I found this article
http://www.eastsideboxing.com/news.php?p=9349&more=1
whats ur thought?
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I found this article
http://www.eastsideboxing.com/news.php?p=9349&more=1
whats ur thought?
Non boxing followers I know say that UFC is boring because of the grappling aspect, the fighters that arent fit, athletic, or just good "fighters" take it to the ground and wrestle which takes their enjoyment away.
As far as their concerned if they wanted to watch a couple of steroided up or overweight "fighters", theyd go down the pub.
Fights anyone wants to watch are along the lines of Castillo v Coralles 1, Barrera v Morales 1, any gatti v Ward fight anything where punches are being exchanged and not 2 grown men rolling around on the floor trying to avoid getting involved
Where do people get the PPV sales numbers?Quote:
Originally Posted by godson
Anyway, MMA is not exclusively from the US as this guy claims, traditionally the biggest tournaments were held in Japan. I think the fact that boxers are not as active as they used to be is really hurting the sport as a whole. To get boxing back into the main public eye, we need more household names, people that get exposure. Right now in the US I don't think a casual sports fan could name one of the Heavyweight alphabet title holders.
I loathe UFC or any form of MMA period.
So I suppose I should be taken out of the equation.
CC! Could not have said it better myself.Quote:
Originally Posted by killersheep
All right, UFC fans, gimme what you want but I'd say - straith-faced, boldly, unflinchingly and with absolutely no doubt - that UFC is a big FAKE, a subtle one at that but fake nontheless! The quicker they're exposed, the better it'll be for us boxing fans. Period, no if's and but's.
didn't read the article, but my take on how they compare is the only plus the ufc has that boxing doesn't is there are no freaking ABC belts in there or promoters (i don't think there are any promoters?)
not a big fan of the UFC, certain fights ill watch, but cudnt sit down and just watch the grapeling tbh, to boring for me.
was talking to a few people who had followes boxinf all their lives, and they were saying how they are edging more towards the ufc now 'coz its one champ whos always fighting the best or the one the fans want and thats a major plus.
ufc is to fishsticks as boxing is to lobster ;)
I friggin hate all that shit too... Just go wrestle in a back yard!Quote:
Originally Posted by wacko3205
Umm, i think you may have got this one the wrong way around butt. UFC has nothing to do with fishsticks and boxing has very little to do with lobster, except for the oversized looking fists/claws. I think it should read:Quote:
Originally Posted by frozensolid_702
No charge for the editing bro ;) Actually, I agree with the majority view I think from here which is that UFC is a bit boring, with too much grappling. If I want to watch that I'll go somewhere where there are at least some storylines to make it interesting, in pro wrestling. But personally, I'll stick with boxing.Quote:
Originally Posted by frozensolid_702
Quote:
Originally Posted by superheavyrhun
its a comparison (because of the thread title), ill elaborate for you
if ufc were seafood, it would be fishsticks............
if boxing were seafood, it would be lobster
i get what youre saying, though..............
my grammar sucks (sad but true)
Agreed....I dislike them almost as much as those bastards at eastside who thought Audley Harrison would KO Wladimir Klitschko.Quote:
Originally Posted by wacko3205
Eastside houses a bunch of idiots
MMA is garbage...don't hate me for it but I dislike it.....especially Tito Ortiz he's a silly cunt
Whilst I'd hardly consider myself a fan I do download the odd event or two to watch.
I watched the entire PPV broadcast of Pride's American debut a couple months back and as an event it was highly entertaining.
Some of the fights were over far too quickly and I got a little uncomfortable when a couple of the men assumed 69 position's on the floor and carried out what appeared to my untrained eyes to be sex acts on one another but the whole razzmataz if thats a word was definitely there.
There was this crazy ass woman fight announcer who I could only describe as having a videogame type voice, just amazing the sounds she managed to produce and loads of strobe lighting and effects.
The fights, even though I hadn't barely heard of any of them were still easy to get involved with thanks to brief pre fight interviews with the two protaganists, in which invariably one of them would come across as a complete and utter prick so I'd be rooting for the other guy to kick his face in.
