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Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Replay is showing at 11:30pm EST in the VS station (the old OLN Network)
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Super middleweight Kelly Pavlik (28-0, 25 KOs) thrilled his hometown fans with a fourth round destruction of Leonord Pierre (18-3, 13 KOs) on Thursday night at the Chevrolet Centre in Youngstown, Ohio. Pavlik dropped Pierre with a right hand at the end of the first round and brutally punished "The Haitian Sensation" until a left hook decked Pierre :46 into the fourth round when the slaughter was immediately halted.
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
He did what he was suppose to do, thas good....
Unlike Joel Julio who was faced with Cosme and had trouble with him....
Good for Pavlik.
2007 should be a very interesting yr. in the Super Midd. Div. 8)
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Pavlik is a Super Middleweight?
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Not yet... He weighed in at 162, I guess it was a catch weight.
He did say after his fight with Bronco that he had too much trouble getting down to 160 and wanted to move up. He will probably sit back and see what opportunites come his way. Either way, the boy needs to step it up already!
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Pavlik is a Super Middleweight?
Not officially but he will be in 2007...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pantera
Not yet... He weighed in at 162, I guess it was a catch weight.
He did say after his fight with Bronco that he had too much trouble getting down to 160 and wanted to move up. He will probably sit back and see what opportunites come his way. Either way, the boy needs to step it up already!
Maybe Pavlik vs. Miranda or Pavlik vs. Manfredo...
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Pantera you say the boy needs to step it up, he is Ranked #2 WBC and #4 WBA in the middleweight division and has not been able to secure a fight with any top level guy. Could it be that guys are staying away because he is not only a guy with power in both hands but can box and always stay composed????
You say step it up already and Miranda is fighting the guy, Willie Gibbs, that Pierre was beating on 2 out of 3 judges scorecards in the 12th round before getting knocked out.
Can you not give him the props he is due??
Pavlik is not moving up at least not yet, he wants the Middleweight World Championship.
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntin_itai
Pantera you say the boy needs to step it up, he is Ranked #2 WBC and #4 WBA in the middleweight division and has not been able to secure a fight with any top level guy. Could it be that guys are staying away because he is not only a guy with power in both hands but can box and always stay composed????
You say step it up already and Miranda is fighting the guy, Willie Gibbs, that Pierre was beating on 2 out of 3 judges scorecards in the 12th round before getting knocked out.
Can you not give him the props he is due??
Pavlik is not moving up at least not yet, he wants the Middleweight World Championship.
How about you give Miranda props for "beating" Artur Abraham. Someone who was considered a "huge" step up?
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntin_itai
Pantera you say the boy needs to step it up, he is Ranked #2 WBC and #4 WBA in the middleweight division and has not been able to secure a fight with any top level guy. Could it be that guys are staying away because he is not only a guy with power in both hands but can box and always stay composed????
You say step it up already and Miranda is fighting the guy, Willie Gibbs, that Pierre was beating on 2 out of 3 judges scorecards in the 12th round before getting knocked out.
Can you not give him the props he is due??
Pavlik is not moving up at least not yet, he wants the Middleweight World Championship.
How about you give Miranda props for "beating" Artur Abraham. Someone who was considered a "huge" step up?
That whole time out, Dr. Look at the jaw, lets go to the cards stuff that happened is out of Abrahams reach... Now what happened during the 3:00 min. of each rd. is different....
Miranda did not beat Abraham...... Like I said don't mix up the shuffle rd. as I like to call it, with the actual fight (inside those 3:00 min.) Abraham won a very contreversial fight but did enough to win it... In the last rds.
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMicK
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntin_itai
Pantera you say the boy needs to step it up, he is Ranked #2 WBC and #4 WBA in the middleweight division and has not been able to secure a fight with any top level guy. Could it be that guys are staying away because he is not only a guy with power in both hands but can box and always stay composed????
You say step it up already and Miranda is fighting the guy, Willie Gibbs, that Pierre was beating on 2 out of 3 judges scorecards in the 12th round before getting knocked out.
Can you not give him the props he is due??
Pavlik is not moving up at least not yet, he wants the Middleweight World Championship.
How about you give Miranda props for "beating" Artur Abraham. Someone who was considered a "huge" step up?
That whole time out, Dr. Look at the jaw, lets go to the cards stuff that happened is out of Abrahams reach... Now what happened during the 3:00 min. of each rd. is different....
Miranda did not beat Abraham...... Like I said don't mix up the shuffle rd. as I like to call it, with the actual fight (inside those 3:00 min.) Abraham won a very contreversial fight but did enough to win it... In the last rds.
Abraham said he couldn't continue and the ref listened to people in the crowd to change his answer and Abraham shrugged his shoulders like 'fook it' and went out there again
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
This was a mismatch, I was surprised Pierre made it 4.
Miranda-Gibbs will be another mismatch unless Willie lands a huge shot.
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntin_itai
Pantera you say the boy needs to step it up, he is Ranked #2 WBC and #4 WBA in the middleweight division and has not been able to secure a fight with any top level guy. Could it be that guys are staying away because he is not only a guy with power in both hands but can box and always stay composed????
You say step it up already and Miranda is fighting the guy, Willie Gibbs, that Pierre was beating on 2 out of 3 judges scorecards in the 12th round before getting knocked out.
Can you not give him the props he is due??
Pavlik is not moving up at least not yet, he wants the Middleweight World Championship.
Miranda fought Eastman and than went to Germany to fight Abraham. Yes, he risked his undefeated record and went into the corruption of Wilfred Sauerland to take on the hard hitting Abraham. So don't say stupid crap about Miranda not stepping it up!
