Taylor's still hungry...but R you still hungry for Taylor? What's your thoughts

Taylor Still Hungry for Greater Ring Glory!

One might think that defeating the legendary Bernard Hopkins twice and battling the skillful Winky Wright to a draw would satisfy most fighters. After all, Hopkins will be a sure-fire inductee into the Boxing Hall of Fame at Canastota, New York, and Winky Wright may be the most highly avoided fighter of his generation. Undefeated middleweight champion Jermain “Bad Intentions” Taylor not only faced these great fighters but also did not lose in all three bouts. He accomplished these monumental feats by wrestling the title from Hopkins in a disputed decision, capturing another close decision over the legend and then retaining his title for a second time by battling Wright to a draw.

full article on www.fightnews.com

I'm torn here. In the start...I really REALLY believed in Taylor. Part of me still does...but I TRULY BELIEVE that he lost to Hopkins in that first fight. He won the second one & I commend him...but again...comes the second plague...HE LOST TO WRIGHT.

He knows it, Wright knows it, & most of his fans know it.

That all being said...Taylor can control the division...provided that he plays his cards right...& in the event that he has a close call...he keeps kissing a** at HBO. They have their new Golden Boy in Taylor & he can make good on his role.

While it sounds overly critical...my opinion of Taylor is high & hopeful.

I voted for Option #2.

How did you vote? Let's talk.

I voted #1 brutha!

Jermain Taylor is awesome....he's 28, 25(17 KO)-0-1 he ALREADY has 2 hall of famers on his record and not in the loss column either!!!!

JT wasn't ready for B-Hop the first time and he wasn't active enough to beat Winky either but those guys are tough as shit to fight much less beat and look good doing it!!!!


The Ouma match is basically a stay warm fight, Wright didn't want the rematch, Abraham is hurt, Miranda just got done with Abraham and LOST, Mora is a douche, Sturm got beat, Castillejo would have been a good choice but he's old as hell....if there were other options I'd listen.....don't say Sam Soliman, no one wants to fight him, not after how he made Winky look

....oh yeah, yall gotta remember this is only his SECOND fight with Manny as his trainer it's a learning process....I expect to see a calmer, more tactical, harder hitting JT vs Ouma than we've seen in the past

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Originally Posted by Lyle

I voted #1 brutha!

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I knew you would.

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Originally Posted by Lyle

Jermain Taylor is awesome....he's 28, 25(17 KO)-0-1 he ALREADY has 2 hall of famers on his record and not in the loss column either!!!!

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Agreed...he's got the goods...not sure that I still classify him as I did in the past...but he's got the goods.

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Originally Posted by Lyle

JT wasn't ready for B-Hop the first time and he wasn't active enough to beat Winky either but those guys are tough as S*** to fight much less beat and look good doing it!!!!

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He still lost to Hopkins & Wright in my book. I know you disagree...but I just don't see it.

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Originally Posted by Lyle

The Ouma match is basically a stay warm fight, Wright didn't want the rematch, Abraham is hurt, Miranda just got done with Abraham and LOST, Mora is a douche, Sturm got beat, Castillejo would have been a good choice but he's old as hell....if there were other options I'd listen.....don't say Sam Soliman, no one wants to fight him, not after how he made Winky look

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The thing about the Ouma match...what if it back fires?

Wouldn't that suck ass?!?!

Agreed...Miranda did indeed lose to Abraham...& I aint so sure Taylor wouldn't. I woulda loved for him to have fought Castillejo...that would have been the right choice.

I still think that Soliman is underappreciated & should get more shots at a title...I aint a fan...but he's a worthy challenger.

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Originally Posted by Lyle

....oh yeah, yall gotta remember this is only his SECOND fight with Manny as his trainer it's a learning process....I expect to see a calmer, more tactical, harder hitting JT vs Ouma than we've seen in the past

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Personally...I think that will prove to be Taylor's biggest career mistake. Burns was what made Taylor...Burns was, IWO, Taylor's rock...I could be wrong...but I'm a big stickler for loyalty.

