Top 50 Super Middleweight

Credit: Hr

Super Middleweight

1. Mikkel Kessler
2. Joe Calzaghe
3. Anthony Mundine
4. Librado Andrade
5. Lucien Bute
6. Alejandro Berrio
7. Carl Froch
8. Denis Inkin
9. Robert Stieglitz
10. Sakio Bika
11. Jean Paul Mendy
12. Anthony Hanshaw
13. Allan Green
14. Markus Beyer
15. Mario Veit
16. Jeff Lacy
17. Vitali Tsypko
18. Jürgen Brähmer
19. David Gogiya
20. Victor Oganov
21. Jean Pascal
22. Sam Soliman
23. Karoly Balzsay
24. Lolenga Mock
25. Gysmyl Perdomo
26. Mger Mkrtchian
27. Joszef Nagy
28. Peter Manfredo
29. Henry Buchanan
30. Peter Kariuki Ngateri
31. Dimitri Sartison
32. Rubin Williams
33. Antwun Echols
34. Yusaf Mack
35. Willie Stewart
36. Glenn Catley
37. Stas Kashtanov
38. Sergej Tatevosyan
39. Danilo Häussler
40. Rudy Markussen
41. Lajuan Simon
42. Jaidon Codrington
43. Martin Bruer
44. William Joppy
45. Eric Teymour
46. Peter Mashamaite
47. Anthony Dirrell
48. Curtis Stevens
49. Mohammed Ali Ndiaye
50. Lukas Wilachek

who've you got at 51 ? ???

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Originally Posted by Mark TKO

who've you got at 51 ? ???

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Cristian Sanavia or Tony Dodson :)

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Originally Posted by Elephant Beer

Credit: Hr

Super Middleweight

1. Mikkel Kessler
2. Joe Calzaghe
3. Anthony Mundine
4. Librado Andrade
5. Lucien Bute
6. Alejandro Berrio
7. Carl Froch
8. Denis Inkin
9. Robert Stieglitz
10. Sakio Bika
11. Jean Paul Mendy
12. Anthony Hanshaw
13. Allan Green
14. Markus Beyer
15. Mario Veit
16. Jeff Lacy
17. Vitali Tsypko
18. Jürgen Brähmer
19. David Gogiya
20. Victor Oganov
21. Jean Pascal
22. Sam Soliman
23. Karoly Balzsay
24. Lolenga Mock
25. Gysmyl Perdomo
26. Mger Mkrtchian
27. Joszef Nagy
28. Peter Manfredo
29. Henry Buchanan
30. Peter Kariuki Ngateri
31. Dimitri Sartison
32. Rubin Williams
33. Antwun Echols
34. Yusaf Mack
35. Willie Stewart
36. Glenn Catley
37. Stas Kashtanov
38. Sergej Tatevosyan
39. Danilo Häussler
40. Rudy Markussen
41. Lajuan Simon
42. Jaidon Codrington
43. Martin Bruer
44. William Joppy
45. Eric Teymour
46. Peter Mashamaite
47. Anthony Dirrell
48. Curtis Stevens
49. Mohammed Ali Ndiaye
50. Lukas Wilachek

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Is this your own list, or does it have another source?

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Originally Posted by miles

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Originally Posted by Elephant Beer

Credit: Hr

Super Middleweight

1. Mikkel Kessler
2. Joe Calzaghe
3. Anthony Mundine
4. Librado Andrade
5. Lucien Bute
6. Alejandro Berrio
7. Carl Froch
8. Denis Inkin
9. Robert Stieglitz
10. Sakio Bika
11. Jean Paul Mendy
12. Anthony Hanshaw
13. Allan Green
14. Markus Beyer
15. Mario Veit
16. Jeff Lacy
17. Vitali Tsypko
18. Jürgen Brähmer
19. David Gogiya
20. Victor Oganov
21. Jean Pascal
22. Sam Soliman
23. Karoly Balzsay
24. Lolenga Mock
25. Gysmyl Perdomo
26. Mger Mkrtchian
27. Joszef Nagy
28. Peter Manfredo
29. Henry Buchanan
30. Peter Kariuki Ngateri
31. Dimitri Sartison
32. Rubin Williams
33. Antwun Echols
34. Yusaf Mack
35. Willie Stewart
36. Glenn Catley
37. Stas Kashtanov
38. Sergej Tatevosyan
39. Danilo Häussler
40. Rudy Markussen
41. Lajuan Simon
42. Jaidon Codrington
43. Martin Bruer
44. William Joppy
45. Eric Teymour
46. Peter Mashamaite
47. Anthony Dirrell
48. Curtis Stevens
49. Mohammed Ali Ndiaye
50. Lukas Wilachek

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Is this your own list, or does it have another source?

