Should we put Winky up there with Roy Jones are does he still have more to prove
This guy is starting too slowly turn into my favorite fighter, I am not trying to jump on the bandwagon but it's because he is a humble character. The only time he has been an asshole was after the Taylor fight. I wish he would have not had such a slow start in his career, he would probably be a top 15 fighter at this time (of all time). Look at his resume two dominate victories over Shane Mosley, Trinidad, Quartey and a questionable draw against a much bigger Taylor, a robbery loss against Vargas and it looks like he will be around at least a couple of more years. Should we put him up there with RJJ and the other greats or does he still have more to prove. I would put him up there, I would love too see him take Hopkins to school.
Re: Should we put Winky up there with Roy Jones are does he still have more to prove
first off COOL CLICK bro PM or email me the 411 for MIAMI in 07 bro hollar!
2nd WINKY is def the TRUTH no one can front on that. although his style may not appeal to the masses, its EFFECTIVE, SMART and CLEAN.
Its funny u are comparing him to RJJ, personally i think RJJ is the shiiiiiiiit, im the biggest RJJ fan so no one comes close to him in my book. a PRIME RJJ was just insane bannanas man PERIOD. a PRIME RJJ could do whatever the F he wanted to man literally.
also im sure u know RJJ use to promote Winky, and that MAYBE one of the reasons why Winky did not get the love he deserved earlier on in his career. cuz although RJJ was the man in the ring im not quite sure he was the best promoter for other fighters especially with someone with winky's style.
i even remember when RJJ would commentate with JIM and LARRY and JIM pointed out that tonight is Winky's last fight under the promotion of RJJ so it does matter win lose or draw RJJ will commentat unbiasedly on this fight tonight for Winky is not one of his fighters anymore tonight. ahahahha
Re: Should we put Winky up there with Roy Jones are does he still have more to prove
also i want to add if winky does take on oscar and pbf and comes out with a win on either even or better yet both, then theres no room for HATIN there at all.
Re: Should we put Winky up there with Roy Jones are does he still have more to prove
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Originally Posted by brazilianbomber
The only time he has been an asshole was after the Taylor fight.
Although, I thougth he put on a good fight Saturday, and was cool afterwards, its still hard for me to like him after Taylor Tantrum.
Re: Should we put Winky up there with Roy Jones are does he still have more to prove
The only thing bad about his style is that when the other guy goes all out on him Winky is forced to go in his shell and jab a little, possibly throw in a left. Other than that, no one has ever been able to crack a Prime Winky in this era. Which is a great accomplishment. Hopkins Winky would have been awesome, because both those guys make their opponents look impotent. heheh
Winky does have a habit of taking the last rounds off a close fight. Vargas and Taylor. And I never liked it when he or any other fighter raise their hands during the last 10 seconds of a fight. Raise hands afterwards. Winky does move back in the last rounds, in Vargas and Taylor fight. What he should have done is gut it out and handily keep beating them down once they turn up the heat... don't let them get the benifit of the doubt by activity from the judges.
But when his career is all said and done, he should be a Hall of Famer.
Re: Should we put Winky up there with Roy Jones are does he still have more to prove
GREAT FIGHTERS beaten by Roy Jones Jr. :
James Toney - Prime but weight drained, but probably his greatest victory
Bernard Hopkins - young, not the great he would become
Never fights either again.
GREAT FIGHTERS beaten by Winky Wright :
Shane Mosley, TWICE, in his prime.
Tito Trinidad - on the back end of his career.
TIMES KTFO
Jones - 2
Wright - 0
In terms of pure talent and public perception, Jones is ahead. In terms of production, performance, record against top competion, Wright is at least equal, if not superior. In terms of skill and craft, Wright is WAY ahead.
Re: Should we put Winky up there with Roy Jones are does he still have more to prove
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanE
GREAT FIGHTERS beaten by Roy Jones Jr. :
James Toney - Prime but weight drained, but probably his greatest victory
Bernard Hopkins - young, not the great he would become
Never fights either again.
GREAT FIGHTERS beaten by Winky Wright :
Shane Mosley, TWICE, in his prime.
Tito Trinidad - on the back end of his career.
TIMES KTFO
Jones - 2
Wright - 0
In terms of pure talent and public perception, Jones is ahead. In terms of production, performance, record against top competion, Wright is at least equal, if not superior. In terms of skill and craft, Wright is WAY ahead.
I like Winky, but to say he beat a prime Shane is a reach. Shane starting slipping after getting beat twice by Forrest. I dont see Shane as a dominating fighter at 154.
I rank Winky at least equal to Jones, since he has alway wanted to fight the top guys. Jones spent a good part of his prime fighting cab drivers. When his skills slipped he got knocked out by cab driver named Tarver. :laugh:
Re: Should we put Winky up there with Roy Jones are does he still have more to prove
Quote:
Originally Posted by right_cross
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanE
GREAT FIGHTERS beaten by Roy Jones Jr. :
James Toney - Prime but weight drained, but probably his greatest victory
Bernard Hopkins - young, not the great he would become
Never fights either again.
