What if? Floyd Mayweather vs 1981 Ray Leonard

Ray was 5-10 ,with great speed ,footwork ,and had very good power at 147. A lot of ppl remember him for running around the ring against Hagler ,but keep in mind he was 13 pounds out of his natural weight class ,coming off a 4 year layoff ,plus Hagler was just the naturally bigger man. Nobody was going to hurt Hagler . Ray would have the height ,and strength advantage over Floyd. I think the advantage for Floyd is i think he is a better counterpuncher then Leonard. He can counterpunch immedietely off his defense better . Ray puts his punches together much better without just pot shotting. In your opinion who wins this fight?

Floyd would have to fight in this matchup. Leonard was as gifted a boxer as Floyd is, but Leonard could also be a killer.

I give a big edge to Leonard in this match with a high likelyhood of a Leonard KO of Floyd.

Floyd might be to gifted of a defensive fighter to get knocked out ,but if there is a fighter that could KO him ,it would be Leonard.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RayLeonard82

Floyd might be to gifted of a defensive fighter to get knocked out ,but if there is a fighter that could KO him ,it would be Leonard.

---

I cant argue with you on that. But I think Floyds pride would be put on the line, cuz with Rays speed and size advantage Floyd would get hit. It would be interesting to see how he would respond when faced with a fighter of equal skills.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RayLeonard82

Floyd might be to gifted of a defensive fighter to get knocked out ,but if there is a fighter that could KO him ,it would be Leonard.

---

Id pick Hearns to KO him more definetly.... I do think Leonard would win, just more likely to be a close decision imo.

I agree about Hearns ,that is a very bad matchup for Floyd. If Tommy doesnt respect your punching power ,he will be looking to KO you early.

I really think Ray Leonard would stop Floyd around the 8th. Better offensive fighter and was bigger naturally. This would really tell in this fight IMO.

I think Mayweather would be too skilled for Leonard... Hearns outboxed Leonard, and he wasn't as fast as Mayweather or as smart in the ring. I think Mayweather's defense is the biggest factor in this fight.

Hearns is a different matchup for Leonard because he was 6-1 with long arms ,snapping jab and a big right hand. Part of him building up that early lead was Ray was trying to stay away from that big right hand of Tommy's. With Floyd ,i think Leonard would be aggressive from the start like he was against Benitez ,and Andy Price. He wouldn't have much respect for Floyd's power.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Taeth

I think Mayweather would be too skilled for Leonard... Hearns outboxed Leonard, and he wasn't as fast as Mayweather or as smart in the ring. I think Mayweather's defense is the biggest factor in this fight.

---

it was hearns height that gave leonard trouble he couldnt really get on inside mayweathers height would be no problem because he is 5 foot 8 and leonard is taller than floyd i pick ud for leonard and plus hearns hit alot harder than mayweather and leonard wouldnt have to worry about mayweathers power

I honestly can't think of a more skilled fighter than Mayweather, not saying Ray Leonard wasn't as skilled, but certainly disagree with the opinions stating Floyd would be stopped by Ray. I don't see why people still haven't realized that Floyd is as tough as they come. Much like Ali who was known for his finesse, he was underappreciated as being a tough S.O.B., and Floyd is the same way. He's not just some feather fisted priss who's afraid to get hit, or even moreso, who can't take a hit. He's simply too good to be hit most of the time, and when he is, he's rarely hurt, and certainly never close to being stopped. Floyd definately isn't nearly as powerful as Hearns but he's tougher and a better boxer(and most importantly, supremely conditioned and NEVER fades toward the end of a fight), and I feel that would be more than enough for him to outpoint Leonard.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by clean

I honestly can't think of a more skilled fighter than Mayweather, not saying Ray Leonard wasn't as skilled, but certainly disagree with the opinions stating Floyd would be stopped by Ray.  I don't see why people still haven't realized that Floyd is as tough as they come.  Much like Ali who was known for his finesse, he was underappreciated as being a tough S.O.B., and Floyd is the same way.  He's not just some feather fisted priss who's afraid to get hit, or even moreso, who can't take a hit.  He's simply too good to be hit most of the time, and when he is, he's rarely hurt, and certainly never close to being stopped.  Floyd definately isn't nearly as powerful as Hearns but he's tougher and a better boxer(and most importantly, supremely conditioned and NEVER fades toward the end of a fight), and I feel that would be more than enough for him to outpoint Leonard. 

---

i dont know about that statement about mayweather being better boxer than hearns to be honest hearns is one of the most skilled boxers ive ever seen if he had granite chin he would be almost unbeatable ray leonard has great conditioning aswell leonard can do everything mayweather can do but he can do bit more like brawling and he hits harder than mayweather and i feel leonard is shade quicker than mayweather and he would outpoint mayweather

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by clean

I honestly can't think of a more skilled fighter than Mayweather, not saying Ray Leonard wasn't as skilled, but certainly disagree with the opinions stating Floyd would be stopped by Ray. I don't see why people still haven't realized that Floyd is as tough as they come. Much like Ali who was known for his finesse, he was underappreciated as being a tough S.O.B., and Floyd is the same way. He's not just some feather fisted priss who's afraid to get hit, or even moreso, who can't take a hit. He's simply too good to be hit most of the time, and when he is, he's rarely hurt, and certainly never close to being stopped. Floyd definately isn't nearly as powerful as Hearns but he's tougher and a better boxer(and most importantly, supremely conditioned and NEVER fades toward the end of a fight), and I feel that would be more than enough for him to outpoint Leonard.