And I have to say there is something rather satisfying about a sport that allows a fighter to literally do that! I saw people get knocked out by flying knees to the face, by having their ankles snapped, or being elbowed on the nose whilst being pinned down on the floor unable to move, its the kind of brutality you sometimes wish you could inject in a boxing fight.
Who wouldn't have liked to have seen Kosta Tyszu lay a prostrate Zab Judah on the ground, then sit astride his chest and headbutt him repeatedly on his nose until his face was a bloody mess?
Overall whilst I don't think it compares to boxing as a serious sport I would have to say that it can be very entertaining to watch at times and I would consider going to an event if they ever staged one near me.
To me its kind of like the difference between Formula One racing and Nascar. Whilst purists, journalists and serious race fans would not even consider Nascar to be a serious sport like Formula One, a huge swathe of hicks, rednecks and children watch it avidly to see the crashes.
Overall I would say it complements boxing rather than competes against it. Fight fans have more than one related sport to get excited about which is hardly a bad thing.
Well of course Lyle you make an educated argument as always ;D I use to argue about it but I came to realize entertainment value is subjective so its no different than Saying you prefer Soccer over american Football..Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
The only Problem I have when someone says it garbage.. Well the numbers dont lie you can put your head in the sand all you want but MMA has already gained on Boxing and will overtake it soon enough.. Dont get me wrong I love Boxing to the ends of the earth but to train in MMA like I have and here someone call it garbage just pisses me off cause I guaranteed if you spent a month at a grappling school you would change your tune and respect the commitment, work ethic, skill and knowledge and to be able to think and constantly adapt..
I always say Boxing Intelligence is like driving on the Autobahn having to adapt quickly and to react to an opponents attack standing in front of you with them striking you with fists only and above the belt...
MMA is like trying to fly a Fighter Jet in a Gymnasium.. You have to be prepared to defend at all angles front and back, knee strikes, punches, kicks, takedowns, 1000's of submissions etc...
Again you dont have to like it but calling it garbage is just ignorant and idiotic
As for people saying that the UFC and any MMA is too much grappling, theres a lot less grappling and a lot more stand up action than there used to be - which is a shame in my opinion I liked the grappling, theres too many rules in the UFC now that encourage toe to toe stand up fighting than grappling (which involves a lot more skill than people on this board seem to give it credit for but its a boxing board so its forgiven) Its the big knockouts that draw the big audiences and the big PPV revenues so its hard to blame to UFC for all the changes.
Im getting a little of point here so back to comparing boxing and UFC its impossible really, like comparing horse racing and formula one racing - they're two very different sports! A good boxer would have little chance in an MMA fight and a good fighter from the UFC would have little chance fighting under boxing rules. Both can be brilliant in their own field but very hard to compare.
sometimes i watch it and its alright but othertimes when there doing that grapple shit on the floor bores me i think to myself stop grappling just bloody hit him lol it can be frustrating at times 8)
It was a good idea to start with, no weight divisions or anything. I lost interest after UFC 6 myself but UFC 3 was great. Watching a 7 foot 650 LB sumo wrestler fight with a 200 LB Kempo karate guy was pure comedy gold.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
That just depends on how much respect you have for the technical side of MMA, its the same as someone complaining about boxers going 12 rounds, is that boring because theres no knockout?
:coolclick: agreed!!!! again like you said its a boxing forum and people are here for boxing not MMA so the dislike is expected but again I have a problem with people being disrespectful when they have 0 knowledge of what there commenting on and then pretent to think its not legit or it will go away when infact its caught up to Boxing and has surpassed it in popularity on a few levels...Quote:
Originally Posted by beerjelly
I personally Prefer Pride F/C instead of the UFC I think they are marketing it like the WWF... Pride show cases the best fighters from all over the world.. I am excited to see Mirko Crocop and Quinton "Rampage" Jackson have signed contracts with the UFC from Pride.. I am confident they will run the Table in there divisions because of there exposure to fighters from all over the world..
