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Do you think Pac would've beaten either or both, had they been prime at the time of the fights.
I think Pac is p4p number on merit, but I don't think he would've beaten either MAB or EM in their primes
You can see how Morales dictated the fight in their first encounter, when he still had something left, I think both would've probably 'outboxed' him. WHADDAYOURECKON?
CC for an interesting debate starter...
I suppose Pac is now entering his prime. He has developed Knockout power in both hands and has more to his game than when he fought Barrera last time out or when Morales managed to decision him. Its a tricky poser with so many variables at play. Morales is a great but he has always played to the crowd and against a Pac with fire now in both hands that could perhaps have been the deciding factor in any prime against prime debate. Barrera is more able to resist going to the trenches. Even got some jeers against Rocky second time out for doing just what needed to be done. I think prime Barrera is able to be patient and pick his shots and most crucially, be evasive.
Im in the minority that thinks Barrera can still beat Pac in a second meeting...
CC mate
I think fighting Pac again would be 1 fight too many for Barrera - but if he does and he wins, it would be a magnificent finale.
And it would mean an end to these "Pac versus PBF what if" threads....ever so slightly unhinged! ;DQuote:
Originally Posted by BIG H
Lol ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by miles
What weight? 122 was (for me) Barrera's best weight and despite his weight problems I think it was Morales' best, he physically needed to move up but the punch power had a lesser effect.
I really am not sure about Barerra vs Pac in their primes.. I suspect Pac could have still beaten him, although it is a very tricky question.. Im not pretending to know one way or the other, I would simply pick a prime Morales over Pac because a slightly faded one above his best weight already beat Manny.. But like Miles said, Pac may still be coming into his prime, time will tell.
Personally i take Barrera to beat them both at his best.
I think this is pretty premature question of comparison because Pacquiao hasn't even reached his prime yet. While MAB and Erik is safe to compare because we know they've both reached their peak already. Anyway, we can always guess in our own point of view, but just remember PAC is a very very fast learner so add that to your PAC prime learning curve direction and i hope you got the picture of what he would become if he would reach his prime. ;)
Fighters we root for do not look "normal" when getting beat or beat up. The same holds true with PAC when he gets beat by a younger probably stronger fighter in the future. It's hard to beat a prime PAC if he loses then he is no longer or not yet in his prime :)
Pacquaio would have beaten Morales and Barrera even in their primes. Pacquaio's punches are really heavier than the two. Somebody may rebutt that it's not about strength alone (its about skills, speed, etc.unfortunately pacquaio has all those).... but you must agree with me guys that Pacquaio has a lot more strength and power in his punches than Morales and Barrera.
I have not seen a prime PAC but he is getting there. With that being said, I can not discuss this. Some one let me know when PAC has reached his prime then we can talk.
He's currently in his prime.Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny_G
I heard Pacquaio said that he needs to practice and develop his skills more..... the man knows he still needs to learn more things in boxing. Definitely he is not in his prime yet.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
but he shows remarkable improvements everytime he fightsQuote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
and i think this question differs nothin from the unsolved archived
questions like prime ali vs prime tyson vs prime louis
or a prime ray leonard vs prime PBF etc... this still would end as a question
You can not seriously be suggesting that he has better boxing skills than barrera and morales :dunce:Quote:
Originally Posted by rrbong
.
at superbantamweight pac's punch was incredible.i dont think barrera could stand in that division.Quote:
Originally Posted by Missy
yawn. That's right. He was a monster at that weight.
It;s diffcult to pinpoint MAB's prime but certainly when he was younger,he has the boxing skills but he had that fire which I do not feek he has:watch his wars with Junior Jones and Kennedy Mckinney. Pacman is a great fighter,a true warrior but it would be a close close fight"!
Time will tell. Pacman is still developing his talents and skills. As of now, he is at the verge of exceeding the combined talents and skills of Barrera and Morales. That''s why he was able to batter the two mexicans.Quote:
Originally Posted by Missy
Thought I'd 'bump' this.
I stand by my 2006 assesment that both MAB and EM ewould have outboxed PAC at their peaks
Styles make fights.
For this reason I think a prime sharpshooting Erik beats Pacquiao.
For the same reason I think that Marco struggles as he brawls with Pac, I'd say that Marco beats him 70+% of the time.
Very harsh on Pac considering he beat them 4 out of 5 times.
I tend to agree though. The first Morales fight was a truer reflection of how they compare than the all of a sudden shot Morales of the rematch.
And Barrera showed enough second time to suggest, in his pomp, with a better preparation, the first Pac fight may well have been different.
I feel Pac's main disuading factor would have been his power. Barrera dealt with the power of both EM and Prince pretty well, so I feel a prime Barrera would only have difficulrty if he made the fight hard for himself.