HBO is the one who picked Gibbs for Miranda's showcase on their network. I agree that Gibbs should be an easy fight, but that is what HBO wants, not necessarily Miranda. Pavlik had an open invitation to fight Miranda last year, and he turned it down (this is a fact, eventhough you will deny it, ask Cameron Dunkin if you don't believe me!). He again has an open invitation to fight Miranda after the WBC mandated an eliminator between them. Let's see if Pavlik takes the fight now.
Listen, I give Pavlik props for looking good against the quality of his recent opposition, but until he fights a true top 10 contender, nobody will know for sure how good he is. He was on the canvas when he fought Brono and Zuniga, so who knows what will happen when he gets hit by someone with Miranda's power. I for one hope the fight happens!
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pantera
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntin_itai
Pantera you say the boy needs to step it up, he is Ranked #2 WBC and #4 WBA in the middleweight division and has not been able to secure a fight with any top level guy. Could it be that guys are staying away because he is not only a guy with power in both hands but can box and always stay composed????
You say step it up already and Miranda is fighting the guy, Willie Gibbs, that Pierre was beating on 2 out of 3 judges scorecards in the 12th round before getting knocked out.
Can you not give him the props he is due??
Pavlik is not moving up at least not yet, he wants the Middleweight World Championship.
Miranda fought Eastman and than went to Germany to fight Abraham. Yes, he risked his undefeated record and went into the corruption of Wilfred Sauerland to take on the hard hitting Abraham. So don't say stupid crap about Miranda not stepping it up!
HBO is the one who picked Gibbs for Miranda's showcase on their network. I agree that Gibbs should be an easy fight, but that is what HBO wants, not necessarily Miranda. Pavlik had an open invitation to fight Miranda last year, and he turned it down (this is a fact, eventhough you will deny it, ask Cameron Dunkin if you don't believe me!). He again has an open invitation to fight Miranda after the WBC mandated an eliminator between them. Let's see if Pavlik takes the fight now.
Listen, I give Pavlik props for looking good against the quality of his recent opposition, but until he fights a true top 10 contender, nobody will know for sure how good he is. He was on the canvas when he fought Brono and Zuniga, so who knows what will happen when he gets hit by someone with Miranda's power. I for one hope the fight happens!
I agree Pantera, Miranda travelled to the place where you need to basically knock the guy out to get a decision and did himself proud, i think in America where the rumour is this will happen again in spring, my money is on Mirnada he is a dangerous customer and i like his style.
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntin_itai
Pantera you say the boy needs to step it up, he is Ranked #2 WBC and #4 WBA in the middleweight division and has not been able to secure a fight with any top level guy. Could it be that guys are staying away because he is not only a guy with power in both hands but can box and always stay composed????
You say step it up already and Miranda is fighting the guy, Willie Gibbs, that Pierre was beating on 2 out of 3 judges scorecards in the 12th round before getting knocked out.
Can you not give him the props he is due??
Pavlik is not moving up at least not yet, he wants the Middleweight World Championship.
How about you give Miranda props for "beating" Artur Abraham. Someone who was considered a "huge" step up?
Abraham was never placed as a huge step up for Miranda, I mean they fought a couple of the same guys and the odds were almost 50 / 50.
And that fight was not nearly as close as people who havent seen it are telling you. I have it on DVD and I though Abraham was winning convincivly without the point deductions.
And all that bullshit people are saying about the 2 point reduction. Anyone who knows abit of boxing rules knows that any intentional foul is 2 points deducted, not 1. Its funny because those same people admit it was intentional. Your boy lost a dirty fight that he chose to fight, he fought dirty because he knew he would get his ass whooped.
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMicK
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntin_itai
Pantera you say the boy needs to step it up, he is Ranked #2 WBC and #4 WBA in the middleweight division and has not been able to secure a fight with any top level guy. Could it be that guys are staying away because he is not only a guy with power in both hands but can box and always stay composed????
You say step it up already and Miranda is fighting the guy, Willie Gibbs, that Pierre was beating on 2 out of 3 judges scorecards in the 12th round before getting knocked out.
Can you not give him the props he is due??
Pavlik is not moving up at least not yet, he wants the Middleweight World Championship.
How about you give Miranda props for "beating" Artur Abraham. Someone who was considered a "huge" step up?
That whole time out, Dr. Look at the jaw, lets go to the cards stuff that happened is out of Abrahams reach... Now what happened during the 3:00 min. of each rd. is different....
Miranda did not beat Abraham...... Like I said don't mix up the shuffle rd. as I like to call it, with the actual fight (inside those 3:00 min.) Abraham won a very contreversial fight but did enough to win it... In the last rds.
Abraham said he couldn't continue and the ref listened to people in the crowd to change his answer and Abraham shrugged his shoulders like 'fook it' and went out there again
Do you speak German? Were you in the corner and heard him say that? Unless you answer yes to those questions shut the fuck up, thats heresay.
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMicK
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntin_itai
Pantera you say the boy needs to step it up, he is Ranked #2 WBC and #4 WBA in the middleweight division and has not been able to secure a fight with any top level guy. Could it be that guys are staying away because he is not only a guy with power in both hands but can box and always stay composed????
You say step it up already and Miranda is fighting the guy, Willie Gibbs, that Pierre was beating on 2 out of 3 judges scorecards in the 12th round before getting knocked out.
Can you not give him the props he is due??
Pavlik is not moving up at least not yet, he wants the Middleweight World Championship.
How about you give Miranda props for "beating" Artur Abraham. Someone who was considered a "huge" step up?
That whole time out, Dr. Look at the jaw, lets go to the cards stuff that happened is out of Abrahams reach... Now what happened during the 3:00 min. of each rd. is different....
