But the speed of Jones reaching him with that right hand would bother him and Jones was one of theh ardest punching 168 pounders to ever grace ;) Sure you say Benetez didn't outbox Hearns, he still landed shots and leather on him, the kind of shots that if Jonesh it him with Tommy would be KO'd ;)

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Hearns was never worried about Benitez power, so he took a few extra risks. But that does not hide the fact, he dominated Benitez in a way that not even near prime SRL could.

RJJ has a huge problem taking the straight right, it would haunt him thoughout a fight with Hearns. Sure Tommy would not be able to take the absolute piss, because his legs were on the way out by the time he was a 168lber. But that does not stop him leveling RJJ with a straight right sometime around the fourth, in a hypothetical bout, IMO. ;)

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Suure Tommy took more risks because he wasn't worried about the power. Fact remains he never fought anyone as fast or that hit as hard with Jones ;)

Doesn't stop Jones from landing the lead right all night which Hearns is always open for ;)

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Originally Posted by raleights

Starr don't argue with him, you're good but not that good ;D

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haha!!! Britkid and I have been rivals for 4 years since I came here ;) We have battled about a thousand times ;) Trust me, we deal with each other. We are both "that good" :)

Our battles are legendary, there is no Purist without Britkid and vice versa. Our battles are legendary. I can handle him and he can handle me ;)

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Originally Posted by raleights

Starr don't argue with him, you're good but not that good ;D

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Ha, Ha

You can't handle me....

or any of my brethren!

http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/kkamaras/fat_people.jpg

I'd like to think RJ was too talented for Tommy but I just dunno, will let you 2 battle it out

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Originally Posted by raleights

will let you 2 battle it out

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What can I say. I was never a complete poster until Britkid disagreed with me ;D And won :o And I was never completen until I rematched him on a different subject and won. And thus it began. Ali Frazier aint got nothing on Purist vs. britkid ;D Not even Corrales Castillo got us ;)

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Originally Posted by Starr

Suure Tommy took more risks because he wasn't worried about the power. Fact remains he never fought anyone as fast or that hit as hard with Jones ;)

Doesn't stop Jones from landing the lead right all night which Hearns is always open for ;)

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I would say a 147lber Leonard was faster than RJJ, and in a different sort of way Hill was more elusive than RJJ (to the head at least :P).

And RJJ never had them heavy hands; he relied on his speed to stun his top class opposition. The only top level opponent he ever stopped was Hill, and that was a body shot, a mother of a body shot, but a body shot. All his other stoppage wins were against lesser opponents like Griffin and Kelly.

And if RJJ was disrespectful enough to throw a lead right at Hearns; sooner or later he drops that left enough for Hearns to fire a right hand Crackerjack at RJJ's chin... ;)

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Originally Posted by Starr

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Originally Posted by raleights

will let you 2 battle it out

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What can I say. I was never a complete poster until Britkid disagreed with me ;D And won :o And I was never completen until I rematched him on a different subject and won. And thus it began. Ali Frazier aint got nothing on Purist vs. britkid ;D Not even Corrales Castillo got us ;)

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Terry Norris-Luis Santana does. :thumb:

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Originally Posted by Britkid

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Originally Posted by Starr

Suure Tommy took more risks because he wasn't worried about the power. Fact remains he never fought anyone as fast or that hit as hard with Jones ;)

Doesn't stop Jones from landing the lead right all night which Hearns is always open for ;)

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I would say a 147lber Leonard was faster than RJJ, and in a different sort of way Hill was more elusive than RJJ (to the head at least :P).

And RJJ never had them heavy hands; he relied on his speed to stun his top class opposition. The only top level opponent he ever stopped was Hill, and that was a body shot, a mother of a body shot, but a body shot. All his other stoppage wins were against lesser opponents like Griffin and Kelly.

And if RJJ was disrespectful enough to throw a lead right at Hearns; sooner or later he drops that left enough for Hearns to fire a right hand Crackerjack at RJJ's chin... ;)

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I don't think so ;) Because Roy's shot to Tommy's chin would very much effect him and probably put him on dream street, put that on fact that Roy got make it in and out ON Tommy and Roy would at the very least go to the body on Tommy. And if Roy landed that right hand to the body of Hearns then he'll knock him out his skeleton, Roy was also a body destroyer ;) And I don't think Tommy could take it to the body, you know, the body thats open every time he brought his jab back ;)

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Originally Posted by Violent Demise

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Originally Posted by Starr

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Originally Posted by raleights

will let you 2 battle it out

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What can I say. I was never a complete poster until Britkid disagreed with me ;D And won :o And I was never completen until I rematched him on a different subject and won. And thus it began. Ali Frazier aint got nothing on Purist vs. britkid ;D Not even Corrales Castillo got us ;)