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Credit to Hr, so it is not my list.

Who is Hr?

It is a very interesting list. I have one or two quibbles but can understand most of the positions on that list.

I would put Markussen at 41, not 40


He ain't that good

And I do think Lacy should be ahead of Mario Veit...just quibbles though! ;D

How can Bute rank ahead of Froch?

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Originally Posted by Elephant Beer

Credit: Hr

Super Middleweight

1. Mikkel Kessler
2. Joe Calzaghe
3. Anthony Mundine
4. Librado Andrade
5. Lucien Bute
6. Alejandro Berrio
7. Carl Froch
8. Denis Inkin
9. Robert Stieglitz
10. Sakio Bika
11. Jean Paul Mendy
12. Anthony Hanshaw
13. Allan Green
14. Markus Beyer
15. Mario Veit
16. Jeff Lacy
17. Vitali Tsypko
18. Jürgen Brähmer
19. David Gogiya
20. Victor Oganov
21. Jean Pascal
22. Sam Soliman
23. Karoly Balzsay
24. Lolenga Mock
25. Gysmyl Perdomo
26. Mger Mkrtchian
27. Joszef Nagy
28. Peter Manfredo
29. Henry Buchanan
30. Peter Kariuki Ngateri
31. Dimitri Sartison
32. Rubin Williams
33. Antwun Echols
34. Yusaf Mack
35. Willie Stewart
36. Glenn Catley
37. Stas Kashtanov
38. Sergej Tatevosyan
39. Danilo Häussler
40. Rudy Markussen
41. Lajuan Simon
42. Jaidon Codrington
43. Martin Bruer
44. William Joppy
45. Eric Teymour
46. Peter Mashamaite
47. Anthony Dirrell
48. Curtis Stevens
49. Mohammed Ali Ndiaye
50. Lukas Wilachek

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HR, needs an MRI.... ;D
Cause there is no way 'Dinamite' Dann is worst then these 50 guys....
On avg. Danns rated top 20.....

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Originally Posted by miles

Who is Hr?

It is a very interesting list. I have one or two quibbles but can understand most of the positions on that list.

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Hr is a poster on another board. He has been doing this long list for quite a time now. I guess that he updating it once or twice a month.

Even he has it as long as top 50 he also mentions boxers almost doing the list ;D

Boblere: Stjepan Bozic, Andre Dirrell, Nader Hamdan, Damon McCreary, Christophe Tendil, Piotr Wilszewski, Tito Mendoza, Cristian Sanavia, Mehdi Amar, Michael Henrotin, LaFarrell Bunteng, Esteban Camou, Dale Westerman, Tony Dodson

I just saw Mendy & Hanshaw, 11 & 12.... :-X ahead of Beyer, Veit, Lacy, Brahamer, Green....

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Originally Posted by Fenster

How can Bute rank ahead of Froch?

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By having fought the better opposition, even with less fights and years as a pro? Or maybe just because ppl use their eyes and think he's a better fighter. Take your pick, really... I don't see why he shouldn't be ahead of Froch though.

Say what you will about Manfredol, but in all honesty, I'm pretty sure he'd put a good azz whipping on anyone not named Kessler or Calzaghe, and yes, that includes Mundine et al.

And a healthy Lacy is still legit top-5.

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Originally Posted by p4pking

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Originally Posted by Fenster

How can Bute rank ahead of Froch?

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By having fought the better opposition, even with less fights and years as a pro? Or maybe just because ppl use their eyes and think he's a better fighter. Take your pick, really... I don't see why he shouldn't be ahead of Froch though.

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Who's he fought thats better than Brian Magee?

Froch just took out a fighter in 2 rounds that took Bute the distance.

The more I look at the list the more things I disagree with....

I rank Inkin higher then both Froch & Bute.... yet on this list Bute is #5, Froch #7 and Inkin #8 below them.....

Elephant Beer ask HR to list the fighters that both Froch & Bute fought that are more reputable then these 2 that Inkin has fought; Julio C. Vasquez & Mario Veit.