---

i dont know about that statement about mayweather being better boxer than hearns to be honest hearns is one of the most skilled boxers ive ever seen if he had granite chin he would be almost unbeatable ray leonard has great conditioning aswell leonard can do everything mayweather can do but he can do bit more like brawling and he hits harder than mayweather and i feel leonard is shade quicker than mayweather and he would outpoint mayweather

---

I do know. Mayweather was a better boxer than Hearns. It's fairly clear. Thommy had about 10X as much power at welterweight, and obviously every physical advantage there is except speed.. But in terms of skills, there is no way Hearns was as good a boxer as Mayweather.. He had great boxing ability no doubt.. But hypothetically, imagine if Floyd's right hand was as powerful as Thommy Hearns.. He would have 37 first round KO's. Seriously.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by clean

I honestly can't think of a more skilled fighter than Mayweather, not saying Ray Leonard wasn't as skilled, but certainly disagree with the opinions stating Floyd would be stopped by Ray. I don't see why people still haven't realized that Floyd is as tough as they come. Much like Ali who was known for his finesse, he was underappreciated as being a tough S.O.B., and Floyd is the same way. He's not just some feather fisted priss who's afraid to get hit, or even moreso, who can't take a hit. He's simply too good to be hit most of the time, and when he is, he's rarely hurt, and certainly never close to being stopped. Floyd definately isn't nearly as powerful as Hearns but he's tougher and a better boxer(and most importantly, supremely conditioned and NEVER fades toward the end of a fight), and I feel that would be more than enough for him to outpoint Leonard.

---

cc, couldnt have said it better myself

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by clean

I honestly can't think of a more skilled fighter than Mayweather, not saying Ray Leonard wasn't as skilled, but certainly disagree with the opinions stating Floyd would be stopped by Ray. I don't see why people still haven't realized that Floyd is as tough as they come. Much like Ali who was known for his finesse, he was underappreciated as being a tough S.O.B., and Floyd is the same way. He's not just some feather fisted priss who's afraid to get hit, or even moreso, who can't take a hit. He's simply too good to be hit most of the time, and when he is, he's rarely hurt, and certainly never close to being stopped. Floyd definately isn't nearly as powerful as Hearns but he's tougher and a better boxer(and most importantly, supremely conditioned and NEVER fades toward the end of a fight), and I feel that would be more than enough for him to outpoint Leonard.

---

To say Floyd is underappreciated like Ali in terms of toughness is way off. Ali took the best fighters like Frazier, Foreman, and Shavers could offer. Ali's toughness is well acknowledged. Floyd hasnt come close to establishing the toughness of Ali.

No doubt, Floyd is the best technical boxer out there today. No one even touches him in that respect. But at 147, he is outgunned by both Leonard and Hearns. I'd be interested to hear how Floyd gets inside of Hearns looooooong punishing jab, or how he outboxes Leonard.

Floyd would be forced to fight in these contests. No clinic would be put on with these guys. Floyd hasnt even come close to sniffing the level of competition Leonard and Hearns bring into the ring.

This is just my opinion, but Floyd would have to fight in these contests and hes outgunned by both fighters. He wont out speed Leonard, and Hearns power would be his death march.

Ray was a very smart fighterand skilled BUT
remember the first duran fight? a quick and strong defensive fighter with great counterpunching skills beat him.
I think that would make the dif. i pick mayweather by ud.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by landmine950

Ray was a very smart fighterand skilled BUT
remember the first duran fight? a quick and strong defensive fighter with great counterpunching skills beat him.
I think that would make the dif. i pick mayweather by ud.

---

no reason he lost that fight was because duran said he fought like a pussy so leonard fought like brawler to prove that he could stand his ground and brawl with duran in rematches he showed he was better fighter by fighting his normal style u cant use first duran fight because he fought like brawler to prove a point

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by landmine950

Ray was a very smart fighterand skilled BUT
remember the first duran fight? a quick and strong defensive fighter with great counterpunching skills beat him.
I think that would make the dif. i pick mayweather by ud.

---

In Leonard/Duran 1, Ray went toe to toe with Duran. If your putting Floyd in a toe to toe catagory with Duran, I think you're way off. You cant classify Floyd and Duran in the same catagory.

Dare I say, Floyd would get pasted going toe to toe with Duran. Then again he would whip Duran much the same way Leonard did in the Leonard/Duran 2. When Ray choose to box Roberto.

i say leonard would win by decision

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by right_cross

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by clean

I honestly can't think of a more skilled fighter than Mayweather, not saying Ray Leonard wasn't as skilled, but certainly disagree with the opinions stating Floyd would be stopped by Ray. I don't see why people still haven't realized that Floyd is as tough as they come. Much like Ali who was known for his finesse, he was underappreciated as being a tough S.O.B., and Floyd is the same way. He's not just some feather fisted priss who's afraid to get hit, or even moreso, who can't take a hit. He's simply too good to be hit most of the time, and when he is, he's rarely hurt, and certainly never close to being stopped. Floyd definately isn't nearly as powerful as Hearns but he's tougher and a better boxer(and most importantly, supremely conditioned and NEVER fades toward the end of a fight), and I feel that would be more than enough for him to outpoint Leonard.

---

To say Floyd is underappreciated like Ali in terms of toughness is way off. Ali took the best fighters like Frazier, Foreman, and Shavers could offer. Ali's toughness is well acknowledged. Floyd hasnt come close to establishing the toughness of Ali.

No doubt, Floyd is the best technical boxer out there today. No one even touches him in that respect. But at 147, he is outgunned by both Leonard and Hearns. I'd be interested to hear how Floyd gets inside of Hearns looooooong punishing jab, or how he outboxes Leonard.