Doesn't matter to me anymore. I would have liked him more if he'd gotten those losses. Then he could be a true champion. I've never seen Hopkins need a gift decision. Less likely 3 in a row. I expect him to dominate Ouma but it proves nothing other then he can beat undersized 54 pounders which was already known.

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Originally Posted by Lyle

I voted #1 brutha!

Jermain Taylor is awesome....he's 28, 25(17 KO)-0-1 he ALREADY has 2 hall of famers on his record and not in the loss column either!!!!

JT wasn't ready for B-Hop the first time and he wasn't active enough to beat Winky either but those guys are tough as S*** to fight much less beat and look good doing it!!!!


The Ouma match is basically a stay warm fight, Wright didn't want the rematch, Abraham is hurt, Miranda just got done with Abraham and LOST, Mora is a douche, Sturm got beat, Castillejo would have been a good choice but he's old as hell....if there were other options I'd listen.....don't say Sam Soliman, no one wants to fight him, not after how he made Winky look

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I went with #1 as well.....I just think he's a great person and fighter.....I don't think he won the first with B-HOP...and I didn't think he beat Winky either...but to hang and come as close as he did...not getting blown out and making those fights EXTREEMLY competitive goes to His ability.....I think he is for real!!! And he is getting better!!!

A great person that got rid of his trainer that got him to that Middleweight Championship.

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Originally Posted by THE Bigragu

I went with #1 as well.....I just think he's a great person and fighter.....I don't think he won the first with B-HOP...and I didn't think he beat Winky either...but to hang and come as close as he did...not getting blown out and making those fights EXTREEMLY competitive goes to His ability.....I think he is for real!!! And he is getting better!!!

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:coolclick: Well said.

He has been in some tough fights and got some HBO rounds, but he still looked good and you can't take that away from him. But until he fights someone who's got power, I got my doubts. Dibella will protect him as much as possible. He knows with HBO, JT wins (or gets a draw) on anything close. He will out weigh Ouma by 15+ pounds come fight time. If he has ANY touble in that fight, I will lose respect...

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Originally Posted by Majesty

A great person that got rid of his trainer that got him to that Middleweight Championship.

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Who WOULDN'T take Emmanual Steward as your TRAINER!!! you would be an idiot to turn down that opportunity.....Manny affords JT the ability to become the best he can be....JT's trainer did a great job getting him as far as he did....But Manny gives him the opportunity to become GREAT!!!!

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Originally Posted by THE Bigragu

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Originally Posted by Majesty

A great person that got rid of his trainer that got him to that Middleweight Championship.

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Who WOULDN'T take Emmanual Steward as your TRAINER!!! you would be an idiot to turn down that opportunity.....Manny affords JT the ability to become the best he can be....JT's trainer did a great job getting him as far as he did....But Manny gives him the opportunity to become GREAT!!!!

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And he looks terrible against Wright.

Karma will come back on him like it did to Brewster for dumping Reed.

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Originally Posted by wacko3205

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Originally Posted by THE Bigragu

I went with #1 as well.....I just think he's a great person and fighter.....I don't think he won the first with B-HOP...and I didn't think he beat Winky either...but to hang and come as close as he did...not getting blown out and making those fights EXTREEMLY competitive goes to His ability.....I think he is for real!!! And he is getting better!!!

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:coolclick: Well said.

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CC back at cha brother!!!

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Originally Posted by Pantera

He has been in some tough fights and got some HBO rounds, but he still looked good and you can't take that away from him. But until he fights someone who's got power, I got my doubts. Dibella will protect him as much as possible. He knows with HBO, JT wins (or gets a draw) on anything close. He will out weigh Ouma by 15+ pounds come fight time. If he has ANY touble in that fight, I will lose respect...

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It's a proven fact that a little skill goes a looooooooooooooooong way against a lot of power. ;)

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Originally Posted by Majesty

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Originally Posted by THE Bigragu

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Originally Posted by Majesty

A great person that got rid of his trainer that got him to that Middleweight Championship.