its not that easy the minute you focus on 1 paticular area that when you utilize another.. Like when I trained when I was sparring with a good striker, the last thing I wanted to do was stand there and trade, so I would look for my opening and shoot the legs and go for the takedown or get in a Muay Thai clinch deliver the knees and then takedown, but its a fast paced chess match and you have to stay alert and never get comfortable in 1 aspect of the fight..Quote:
Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
Its doesn't ;)
Plenty of fights go 12 rounds and are absolute stormers. Yeah you might get the odd boring 12 rounder but its still more exiting to watch than two guys fondling each other on the floor.Quote:
Originally Posted by beerjelly
I respect the technical side of MMA but I dont get much joy from watching it and it does not come close to boxing and the exitement I get from it boxing. Sometimes my heart thumps big time when watching a big fight, I cant get enough of it. I love the sport to bits.
Its like comparing baseball to cricket if you ask me.
agreed well said thats the way i feel aswellQuote:
Originally Posted by Kel
That is what the general sports fan finds offputting about open fighting as compared to boxing, boxing is more of a spectacle, people want to see a fight, not appreciate the aspects of some holding on to anothers limb for dear life.Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
Also you mention that a good striker would make you want to take it to the ground, boxers, good ones, aggressive ones, strike fear in to the heart of grapplers because its hard to start a take down on someone with fast hands who is aiming to ko you, as soon as you rush forward with arms out your a target
Well I consider myself pretty well versed on UFC and Boxing, others may disagree but hey what can I say? ;D
I've actually followed UFC, since the very first UFC tournament,where there were NO rules. When a #10 ranked Cruiserweight fighter came into the ring with one boxing glove on his hand ready to KO somebody, and got choked out two minutes later by Royce Gracie. When you could punch a guy in the nuts 10-15 times, and not disqualified. I saw Royce Gracie win against Ken Shamrock. I've seen Tank Abbott get his ass kicked a thousand times, Mark "the Hammer" Coleman, and his protege, Kevin Randleman come and change the sport with their "ground and pound" tactics. I've seen the UFC go from separate martial arts competing against each other to MMA, where everybody is cross trained in everything. I've seen it all in the UFC really, and for the most part I've liked it. Its been brutal. Now, though it has changed, and its still pretty good, but all the freakin yuppies, and young punks are getting into it and thinking they know something about fighting. They know Liddell and Ortiz. They know shit IMO. Anyway, point is, the pisshead Dana White, who apparently used to be a amatuer boxer, is making the UFC out to be a brand, he's taken it mainstream, and it has become almost like Pro Wrestling. No longer is it barred in most states, or an underground thing like it was. It's really become a traveling circus IMO. I still like it, but I don't love it like I do boxing. Boxing is great, because its on a lot more than UFC, and its just more of an art, more of a pure sport the way I see it. Anything can happen in boxing and has, and I love that. UFC has become a fad, and people will start to see that, the same fighters keep fighting one another way too often, and it will pass, least at the rate Dana White is going. Boxing however will never die.
*oh and for the record, grappling can be boring, but it is not that frequent anymore, and a good grappler will always beat a good strker, if that striker can't defend against the takedown or panics when he gets taken down, grapplers are very skilled, and there are tons of submissions out there.
Ok here's my list of complaints:
First of all, a lot of the fights end in the first couple of minutes. That may be ideal for the growing numbers of adolescents with ADD but it's boring as hell to me.
The stand-up that everyone praises is absolute crap. Aids patients have a better defense against colds than the majority of those fighters have against punches. The end of that sell/smith match is my example. "But he feinted to the head which is why his body was open". Oh no it looks like his fist is coming towards my face, i'll just guard my face completely and leave my body wide open because i'm hoping he doesn't have the reaction time to hit me in the body for the 10 seconds i'll leave it exposed.
It goes to the ground A LOT. They roll around A LOT.
Most matches end in the same fashion of a jerry springer show or playground fight. Two people swinging wildly one goes to the ground the other lands with horrible accuracy and then the two are seperated by Steve, the other person's mom, or a huge ref on roids. I apologize for not seeing thelearned technical skill employed in this finishes.