Floyd would be forced to fight in these contests. No clinic would be put on with these guys. Floyd hasnt even come close to sniffing the level of competition Leonard and Hearns bring into the ring.

This is just my opinion, but Floyd would have to fight in these contests and hes outgunned by both fighters. He wont out speed Leonard, and Hearns power would be his death march.

---

BS ::** The biggest misconception about Hearns is that he was this excellent boxer who simply chose to brawl most of the time, but could shut people out whenever he felt like it ::** Please. It's funny how people forget that Hearns basically went into survival mode against Leonard in their first fight by the midrounds and was on the run, reduced to using his long reach advantage as a last means to making it to the end of the fight. He was a skilled fighter, don't get me wrong, but thinking that a supreme technician would be befuddled and confused by simply someone with a long reach advantage is totally naive. And you'll be hardpressed to name a fighter in history with more ringsmarts than Mayweather as well, and a fighter with a boxing IQ like that isn't going get complacent and get caught by Hearns' right hand. Duran got caught because he's a pressure fighter and a brawler, not a thinker. Hagler got caught for the same reason, but survived. And you'd be interested in hearing how he'd outbox Leonard? Easy as this, HE'D OUTBOX HIM. It's as simple as that. Sugar Ray Leonard does NOT have faster hands than Floyd Mayweather and anyone arguing the contrary is kidding themselves. The guy's a former featherweight for the love of God. And the power advantage is negligible for the simple fact that Leonard does not have one punch KO power, and when a fighter does not possess that, arguing who has more power is futile. Mayweather beats Hearns 10 times out of 10 and Leonard at least 5 out of 10 (I'm giving Leonard the respect of his huge heart that allowed him to dig deep and find ways to win).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by landmine950

Ray was a very smart fighterand skilled BUT
remember the first duran fight? a quick and strong defensive fighter with great counterpunching skills beat him.
I think that would make the dif. i pick mayweather by ud.

---

no reason he lost that fight was because duran said he fought like a pussy so leonard fought like brawler to prove that he could stand his ground and brawl with duran in rematches he showed he was better fighter by fighting his normal style u cant use first duran fight because he fought like brawler to prove a point

---

But Duran still fought a close second fight... and he is way slower than Mayweather. Also Mayweather is only superior to Leonard as an defensive fighter, but also he is a better outside fighter.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by right_cross

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by landmine950

Ray was a very smart fighterand skilled BUT
remember the first duran fight? a quick and strong defensive fighter with great counterpunching skills beat him.
I think that would make the dif. i pick mayweather by ud.

---

In Leonard/Duran 1, Ray went toe to toe with Duran. If your putting Floyd in a toe to toe catagory with Duran, I think you're way off. You cant classify Floyd and Duran in the same catagory.

Dare I say, Floyd would get pasted going toe to toe with Duran. Then again he would whip Duran much the same way Leonard did in the Leonard/Duran 2. When Ray choose to box Roberto.

---

Its hard to say if Floyd would be pasted toe to toe against Duran, we'll see if he can handle that kind of power in about six months, but if he could I think FLoyd would beat Duran... maybe. The thing about Duran is he's a dirty fighter, and will tie you up on the inside and use his greatest asset, his strength, to dominate the fight. Like I said before Duran wasn't "whipped" by Leonard in their second fight at all.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skyler

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by right_cross

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by clean

I honestly can't think of a more skilled fighter than Mayweather, not saying Ray Leonard wasn't as skilled, but certainly disagree with the opinions stating Floyd would be stopped by Ray. I don't see why people still haven't realized that Floyd is as tough as they come. Much like Ali who was known for his finesse, he was underappreciated as being a tough S.O.B., and Floyd is the same way. He's not just some feather fisted priss who's afraid to get hit, or even moreso, who can't take a hit. He's simply too good to be hit most of the time, and when he is, he's rarely hurt, and certainly never close to being stopped. Floyd definately isn't nearly as powerful as Hearns but he's tougher and a better boxer(and most importantly, supremely conditioned and NEVER fades toward the end of a fight), and I feel that would be more than enough for him to outpoint Leonard.

---

I agree with everything, except Hearns was a tremendous boxer, and one of the best on the outside I've ever seen. However Mayweather Jr. And Jones Jr. where at another level with reflexes, and timing. I have more respect for Hearns' skill than any of the other four. Leonard was great, don't get me wrong, but these two are/were superior atheletes. Watch Leonard fight Mayweather's dad, and you will see he had troubles getting in on a much less skilled fighter using a similar style to Floyd Jr.
To say Floyd is underappreciated like Ali in terms of toughness is way off. Ali took the best fighters like Frazier, Foreman, and Shavers could offer. Ali's toughness is well acknowledged. Floyd hasnt come close to establishing the toughness of Ali.

No doubt, Floyd is the best technical boxer out there today. No one even touches him in that respect. But at 147, he is outgunned by both Leonard and Hearns. I'd be interested to hear how Floyd gets inside of Hearns looooooong punishing jab, or how he outboxes Leonard.

Floyd would be forced to fight in these contests. No clinic would be put on with these guys. Floyd hasnt even come close to sniffing the level of competition Leonard and Hearns bring into the ring.

This is just my opinion, but Floyd would have to fight in these contests and hes outgunned by both fighters. He wont out speed Leonard, and Hearns power would be his death march.