As for prime Morales, I feel that he could have dealt with Pac much easier using his boxer/puncher style.
I actually think another guy who could have challenged Pac would have been McCullough at the lighter weights. With his chin and style he could have dredged out an exciting loss to Pac.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Exactly . If thats what a washed up Barrera can do . Imagine if Barrera was in his prime
I think Morales would beat him more often than not but Pac would always give Barrera a lot of trouble IMO. Barrera of the first fight (unless you buy all the excuses) was physically fresh and a smarter fighter than the young Barrera and Pac beat him down. And I was a pretty big Barrera fan but he didn't seem all that interested in a rematch for a pretty long time. I don't put too much stock in the second fight, Barrera was just extremely defensive, I don't see him fighting like that in his prime, he would fight smart but not like that.
Good points. I actually think that Morales would have abused Pacquiao in a bad way during his prime.Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG H
Up until 2004 or so Erik Morales was one of the greatest fighters this sport has ever seen.
I would have choosen Barrera by decision in a prime battle as well.
I am not trying to take anything away from Manny Pacquiao either, he is a great fighter and deserves his place in the sport as well by all means.
I agreeQuote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Just re watched the 1st fight last night. That Pacquiao is a shadow of the pacquiao of today technically.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
When Morales rush him old pac backpedals and morales got him by landing combos before covering up at the ropes.
Pac of today would slide sideways and regroup at the middle of the ring.
old pac tried the right hook a few times but were inaccurate
pac's Right hook and uppercut are pretty accurate at the moment.
Just IMAGINE how would people rank a prime Barrera if a washed up version was pound for pound number 3 :D. The sad thing is that's all we can do. IMAGINEQuote:
Originally Posted by GAMEQuote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Exactly . If thats what a washed up Barrera can do . Imagine if Barrera was in his prime
Another old thread and I even posted on it. What's going on?
I have revised my opinion. Barrera and Morales could knock out all nughuggers in one round.
It's a tricky question. Morales won the first Pac fight and he was just probabaly getting past his peak around that time. The second and third fights, Eric was clearly shot...and Pac was hungry. The first Barrera fight is hard to judge for me. Marco definitely had outside distraction...PLUS...i don't think him or anyone else was ready for Pac to explode onto the scene like that. Their second fight...well...Barrera was nowhere near his prime and was gunshy. I would say Marco would have the better chance in his prime because Marco was a cerebral fighter on top of being a brawler. Eric was technically a great fighter...but his pride always got the best of him.
I think Morales beats both, simply becuz he beat Pac when he was exiting his "Prime" and them beat Barrera 2/3...Morales was robbed of the 3rd fight...in their trilogy.
Part of me thinks the styles make fights. I personally had Barrera winning all 3 fights with Morales, but I think he is the one truly elite fighter who fought Manny in his prime. Morales had a good enough chin in his prime I think to withstand Pac & beat him on points as he did in the first fight, however, at that time Pac wasn't as refined as he is now.
As surprised as I am saying this, I think Pacquiao is the greatest of the 3, followed by MAB & then Morales. But all were more than capable of beating each other, I just think Pacquiao is the one most likely to be the victor on the majority of occasions
One thing I do regret is that the Pac: Barrera rematch didn't happen sooner. I really believe it would have been a much more competitive fight than both of the Pac: Barrera fights we saw.
The first fight saw Barrera clearly not expecting Pac to be quite as relentless as he was and by the time of the second fight Barrera's reflexes had dulled somewhat and he was just too conservative to make a proper dent in Manny.
A fight at the midway point in these junctures would have been very interesting IMO.
:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by miles
Can you tell me the purpose of the 5 related threads at bottom of each current thread?
I havent read some of them so i went in and read. is it forbidden to reply to it?
That's what im driving at. People say Morales and Barrera were out of prime but the more obvious thing is Pacquiao wasnt prime either when he fought them.Quote:
Originally Posted by JazMerkin
:vd:
Oh come on now. :-\Quote:
Originally Posted by miron_lang:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by miles
Can you tell me the purpose of the 5 related threads at bottom of each current thread?
I havent read some of them so i went in and read. is it forbidden to reply to it?
I wasn't being serious. I haven't been serious on a number of my recent posts. Just surprised to read through a thread and saw I posted a long time ago that's all....
Quote:
Originally Posted by milesOh come on now. :-\Quote:
Originally Posted by miron_lang:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by miles
Can you tell me the purpose of the 5 related threads at bottom of each current thread?
I havent read some of them so i went in and read. is it forbidden to reply to it?
I wasn't being serious. I haven't been serious on a number of my recent posts. Just surprised to read through a thread and saw I posted a long time ago that's all....
sure mate
i wasnt being serious either ;)
Just making up for lost time. havent been here for years. i guess saddo should take out that feature wherein 5 related threads are displayed no matter how old. :-\