HERO= Ali..........Dr Martin Luther King Jr, Malcolm X, Abe Lincoln

These men were all heros... For a reason... Ali is forgotten for what he's done for our society... He made a statement!

My father fought in Vietnam... Didn't just fight but was wounded in action twice. He is my hero. People like him have alowed our freedom for many years.

I served for 4 years in the military and 3 months in Iraq(not in a very hostile area, outside of Mosel... a small town) I din't serve like my father. he got 2 purple hearts in Vietnam... He is a hero. Mine anyway. But I digress. My point is this-

Ali was told to go to war-

My father calls him a coward cuz he didn't go!

I disagree....

He became a deeply religous man.(not an excuse... keep readin) He did not dodge the draft... He didn't do anything but due what he beleaved in. How can you not respect that. He served jail time. He fought his war here. (this comes from a Vet) I will never fault him for that. Go to war... Or go to jail! He did the latter... He showed that we all have a choice. We do not have to be robots, although I would nt have chosehis path. I think him a hero in 2 ways-1. He stood up for his religion and what he believed in... 2- He was one of the best P4P's of all time... And his life story is one for the books... Live well Ali!

Ben Franklin said "It is our duty to question our government!!!! It is our right!

Kudos to your father and his Purple Heart.

I try very hard and not touch political threads but since this is about Ali ;D

I think Ali did the right thing. I love this quote.
"I ain't got no quarrel with the Viet Cong," Ali said, "No Viet Cong ever called me 'nigger.'"

O0

I don't know...Ali sent this country in a different direction

Pre Ali: Joe Louis serves in the military, Jackie Robinson, Ted Williams served TWICE, and other star athletes put their careers on hold to fight for their country because it was the right thing to do.

The BIGGEST changes came in Hollywood: In WWII MANY actors served and they actually fought, Lee Marvin was in the Marines in the Pacific, most amazing Jimmy Stewart was a BRIGADIER GENERAL....now in Hollywood no one wants to fight, no matter what the situation, it's like war is some game that they got tired of playing and they think they can just call time out so they can be int he spotlight and live the good life.

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Originally Posted by "PRIDE OF BOSTON"

These men were all heros... For a reason... Ali is forgotten for what he's done for our society... He made a statement!

My father fought in Vietnam... Didn't just fight but was wounded in action twice. He is my hero. People like him have alowed our freedom for many years.

I served for 4 years in the military and 3 months in Iraq(not in a very hostile area, outside of Mosel... a small town) I din't serve like my father. he got 2 purple hearts in Vietnam... He is a hero. Mine anyway. But I digress. My point is this-

Ali was told to go to war-

My father calls him a coward cuz he didn't go!

I disagree....

He became a deeply religous man.(not an excuse... keep readin) He did not dodge the draft... He didn't do anything but due what he beleaved in. How can you not respect that. He served jail time. He fought his war here. (this comes from a Vet) I will never fault him for that. Go to war... Or go to jail! He did the latter... He showed that we all have a choice. We do not have to be robots, although I would nt have chosehis path. I think him a hero in 2 ways-1. He stood up for his religion and what he believed in... 2- He was one of the best P4P's of all time... And his life story is one for the books... Live well Ali!

Ben Franklin said "It is our duty to question our government!!!! It is our right!

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I think that Mohammed Ali and Malcolm X are two of the saddest persons ever – prefer Ronald Reagan and Max Schmelling. Schmelling was a tolerant gentleman Ali was/is not.

With regard to Hollywood's role in WWII, I just saw a documentary on the great director John Ford. It was Ford who basically made John Wayne's career. Ford spent time in the war filming combat in the Pacific. Supposedly he hardly even spoke to Wayne during the war because he was upset that Wayne did not serve. As for boxers in the war, Tunney, Dempsey, Baer and Barney Ross who was decorated for valor at Guadalcanal. Apologies for anyone I've letf out.