---

BS ::** The biggest misconception about Hearns is that he was this excellent boxer who simply chose to brawl most of the time, but could shut people out whenever he felt like it ::** Please. It's funny how people forget that Hearns basically went into survival mode against Leonard in their first fight by the midrounds and was on the run, reduced to using his long reach advantage as a last means to making it to the end of the fight. He was a skilled fighter, don't get me wrong, but thinking that a supreme technician would be befuddled and confused by simply someone with a long reach advantage is totally naive. And you'll be hardpressed to name a fighter in history with more ringsmarts than Mayweather as well, and a fighter with a boxing IQ like that isn't going get complacent and get caught by Hearns' right hand. Duran got caught because he's a pressure fighter and a brawler, not a thinker. Hagler got caught for the same reason, but survived. And you'd be interested in hearing how he'd outbox Leonard? Easy as this, HE'D OUTBOX HIM. It's as simple as that. Sugar Ray Leonard does NOT have faster hands than Floyd Mayweather and anyone arguing the contrary is kidding themselves. The guy's a former featherweight for the love of God. And the power advantage is negligible for the simple fact that Leonard does not have one punch KO power, and when a fighter does not possess that, arguing who has more power is futile. Mayweather beats Hearns 10 times out of 10 and Leonard at least 5 out of 10 (I'm giving Leonard the respect of his huge heart that allowed him to dig deep and find ways to win).

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by right_cross

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by landmine950

Ray was a very smart fighterand skilled BUT
remember the first duran fight? a quick and strong defensive fighter with great counterpunching skills beat him.
I think that would make the dif. i pick mayweather by ud.

---

In Leonard/Duran 1, Ray went toe to toe with Duran. If your putting Floyd in a toe to toe catagory with Duran, I think you're way off. You cant classify Floyd and Duran in the same catagory.

Dare I say, Floyd would get pasted going toe to toe with Duran. Then again he would whip Duran much the same way Leonard did in the Leonard/Duran 2. When Ray choose to box Roberto.

---

Prepare to laugh.......i pick duran as one of my all time top 10 p4p fighters
and maybe the greatest defense of all time.
the matcho stuff was really a bit of a smoke screen he was a superb counter puncher and soooo hard to hit. james toney ish..
I remember when he fought iran barkley at 160 (remember he fought ray at 143) and showed his mastery i still have the tape.
The second ray fight he had ballooned up to over 190 and had to crash diet so he got cramps and couldnt move was not in shape.got frustrated and all and no massed his ass out of there. an excuse yes but prob better than "i fought the wrong style for too long and lost" ie got outsmarted!
Duran was super slick with great finishing skills..with the hands of stone!

ACK! Who sad clicked me! ??? Whoever did is a loser.

Just opinions. Anyone can make a case for a fighter. Mine are not so far out of wack that they get sad clicked.

Hey Skyler, sadclicker. Your creds go down the pipe when you say Floyd takes Hearns 10 out of 10 at 147. Realistic........NOT! You think Floyd at 147 has the goods to pressure Hearns the same way Leonard did and wear him out.

Like I said earlier, Floyd is head over heals better technically than anyone in the game today. But he hasnt even sniffed the level of prime fighters that Leonard and Hearns were at 147. Yeah I know Floyd is superior in every catagory. Hand speed the works..right. ::**

Oh yeah and a BS right back at you.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skyler

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by right_cross

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by clean

I honestly can't think of a more skilled fighter than Mayweather, not saying Ray Leonard wasn't as skilled, but certainly disagree with the opinions stating Floyd would be stopped by Ray. I don't see why people still haven't realized that Floyd is as tough as they come. Much like Ali who was known for his finesse, he was underappreciated as being a tough S.O.B., and Floyd is the same way. He's not just some feather fisted priss who's afraid to get hit, or even moreso, who can't take a hit. He's simply too good to be hit most of the time, and when he is, he's rarely hurt, and certainly never close to being stopped. Floyd definately isn't nearly as powerful as Hearns but he's tougher and a better boxer(and most importantly, supremely conditioned and NEVER fades toward the end of a fight), and I feel that would be more than enough for him to outpoint Leonard.

---

To say Floyd is underappreciated like Ali in terms of toughness is way off. Ali took the best fighters like Frazier, Foreman, and Shavers could offer. Ali's toughness is well acknowledged. Floyd hasnt come close to establishing the toughness of Ali.

No doubt, Floyd is the best technical boxer out there today. No one even touches him in that respect. But at 147, he is outgunned by both Leonard and Hearns. I'd be interested to hear how Floyd gets inside of Hearns looooooong punishing jab, or how he outboxes Leonard.

Floyd would be forced to fight in these contests. No clinic would be put on with these guys. Floyd hasnt even come close to sniffing the level of competition Leonard and Hearns bring into the ring.

This is just my opinion, but Floyd would have to fight in these contests and hes outgunned by both fighters. He wont out speed Leonard, and Hearns power would be his death march.

---

BS ::** The biggest misconception about Hearns is that he was this excellent boxer who simply chose to brawl most of the time, but could shut people out whenever he felt like it ::** Please. It's funny how people forget that Hearns basically went into survival mode against Leonard in their first fight by the midrounds and was on the run, reduced to using his long reach advantage as a last means to making it to the end of the fight. He was a skilled fighter, don't get me wrong, but thinking that a supreme technician would be befuddled and confused by simply someone with a long reach advantage is totally naive. And you'll be hardpressed to name a fighter in history with more ringsmarts than Mayweather as well, and a fighter with a boxing IQ like that isn't going get complacent and get caught by Hearns' right hand. Duran got caught because he's a pressure fighter and a brawler, not a thinker. Hagler got caught for the same reason, but survived. And you'd be interested in hearing how he'd outbox Leonard? Easy as this, HE'D OUTBOX HIM. It's as simple as that. Sugar Ray Leonard does NOT have faster hands than Floyd Mayweather and anyone arguing the contrary is kidding themselves. The guy's a former featherweight for the love of God. And the power advantage is negligible for the simple fact that Leonard does not have one punch KO power, and when a fighter does not possess that, arguing who has more power is futile. Mayweather beats Hearns 10 times out of 10 and Leonard at least 5 out of 10 (I'm giving Leonard the respect of his huge heart that allowed him to dig deep and find ways to win).