The announcer with the most prestige on ufc is joe f'n rogan. This is a man who made himself famous by paying people for eating horrible stuff. He now gets paid to announce the action of something that, if it was made into a food, people wouldn't eat for any amount of money.
Any mofo with two arms and two legs can land a lucky shot and win. They could just twist the guys arm until he quits. I again apologize for not seeing the great technical skill employed in that.
They made commercials for the ultime fighter that goes and i quote " What's real? Wrestling? No. Boxing? Not anymore :o Watch whats real." This garbage coming from a man who was too much of a bitch to become a pro boxer and has the nerve to say that boxing's a pushover sport. Lets see him get in the ring with wlad and see how fake it is when he breaks chris byrd's record for biggest gash received on the side of one's face.
>:mad
I prefer boxing myself, but it pains me to say I think we boxing fans have truly become the minority. I'm 21 so pretty young, I can't talk to any of my buds about boxing cause none of em watch it and find it borring, my dad is pretty much the only person I know that likes it, but I guess that cause he's "old", mma is where it's at for most young people. I don't despise mma, I'll even watch it occasionally. All the grappling and groundwork doesn't bother me, I myself did wrestling for a few years and judo, so I like to see some kick ass submissions and take downs every once in a while, but for excitement and entertainment value boxing wins for me on any day. I'll be realistic though and say that in a few years time mma will beat out boxing in popularity, it's not something that has to happen, but for it not to happen there have to be some changes in boxing.
This is how I see things.
Some on the internet are of the opinion UFC is huge everywhere and is going to take over from boxing as the number 1 fighting sport. I simply don't beleive this is true. UFC has drawn some very impressive buyrates this year on ppv. Aside from De La Hoya vs Mayorga, their top couple of shows have beaten all boxing ppv's this year. This alone does not mean UFC is now number 1.
I am also a wrestling fan, and UFC moved to the tv station in America that WWE Raw used to be on, and they get rating that are about a third of what Raw was getting when it left the station. And wrestling has been on a downward spiral for years now. It also has nowhere near the popularity it does in America in other countries. When I go in to work I can always find people to talk about the boxing on ITV, I've never met a UFC fan anywhere but on the internet.
Where UFC has a big advantage is that they all work for a promotion. Boxers and boxing promoters seem to try and put off fans by avoiding putting on matches people want to see. There always seems to be something in the way, look at the welterweight scene this year, there was huge money to be made with a combination of Hatton/Mayweather/Margarito/Cotto but none of those guys ever got it on, all took inferior matches that people didn't really want to see. This hurts boxing, whereas UFC is one organistaion, they have their fighters under contract, they have their own ppv schedule, and a tv show to hype them. It's much easier for them to put on the matches their fans want to see. And thats what I chalk them getting big buyrates up too. They don't have everyone all over the world clamering to see who wins their matches, it's still a niche sport, I can't stand it and think it's incredibly boring, but they have a fanbase, which is the biggest it's been since their mid nineties boom, and they are putting on the matches these fans want. Eventually these matches will dry up and the boom will be over, just like what happned before. Boxing will carry on just as it always has, regardless.
:coolclick: in a couple of years it will join the pog boom of the early 90's and the yo-yo boom of the late 90's: in the fad trash can. Hopefully emo music follows it down.Quote:
Originally Posted by Larryboy
Theres a big difference covering up with a 4-6 oz glove and protecting yourself against a 4-6 oz glove then there is with 10 oz gloves..Quote:
Originally Posted by Punisher136
Understand how it might look to you but its all subtle technique.. I am 190lbs and I guarantee I can hold an untrained but in shape 222-270lb man on the ground and keep superior positionong just like I can escape when that same guy tries holding me down to inflict pain and punch on me, its not cause I am stronger or more athletic but I have better technical skills and a better understanding of leverage and physics of the human body while holding position...Quote:
Originally Posted by Punisher136
Quote:
Originally Posted by Punisher136
True Joe Rogan is a comedian and was famous from fear factor, but what you might not know is Joe is one hell of an accompolished Martial Artist himself with a brown belt in Brazalian Ju Jitsu.. So he is more than qualified to be a commentator.