Miranda did not beat Abraham...... Like I said don't mix up the shuffle rd. as I like to call it, with the actual fight (inside those 3:00 min.) Abraham won a very contreversial fight but did enough to win it... In the last rds.
Abraham said he couldn't continue and the ref listened to people in the crowd to change his answer and Abraham shrugged his shoulders like 'fook it' and went out there again
Do you speak German? Were you in the corner and heard him say that? Unless you answer yes to those questions shut the F*** up, thats heresay.
ahhh, Mr Hous.... I was at the fight and have seen it numerous times on DVD. I have stated my feelings about this fight and the fact the IBF, WBO, Ring Magazine, ESPN, HBO, and many other respected writers and organizations agree with my opinion, I think I can not be far off. You may disagree, along with many Euros and Abraham fans, but let's not revisit that discussion...
HOWEVER, don't say things that are untrue. Starr was right on with what happened and you can't argue the point. I had EVERY word translated to me that was spoken in Round 5, and the truth is:
The corner wanted to stop the fight, the Doctor wanted to stop the fight, Abraham wanted to quit and the ref agreed. Wilfred Sauerland was the only man demanding the fight continue. Even after all the craziness, Randy Neumann looked at Abraham and said "OK, we're gonna fight, can you fight?" and Abraham shook his head and said "NO!".
Why the fight wasn't immediately waived off can only make one think the ref was in the pocket of Sauerland. But, whatever the reason, the rest is history and Abraham got the judges vote.
So quit pushing your BS. What I say is all true, and all clearly seen and heard on tape.
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Pavlick-Green winner fights Lacey. That winner gets Kessler-JC winner for mega bucks. Why not? It has a nice Euro-American angle thta spells m o n e y!
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted The Bull
Pavlick-Green winner fights Lacey. That winner gets Kessler-JC winner for mega bucks. Why not? It has a nice Euro-American angle thta spells m o n e y!
Kessler v Calzaghe?? Have i missed something you got more chance of Sonny Listen v Joe Louis. ;D
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pantera
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMicK
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntin_itai
Pantera you say the boy needs to step it up, he is Ranked #2 WBC and #4 WBA in the middleweight division and has not been able to secure a fight with any top level guy. Could it be that guys are staying away because he is not only a guy with power in both hands but can box and always stay composed????
You say step it up already and Miranda is fighting the guy, Willie Gibbs, that Pierre was beating on 2 out of 3 judges scorecards in the 12th round before getting knocked out.
Can you not give him the props he is due??
Pavlik is not moving up at least not yet, he wants the Middleweight World Championship.
How about you give Miranda props for "beating" Artur Abraham. Someone who was considered a "huge" step up?
That whole time out, Dr. Look at the jaw, lets go to the cards stuff that happened is out of Abrahams reach... Now what happened during the 3:00 min. of each rd. is different....
Miranda did not beat Abraham...... Like I said don't mix up the shuffle rd. as I like to call it, with the actual fight (inside those 3:00 min.) Abraham won a very contreversial fight but did enough to win it... In the last rds.
Abraham said he couldn't continue and the ref listened to people in the crowd to change his answer and Abraham shrugged his shoulders like 'fook it' and went out there again
Do you speak German? Were you in the corner and heard him say that? Unless you answer yes to those questions shut the F*** up, thats heresay.
ahhh, Mr Hous.... I was at the fight and have seen it numerous times on DVD. I have stated my feelings about this fight and the fact the IBF, WBO, Ring Magazine, ESPN, HBO, and many other respected writers and organizations agree with my opinion, I think I can not be far off. You may disagree, along with many Euros and Abraham fans, but let's not revisit that discussion...
HOWEVER, don't say things that are untrue. Starr was right on with what happened and you can't argue the point. I had EVERY word translated to me that was spoken in Round 5, and the truth is:
The corner wanted to stop the fight, the Doctor wanted to stop the fight, Abraham wanted to quit and the ref agreed. Wilfred Sauerland was the only man demanding the fight continue. Even after all the craziness, Randy Neumann looked at Abraham and said "OK, we're gonna fight, can you fight?" and Abraham shook his head and said "NO!".
Why the fight wasn't immediately waived off can only make one think the ref was in the pocket of Sauerland. But, whatever the reason, the rest is history and Abraham got the judges vote.
So quit pushing your BS. What I say is all true, and all clearly seen and heard on tape.
Im not a Euro or a abraham fan, hell im not even white. Miranda lost, get over it.
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
I'm beyond it. Everything worked out great for Miranda landing an HBO date and I am happy for him.
Like I said, I'm not trying to make a debate over who really won and why, you just went off on Starr and were wrong in doing so. I thought I should set the record straight.
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pantera
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMicK
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntin_itai
Pantera you say the boy needs to step it up, he is Ranked #2 WBC and #4 WBA in the middleweight division and has not been able to secure a fight with any top level guy. Could it be that guys are staying away because he is not only a guy with power in both hands but can box and always stay composed????
You say step it up already and Miranda is fighting the guy, Willie Gibbs, that Pierre was beating on 2 out of 3 judges scorecards in the 12th round before getting knocked out.
Can you not give him the props he is due??
Pavlik is not moving up at least not yet, he wants the Middleweight World Championship.
How about you give Miranda props for "beating" Artur Abraham. Someone who was considered a "huge" step up?
That whole time out, Dr. Look at the jaw, lets go to the cards stuff that happened is out of Abrahams reach... Now what happened during the 3:00 min. of each rd. is different....