---

Leonard may not have had one punch power, but boy could he crack at Welter, ALOT more then Mayweather can thats for sure. Leonard definitely had faster combinations then Mayweather for my money no doubt about it. You seem to forget that Mayweather has only faught Baldomir, Judah and Mitchell at welter, when Leonard faught at welter for years and beat some of the best competition ever, all this along with the fact that Mayweather would be disadvantaged size wise from the start leads me to think Leonard stops him.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by right_cross

ACK! Who sad clicked me! ??? Whoever did is a loser.

Just opinions. Anyone can make a case for a fighter. Mine are not so far out of wack that they get sad clicked.

Hey Skyler, sadclicker. Your creds go down the pipe when you say Floyd takes Hearns 10 out of 10 at 147. Realistic........NOT! You think Floyd at 147 has the goods to pressure Hearns the same way Leonard did and wear him out.

Like I said earlier, Floyd is head over heals better technically than anyone in the game today. But he hasnt even sniffed the level of prime fighters that Leonard and Hearns were at 147. Yeah I know Floyd is superior in every catagory. Hand speed the works..right. ::**

Oh yeah and a BS right back at you.

---

Hey moron, I didn't sadclick you. I don't give out sadclicks because it's stupid, so try finding out what's going on before you jump out and accuse someone of something they didn't do. And are you not aware of the concept that styles make fights? Mayweather doesn't have to pressure Hearns. People who compare Mayweather's style to Leonard's style are as misguided as people who compare Tyson's style to Frazier's style. They fight almost nothing alike. The only 2 fighters out of the 4 greats with a realistic shot of beating Floyd would be Hagler and Duran because they go to the body on a consistent basis, NOT Leonard and Hearns. And who Floyd has faced only places him lower than Leonard at the moment in terms of greatness, not who's better. There's a difference between who's greater and who's better. Greatness has to do with accomplishments, being better means who would win, and Floyd is better than Leonard (who by the way is by far the most overrated of the 4 greats of the 80s and in alot of people's estimations ranks 4th).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skyler

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by right_cross

ACK! Who sad clicked me! ??? Whoever did is a loser.

Just opinions. Anyone can make a case for a fighter. Mine are not so far out of wack that they get sad clicked.

Hey Skyler, sadclicker. Your creds go down the pipe when you say Floyd takes Hearns 10 out of 10 at 147. Realistic........NOT! You think Floyd at 147 has the goods to pressure Hearns the same way Leonard did and wear him out.

Like I said earlier, Floyd is head over heals better technically than anyone in the game today. But he hasnt even sniffed the level of prime fighters that Leonard and Hearns were at 147. Yeah I know Floyd is superior in every catagory. Hand speed the works..right. ::**

Oh yeah and a BS right back at you.

---

Hey moron, I didn't sadclick you.  I don't give out sadclicks because it's stupid, so try finding out what's going on before you jump out and accuse someone of something they didn't do.  And are you not aware of the concept that styles make fights?  Mayweather doesn't have to pressure Hearns.  People who compare Mayweather's style to Leonard's style are as misguided as people who compare Tyson's style to Frazier's style.  They fight almost nothing alike.  The only 2 fighters out of the 4 greats with a realistic shot of beating Floyd would be Hagler and Duran because they go to the body on a consistent basis, NOT Leonard and Hearns.  And who Floyd has faced only places him lower than Leonard at the moment in terms of greatness, not who's better.  There's a difference between who's greater and who's better.  Greatness has to do with accomplishments, being better means who would win, and Floyd is better than Leonard (who by the way is by far the most overrated of the 4 greats of the 80s and in alot of people's estimations ranks 4th). 

---

i disagree i think hagler and duran would prolly have worse chance against mayweather i think leonard is better than mayweather and leonard is not most overrated out of the 4 he beat duran hearns and hagler and what makes it amazing is that leonard before hagler fight hadnt fought in 3 years and still beat the best middleweight at that time and no way leonard ranks 4th out of the famous 4

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by cockey cockney

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skyler

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by right_cross

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by clean

I honestly can't think of a more skilled fighter than Mayweather, not saying Ray Leonard wasn't as skilled, but certainly disagree with the opinions stating Floyd would be stopped by Ray. I don't see why people still haven't realized that Floyd is as tough as they come. Much like Ali who was known for his finesse, he was underappreciated as being a tough S.O.B., and Floyd is the same way. He's not just some feather fisted priss who's afraid to get hit, or even moreso, who can't take a hit. He's simply too good to be hit most of the time, and when he is, he's rarely hurt, and certainly never close to being stopped. Floyd definately isn't nearly as powerful as Hearns but he's tougher and a better boxer(and most importantly, supremely conditioned and NEVER fades toward the end of a fight), and I feel that would be more than enough for him to outpoint Leonard.

---

To say Floyd is underappreciated like Ali in terms of toughness is way off. Ali took the best fighters like Frazier, Foreman, and Shavers could offer. Ali's toughness is well acknowledged. Floyd hasnt come close to establishing the toughness of Ali.

No doubt, Floyd is the best technical boxer out there today. No one even touches him in that respect. But at 147, he is outgunned by both Leonard and Hearns. I'd be interested to hear how Floyd gets inside of Hearns looooooong punishing jab, or how he outboxes Leonard.