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Originally Posted by 4YOU

Quote:

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Originally Posted by "PRIDE OF BOSTON"

These men were all heros... For a reason... Ali is forgotten for what he's done for our society... He made a statement!

My father fought in Vietnam... Didn't just fight but was wounded in action twice. He is my hero. People like him have alowed our freedom for many years.

I served for 4 years in the military and 3 months in Iraq(not in a very hostile area, outside of Mosel... a small town) I din't serve like my father. he got 2 purple hearts in Vietnam... He is a hero. Mine anyway. But I digress. My point is this-

Ali was told to go to war-

My father calls him a coward cuz he didn't go!

I disagree....

He became a deeply religous man.(not an excuse... keep readin) He did not dodge the draft... He didn't do anything but due what he beleaved in. How can you not respect that. He served jail time. He fought his war here. (this comes from a Vet) I will never fault him for that. Go to war... Or go to jail! He did the latter... He showed that we all have a choice. We do not have to be robots, although I would nt have chosehis path. I think him a hero in 2 ways-1. He stood up for his religion and what he believed in... 2- He was one of the best P4P's of all time... And his life story is one for the books... Live well Ali!

Ben Franklin said "It is our duty to question our government!!!! It is our right!

---

I think that Mohammed Ali and Malcolm X are two of the saddest persons ever – prefer Ronald Reagan and Max Schmelling. Schmelling was a tolerant gentleman Ali was/is not.

---

But you're a racist biggot who thinks that Kessler is a living god just because he is getting into your fine sister.

So why should we listen to you?

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Originally Posted by AdamGB

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 4YOU

Quote:

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Originally Posted by "PRIDE OF BOSTON"

These men were all heros... For a reason... Ali is forgotten for what he's done for our society... He made a statement!

My father fought in Vietnam... Didn't just fight but was wounded in action twice. He is my hero. People like him have alowed our freedom for many years.

I served for 4 years in the military and 3 months in Iraq(not in a very hostile area, outside of Mosel... a small town) I din't serve like my father. he got 2 purple hearts in Vietnam... He is a hero. Mine anyway. But I digress. My point is this-

Ali was told to go to war-

My father calls him a coward cuz he didn't go!

I disagree....

He became a deeply religous man.(not an excuse... keep readin) He did not dodge the draft... He didn't do anything but due what he beleaved in. How can you not respect that. He served jail time. He fought his war here. (this comes from a Vet) I will never fault him for that. Go to war... Or go to jail! He did the latter... He showed that we all have a choice. We do not have to be robots, although I would nt have chosehis path. I think him a hero in 2 ways-1. He stood up for his religion and what he believed in... 2- He was one of the best P4P's of all time... And his life story is one for the books... Live well Ali!

Ben Franklin said "It is our duty to question our government!!!! It is our right!

---

I think that Mohammed Ali and Malcolm X are two of the saddest persons ever – prefer Ronald Reagan and Max Schmelling. Schmelling was a tolerant gentleman Ali was/is not.

---

But you're a racist biggot who thinks that Kessler is a living god just because he is getting into your fine sister.

So why should we listen to you?

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Racist? Why?

I guess that Muhammed and Malcolm were two of the biggest racists ever, right?

Why is the grass green Royal? ;)

I'd love to debate this with you I really would... I'd rather discuss it with your sister over a bottle of red wine though. Would kessler mind?

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Originally Posted by AdamGB

Why is the grass green Royal? ;)

I'd love to debate this with you I really would... I'd rather discuss it with your sister over a bottle of red wine though. Would kessler mind?

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:)

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Originally Posted by AdamGB

Why is the grass green Royal? ;)

I'd love to debate this with you I really would... I'd rather discuss it with your sister over a bottle of red wine though. Would kessler mind?

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Why would you want to argue with a wall AdamGB

you can't win...























Or can you? ;)

as far as boxing goes, he brought it to another level. and we all gotta appreciate him for that.