Miranda did not beat Abraham...... Like I said don't mix up the shuffle rd. as I like to call it, with the actual fight (inside those 3:00 min.) Abraham won a very contreversial fight but did enough to win it... In the last rds.
Abraham said he couldn't continue and the ref listened to people in the crowd to change his answer and Abraham shrugged his shoulders like 'fook it' and went out there again
Do you speak German? Were you in the corner and heard him say that? Unless you answer yes to those questions shut the F*** up, thats heresay.
ahhh, Mr Hous.... I was at the fight and have seen it numerous times on DVD. I have stated my feelings about this fight and the fact the IBF, WBO, Ring Magazine, ESPN, HBO, and many other respected writers and organizations agree with my opinion, I think I can not be far off. You may disagree, along with many Euros and Abraham fans, but let's not revisit that discussion...
HOWEVER, don't say things that are untrue. Starr was right on with what happened and you can't argue the point. I had EVERY word translated to me that was spoken in Round 5, and the truth is:
The corner wanted to stop the fight, the Doctor wanted to stop the fight, Abraham wanted to quit and the ref agreed. Wilfred Sauerland was the only man demanding the fight continue. Even after all the craziness, Randy Neumann looked at Abraham and said "OK, we're gonna fight, can you fight?" and Abraham shook his head and said "NO!".
Why the fight wasn't immediately waived off can only make one think the ref was in the pocket of Sauerland. But, whatever the reason, the rest is history and Abraham got the judges vote.
So quit pushing your BS. What I say is all true, and all clearly seen and heard on tape.
Im not a Euro or a abraham fan, hell im not even white. Miranda lost, get over it.
You talked shit to her like you were at the fight yourself and then got shown up by someone actually at the fight.
Truth is Miranda lost. Trust is Abraham quit but they let it continue(and I'm going by what Pantera said because I've only seen rbr's and highlights of the fight)
Was there an investigation of this fight.
Here's the other truth.
because they let Abraham fight on, he won't be fighting again for a long time. Miranda already has another TV fight coming up on hbo. So who got the best of that deal?
And you say you're not an Abraham fan but you stated every instance to prove somebody wrong as if it was fact to insult them. So then what are you? Because you dang sure aint neutral.
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Pantera we can go back and forth all day long about who wanted the fight and who did not. I have ended that battle with you.
I have given Miranda props for what he is a guy with excellent power that has little to no other boxing skills. He is far more raw than Pavlik, watch some of Kelly's fights he has far better boxing skills and has power in both his left and his right hands. The guys he fought were also picked by his camp as you say Gibbs was picked by HBO and Kelly did not just win those fights he walked right through them and was never in trouble in any of his fights to this point, he is 29-0 with 26 KO's.
The thing is I have watched the Abraham fight over and over. You must realize that Abraham lasted the last 8 rounds with a broken jaw, Miranda did not knock out a guy with a broken jaw.
I really hope that Miranda and Pavlik fight, but for now we will just have to agree to disagree.
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntin_itai
I have given Miranda props for what he is a guy with excellent power that has little to no other boxing skills. He is far more raw than Pavlik, watch some of Kelly's fights he has far better boxing skills and has power in both his left and his right hands. The guys he fought were also picked by his camp as you say Gibbs was picked by HBO and Kelly did not just win those fights he walked right through them and was never in trouble in any of his fights to this point, he is 29-0 with 26 KO's.
The thing is I have watched the Abraham fight over and over. You must realize that Abraham lasted the last 8 rounds with a broken jaw, Miranda did not knock out a guy with a broken jaw.
I really hope that Miranda and Pavlik fight, but for now we will just have to agree to disagree.
How can you say Miranda has little to no boxing skills other than power? The man KO'd Eastman and argueably KO'd Abraham and beat him on points. It takes a lot more than power to accomplish those two feats alone. It's easy to look good and stay undefeated like Pavlik when you hand pick class B smaller guys to beat up on. Send Pavlik to Germany to face Abraham and see what happens, than you can talk, until than STFU! ;D
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Do you speak German? Were you in the corner and heard him say that? Unless you answer yes to those questions shut the F*** up, thats heresay.
After the ref asks Abraham if he wants to fight you can clearly hear him say "no" then somebody outside of the ring starts talking to him and then he turns to the ref and shrugs his shoulders. The ref then asks if he has a mouth piece, then asks him if he is ready to fight and the ref calls time in and they start fighting again. So I would have to say it is not heresay and you need to shut up about it because you are clearly biased about the fight, sc.
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majesty
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pantera
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMicK
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntin_itai
Pantera you say the boy needs to step it up, he is Ranked #2 WBC and #4 WBA in the middleweight division and has not been able to secure a fight with any top level guy. Could it be that guys are staying away because he is not only a guy with power in both hands but can box and always stay composed????
You say step it up already and Miranda is fighting the guy, Willie Gibbs, that Pierre was beating on 2 out of 3 judges scorecards in the 12th round before getting knocked out.
Can you not give him the props he is due??
Pavlik is not moving up at least not yet, he wants the Middleweight World Championship.
How about you give Miranda props for "beating" Artur Abraham. Someone who was considered a "huge" step up?
That whole time out, Dr. Look at the jaw, lets go to the cards stuff that happened is out of Abrahams reach... Now what happened during the 3:00 min. of each rd. is different....
Miranda did not beat Abraham...... Like I said don't mix up the shuffle rd. as I like to call it, with the actual fight (inside those 3:00 min.) Abraham won a very contreversial fight but did enough to win it... In the last rds.