Floyd would be forced to fight in these contests. No clinic would be put on with these guys. Floyd hasnt even come close to sniffing the level of competition Leonard and Hearns bring into the ring.

This is just my opinion, but Floyd would have to fight in these contests and hes outgunned by both fighters. He wont out speed Leonard, and Hearns power would be his death march.

---

BS ::** The biggest misconception about Hearns is that he was this excellent boxer who simply chose to brawl most of the time, but could shut people out whenever he felt like it ::** Please. It's funny how people forget that Hearns basically went into survival mode against Leonard in their first fight by the midrounds and was on the run, reduced to using his long reach advantage as a last means to making it to the end of the fight. He was a skilled fighter, don't get me wrong, but thinking that a supreme technician would be befuddled and confused by simply someone with a long reach advantage is totally naive. And you'll be hardpressed to name a fighter in history with more ringsmarts than Mayweather as well, and a fighter with a boxing IQ like that isn't going get complacent and get caught by Hearns' right hand. Duran got caught because he's a pressure fighter and a brawler, not a thinker. Hagler got caught for the same reason, but survived. And you'd be interested in hearing how he'd outbox Leonard? Easy as this, HE'D OUTBOX HIM. It's as simple as that. Sugar Ray Leonard does NOT have faster hands than Floyd Mayweather and anyone arguing the contrary is kidding themselves. The guy's a former featherweight for the love of God. And the power advantage is negligible for the simple fact that Leonard does not have one punch KO power, and when a fighter does not possess that, arguing who has more power is futile. Mayweather beats Hearns 10 times out of 10 and Leonard at least 5 out of 10 (I'm giving Leonard the respect of his huge heart that allowed him to dig deep and find ways to win).

---

Leonard may not have had one punch power, but boy could he crack at Welter, ALOT more then Mayweather can thats for sure. Leonard definitely had faster combinations then Mayweather for my money no doubt about it. You seem to forget that Mayweather has only faught Baldomir, Judah and Mitchell at welter, when Leonard faught at welter for years and beat some of the best competition ever, all this along with the fact that Mayweather would be disadvantaged size wise from the start leads me to think Leonard stops him.

---

I think it's weird that people feel the need to see someone fight at a certain weight 20 times before they realize they can stand their own ground there. People also need to realize that Mayweather is no longer ever disadvantaged sizewise, as he has grown into 147. Next May will truly be the first time you can say that. It's like when everyone (myself included) thought Oscar would steamroll Mosely their first fight because Mosley didn't have any fights at that weight and was going up against a guy who had many. It had absolutely nothing to do with who was the better of the two.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skyler

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by right_cross

ACK! Who sad clicked me! ??? Whoever did is a loser.

Just opinions. Anyone can make a case for a fighter. Mine are not so far out of wack that they get sad clicked.

Hey Skyler, sadclicker. Your creds go down the pipe when you say Floyd takes Hearns 10 out of 10 at 147. Realistic........NOT! You think Floyd at 147 has the goods to pressure Hearns the same way Leonard did and wear him out.

Like I said earlier, Floyd is head over heals better technically than anyone in the game today. But he hasnt even sniffed the level of prime fighters that Leonard and Hearns were at 147. Yeah I know Floyd is superior in every catagory. Hand speed the works..right. ::**

Oh yeah and a BS right back at you.

---

Hey moron, I didn't sadclick you. I don't give out sadclicks because it's stupid, so try finding out what's going on before you jump out and accuse someone of something they didn't do. And are you not aware of the concept that styles make fights? Mayweather doesn't have to pressure Hearns. People who compare Mayweather's style to Leonard's style are as misguided as people who compare Tyson's style to Frazier's style. They fight almost nothing alike. The only 2 fighters out of the 4 greats with a realistic shot of beating Floyd would be Hagler and Duran because they go to the body on a consistent basis, NOT Leonard and Hearns. And who Floyd has faced only places him lower than Leonard at the moment in terms of greatness, not who's better. There's a difference between who's greater and who's better. Greatness has to do with accomplishments, being better means who would win, and Floyd is better than Leonard (who by the way is by far the most overrated of the 4 greats of the 80s and in alot of people's estimations ranks 4th).

---

i disagree i think hagler and duran would prolly have worse chance against mayweather i think leonard is better than mayweather and leonard is not most overrated out of the 4 he beat duran hearns and hagler and what makes it amazing is that leonard before hagler fight hadnt fought in 3 years and still beat the best middleweight at that time and no way leonard ranks 4th out of the famous 4

---

You need to go watch the fight again, kid. Slapping with your punches for the last 30 seconds of each round should not win fights. Leonard did not beat Hagler. He was given a gift. And Leonard did not fight for 3 years cuz he was waiting for Hagler to show signs of aging. Leonard could of faught if he wanted to.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rotten Apple

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skyler

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by right_cross

ACK! Who sad clicked me! ??? Whoever did is a loser.

Just opinions. Anyone can make a case for a fighter. Mine are not so far out of wack that they get sad clicked.

Hey Skyler, sadclicker. Your creds go down the pipe when you say Floyd takes Hearns 10 out of 10 at 147. Realistic........NOT! You think Floyd at 147 has the goods to pressure Hearns the same way Leonard did and wear him out.

Like I said earlier, Floyd is head over heals better technically than anyone in the game today. But he hasnt even sniffed the level of prime fighters that Leonard and Hearns were at 147. Yeah I know Floyd is superior in every catagory. Hand speed the works..right. ::**

Oh yeah and a BS right back at you.