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Who WOULDN'T take Emmanual Steward as your TRAINER!!! you would be an idiot to turn down that opportunity.....Manny affords JT the ability to become the best he can be....JT's trainer did a great job getting him as far as he did....But Manny gives him the opportunity to become GREAT!!!!

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And he looks terrible against Wright.

Karma will come back on him like it did to Brewster for dumping Reed.

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Taylor dumped Pat Burns, babe.

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Originally Posted by Majesty

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Originally Posted by THE Bigragu

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Originally Posted by Majesty

A great person that got rid of his trainer that got him to that Middleweight Championship.

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Who WOULDN'T take Emmanual Steward as your TRAINER!!! you would be an idiot to turn down that opportunity.....Manny affords JT the ability to become the best he can be....JT's trainer did a great job getting him as far as he did....But Manny gives him the opportunity to become GREAT!!!!

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And he looks terrible against Wright.

Karma will come back on him like it did to Brewster for dumping Reed.

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I don't see that happening.....Honestly, How can you fault JT for going with EMMANUEL STEWARD!!!!!!!! IT'S EMMANUEL STEWARD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! one of the greatest trainers EVER!!!! Come on!!!

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Originally Posted by wacko3205

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Originally Posted by Majesty

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Originally Posted by THE Bigragu

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Originally Posted by Majesty

A great person that got rid of his trainer that got him to that Middleweight Championship.

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Who WOULDN'T take Emmanual Steward as your TRAINER!!! you would be an idiot to turn down that opportunity.....Manny affords JT the ability to become the best he can be....JT's trainer did a great job getting him as far as he did....But Manny gives him the opportunity to become GREAT!!!!

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And he looks terrible against Wright.

Karma will come back on him like it did to Brewster for dumping Reed.

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Taylor dumped Pat Burns, babe.

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I know. I was making a comparison

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Originally Posted by THE Bigragu

I don't see that happening.....Honestly, How can you fault JT for going with EMMANUEL STEWARD!!!!!!!! IT'S EMMANUEL STEWARD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! one of the greatest trainers EVER!!!! Come on!!!

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I can see what you're saying. But Pat Burns has been there since day one.

You can't blame Jermain for getting scores from judges...that's fucking ridiculous


JT manned up he offered Winky a rematch, Winky turned it down because he felt screwed, he did an immediate rematch with Hopkins and in my opinion Taylor AT LEAST drew with him in the first fight and Taylor beat him up in the second fight....don't deny it! You can't wait 5-6 rounds before you start fighting when the last fight you did the same thing and it was close as hell.

Pat Burns didn't fix the issues JT had....maybe he didn't see them, at least JT got a PROVEN trainer unlike Brewster when he dumped Reid (who wasn't his true trainer but the assistant to his real trainer who died)

And..

is anyone else getting annoyed by this term "hungry" to describe a fighters drive. I hear it every freaking interview and it gets annoying.

How do you feel today Champ? I'm hungry man. I'm more hungry then I have ever been!


Oh our fighter is reeally hungry. He's the most hungry ever and we're coming back to take those belts.

Can't they use a better term like "determined" or "driven" ???

I went with the fourth option "Taylor can be the future of the division". I think he has a great attitude in wanting to fight the best out there. He hasnt backed down from any fight so far. I believe with Steward in his corner he is only going to get better with time. Whether he won or lost against B-hop and Winky doesnt matter, its all a moot point at this time. The first Hopkins fight he was still a little green, but made a good accounting of himself. Taylor was better in the second Hopkins fight and won it. Looked good against Winky (which is hard for anyone to do) in a close fight that could have gone either way. It wouldnt have bothered me who won that fight, it was close enough to go to either. But now since Hopkins is gone and Winky doesnt want a rematch (as of yet) I dont think there is anyone at 160 that can seriously challenge him. I think fights with Abraham or Miranda would be great fights. Especially against Miranda I think that would be a nice action fight. Outside of a rematch with Winky those are the only two real interesting fights left for Taylor, IMO.