Abraham said he couldn't continue and the ref listened to people in the crowd to change his answer and Abraham shrugged his shoulders like 'fook it' and went out there again
Do you speak German? Were you in the corner and heard him say that? Unless you answer yes to those questions shut the F*** up, thats heresay.
ahhh, Mr Hous.... I was at the fight and have seen it numerous times on DVD. I have stated my feelings about this fight and the fact the IBF, WBO, Ring Magazine, ESPN, HBO, and many other respected writers and organizations agree with my opinion, I think I can not be far off. You may disagree, along with many Euros and Abraham fans, but let's not revisit that discussion...
HOWEVER, don't say things that are untrue. Starr was right on with what happened and you can't argue the point. I had EVERY word translated to me that was spoken in Round 5, and the truth is:
The corner wanted to stop the fight, the Doctor wanted to stop the fight, Abraham wanted to quit and the ref agreed. Wilfred Sauerland was the only man demanding the fight continue. Even after all the craziness, Randy Neumann looked at Abraham and said "OK, we're gonna fight, can you fight?" and Abraham shook his head and said "NO!".
Why the fight wasn't immediately waived off can only make one think the ref was in the pocket of Sauerland. But, whatever the reason, the rest is history and Abraham got the judges vote.
So quit pushing your BS. What I say is all true, and all clearly seen and heard on tape.
Im not a Euro or a abraham fan, hell im not even white. Miranda lost, get over it.
You talked shit to her like you were at the fight yourself and then got shown up by someone actually at the fight.
Truth is Miranda lost. Trust is Abraham quit but they let it continue(and I'm going by what Pantera said because I've only seen rbr's and highlights of the fight)
Was there an investigation of this fight.
Here's the other truth.
because they let Abraham fight on, he won't be fighting again for a long time. Miranda already has another TV fight coming up on hbo. So who got the best of that deal?
And you say you're not an Abraham fan but you stated every instance to prove somebody wrong as if it was fact to insult them. So then what are you? Because you dang sure aint neutral.
Im not neutral? Hmmm Im just not a fan of ignorance because lets all go back to how this started, Star said Abraham lost and Miranda won. I never argued with anyone about who got the better end of the fight because I simply dont give a damn about either fighter. I didnt even know who Abraham or Pantera were until I meet Pantera and some Armenians on another Boxing forum. This fight was hyped but did not deleiver.
Abraham won, if you want to debate that with me so be it. But if you want to talk about their futures im going to ignore you because neither impressed me apart from Abrahams heart.
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majesty
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pantera
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMicK
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntin_itai
Pantera you say the boy needs to step it up, he is Ranked #2 WBC and #4 WBA in the middleweight division and has not been able to secure a fight with any top level guy. Could it be that guys are staying away because he is not only a guy with power in both hands but can box and always stay composed????
You say step it up already and Miranda is fighting the guy, Willie Gibbs, that Pierre was beating on 2 out of 3 judges scorecards in the 12th round before getting knocked out.
Can you not give him the props he is due??
Pavlik is not moving up at least not yet, he wants the Middleweight World Championship.
How about you give Miranda props for "beating" Artur Abraham. Someone who was considered a "huge" step up?
That whole time out, Dr. Look at the jaw, lets go to the cards stuff that happened is out of Abrahams reach... Now what happened during the 3:00 min. of each rd. is different....
Miranda did not beat Abraham...... Like I said don't mix up the shuffle rd. as I like to call it, with the actual fight (inside those 3:00 min.) Abraham won a very contreversial fight but did enough to win it... In the last rds.
Abraham said he couldn't continue and the ref listened to people in the crowd to change his answer and Abraham shrugged his shoulders like 'fook it' and went out there again
Do you speak German? Were you in the corner and heard him say that? Unless you answer yes to those questions shut the F*** up, thats heresay.
ahhh, Mr Hous.... I was at the fight and have seen it numerous times on DVD. I have stated my feelings about this fight and the fact the IBF, WBO, Ring Magazine, ESPN, HBO, and many other respected writers and organizations agree with my opinion, I think I can not be far off. You may disagree, along with many Euros and Abraham fans, but let's not revisit that discussion...
HOWEVER, don't say things that are untrue. Starr was right on with what happened and you can't argue the point. I had EVERY word translated to me that was spoken in Round 5, and the truth is:
The corner wanted to stop the fight, the Doctor wanted to stop the fight, Abraham wanted to quit and the ref agreed. Wilfred Sauerland was the only man demanding the fight continue. Even after all the craziness, Randy Neumann looked at Abraham and said "OK, we're gonna fight, can you fight?" and Abraham shook his head and said "NO!".
Why the fight wasn't immediately waived off can only make one think the ref was in the pocket of Sauerland. But, whatever the reason, the rest is history and Abraham got the judges vote.
So quit pushing your BS. What I say is all true, and all clearly seen and heard on tape.
Im not a Euro or a abraham fan, hell im not even white. Miranda lost, get over it.
You talked shit to her like you were at the fight yourself and then got shown up by someone actually at the fight.
Truth is Miranda lost. Trust is Abraham quit but they let it continue(and I'm going by what Pantera said because I've only seen rbr's and highlights of the fight)
Was there an investigation of this fight.
Here's the other truth.
because they let Abraham fight on, he won't be fighting again for a long time. Miranda already has another TV fight coming up on hbo. So who got the best of that deal?
And you say you're not an Abraham fan but you stated every instance to prove somebody wrong as if it was fact to insult them. So then what are you? Because you dang sure aint neutral.
Im not neutral? Hmmm Im just not a fan of ignorance because lets all go back to how this started, Star said Abraham lost and Miranda won. I never argued with anyone about who got the better end of the fight because I simply dont give a damn about either fighter. I didnt even know who Abraham or Pantera were until I meet Pantera and some Armenians on another Boxing forum. This fight was hyped but did not deleiver.