---

Hey moron, I didn't sadclick you.  I don't give out sadclicks because it's stupid, so try finding out what's going on before you jump out and accuse someone of something they didn't do.  And are you not aware of the concept that styles make fights?  Mayweather doesn't have to pressure Hearns.  People who compare Mayweather's style to Leonard's style are as misguided as people who compare Tyson's style to Frazier's style.  They fight almost nothing alike.  The only 2 fighters out of the 4 greats with a realistic shot of beating Floyd would be Hagler and Duran because they go to the body on a consistent basis, NOT Leonard and Hearns.  And who Floyd has faced only places him lower than Leonard at the moment in terms of greatness, not who's better.  There's a difference between who's greater and who's better.  Greatness has to do with accomplishments, being better means who would win, and Floyd is better than Leonard (who by the way is by far the most overrated of the 4 greats of the 80s and in alot of people's estimations ranks 4th). 

---

i disagree i think hagler and duran would prolly have worse chance against mayweather i think leonard is better than mayweather and leonard is not most overrated out of the 4 he beat duran hearns and hagler and what makes it amazing is that leonard before hagler fight hadnt fought in 3 years and still beat the best middleweight at that time and no way leonard ranks 4th out of the famous 4

---

You need to go watch the fight again, kid.  Slapping with your punches for the last 30 seconds of each round should not win fights.  Leonard did not beat Hagler.  He was given a gift.  And Leonard did not fight for 3 years cuz he was waiting for Hagler to show signs of aging.  Leonard could of faught if he wanted to.

---

ive watched it many times and leonard did enough to win he won first 4 rounds easy as pie then it got close with hagler winning middle rounds i had it 7 rounds to 5 for leonard people didnt give leonard a chance against hagler plus hagler had just had two of best wins of his career against mugabi and hearns where as leonard had been knocked down by howard and didnt look impressive so yea it was amazing that he was able to win even if it was close still good performance for not fighting for 3 years hagler didnt do much either it wasnt really good fight but leonard done enough to win hagler gave away first 4 rounds by trying to box with leonard so its haglers fault for giving away first 4 rounds

I also rank Leonard 4th out of the big 4 because I thought Hagler was robbed and thought Hearns was robbed in the rematch. Also, all of the other 4s big wins are decisive, while Leonard's are the only one's that remain cloudy (except for the first Hearns fight). However where he ranks among those guys is a matter of opinion and everyone can see it differently.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rotten Apple

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skyler

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by right_cross

ACK! Who sad clicked me! ??? Whoever did is a loser.

Just opinions. Anyone can make a case for a fighter. Mine are not so far out of wack that they get sad clicked.

Hey Skyler, sadclicker. Your creds go down the pipe when you say Floyd takes Hearns 10 out of 10 at 147. Realistic........NOT! You think Floyd at 147 has the goods to pressure Hearns the same way Leonard did and wear him out.

Like I said earlier, Floyd is head over heals better technically than anyone in the game today. But he hasnt even sniffed the level of prime fighters that Leonard and Hearns were at 147. Yeah I know Floyd is superior in every catagory. Hand speed the works..right. ::**

Oh yeah and a BS right back at you.

---

Hey moron, I didn't sadclick you. I don't give out sadclicks because it's stupid, so try finding out what's going on before you jump out and accuse someone of something they didn't do. And are you not aware of the concept that styles make fights? Mayweather doesn't have to pressure Hearns. People who compare Mayweather's style to Leonard's style are as misguided as people who compare Tyson's style to Frazier's style. They fight almost nothing alike. The only 2 fighters out of the 4 greats with a realistic shot of beating Floyd would be Hagler and Duran because they go to the body on a consistent basis, NOT Leonard and Hearns. And who Floyd has faced only places him lower than Leonard at the moment in terms of greatness, not who's better. There's a difference between who's greater and who's better. Greatness has to do with accomplishments, being better means who would win, and Floyd is better than Leonard (who by the way is by far the most overrated of the 4 greats of the 80s and in alot of people's estimations ranks 4th).

---

i disagree i think hagler and duran would prolly have worse chance against mayweather i think leonard is better than mayweather and leonard is not most overrated out of the 4 he beat duran hearns and hagler and what makes it amazing is that leonard before hagler fight hadnt fought in 3 years and still beat the best middleweight at that time and no way leonard ranks 4th out of the famous 4

---

You need to go watch the fight again, kid. Slapping with your punches for the last 30 seconds of each round should not win fights. Leonard did not beat Hagler. He was given a gift. And Leonard did not fight for 3 years cuz he was waiting for Hagler to show signs of aging. Leonard could of faught if he wanted to.

---

ive watched it many times and leonard did enough to win he won first 4 rounds easy as pie then it got close with hagler winning middle rounds i had it 7 rounds to 5 for leonard people didnt give leonard a chance against hagler plus hagler had just had two of best wins of his career against mugabi and hearns where as leonard had been knocked down by howard and didnt look impressive so yea it was amazing that he was able to win even if it was close still good performance for not fighting for 3 years hagler didnt do much either it wasnt really good fight but leonard done enough to win hagler gave away first 4 rounds by trying to box with leonard so its haglers fault for giving away first 4 rounds

---

Either you really love Leonard or really hate Hagler or you just can't judge a fight.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rotten Apple

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rotten Apple

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skyler

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by right_cross

ACK! Who sad clicked me! ??? Whoever did is a loser.

Just opinions. Anyone can make a case for a fighter. Mine are not so far out of wack that they get sad clicked.