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Terry Norris-Luis Santana does. :thumb:

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LOL, you maybe right ;D

No me and Purist/Starr have had one or to intresting debates, she can normally land one or two low blows, before I fend her of with my sword of truth and the trusty shield of British fair play... ;)

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Originally Posted by Britkid

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Originally Posted by Violent Demise

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Originally Posted by Starr

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Originally Posted by raleights

will let you 2 battle it out

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What can I say. I was never a complete poster until Britkid disagreed with me ;D And won :o And I was never completen until I rematched him on a different subject and won. And thus it began. Ali Frazier aint got nothing on Purist vs. britkid ;D Not even Corrales Castillo got us ;)

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Terry Norris-Luis Santana does. :thumb:

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LOL, you maybe right ;D

No me and Purist/Starr have had one or to intresting debates, she can normally land one or two low blows, before I fend her of with my sword of truth and the trusty shield of British fair play... ;)

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You never fend me off Britkid ;) I am the only one on this board to ever beat you in a debate :lickish:

And I really do enjoy our debates a lot :-\ I don't think I'd stay if you left.

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Originally Posted by Britkid

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Originally Posted by Violent Demise

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Originally Posted by Starr

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Originally Posted by raleights

will let you 2 battle it out

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What can I say. I was never a complete poster until Britkid disagreed with me ;D And won :o And I was never completen until I rematched him on a different subject and won. And thus it began. Ali Frazier aint got nothing on Purist vs. britkid ;D Not even Corrales Castillo got us ;)

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Terry Norris-Luis Santana does. :thumb:

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LOL, you maybe right ;D

No me and Purist/Starr have had one or to intresting debates, she can normally land one or two low blows, before I fend her of with my sword of truth and the trusty shield of British fair play... ;)

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"Sword of truth". Classic. That gives me my future counter line, during disagreement. "Don't make me go get Britkid's Sword of truth, now". cc all day for you.

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Originally Posted by Starr

I don't think so ;) Because Roy's shot to Tommy's chin would very much effect him and probably put him on dream street, put that on fact that Roy got make it in and out ON Tommy and Roy would at the very least go to the body on Tommy. And if Roy landed that right hand to the body of Hearns then he'll knock him out his skeleton, Roy was also a body destroyer ;) And I don't think Tommy could take it to the body, you know, the body thats open every time he brought his jab back ;)

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But that is a presumption without any evidence to back it up ;). In a near 30 year pro career, there is no evidence to suggest Tommy could not take shots to the body. But there is plenty of evidence to suggest RJJ was vulnerable to a straight punches, and Tommy had the best straight right in the business, in the 80s.

Added to the notion all other advantages RJJ had over all his opposition of the time, would be neutralized by Hearns' amazing ability to not be out boxed, by even the very best, gives Tommy all the Kings in this fight, and unfortunately for Roy, aces are low ;)

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Originally Posted by Britkid

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Originally Posted by Starr

I don't think so ;) Because Roy's shot to Tommy's chin would very much effect him and probably put him on dream street, put that on fact that Roy got make it in and out ON Tommy and Roy would at the very least go to the body on Tommy. And if Roy landed that right hand to the body of Hearns then he'll knock him out his skeleton, Roy was also a body destroyer ;) And I don't think Tommy could take it to the body, you know, the body thats open every time he brought his jab back ;)

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But that is a presumption without any evidence to back it up ;). In a near 30 year pro career, there is no evidence to suggest Tommy could not take shots to the body. But there is plenty of evidence to suggest RJJ was vulnerable to a straight punches, and Tommy had the best straight right in the business, in the 80s.

Added to the notion all other advantages RJJ had over all his opposition of the time, would be neutralized by Hearns' amazing ability to not be out boxed, by even the very best, gives Tommy all the Kings in this fight, and unfortunately for Roy, aces are low ;)

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Roy has another deck ;) And Tommy has been shown to be subseptable to lead rights and left hooks, both of which are Jones money punches ;) We may be looking at a situation of who gets there first. besides ti also shows that Thomas didn't like to turn, and Roy would make him turn. ;)

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Originally Posted by Starr

Roy has another deck ;) And Tommy has been shown to be subseptable to lead rights and left hooks, both of which are Jones money punches ;) We may be looking at a situation of who gets there first. besides ti also shows that Thomas didn't like to turn, and Roy would make him turn. ;)

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The only men who had the abilities to land lead rights of Hearns, were SRL and Hagler, and both them had to turn the fight into a brawl to do that.

RJJ's chin just does not compare to either Hagler or Leonard's (at 147lbs). Both Marvin and Ray took calculated risks by fighting on the inside, RJJ would almost certainly be committing suicide if he was brave enough to take that route, which I agree would be his only chance of winning, which I recognized in my very first post:

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Originally Posted by Britkid

Tommy's legs were going by the time he was up to 168lbs, so if RJJ could entice Hearns into a brawl, he may of had a chance.