But dont let what he has become cloud your judgement.
He didnt wanna fight for his country, but was ok living in a country where 18yo boys were dien left and right to allow him to live in a "FREE" society. Wanna Live here, then fight for it if called upon. I dont think any of those young men had a quarrel with the "vietcong" but they went, died, got injured, came back alive or dead. He didnt want to die in war, plain and simple. It wasnt because he was muslim, it wasnt because he was worried about what his "people" would think of him. HE DIDNT want to die. I dont blame him, i dont want to die either. But if blue eyed billy down the street can take a frag, so can he.

Do you think that Ali would of actually been posted in combat?

Do you think Ali wasn't aware that he obviously wouldn't be in combat?

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Originally Posted by 4YOU

I think that Mohammed Ali and Malcolm X are two of the saddest persons ever – prefer Ronald Reagan and Max Schmelling. Schmelling was a tolerant gentleman Ali was/is not.

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Hate to say it but I agree....I dislike Ali's political stance and Malcom X was ALWAYS confused. Malcom X was racist, Ali wasn't racist to white people but he put his own down.


Other boxer who served Carmen Basillio

DID YOU KNOW
Former President George H. W. Bush served in WWII and was a pilot. He was among 9 planes shot down and he delivered his bomb then bailed out in the ocean, he began paddling to the little island he just bombed and the Japanese saw him coming and were preparing for him to get close enough to shoot when all of a sudden a Periscope spots him and picks him up....it was a US sub and the 8 other pilots that were captured by the Japanese were beheaded!!!

Yeah it's good to question government but only to an extent

i think ali is the greatest. the main reason that i love boxing is because of ali.

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Originally Posted by "PRIDE OF BOSTON"

These men were all heros... For a reason... Ali is forgotten for what he's done for our society... He made a statement!

My father fought in Vietnam... Didn't just fight but was wounded in action twice. He is my hero. People like him have alowed our freedom for many years.

I served for 4 years in the military and 3 months in Iraq(not in a very hostile area, outside of Mosel... a small town) I din't serve like my father. he got 2 purple hearts in Vietnam... He is a hero. Mine anyway. But I digress. My point is this-

Ali was told to go to war-

My father calls him a coward cuz he didn't go!

I disagree....

He became a deeply religous man.(not an excuse... keep readin) He did not dodge the draft... He didn't do anything but due what he beleaved in. How can you not respect that. He served jail time. He fought his war here. (this comes from a Vet) I will never fault him for that. Go to war... Or go to jail! He did the latter... He showed that we all have a choice. We do not have to be robots, although I would nt have chosehis path. I think him a hero in 2 ways-1. He stood up for his religion and what he believed in... 2- He was one of the best P4P's of all time... And his life story is one for the books... Live well Ali!

Ben Franklin said "It is our duty to question our government!!!! It is our right!

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ali always said he didnt want to go against his religion--how come if he was so religious, that he didnt stop womanizing? aint that against his religion--wont go 2 war but will cheat on wife and of course groupies---thats what i dont understand--no dis to ali cuz hes my favorite all time boxer.

He loved the honeys more than he loved the army... simple... ;)

To much Mojo ;)

I am sadden by the fact that I was not around to see ALI in his prime years.

But instead I am cursed to see the current HW's such as Ruiz, McBride, and Air Force Amy. :'(

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Originally Posted by "PRIDE OF BOSTON"

These men were all heros... For a reason... Ali is forgotten for what he's done for our society... He made a statement!

My father fought in Vietnam... Didn't just fight but was wounded in action twice. He is my hero. People like him have alowed our freedom for many years.

I served for 4 years in the military and 3 months in Iraq(not in a very hostile area, outside of Mosel... a small town) I din't serve like my father. he got 2 purple hearts in Vietnam... He is a hero. Mine anyway. But I digress. My point is this-

Ali was told to go to war-

My father calls him a coward cuz he didn't go!