Nobody would eat if its food huh??? Well yell you what if you havent been paying attention all the networks and all the ratings and PPV numbers... MMA is Filet Mignon brother cause the masses are turning to it and are preferring it over Boxing... Sorry man thats a fact
Twist the guys arm till he Quits... Yea I get that alot with people and ask them to put me in an armbar and when the technique is all wrong and it takes them 10 minutes to do it and its ineffective... Yea anyone can do it ::** Tell you what try it when the other guys expecting it and you have a split 2nd to do it then if you cant apply it effectively you have to let go regain postition and then try for another sub, some body positions you can have someone in a triangle choke and if you cant get it, then you can flow to a leg lock, knee bar, etc... Not easy and believe me its all technique 100%Quote:
Originally Posted by Punisher136
Again this is a boxing forum not an MMA forum so I never expect anyone to embrace MMA.... But I am versed in Boxing and MMA so I can tell you 95% of the people that have pre conceived notions or talk about it, really know nothing about it or how its strategy or techniques apply....
Another thing:
Is it just me or does MMA stand for Male Mid-life crisis Association?
Any time a UFC fighter gets under pressure from a "striker" they take the featal position and dont do much else (like Ortiz against Lidell), either that or they try trading by holdng their head bolt upright and walking forward like a windmill (like Lidell v anyone).Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
There may be alot of technique in the BJJ but it doesnt make it entertaining to the masses, honest opinion on MMA or cage fighting is that its boring
Funny thing to me is people think that UFC is the only MMA entity in the world... Hell UFC isint even the largest organization in the world.. Pride F/C is.... Not to mention there is K1 as well so UFC is what people relate MMA to but its not...Quote:
Originally Posted by Larryboy
Again see above post UFC isint the only Entity, Pride and K1 showcase the best MMA fighters in the world they have a ton of European, Asian and American fighters not to mention the other organizations like NAGA and Mass Destruction etc.. Contrary to your belief there is plenty of fan fare and anticipation for matches and outcomes...MMA has been on the rise every year and again I dont know any fads that go on for over 16 years and show dramatic increase in numbers year after year..It cant dry up cause there are Plenty of upper echilon MMA fighters in the world, actually they out number Upper echilon Boxers even with all the alphabet organizations...And the difference between A, B and C class fighters in MMA is so razor thin its ridiculous to illustrate the skill level is tremendous..Quote:
Originally Posted by Larryboy
Again I myself dont like the fact that UFC is the face of MMA, when I think Pride F/C and K1 have much better skills than UFC... Thats my opinionQuote:
Originally Posted by ross
Blah blah blah.....Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Rock
When a good tysonesque heavyweight comes around in america ufc will start to fade away.
I love both but I like boxing better. It's funny that I've seen two former Gold Gloves champs that are UFC fighters and they have such sloppy boxing technique. Some of the ground fighters have better form. Anyone see the fight where the BJJ specialist one punch KOed the striker? I think it was UFC 52.
Does the Coward who :sadclick: me want to man up???? Sorry I didnt agree with your educated opinion.. bunck of children sometimes ::** God forbid we have an intelligent conversation... GROW UP!!!
it wasn't me after that post "sad click courtesy" i announce all of mine
BLAH BLAH??Quote:
Originally Posted by Punisher136
Yea nice respectful intelligent rebuttal there punisher, you put up such a convincing argument.. I might almost be swayed to see it your way ;)
That was real witty... Seeing Tyson hadnt done anything signifigant since about 1989 then I think MMA will be safe.. Yea thats all heavyweight Boxing needs is an unfocused, undiciplined, quitter....
I meant a ko artist that flies thru his competition. And i'd like to see you talk about the great technical aspect of mma in real time like when most of the fights end in random unaccurate flurries i wanna hear the second by second break down of the great technical aspect being on display for all to enjoy.