Taylor looks like an exceptional boxer. He has the skills to be an alltime great but also the guts. The fact that he wanted to fight Winky after such a tough fight surprised me. The man has guts. My guess is that after a year or so at middleweight, he will move to light heavy and become undisputed champ there within the next 5 years. by the way, I think his power will show in his Dec. 9 fight

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Originally Posted by LegendBoxing65

Taylor looks like an exceptional boxer. He has the skills to be an alltime great but also the guts. The fact that he wanted to fight Winky after such a tough fight surprised me. The man has guts. My guess is that after a year or so at middleweight, he will move to light heavy and become undisputed champ there within the next 5 years. by the way, I think his power will show in his Dec. 9 fight

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His power only shows against people moving up a weight class to fight him so expect it ;)

he fought Hopkins twice and then Winky. Two guys who have good defense and are top fighters. On Dec. 9 I think his power shots will land and he will showcase his power for the first time in 2 years. You think he is ready for Calzaghe?

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Originally Posted by LegendBoxing65

he fought Hopkins twice and then Winky. Two guys who have good defense and are top fighters. On Dec. 9 I think his power shots will land and he will showcase his power for the first time in 2 years. You think he is ready for Calzaghe?

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I think he would get beaten by Calzaghe. Calzaghe is open down the middle but Taylor can be outmuscled as he gets tired easy and willingly backs into a corner. He doesn't know how to fight a "pace" when he is pressured. And will go to the ropes and let you unload on him and then he'll return some shots. Thats his mentality and it would cost him against the likes of Joe if Taylor isn't gonna keep his hands up.

Absolutely.. I voted no.1. He's lost 2 close as hell decisions to Bhop and Winky Wright, who are basically living legends in the sport.. And in neither of those fights was he embaressed or exposed, apart from some flaws in his game that could use some work.. THey were the kind of defeats that are total learning experiences for a fighter, there's absolutely no reason he couldn't and shouldn't be much better for fighting both of those guys. He learned more and saw more tricks in those 3 fights than most fighters see in their career, and he is still considered up and coming.. I mean honestly, were Hopkins or Wright able to frustrate him, or make him fight their fight? No, so the guy obviously can gain the respect of just about anyone right off the bat. It took everything Hopkins and Wright had for them to beat him, each needed to fight out of their envelopes and adapt over the course of 12.. Those are things that experienced fighters are going to be able to do through learning at the world level, which a young fighter hasn't learned yet, and is the only reason Hopkins and WRight were able to win against him.

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Originally Posted by Majesty

Doesn't matter to me anymore. I would have liked him more if he'd gotten those losses. Then he could be a true champion. I've never seen Hopkins need a gift decision. Less likely 3 in a row. I expect him to dominate Ouma but it proves nothing other then he can beat undersized 54 pounders which was already known.

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Your the first person i heard say that and I agree entirely. I think taylor is a great person but I feel like he lost to hopkins and wright. His reign is disputed. Thats the one thing I liked about hopkins is that there was no denying his hold over that division. Whenever you talked about an up and coming 160 pounder you asked youself,"Yeah hes good but can he mess with hopkins?".You don't say that about taylor. I was looking in an old ring mag(2002) at the rating and in the middleweight top ten you see hopkins as champ and as you look down the list you see that hop fought,beat and dominated at least 7 people on that list. You look at that list today and you'll see that the champ hasn't beaten ANYONE on the list. Truthfully he didn't even deserve a shot at hop considering at the time he hadn't fought anyone in the top ten. I'm sorry but I just can't get behind a guy who didn't deserve a shot , gets one anyway and then gets a shady win. IMO hes the Disputed Middleweight Champ. But he has time so we will see.

I've nver understood how people can feel Hopkins won either fight against Taylor. He started too late in both fights. In the first fight even if you didn't score it as such yourself you would have to concede that of the first 8 rounds there was not a single round you could conclusively score for Hopkins. I had Taylor winning 6 of the first 8 with one even, Hop just didn't show anything in those rounds.