Abraham won, if you want to debate that with me so be it. But if you want to talk about their futures im going to ignore you because neither impressed me apart from Abrahams heart.
Fan of ignorance? Yeah if you wanted to debate who won you wouldn't have attacked me for my comment about Abraham quitting with your "Do speak German? Thats heresay? Shut up!" Bullshit ::**
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pantera
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntin_itai
I have given Miranda props for what he is a guy with excellent power that has little to no other boxing skills. He is far more raw than Pavlik, watch some of Kelly's fights he has far better boxing skills and has power in both his left and his right hands. The guys he fought were also picked by his camp as you say Gibbs was picked by HBO and Kelly did not just win those fights he walked right through them and was never in trouble in any of his fights to this point, he is 29-0 with 26 KO's.
The thing is I have watched the Abraham fight over and over. You must realize that Abraham lasted the last 8 rounds with a broken jaw, Miranda did not knock out a guy with a broken jaw.
I really hope that Miranda and Pavlik fight, but for now we will just have to agree to disagree.
How can you say Miranda has little to no boxing skills other than power? The man KO'd Eastman and argueably KO'd Abraham and beat him on points. It takes a lot more than power to accomplish those two feats alone. It's easy to look good and stay undefeated like Pavlik when you hand pick class B smaller guys to beat up on. Send Pavlik to Germany to face Abraham and see what happens, than you can talk, until than STFU! ;D
How can anyone think Miranda outpointed Abraham is beyond me, it wasnt even close in my book. Toney Peter was close, Winky Taylor was close, Abraham Miranda was not close. Miranda broke his jaw, thats pretty much all. The fight was actually pretty damn boring to be completely honest with you. Even after the fight people hyped it "OMG he broke his jaw" yeah thats all that happened...
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majesty
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pantera
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMicK
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntin_itai
Pantera you say the boy needs to step it up, he is Ranked #2 WBC and #4 WBA in the middleweight division and has not been able to secure a fight with any top level guy. Could it be that guys are staying away because he is not only a guy with power in both hands but can box and always stay composed????
You say step it up already and Miranda is fighting the guy, Willie Gibbs, that Pierre was beating on 2 out of 3 judges scorecards in the 12th round before getting knocked out.
Can you not give him the props he is due??
Pavlik is not moving up at least not yet, he wants the Middleweight World Championship.
How about you give Miranda props for "beating" Artur Abraham. Someone who was considered a "huge" step up?
That whole time out, Dr. Look at the jaw, lets go to the cards stuff that happened is out of Abrahams reach... Now what happened during the 3:00 min. of each rd. is different....
Miranda did not beat Abraham...... Like I said don't mix up the shuffle rd. as I like to call it, with the actual fight (inside those 3:00 min.) Abraham won a very contreversial fight but did enough to win it... In the last rds.
Abraham said he couldn't continue and the ref listened to people in the crowd to change his answer and Abraham shrugged his shoulders like 'fook it' and went out there again
Do you speak German? Were you in the corner and heard him say that? Unless you answer yes to those questions shut the F*** up, thats heresay.
ahhh, Mr Hous.... I was at the fight and have seen it numerous times on DVD. I have stated my feelings about this fight and the fact the IBF, WBO, Ring Magazine, ESPN, HBO, and many other respected writers and organizations agree with my opinion, I think I can not be far off. You may disagree, along with many Euros and Abraham fans, but let's not revisit that discussion...
HOWEVER, don't say things that are untrue. Starr was right on with what happened and you can't argue the point. I had EVERY word translated to me that was spoken in Round 5, and the truth is:
The corner wanted to stop the fight, the Doctor wanted to stop the fight, Abraham wanted to quit and the ref agreed. Wilfred Sauerland was the only man demanding the fight continue. Even after all the craziness, Randy Neumann looked at Abraham and said "OK, we're gonna fight, can you fight?" and Abraham shook his head and said "NO!".
Why the fight wasn't immediately waived off can only make one think the ref was in the pocket of Sauerland. But, whatever the reason, the rest is history and Abraham got the judges vote.
So quit pushing your BS. What I say is all true, and all clearly seen and heard on tape.
Im not a Euro or a abraham fan, hell im not even white. Miranda lost, get over it.
You talked S*** to her like you were at the fight yourself and then got shown up by someone actually at the fight.
Truth is Miranda lost. Trust is Abraham quit but they let it continue(and I'm going by what Pantera said because I've only seen rbr's and highlights of the fight)
Was there an investigation of this fight.
Here's the other truth.
because they let Abraham fight on, he won't be fighting again for a long time. Miranda already has another TV fight coming up on hbo. So who got the best of that deal?
And you say you're not an Abraham fan but you stated every instance to prove somebody wrong as if it was fact to insult them. So then what are you? Because you dang sure aint neutral.
Im not neutral? Hmmm Im just not a fan of ignorance because lets all go back to how this started, Star said Abraham lost and Miranda won. I never argued with anyone about who got the better end of the fight because I simply dont give a damn about either fighter. I didnt even know who Abraham or Pantera were until I meet Pantera and some Armenians on another Boxing forum. This fight was hyped but did not deleiver.
Abraham won, if you want to debate that with me so be it. But if you want to talk about their futures im going to ignore you because neither impressed me apart from Abrahams heart.
Fan of ignorance? Yeah if you wanted to debate who won you wouldn't have attacked me for my comment about Abraham quitting with your "Do speak German? Thats heresay? Shut up!" Bullshit ::**
She is sexy and fiesty! ;)
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majesty
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pantera
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMicK
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntin_itai
Pantera you say the boy needs to step it up, he is Ranked #2 WBC and #4 WBA in the middleweight division and has not been able to secure a fight with any top level guy. Could it be that guys are staying away because he is not only a guy with power in both hands but can box and always stay composed????