I disagree....

He became a deeply religous man.(not an excuse... keep readin) He did not dodge the draft... He didn't do anything but due what he beleaved in. How can you not respect that. He served jail time. He fought his war here. (this comes from a Vet) I will never fault him for that. Go to war... Or go to jail! He did the latter... He showed that we all have a choice. We do not have to be robots, although I would nt have chosehis path. I think him a hero in 2 ways-1. He stood up for his religion and what he believed in... 2- He was one of the best P4P's of all time... And his life story is one for the books... Live well Ali!

Ben Franklin said "It is our duty to question our government!!!! It is our right!

---

Only Luther King was worth mentioning(A man of great dignity and salvation for resolve), the other two are just racist scum, just my opinion. Fuk Malcom X( The Black Hitler)

I may have been wrong in naming this thread what I did... We all have our views. I shouldn't have put political figures in the thread. I'm white just so everyone knows. But I think these me, good or bad, were heros. I did not like alot of what Malcolm X said... Well, Pretty much none of it. But, he stood for a cause that was great... and that was my point... King stood for Freedom, Ali... Think what you will... I told you, I'm a vet and I don't hate on him not going... He chose to pay the piper here(course that was a choice that insured he would live... I don't(truly) think it was about that) and not there...

I am a White male from Boston saying this... These men were all heros if looked at objectivly

or just choose to object.

or choose to post your own hero in history
(Hitler and Pol pot discluded)

allen "the answer" iverson is my childhood hero
its crazy how this guy became a huge part of my life
and how my miserable life became a meaningful one
hes the best example of 'rags to riches'
you may all call this absurd but I tell you its not
im 24 and ive been the greatest fan

I love Muhammad Ali.

But if it was against his religion to go to war, why are Muslims fighting us in Iraq and Afghanistan, for example?

If it was against his religion to go to war, why does the Koran say that Islam was founded and spread through the wars of the Prophet Muhammad (Peace be with him)?

I think Ali was being influenced by politically bogoted people at the time, who were not Muslim despite what they said. He was easily led.

He would never ever have seen combat anyway.

Genghis Khan is one of my heroes.

He conquered the largest land empire in history, which continued after his death. He robbed, raped, enslaved and killed millions of people. He fucked his way around the world to the extent that some 400 million people now carry traces of his DNA.

He was quick to take offence, and quicker to evenge it. He took over established and vibrant cultures, those of Islam and China to name but two, yet never softened from being a nomadic warrior. he would pitch his tent inside the palaces of defeated opponents and live in that.

Political correctness now brainwashes us into thanking that such behaviour is bad - fuck that - I would love to have done what he did !!!

8)

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Originally Posted by X

Genghis Khan is one of my heroes.

He conquered the largest land empire in history, which continued after his death. He robbed, raped, enslaved and killed millions of people. He fucked his way around the world to the extent that some 400 million people now carry traces of his DNA.

He was quick to take offence, and quicker to evenge it. He took over established and vibrant cultures, those of Islam and China to name but two, yet never softened from being a nomadic warrior. he would pitch his tent inside the palaces of defeated opponents and live in that.

Political correctness now brainwashes us into thanking that such behaviour is bad - F*** that - I would love to have done what he did !!!

8)

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You told me that your favorite hero was bloody Stalin

I pick and choose, depending on whom I can most easily offend
;)

ken norton learned how to box when he was in the marines. i think he went to vietnam. anyone know?

if ALI is your hero go peep my halloween costume thread bro! O0

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Originally Posted by X

I love Muhammad Ali.

But if it was against his religion to go to war, why are Muslims fighting us in Iraq and Afghanistan, for example?

If it was against his religion to go to war, why does the Koran say that Islam was founded and spread through the wars of the Prophet Muhammad (Peace be with him)?

I think Ali was being influenced by politically bogoted people at the time, who were not Muslim despite what they said. He was easily led.