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Originally Posted by p4pking

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Originally Posted by Fenster

How can Bute rank ahead of Froch?

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By having fought the better opposition, even with less fights and years as a pro? Or maybe just because ppl use their eyes and think he's a better fighter. Take your pick, really... I don't see why he shouldn't be ahead of Froch though.

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See above..... for my :twocents:

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Originally Posted by Fenster

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Originally Posted by p4pking

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Originally Posted by Fenster

How can Bute rank ahead of Froch?

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By having fought the better opposition, even with less fights and years as a pro? Or maybe just because ppl use their eyes and think he's a better fighter. Take your pick, really... I don't see why he shouldn't be ahead of Froch though.

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Who's he fought thats better than Brian Magee?

Froch just took out a fighter in 2 rounds that took Bute the distance.

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Very early stoppage

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Originally Posted by Elephant Beer

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Originally Posted by Fenster

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Originally Posted by p4pking

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Originally Posted by Fenster

How can Bute rank ahead of Froch?

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By having fought the better opposition, even with less fights and years as a pro? Or maybe just because ppl use their eyes and think he's a better fighter. Take your pick, really... I don't see why he shouldn't be ahead of Froch though.

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Who's he fought thats better than Brian Magee?

Froch just took out a fighter in 2 rounds that took Bute the distance.

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Very early stoppage

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Yes cause Tatevosyan really kicked up a fuss as the ref SAVED him

"fuck this for a game of soldiers" was written all over Tatevosyan's face.

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Originally Posted by Fenster

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Originally Posted by Elephant Beer

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Originally Posted by Fenster

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Originally Posted by p4pking

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Originally Posted by Fenster

How can Bute rank ahead of Froch?

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By having fought the better opposition, even with less fights and years as a pro? Or maybe just because ppl use their eyes and think he's a better fighter. Take your pick, really... I don't see why he shouldn't be ahead of Froch though.

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Who's he fought thats better than Brian Magee?

Froch just took out a fighter in 2 rounds that took Bute the distance.

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Very early stoppage

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Yes cause Tatevosyan really kicked up a fuss as the ref SAVED him

"F*** this for a game of soldiers" was written all over Tatevosyan's face.

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Tatevosyan or however it's spelled, took the Froch fight after losing to Bute just 2 months ago... So he took him the distance, he didn't win a single round though, and he also took Howard Eastman the distance a few years back. I haven't seen Froch KO him though, so I will hold judgement there.. As far as who he's fought that's better than Magee.. Well, Bute stopped Karambey Salem, who took Calzaghe the distance and even dropped him, and Joe couldn't return the favour. Salem also went the distance with Mario Veit(a SD loss), Antwun Echols, and Eric Harding...Salem has fought on a completely different plane than Magee. I don't think you could argue that he's the tougher opponent. Bute only turned pro in 2004 keep in mind.. And he's already built up a very solid resume for his experience. I suppose on paper theres nothing to seperate Froch and Bute. I can easily say I think Bute is a better fighter with a brighter future though. Guess will just see what happens for both men. Certainly nothing wrong with Bute being 2 spots ahead of him..

p4pking & Fens..... Say as you will but theres no way Froch & Bute should be listed above Inkin....

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Originally Posted by CutMeMicK

The more I look at the list the more things I disagree with....

I rank Inkin higher then both Froch & Bute.... yet on this list Bute is #5, Froch #7 and Inkin #8 below them.....

Elephant Beer ask HR to list the fighters that both Froch & Bute fought that are more reputable then these 2 that Inkin has fought; Julio C. Vasquez & Mario Veit.

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Originally Posted by CutMeMicK

p4pking & Fens..... Say as you will but theres no way Froch & Bute should be listed above Inkin....

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Originally Posted by CutMeMicK

The more I look at the list the more things I disagree with....

I rank Inkin higher then both Froch & Bute.... yet on this list Bute is #5, Froch #7 and Inkin #8 below them.....

Elephant Beer ask HR to list the fighters that both Froch & Bute fought that are more reputable then these 2 that Inkin has fought; Julio C. Vasquez & Mario Veit.

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Why not? THe only name Inkin has on his resume is Mario Veit.. Not to say that isn't a great win for a prospect... But Inkin, like Froch is already almost 30 and has been pro since 2001... Why hasn't he fought tougher opponents sooner? He certainly isn't clearly ahead of Froch or Bute on paper.. I haven't seen that much of him though so I can't argue if you think he's a better talent. Certainly it isn't clear cut that he should be ranked ahead of those 2 though.