You say step it up already and Miranda is fighting the guy, Willie Gibbs, that Pierre was beating on 2 out of 3 judges scorecards in the 12th round before getting knocked out.
Can you not give him the props he is due??
Pavlik is not moving up at least not yet, he wants the Middleweight World Championship.
How about you give Miranda props for "beating" Artur Abraham. Someone who was considered a "huge" step up?
That whole time out, Dr. Look at the jaw, lets go to the cards stuff that happened is out of Abrahams reach... Now what happened during the 3:00 min. of each rd. is different....
Miranda did not beat Abraham...... Like I said don't mix up the shuffle rd. as I like to call it, with the actual fight (inside those 3:00 min.) Abraham won a very contreversial fight but did enough to win it... In the last rds.
Abraham said he couldn't continue and the ref listened to people in the crowd to change his answer and Abraham shrugged his shoulders like 'fook it' and went out there again
Do you speak German? Were you in the corner and heard him say that? Unless you answer yes to those questions shut the F*** up, thats heresay.
ahhh, Mr Hous.... I was at the fight and have seen it numerous times on DVD. I have stated my feelings about this fight and the fact the IBF, WBO, Ring Magazine, ESPN, HBO, and many other respected writers and organizations agree with my opinion, I think I can not be far off. You may disagree, along with many Euros and Abraham fans, but let's not revisit that discussion...
HOWEVER, don't say things that are untrue. Starr was right on with what happened and you can't argue the point. I had EVERY word translated to me that was spoken in Round 5, and the truth is:
The corner wanted to stop the fight, the Doctor wanted to stop the fight, Abraham wanted to quit and the ref agreed. Wilfred Sauerland was the only man demanding the fight continue. Even after all the craziness, Randy Neumann looked at Abraham and said "OK, we're gonna fight, can you fight?" and Abraham shook his head and said "NO!".
Why the fight wasn't immediately waived off can only make one think the ref was in the pocket of Sauerland. But, whatever the reason, the rest is history and Abraham got the judges vote.
So quit pushing your BS. What I say is all true, and all clearly seen and heard on tape.
Im not a Euro or a abraham fan, hell im not even white. Miranda lost, get over it.
You talked shit to her like you were at the fight yourself and then got shown up by someone actually at the fight.
Truth is Miranda lost. Trust is Abraham quit but they let it continue(and I'm going by what Pantera said because I've only seen rbr's and highlights of the fight)
Was there an investigation of this fight.
Here's the other truth.
because they let Abraham fight on, he won't be fighting again for a long time. Miranda already has another TV fight coming up on hbo. So who got the best of that deal?
And you say you're not an Abraham fan but you stated every instance to prove somebody wrong as if it was fact to insult them. So then what are you? Because you dang sure aint neutral.
Im not neutral? Hmmm Im just not a fan of ignorance because lets all go back to how this started, Star said Abraham lost and Miranda won. I never argued with anyone about who got the better end of the fight because I simply dont give a damn about either fighter. I didnt even know who Abraham or Pantera were until I meet Pantera and some Armenians on another Boxing forum. This fight was hyped but did not deleiver.
Abraham won, if you want to debate that with me so be it. But if you want to talk about their futures im going to ignore you because neither impressed me apart from Abrahams heart.
Fan of ignorance? Yeah if you wanted to debate who won you wouldn't have attacked me for my comment about Abraham quitting with your "Do speak German? Thats heresay? Shut up!" Bullshit ::**
Wow, I do beleive you are truely a moron.
I saw the fight and I didnt see him quit, infact I didnt even see the supposed interractions you speak of. If Abraham had the balls to step into the ring after the 4th, you cant take that away from him. If he wanted to quit trust me he would have quit. Its foolish to say he quit when he obviously finished a 12 round fight. He obviously didnt want to quit.
-
Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by TyBuff
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Do you speak German? Were you in the corner and heard him say that? Unless you answer yes to those questions shut the F*** up, thats heresay.
After the ref asks Abraham if he wants to fight you can clearly hear him say "no" then somebody outside of the ring starts talking to him and then he turns to the ref and shrugs his shoulders. The ref then asks if he has a mouth piece, then asks him if he is ready to fight and the ref calls time in and they start fighting again. So I would have to say it is not heresay and you need to shut up about it because you are clearly biased about the fight, sc.
How am I biased?
-
Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majesty
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pantera
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMicK
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starr
Quote:
Originally Posted by huntin_itai
Pantera you say the boy needs to step it up, he is Ranked #2 WBC and #4 WBA in the middleweight division and has not been able to secure a fight with any top level guy. Could it be that guys are staying away because he is not only a guy with power in both hands but can box and always stay composed????
You say step it up already and Miranda is fighting the guy, Willie Gibbs, that Pierre was beating on 2 out of 3 judges scorecards in the 12th round before getting knocked out.
Can you not give him the props he is due??
Pavlik is not moving up at least not yet, he wants the Middleweight World Championship.
How about you give Miranda props for "beating" Artur Abraham. Someone who was considered a "huge" step up?
That whole time out, Dr. Look at the jaw, lets go to the cards stuff that happened is out of Abrahams reach... Now what happened during the 3:00 min. of each rd. is different....
Miranda did not beat Abraham...... Like I said don't mix up the shuffle rd. as I like to call it, with the actual fight (inside those 3:00 min.) Abraham won a very contreversial fight but did enough to win it... In the last rds.