He would never ever have seen combat anyway.

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:coolclick:

Great post X I was thinking the same thing.

Ali saying it was against the Islamic relgion to go to war is like Hugh Hefner saying he's against sex before marriage.

Either Ali clearly didn't know much about the religion he professed to believe in or he didn't trust in Allah to protect him in battle.

Personally I think it was a copout on Ali's part. Lyle's posts made very good sense and he is dead right that nowadays celebrities would attempt to get out of doing anything, although they are happy to wade into some political quagmire to further their own agenda's.

I kind of agree with X and Lyle I gotta say.....

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Originally Posted by Lyle

I don't know...Ali sent this country in a different direction

Pre Ali: Joe Louis serves in the military, Jackie Robinson, Ted Williams served TWICE, and other star athletes put their careers on hold to fight for their country because it was the right thing to do.

The BIGGEST changes came in Hollywood: In WWII MANY actors served and they actually fought, Lee Marvin was in the Marines in the Pacific, most amazing Jimmy Stewart was a BRIGADIER GENERAL....now in Hollywood no one wants to fight, no matter what the situation, it's like war is some game that they got tired of playing and they think they can just call time out so they can be int he spotlight and live the good life.

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hollywood is full of pussys...that is no big statement....But to stand up...that is....I served with the US Army..and if they would have tried to send me to IRAQ over some bullsh*t "I gotta do what my daddy couldn't get done" war...I would have told the Army to kiss my a**...kiss the whole a**...gotta respect the man...Ali that is....

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Originally Posted by Lyle

I don't know...Ali sent this country in a different direction

Pre Ali: Joe Louis serves in the military, Jackie Robinson, Ted Williams served TWICE, and other star athletes put their careers on hold to fight for their country because it was the right thing to do.

The BIGGEST changes came in Hollywood: In WWII MANY actors served and they actually fought, Lee Marvin was in the Marines in the Pacific, most amazing Jimmy Stewart was a BRIGADIER GENERAL....now in Hollywood no one wants to fight, no matter what the situation, it's like war is some game that they got tired of playing and they think they can just call time out so they can be int he spotlight and live the good life.

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Your hilarious Lyle. Seriously, that line says it all. Your talking about WWII and Iraq here, and can't even differentiate between the two. It's simply WAR.

Oh I'm sorry the popular thing to do is compare every violent situation to Vietnam....my bad


The reason Iraq is going poorly is because no one realizes that the Iraqi people are lazy pieces of shit and the only people working to accomplish a goal are the terrorists.


I'm not comparing the actual wars just the way Hollywood has changed, used to be very supportive of the US and US Government and then along came the McCarthy Trials and EVERYONE turned against the government...good at the time but they never came back to where the regular people are.

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Originally Posted by Lyle

Oh I'm sorry the popular thing to do is compare every violent situation to Vietnam....my bad


The reason Iraq is going poorly is because no one realizes that the Iraqi people are lazy pieces of S*** and the only people working to accomplish a goal are the terrorists.


I'm not comparing the actual wars just the way Hollywood has changed, used to be very supportive of the US and US Government and then along came the McCarthy Trials and EVERYONE turned against the government...good at the time but they never came back to where the regular people are.

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Have a :coolclick: Lyle, I'll back no matter what the haters think 8)

Thanks Bilbo...you da man :thumb:

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Originally Posted by Lyle

no one realizes that the Iraqi people are lazy pieces of S*** and the only people working to accomplish a goal are the terrorists.

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An interesting and rounded viewpoint, Lyle. It's a good job you are around to tell us these things. ;)

How many Iraqis do you know, and how many of them that live in Iraq?