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So it would seem we are in agreement Starr... ;)

I think if Tommy went up to 168 to fight RJJ, i think RJJ would expose that fragile chin of Hearns espesh as Jones hit hard and very quickly.

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Originally Posted by Britkid

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Originally Posted by Starr

Roy has another deck ;) And Tommy has been shown to be subseptable to lead rights and left hooks, both of which are Jones money punches ;) We may be looking at a situation of who gets there first. besides ti also shows that Thomas didn't like to turn, and Roy would make him turn. ;)

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The only men who had the abilities to land lead rights of Hearns, were SRL and Hagler, and both them had to turn the fight into a brawl to do that.

RJJ's chin just does not compare to either Hagler or Leonard's (at 147lbs). Both Marvin and Ray took calculated risks by fighting on the inside, RJJ would almost certainly be committing suicide if he was brave enough to take that route, which I agree would be his only chance of winning, which I recognized in my very first post:

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Originally Posted by Britkid

Tommy's legs were going by the time he was up to 168lbs, so if RJJ could entice Hearns into a brawl, he may of had a chance.

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So it would seem we are in agreement Starr... ;)

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There is an assumtion you're making Britkid, that Jones wouldn't be able to take Hearns punch at 168. But Roy was never ever hurt until he went up to 175 ;) He had a very good chin at 60 and 68 ;) hearns .... didn't ;D

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Originally Posted by Starr

There is an assumtion you're making Britkid, that Jones wouldn't be able to take Hearns punch at 168. But Roy was never ever hurt until he went up to 175 ;) He had a very good chin at 60 and 68 ;) hearns .... didn't ;D

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It is assumption based on watching the Cuevas, Duran and Shuler bouts ;)

hearns could be outboxed contrary to pop. belief at times he could be caught if you had the balls to go looking RJJ would do this over and over before wearing tommy down and out boxin him .SRL never went looking early thats why he couldnt convincingly beat him down

I don't think SRL was a big enough puncher to give him any trouble unlike Hagler, or Mr. Jones for that matter

still can't decide even after witnessing this 15 round contest between brit and starr

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Originally Posted by raleights

I don't think SRL was a big enough puncher to give him any trouble unlike Hagler, or Mr. Jones for that matter

still can't decide even after witnessing this 15 round contest between brit and starr

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Wha? Is that why he knocked Hearns out?

Hearns was winning the fight convincingly before he ran out of steam

Thats why Britkid was saying noone ever outboxed Hearns, including SRL. Not hard to tko someone when they're about to collapse in front of you

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Originally Posted by raleights

I don't think SRL was a big enough puncher to give him any trouble unlike Hagler, or Mr. Jones for that matter

still can't decide even after witnessing this 15 round contest between brit and starr

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The "Sword of truth" ended it awhile back

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Originally Posted by raleights

Thats why Britkid was saying noone ever outboxed Hearns, including SRL. Not hard to tko someone when they're about to collapse in front of you

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... Nobody as fast or skilled as Roy fought Hearns... he could counter off the jab far better than Leonard, and he hit harder than Hagler. He could lead against Hearns or counter... he is the only person I could ever see countering Hearns, and he wouldn't have a huge problems doing so.

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Originally Posted by Britkid

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Originally Posted by Starr

I don't think so ;) Because Roy's shot to Tommy's chin would very much effect him and probably put him on dream street, put that on fact that Roy got make it in and out ON Tommy and Roy would at the very least go to the body on Tommy. And if Roy landed that right hand to the body of Hearns then he'll knock him out his skeleton, Roy was also a body destroyer ;) And I don't think Tommy could take it to the body, you know, the body thats open every time he brought his jab back ;)

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But that is a presumption without any evidence to back it up ;). In a near 30 year pro career, there is no evidence to suggest Tommy could not take shots to the body. But there is plenty of evidence to suggest RJJ was vulnerable to a straight punches, and Tommy had the best straight right in the business, in the 80s.

Added to the notion all other advantages RJJ had over all his opposition of the time, would be neutralized by Hearns' amazing ability to not be out boxed, by even the very best, gives Tommy all the Kings in this fight, and unfortunately for Roy, aces are low ;)

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... Roy doesn't have that bad of a time with crosses... Jabs when he wanted to he could counter of them like nobodies business(watch against Virgill Hill's jab which is very similar to Hearns'). Hearns couldn't be outboxed by Leonard, but Roy Jones is on another level than Leonard... he has faster reflexes, more power in his hands... when he goes in he excentuates with his power which Leonard didn't have so Hearns wouldn't be able to counter Roy... At 154 is the best weight for Hearns to have foughten Roy, but he still would have been beaten if Roy possessed the skill he had at 168.