Even the later rounds don't look nearly as one sided in Hopkins favour on the second and third viewings.

The second fight just wasn't controversial at all, Taylor won a close decision.

Against Winky it was close, but Winky only has himself to blame by deciding to give the last to Taylor in a fight where Taylor could see out of only one eye.

If Winky had of come out and won the 12th round he would have won the fight. He chose to run and paid the consequences.

I like Jermain, I do think he's too raw however right now. I can't see anyone beating him at 160, but if and when he moves upto 168 where the real talents are right now I'd see him struggling to keep his 0.

Calzaghe, Kessler, Bute, Andrade, Green, all would give him a tough fight, much better than the likes of Wright, Abraham, Ouma, Sturm, Quartey etc.

I think Taylor is just going to get better at this point. I am glad he is fighting Ouma instead of Wright. I thought the Wright fight would have added wear and tear on a young fighter. I think fighting Ouma lets Taylor maybe win easier and sharpen and refine his punches and technique which was polished by the Hopkins and Wright fights. If Taylor fights Ouma and then fights another top 10 guy and works on the whole game, he can get to the point where he would outpoint Winky substantially. He is only going to get better at this stage. Winky won't.

Fighting legends back to back 3 times(even though I thought he lost 2) but all fights were close,then joining up with Steward and fighting Ouma,I like JT,I'm starting to like him more. JT deserves credit because he is willing to fight the best,fight the most dangerous and remember,even though I'm a Winky fan,it was because of Winky and his greed that the rematch is not ocurring instead of Taylor v Ouma. JT is still young,he has a great future,he seems clean,smart,well mannered and in all honestyI believe he has a great future. I want to see Taylor knock out Ouma though!

He is a classy kid with a lot of respect and a total class act but when it comes to being in the ring yes he is over over over over rated and should have 2 losses

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Originally Posted by Majesty

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Originally Posted by THE Bigragu

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Originally Posted by Majesty

A great person that got rid of his trainer that got him to that Middleweight Championship.

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Who WOULDN'T take Emmanual Steward as your TRAINER!!! you would be an idiot to turn down that opportunity.....Manny affords JT the ability to become the best he can be....JT's trainer did a great job getting him as far as he did....But Manny gives him the opportunity to become GREAT!!!!

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And he looks terrible against Wright.

Karma will come back on him like it did to Brewster for dumping Reed.

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Your off on that one, No way he looks bad against Wright.... If you believe that then you would also have to say Wright looked bad against Taylor :-\

IMO Karma is so OVERRATED and INCONSISTENT I have never bought into Karma because it has NEVER been a FORGONE CONCLUSION anyway.....

Not knocking your views on life and philosphy you know I'm your boy on the forum just wanted to sound off on it though.... ;)

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Originally Posted by Starr

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Originally Posted by LegendBoxing65

he fought Hopkins twice and then Winky. Two guys who have good defense and are top fighters. On Dec. 9 I think his power shots will land and he will showcase his power for the first time in 2 years. You think he is ready for Calzaghe?

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I think he would get beaten by Calzaghe. Calzaghe is open down the middle but Taylor can be outmuscled as he gets tired easy and willingly backs into a corner. He doesn't know how to fight a "pace" when he is pressured. And will go to the ropes and let you unload on him and then he'll return some shots. Thats his mentality and it would cost him against the likes of Joe if Taylor isn't gonna keep his hands up.

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Hard to say for me how he would respond to Calzaghe.....Joe has never fought the level of Competition that Jermain has in his last 3 fights...Jermain has been in with 2 of the 5 premier defenders of the last 20 years and both are excellent counterpunchers so if anything having at least 3 of those fights whether he won, lost or draw is a tremendous feather in his cap and will bode well for his future growth and success in his career...Manny can only take this kid higher and at 28 with 3 super fights that are career defining fights this early in his career will do wonder for his poise and confidence going forward..