Or maybe it was a misprint and you meant IROQUIOS being lazy pieces of shit, because they were all alcoholic wasters (....... nothing to do with being invaded, having their freedom taken away and being occupied by a strange foreign power)

;D

your right, the threat of getting gassed and lit up in flames at any point for farting the wrong tune is so much better ::**
nevermind people being able to vote for more than one candidate now, or maybe even the supplies being given to iraq by other nations are actually given to the iraqi people instead of the to the sadamn Regime. ::** ::**

No, it wasn't better then for the Iraqis than now. They were tortured, imprisoned, killed and mistreated by ol' Saddam.

But they are still being tortured, imprisoned, killed and mistreated ...... but now it's by us.

So, that has not changed, but we have been bombed and attacked a couple of times since.

Therefore things are worse now.

I'm not trying to say everything was better before and try to say that cute bunny rabbits were everywhere in Baghdad or anything.

My point wasn't very political, only pointing out that I doubt all Iraqis (or even most) are lazy pieces of shit. That sounds like a rather silly attention-grabbing statement from a schoolboy (sorry, Lyle!)

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Originally Posted by Lyle

Oh I'm sorry the popular thing to do is compare every violent situation to Vietnam....my bad


The reason Iraq is going poorly is because no one realizes that the Iraqi people are lazy pieces of S*** and the only people working to accomplish a goal are the terrorists.


I'm not comparing the actual wars just the way Hollywood has changed, used to be very supportive of the US and US Government and then along came the McCarthy Trials and EVERYONE turned against the government...good at the time but they never came back to where the regular people are.

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I say we should pull out of all the countries and turn our focus on the crack houses/Crimeriddled ares/Gang hangouts......why don't we clean up our own before sticking our noses elsewhere?...also if the citizens of Iraq want to live in a hovel F*CK EM...let them live like animals....Tired of helping people that don't want to help themselves.....

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Originally Posted by THE Bigragu

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lyle

Oh I'm sorry the popular thing to do is compare every violent situation to Vietnam....my bad


The reason Iraq is going poorly is because no one realizes that the Iraqi people are lazy pieces of S*** and the only people working to accomplish a goal are the terrorists.


I'm not comparing the actual wars just the way Hollywood has changed, used to be very supportive of the US and US Government and then along came the McCarthy Trials and EVERYONE turned against the government...good at the time but they never came back to where the regular people are.

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I say we should pull out of all the countries and turn our focus on the crack houses/Crimeriddled ares/Gang hangouts......why don't we clean up our own before sticking our noses elsewhere?...also if the citizens of Iraq want to live in a hovel F*CK EM...let them live like animals....Tired of helping people that don't want to help themselves.....

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Hmmm And completely ignore foreign policy, yea that should work
you must of voted for billy clint.

Well Bill Clinton led his years by the polls...if people liked it, Billy did it.......problem was his solutions had no teeth so now we have the situation with North Korea because Kim Jong Il promised one thing but never kept his word and therefore has whatever the deal was between them it was never honored.

The United States HAS to step up in the world...the United Nations has NEVER done a goddamn thing to help....look what the did in Darfur!

The reason the UN never helps is because it's leaders are too nice which is why everyone agrees on them to begin with....what they have done with Israel and Palistine is horrible too. An Israli was kidnapped by Palistinians and the UN had footage of the kidnap because it happened right outside their building there and they gave it to the Palistinians but not Israel!

Ali wasn't particularly political earlier on. He bragged about his Irish grandparents. When he visited Moscow and they asked him about racism in America, he replied that we have some very good people in Washington and they are doing a good job of dealing with it. Doesn't sound much like the Ali who was buddies with Malcom, does it?

Later, all hints of Irishness disappeared, and he became a black icon in ways that his earlier self coudn't have done.

That said, I was an anti-war hippy and still am. All respect to Ali for his own version of 'hell no we won't go.'


Poste Script: I was disappointed when he KO'd Sonny Liston. I had seen Sonny on Ed Sullivan, where he stood about twice as high as Ed, and he seemed like a nice guy, and Cassius was so brash. But Sonny would never have become the myth that Ali has become. Respect.