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Originally Posted by p4pking

Why not? THe only name Inkin has on his resume is Mario Veit.. Not to say that isn't a great win for a prospect...

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So former World Champ. Julio C. Vasquez and conqueror of Winky means nothing?
OK, thats fine if you won't accept Vasquez as reputable so then on the Veit win alone he should be ranked higher as he has fought the better opposition....
Isn't that the way rankings go?
I'm ranked higher then you cause I fought and beat a better opponent then any that you have beat. Thats the way it works....

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Originally Posted by p4pking

But Inkin, like Froch is already almost 30 and has been pro since 2001... Why hasn't he fought tougher opponents sooner?

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Well once you get into those things you opne a whole new can of warms... Promoters, Management, Organizations etc. etc. etc.
The fact is Inkin has fought better opposition if you think otherwise then list more reputable names then Vasquez & Veit......

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Originally Posted by p4pking

He certainly isn't clearly ahead of Froch or Bute on paper.. I haven't seen that much of him though so I can't argue if you think he's a better talent. Certainly it isn't clear cut that he should be ranked ahead of those 2 though.

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To me it is and I read on a site that Froch might be facing Inkin which I think is great....
I really like both guys and I think would make for a really good matchup....

Credit: Hr

Super Middleweight

1. Mikkel Kessler - Undefeated (WBA, WBC titles(champ or superchamp or whatever)
2. Joe Calzaghe - Undefeated (WBO title)
3. Anthony Mundine - beat by Kessler
4. Librado Andrade - beat by Kessler
5. Lucien Bute - Undefeated
6. Alejandro Berrio - (IBF title)
7. Carl Froch - Undefeated
8. Denis Inkin - Undefeated
9. Robert Stieglitz - beat by Berrio
10. Sakio Bika - beat by Calzaghe
11. Jean Paul Mendy - Undefeated
12. Anthony Hanshaw - Undefeated
13. Allan Green - Beat by Miranda
14. Markus Beyer - Beat by Kessler
15. Mario Veit - Beat by Calzaghe
16. Jeff Lacy - Beat by Calzaghe
17. Vitali Tsypko - Beat by Lacy
18. Jürgen Brähmer - Beat by Veit
19. David Gogiya - Beat by Tatevosyan
20. Victor Oganov - Undefeated


Who is HR?

Winky lost at Welterweight to 5'8 Vasquez... in 1994 before he created 'Fortress Winky' ;D

(searched boxrec for that :P )

And also when he fought Inkin, Vasquez had lost 3 of 4 previous fights and was 10 years later.

I will agree though Mick - Inkin is a badass boxer and does rank ahead of Froch & Bute.

For starters he has the WBC inter belt i believe and he also blew out Mger Mkertian in like 2 rounds aswell!

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Originally Posted by G0MEZ

Winky lost at Welterweight to 5'8 Vasquez... in 1994 before he created 'Fortress Winky' ;D

(searched boxrec for that :P )

And also when he fought Inkin, Vasquez had lost 3 of 4 previous fights and was 10 years later.

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Oh! yeah! no doubt on that but his name is credible and he continues to fight and he continues to win...

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Originally Posted by G0MEZ

I will agree though Mick - Inkin is a badass boxer and does rank ahead of Froch & Bute.

For starters he has the WBC inter belt i believe and he also blew out Mger Mkertian in like 2 rounds aswell!

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G0MEZ,
Please tell me the chances of Inkin vs. Froch look good.

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Originally Posted by Brockton Bomber

Say what you will about Manfredol, but in all honesty, I'm pretty sure he'd put a good azz whipping on anyone not named Kessler or Calzaghe, and yes, that includes Mundine et al.

And a healthy Lacy is still legit top-5.

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yeah lol lacy would fucking walk through buyer and veit inside 3 rounds imo! i would have lacy at number 3 tbh

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Originally Posted by p4pking

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Originally Posted by Fenster

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Originally Posted by Elephant Beer

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Originally Posted by Fenster

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Originally Posted by p4pking

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Originally Posted by Fenster

How can Bute rank ahead of Froch?

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By having fought the better opposition, even with less fights and years as a pro? Or maybe just because ppl use their eyes and think he's a better fighter. Take your pick, really... I don't see why he shouldn't be ahead of Froch though.