Abraham said he couldn't continue and the ref listened to people in the crowd to change his answer and Abraham shrugged his shoulders like 'fook it' and went out there again
Do you speak German? Were you in the corner and heard him say that? Unless you answer yes to those questions shut the F*** up, thats heresay.
ahhh, Mr Hous.... I was at the fight and have seen it numerous times on DVD. I have stated my feelings about this fight and the fact the IBF, WBO, Ring Magazine, ESPN, HBO, and many other respected writers and organizations agree with my opinion, I think I can not be far off. You may disagree, along with many Euros and Abraham fans, but let's not revisit that discussion...
HOWEVER, don't say things that are untrue. Starr was right on with what happened and you can't argue the point. I had EVERY word translated to me that was spoken in Round 5, and the truth is:
The corner wanted to stop the fight, the Doctor wanted to stop the fight, Abraham wanted to quit and the ref agreed. Wilfred Sauerland was the only man demanding the fight continue. Even after all the craziness, Randy Neumann looked at Abraham and said "OK, we're gonna fight, can you fight?" and Abraham shook his head and said "NO!".
Why the fight wasn't immediately waived off can only make one think the ref was in the pocket of Sauerland. But, whatever the reason, the rest is history and Abraham got the judges vote.
So quit pushing your BS. What I say is all true, and all clearly seen and heard on tape.
Im not a Euro or a abraham fan, hell im not even white. Miranda lost, get over it.
You talked shit to her like you were at the fight yourself and then got shown up by someone actually at the fight.
Truth is Miranda lost. Trust is Abraham quit but they let it continue(and I'm going by what Pantera said because I've only seen rbr's and highlights of the fight)
Was there an investigation of this fight.
Here's the other truth.
because they let Abraham fight on, he won't be fighting again for a long time. Miranda already has another TV fight coming up on hbo. So who got the best of that deal?
And you say you're not an Abraham fan but you stated every instance to prove somebody wrong as if it was fact to insult them. So then what are you? Because you dang sure aint neutral.
Im not neutral? Hmmm Im just not a fan of ignorance because lets all go back to how this started, Star said Abraham lost and Miranda won. I never argued with anyone about who got the better end of the fight because I simply dont give a damn about either fighter. I didnt even know who Abraham or Pantera were until I meet Pantera and some Armenians on another Boxing forum. This fight was hyped but did not deleiver.
Abraham won, if you want to debate that with me so be it. But if you want to talk about their futures im going to ignore you because neither impressed me apart from Abrahams heart.
Fan of ignorance? Yeah if you wanted to debate who won you wouldn't have attacked me for my comment about Abraham quitting with your "Do speak German? Thats heresay? Shut up!" Bullshit ::**
Wow, I do beleive you are truely a moron.
I saw the fight and I didnt see him quit, infact I didnt even see the supposed interractions you speak of. If Abraham had the balls to step into the ring after the 4th, you cant take that away from him. If he wanted to quit trust me he would have quit. Its foolish to say he quit when he obviously finished a 12 round fight. He obviously didnt want to quit.
Funny how you're the only one saying you didn't see him quit. Pantera was AT THE FIGHT!!! boxingtalk was AT THE FIGHT!!! They saw it and they posted about it. And if you still think I'm a moron. LOOK IT UP!!
Anyway...its just funny how you're the ONLY one who didn't see him quit and then want to call it heresay because you didn't catch it but everyone else did
-
Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Quote:
Originally Posted by TyBuff
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hous
Do you speak German? Were you in the corner and heard him say that? Unless you answer yes to those questions shut the F*** up, thats heresay.
After the ref asks Abraham if he wants to fight you can clearly hear him say "no" then somebody outside of the ring starts talking to him and then he turns to the ref and shrugs his shoulders. The ref then asks if he has a mouth piece, then asks him if he is ready to fight and the ref calls time in and they start fighting again. So I would have to say it is not heresay and you need to shut up about it because you are clearly biased about the fight, sc.
How am I biased?
It was either biased or a complete idiot. The facts about that situation are right there and yet you choose to ignore them, so either you are biased about it or a complete idiot. I chose biased because I hate to assume somebody is that ignorant. You obviously scored the fight more in Abrahams favor, I for one had it as a close fight.
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Hous-
Watch the 5th round 'fiasco' again and you can't deny the truth. Abraham wanted to quit, he was talked into fighting from Wilfred Sauerland (you can't see Sauerland in this video, but I was right there and saw it first hand). You also see how bad of a job the ref did in controling the situation. He was there to protect the fighter. He went against the Doctors and fighters opinion and listened to the 'audience' and pushed the fight to continue. Do you think if Miranda was in that situation the ref would have acted that way? Hell no, he would have waived his hands and stopped the fight immediately, as he should.
Here is the link to the stoppage, scan down a little and you will see a link to watch it.
www.warriorsboxing.com
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Now Abraham probably WANTED to quit but you have to give him respect for staying in there after being mauled like that.
even if he kept running away like a little bitch
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
....but I understand english and Randy Neuman said "He can't fight" right after Mr. Abraham shook his head no as in "No I don't want to fight"
Miranda did a very dumb thing with the headbutt but in no way did that cause the broken jaw....Arthur was hardly throwing any punches in that round BEFORE that happened
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Re: Pavlik wins by KO round 4
Yea, the only real problem I have with Miranda in the fight was the stupid head butt. I read somewhere the reason he did it was because everytime Abraham was clinching, he was punching Miranda behind the head. He did it to push Abraham away and make a statement that he was not gonna put up with the clinching and hitting. Either way, it was stupid and bad timing. If it was not for that mistake, I think Abraham would have been finished.