Hey Skyler, sadclicker. Your creds go down the pipe when you say Floyd takes Hearns 10 out of 10 at 147. Realistic........NOT! You think Floyd at 147 has the goods to pressure Hearns the same way Leonard did and wear him out.

Like I said earlier, Floyd is head over heals better technically than anyone in the game today. But he hasnt even sniffed the level of prime fighters that Leonard and Hearns were at 147. Yeah I know Floyd is superior in every catagory. Hand speed the works..right. ::**

Oh yeah and a BS right back at you.

---

Hey moron, I didn't sadclick you.  I don't give out sadclicks because it's stupid, so try finding out what's going on before you jump out and accuse someone of something they didn't do.  And are you not aware of the concept that styles make fights?  Mayweather doesn't have to pressure Hearns.  People who compare Mayweather's style to Leonard's style are as misguided as people who compare Tyson's style to Frazier's style.  They fight almost nothing alike.  The only 2 fighters out of the 4 greats with a realistic shot of beating Floyd would be Hagler and Duran because they go to the body on a consistent basis, NOT Leonard and Hearns.  And who Floyd has faced only places him lower than Leonard at the moment in terms of greatness, not who's better.  There's a difference between who's greater and who's better.  Greatness has to do with accomplishments, being better means who would win, and Floyd is better than Leonard (who by the way is by far the most overrated of the 4 greats of the 80s and in alot of people's estimations ranks 4th). 

---

i disagree i think hagler and duran would prolly have worse chance against mayweather i think leonard is better than mayweather and leonard is not most overrated out of the 4 he beat duran hearns and hagler and what makes it amazing is that leonard before hagler fight hadnt fought in 3 years and still beat the best middleweight at that time and no way leonard ranks 4th out of the famous 4

---

You need to go watch the fight again, kid.  Slapping with your punches for the last 30 seconds of each round should not win fights.  Leonard did not beat Hagler.  He was given a gift.  And Leonard did not fight for 3 years cuz he was waiting for Hagler to show signs of aging.  Leonard could of faught if he wanted to.

---

ive watched it many times and leonard did enough to win he won first 4 rounds easy as pie then it got close with hagler winning middle rounds i had it 7 rounds to 5 for leonard people didnt give leonard a chance against hagler plus hagler had just had two of best wins of his career against mugabi and hearns where as leonard had been knocked down by howard and didnt look impressive so yea it was amazing that he was able to win even if it was close still good performance for not fighting for 3 years hagler didnt do much either it wasnt really good fight but leonard done enough to win hagler gave away first 4 rounds by trying to box with leonard so its haglers fault for giving away first 4 rounds

---

Either you really love Leonard or really hate Hagler or you just can't judge a fight.  

---

i like leonard and i like hagler when i watch a fight i dont pick favourites i split it down the line leonard won first 4 rounds easily and he done enough to win and i can judge fights very well thats not right what ur saying just because i had leonard winning alot of people had leonard winning and alot had hagler winning i think its about 50-50 to who won it was close fight not very good fight either but leonard won it by 7 rounds to 5 in my opinion anyway alot of people have different reviews about that fight doesnt mean u cant judge a fight i could say that about u with hagler but i wont because it was close fight could of gone either way and people are split 50-50 to who won

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Samson3000

I also rank Leonard 4th out of the big 4 because I thought Hagler was robbed and thought Hearns was robbed in the rematch. Also, all of the other 4s big wins are decisive, while Leonard's are the only one's that remain cloudy (except for the first Hearns fight). However where he ranks among those guys is a matter of opinion and everyone can see it differently.

---

Bollocks, IMO he tops it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by cockey cockney

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Samson3000

I also rank Leonard 4th out of the big 4 because I thought Hagler was robbed and thought Hearns was robbed in the rematch. Also, all of the other 4s big wins are decisive, while Leonard's are the only one's that remain cloudy (except for the first Hearns fight). However where he ranks among those guys is a matter of opinion and everyone can see it differently.

---

Bollocks, IMO he tops it.

---

IMO, he doesn't ;D

On the whole Leonard was the best at his best I remember an old saying , Woman have more hair on head than man but Man has more hair on body than Woman but on the hole woman has more hair or something like that

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Samson3000

I also rank Leonard 4th out of the big 4 because I thought Hagler was robbed and thought Hearns was robbed in the rematch. Also, all of the other 4s big wins are decisive, while Leonard's are the only one's that remain cloudy (except for the first Hearns fight). However where he ranks among those guys is a matter of opinion and everyone can see it differently.

---

Really? I though Duran quiting, and Hearns being ko'ed were pretty decisive... IMO Leonard won a close but decisive fight against Hagler, at least as much as when Hagler beat Duran. Also Leonard did lose the rematch against Hearns, but they weren't the same fighters they were in 1981. He is IMO the best of the 4.

As I said, the first Hearns fight was not controversal. However, IMO, he lost to Hagler clearly, as I don't see anything worthy of scoring about flurrying the last 10 seconds of a 3 minute round. I gotta put him 4th (which is nothing to be ashamed of when you're being ranked next to 3 of the all time greats).

OK I know all you Floyd lovers out there will hate me for this but....IMO Ray hurts him....Judah was winning for the first few rds of their fight...Floyd gave him too much respect. Ray is in another universe in terms of skill when compared to Judah....Ray was stronger than most gave credit for...Ray could box his ass off but....HE COULD ALSO FIGHT HIS ASS OFF!!!!!!.......Plus his chin was very good at 147 he showed that against Hearns....Floyd could not hurt Ray nor would he land as many shots against him as he has against guys like Corrales, Gatti and Baldo....Ra would bully him into submission by the 7th.....