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Who's he fought thats better than Brian Magee?

Froch just took out a fighter in 2 rounds that took Bute the distance.

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Very early stoppage

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Yes cause Tatevosyan really kicked up a fuss as the ref SAVED him

"F*** this for a game of soldiers" was written all over Tatevosyan's face.

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Tatevosyan or however it's spelled, took the Froch fight after losing to Bute just 2 months ago... So he took him the distance, he didn't win a single round though, and he also took Howard Eastman the distance a few years back. I haven't seen Froch KO him though, so I will hold judgement there.. As far as who he's fought that's better than Magee.. Well, Bute stopped Karambey Salem, who took Calzaghe the distance and even dropped him, and Joe couldn't return the favour. Salem also went the distance with Mario Veit(a SD loss), Antwun Echols, and Eric Harding...Salem has fought on a completely different plane than Magee. I don't think you could argue that he's the tougher opponent. Bute only turned pro in 2004 keep in mind.. And he's already built up a very solid resume for his experience. I suppose on paper theres nothing to seperate Froch and Bute. I can easily say I think Bute is a better fighter with a brighter future though. Guess will just see what happens for both men. Certainly nothing wrong with Bute being 2 spots ahead of him..

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So the fact that Tatevosyan had never been stopped even though he's mixed with world class fighters like Eastman, Froch beating him inside 6 minutes is bloody good form.

There's not much to seperate Froch and Bute on paper but Froch dispatched with their one common opponent in a far more impressive fashion, which must bode well for him to be ranked above Bute, no?

Calzaghe dropped Salem in the 12th (it was nothing)

Barring Calzaghe I'd put Salem's form losing to Veit and Echols on a par with Magee losing to Reid and Tsypko, so not really much in it...I'll concede though that fighting and dropping Calzaghe puts him slightly ahead ;)

G0MEZ,
Please tell me the chances of Inkin vs. Froch look good.


very very very good. ;D

u have inkin footage?

I would put Mads Larsen on the list somewhere around 25. He is back in business now under German manager Wilfried Sauerland ( I think that is the name),

Mads got pissed at his Danish promoter Palle after he was endured because the promotor got Kessler approved to fight Manny Siaca instead of Mads Larsen, for the WBA title in November 2004.

Mads Larsen is back to get even 8) so he is highly motivated to kick some a**. But there is no way Kessler is gonna fight him due to the very poor relation Larsen have with promotor Palle O0

http://www.boxrec.com/boxer_display.php?boxer_id=5415

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Originally Posted by G0MEZ

G0MEZ,
Please tell me the chances of Inkin vs. Froch look good.


very very very good. ;D

u have inkin footage?

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Yeessssss! :)
Nooooooo! :(
I've only seen his fights on the net I'm not home at the moment so I don't know of the top of my head the name of the site I saw the footage but I'm pretty sure I wrote it down somewhere (I hope) :-\
Thanks for the response....

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Originally Posted by Brockton Bomber

Say what you will about Manfredol, but in all honesty, I'm pretty sure he'd put a good azz whipping on anyone not named Kessler or Calzaghe, and yes, that includes Mundine et al.

And a healthy Lacy is still legit top-5.

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manfredo whoop mundine ???....pleaze, manfredo sux he dosent even deserve a shot at calzaghe. is he even ranked in the top 10? mundine would whoop his b!tch a$$! .... do u think manfredo could go 12 with kessler

That dont mean shit Fenster history is full of such instances comparing fighters performences is no indicator of form .

Bute has stopped Salem and Toney handily beaten Mock , Tatesovoyen , Wiggins and Thysse

He also stopped Thobela something Mikkel Kessler didnt do , should he be ranked above Kessler ?

Bute deserves to be above Froch right now and a fight between them would be good but id side with Bute .

Of course comparing form is a good guide. Not conclusive, but still as good a guide as any.

They're unbeaten prospects, fought similar levels of opposition (Brian Magee is as good/better than all those names(I concede the Salem stoppage is impressive in light of him giving sicknote a few problems) ;)), yet Froch beat their one common opponent in a far more impressive fashion...so anywhere you rate Bute Froch is right there just in front of him, in my book.

All rankings are pretty much bollocks anyway. Untill the fighters FIGHT you'll never know who the better man is. The beuaty of boxing. ;)