GREAT FIGHTERS beaten by Winky Wright :
Shane Mosley, TWICE, in his prime.
Tito Trinidad - on the back end of his career.
TIMES KTFO
Jones - 2
Wright - 0
In terms of pure talent and public perception, Jones is ahead. In terms of production, performance, record against top competion, Wright is at least equal, if not superior. In terms of skill and craft, Wright is WAY ahead.
I like Winky, but to say he beat a prime Shane is a reach. Shane starting slipping after getting beat twice by Forrest. I dont see Shane as a dominating fighter at 154.
I rank Winky at least equal to Jones, since he has alway wanted to fight the top guys. Jones spent a good part of his prime fighting cab drivers. When his skills slipped he got knocked out by cab driver named Tarver. :laugh:
These are some of the stupidest things I've ever heard... Look at the record of the guys Roy fought, and then tell me he ducked people... He fought a whole bunch of good if not great fighters who proved themselves, and had beaten the guys he supposedly ducked... He also would be maybe the only person who could beat Winky EASILY.... He would be able to counter that jab, and he has way more power than Taylor so Winky would be taking the hardest shots he would ever face by a landslide, and though I don't think Roy could knock him out with one punch, but he could definitely hurt Winky, and I think stop him.
Re: Should we put Winky up there with Roy Jones are does he still have more to prove
Also if you look at how they won their fights against top competition, Roy JOnes Jr. dominated, Hill, Johnson, Hopkins, Toney, McCallum, Griffin 2, Tarver I, John Ruiz, while Winky only dominated two of the top guys he fought (Mosley, Trinidad), and Mosley was already on the decline, and Trinidad made mistake that would allow any great boxer be able to beat him.
Re: Should we put Winky up there with Roy Jones are does he still have more to prove
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
Also if you look at how they won their fights against top competition, Roy JOnes Jr. dominated, Hill, Johnson, Hopkins, Toney, McCallum, Griffin 2, Tarver I, John Ruiz, while Winky only dominated two of the top guys he fought (Mosley, Trinidad), and Mosley was already on the decline, and Trinidad made mistake that would allow any great boxer be able to beat him.
In terms of dominating, you can take Hopkins, and Tarver 1 off your list. He didnt dominate those guys. Toney was a drained and McCallum was past it.
I'm not saying Jones wasnt a great fighter, but I'll stick to the statement he knocked over a string of cab drivers. Great fighter doesnt neccessarily translate to great boxer. Great boxers can stretch their careers when their skills fade. Like Hopkins and Toney. Once Roy's athletic ability slipped, he was toast. Couldnt fall back on being a Phd of the sweet science.
Winky isnt the fighter he was, but can still hang with the top guys at 35, cuz he knows how to box. Jones cant cope with diminishing skills like great boxers can. I rate Winky even with Jones.
I'll agree to disagree with ya. :)
Re: Should we put Winky up there with Roy Jones are does he still have more to prove
I think that Roy JOnes Jr. still could... I honestly believe that he wasn't doing things right in preparation for the Johnson fight, and the second Tarver fight he was winning, but got caught with a punch that would have knocked most people out. As for against Hopkins, Jones did dominate him. The last few rounds he wasn't really doing anything, and he was still ahead by 4 rounds with a broken hand. Against a guy like Jones old isn't necessarily a bad thing... I think McCallum had certain advantages that allowed him to stay in the ring against Jones. 1. He was alot bigger, and could take more punishment. 2. He was more savy than in his younger years, sorta of like Hopkins. 3. Roy wasn't even going hard on him. 4. He had a good fight with Toney after fighting Jones. Tarver 1, have you seen the fight? Tarver caught him a few times along the ropes, but the majority of the fight Roy was pot shoting him easily, and I think the 116-112, 117-111 scores demonstated that.
Re: Should we put Winky up there with Roy Jones are does he still have more to prove
Mosely beat ODLH in his last fight before Winky. If he wasn't in his prime, he was pretty damn close.
Jones fans will always have excuses for him. There is just no talking to them on the subject. To some people, he is Moses, Jesus, Mohammed, Vishnu, and the Buddha rolled up into one, wearing boxing gloves.
These are the people who think the 1st decision against Tarver was correct, that McCallum still had it, and Eric Harding was a top-level fighter. They also believe Tarver got lucky, and that a lucky punch ruined their hero. If it weren't for that damn lucky punch, Roy would still be the man.
I wouldn't exactly call Griffin, Hill, or Ruiz top competition. Maybe Griffin. Johnson was a journeyman who put Roy into convulsions the second time around. Tarver got DESTROYED by a 41 y.o. Hopkins. The same Tarver who easily destroyed Jones twice.
Re: Should we put Winky up there with Roy Jones are does he still have more to prove
There was a British fighter called Michael Watson, who Winky reminds me a lot of.
Wright is a very experienced, ring wise technician - he is always fit, does not cut and has a good chin. he is an excellent boxer, helped by being an awkward southpaw (I wonder how many knockdowns he has been credited with which were really the result of his opponent tripping over that hyper-extended right foot?)
I have a lot of respect for him - he has developed an effective style which maximised his physical attributes and can cover up some deficiences - the lack of a real KO punch for example.
He is the latest in a long line of 'blue collar technicians', people like Buddy McGirt, Marlon Starling, Virgil Hill, Mike McCallum etc. They tend to be popular and respected by boxing fans, but don't make the jump to superstardom because they don;t transcend boxing to become known by mainstream sports fans. Maybe the exception to this would be Marvin Hagler?
As a (sort of) knowledgeable boxing fan, I think Wrights record and legacy stands comparison with Jones.
BUT - and it's a strange point of view - he does not make me look forward to his fights, my pulse doesn't pound just before the first bell and (crucially) I don't find much unpredictability in his bouts. There is never the feeling that I shouldn't take my eyes of the screen in case something happens like a one-punch KO. There isn't that 'WOW' factor that we had with Jones' arrogance, Tyson's speed and power, Hearns blitzing right hand, Ray Leonard's silky smoothness - even Gatti's pure bravery.
It's really unfair, because I think a prime Wright could compete with Jones (assuming the same size etc), Hearns and Leonard etc. but it would not necessarily be a great fight for the casual fan to watch.
Wrongly, i don't think history will be kind enough to Winky. :'(
Re: Should we put Winky up there with Roy Jones are does he still have more to prove
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanE
GREAT FIGHTERS beaten by Roy Jones Jr. :
James Toney - Prime but weight drained, but probably his greatest victory
Bernard Hopkins - young, not the great he would become
Never fights either again.
GREAT FIGHTERS beaten by Winky Wright :
Shane Mosley, TWICE, in his prime.
Tito Trinidad - on the back end of his career.
TIMES KTFO
Jones - 2
Wright - 0
In terms of pure talent and public perception, Jones is ahead. In terms of production, performance, record against top competion, Wright is at least equal, if not superior. In terms of skill and craft, Wright is WAY ahead.
also beating virgil hill was excellent win aswell
Re: Should we put Winky up there with Roy Jones are does he still have more to prove
I think it is too big a size differential between the two for Winky to pull it off in a head to head match up, but P4P I consider them close even though I give the edge to Roy. But I think Winky could beat Floyd or Oscar any night of the week. Another Taylor fight would be good, but I will say that he has maybe two more years to continue the run he has started, he is no spring chicken.
Re: Should we put Winky up there with Roy Jones are does he still have more to prove
Nope, Jones Jr won his fights easily. Winky will get Knocked out if he fights Taylor again.
Re: Should we put Winky up there with Roy Jones are does he still have more to prove
Quote:
Originally Posted by X
There was a British fighter called Michael Watson, who Winky reminds me a lot of.
Wright is a very experienced, ring wise technician - he is always fit, does not cut and has a good chin. he is an excellent boxer, helped by being an awkward southpaw (I wonder how many knockdowns he has been credited with which were really the result of his opponent tripping over that hyper-extended right foot?)
I have a lot of respect for him - he has developed an effective style which maximised his physical attributes and can cover up some deficiences - the lack of a real KO punch for example.
He is the latest in a long line of 'blue collar technicians', people like Buddy McGirt, Marlon Starling, Virgil Hill, Mike McCallum etc. They tend to be popular and respected by boxing fans, but don't make the jump to superstardom because they don;t transcend boxing to become known by mainstream sports fans. Maybe the exception to this would be Marvin Hagler?
As a (sort of) knowledgeable boxing fan, I think Wrights record and legacy stands comparison with Jones.
BUT - and it's a strange point of view - he does not make me look forward to his fights, my pulse doesn't pound just before the first bell and (crucially) I don't find much unpredictability in his bouts. There is never the feeling that I shouldn't take my eyes of the screen in case something happens like a one-punch KO. There isn't that 'WOW' factor that we had with Jones' arrogance, Tyson's speed and power, Hearns blitzing right hand, Ray Leonard's silky smoothness - even Gatti's pure bravery.
It's really unfair, because I think a prime Wright could compete with Jones (assuming the same size etc), Hearns and Leonard etc. but it would not necessarily be a great fight for the casual fan to watch.
Wrongly, i don't think history will be kind enough to Winky. :'(
I'll give a cc for the well thought and intellegent analysis. I'm kinda with you on this , except that I seldom felt the WOW factor with Jones, because he mostly fought a bunch a stuffs. I was pretty stoked, however, to see how Taylor/Wright would pan out, as I was I for Wright/Tito. I felt tremendous anticipation to see if superior physical skills could overcome Winky's craft, or if someone could figure out Winky.
Hey Dukeof74m, are from Little Rock or are you just smoking rock? Either one might explain a belief that Taylor could KO Winky :)
