Set-ups for the left hook

So, I'm a lefty that fights orthodox. I got a big left hook as can be expected, and I have alot of success landing it. Naturally, everyone in the gym knows it and I have been having to get crafty and sneaky to land it. I got a bunch of ways that I set it up, but I'm looking for any advice that may help me.

Throw me whatever good set-ups you have and what subtle things you do to set it up. I'd also like some tips on how to make it quicker. And any good drills you may do to further develop it.

I've been doing alot of studying on good ol youtube. Watchin all the left hookers I can find. Who are the best guys to watch? I've been watching alot of Tommy Morrison clips, he definetly had a badass left hook, and I fight somewhat similar to him.

several things you can do to set it up. several punches i use to do it. one punch in paticular I came up with is a punch that is somewhere between a left jab and an uppercut. it forces the opponent to bring his right glove across his body to block , thus leaving his right side open to a left hook .

best of luck mate. - LG

And you would not want two of them ;D

:laugh: cc

The left hook is not a punch that can be landed without setting up. It must be sneaked in as there has not been one person fighting in the history of boxing with an ounce of brains to just let left hooks land on them like that. This is because theyre fairly simple to avoid - unless of course you were made to walk into one. Grey has some posts around here that you should be able to find easy about basic left hook counters. Here's some other interesting set ups for the left hook and also some counters for those counters.

Left hooks can be countered with a left hook. In my opinion this is one of the most fascinating exchanges in boxing. The thing with the left hook is that whilst throwing it the body naturally turns in such a way that turns right into the opponents left hook. I call it double hooks. In such a scenario both opponents are exposed to being hit in either the head or the solar plexus. Both are moving into each other's punch and if caught will be be caught off balance as consequence to being hit while punching. If hit during this exchange the results are typically devastating. The exchange itself is responsible for many of the knockdown/knockouts in boxing and I always cringe when I see two fighters preparing to go into it. When Felix Trinidad fought Fernando Vargas this sort of thing happened very often as both fighters like to look
for the left hook. I really recommend trying to get a hold this fight and studying it if you want to learn more about left hooks.

Here are some shots of the first knockdown of the fight. Commonly people tend to think Tito landed the perfect example of a left hook counter to the jab. What most people don't know is that what he actually ended up countering was a left hook.

Here you see Tito slipping the jab so that it passes over his right shoulder. (on a side note notice that Tito is in a position to be hit by a right hand ;D)
http://img370.imageshack.us/img370/5316/1ago9.jpg

Here Tito starting his left hook counter in response to the jab. Whats important to note here is that Vargas could have very easily blocked the punch as you can see.
http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/9158/1bvz9.jpg

Instead of blocking Tito's left hook Vargas opts to throw left hook of his own in response to Trinidad's. You can see him getting tagged as he starts his left hook.
http://img398.imageshack.us/img398/3628/1cib7.jpg

Vargas finishing up his left hook and eventually wobbling to the canvas
http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/8310/1dvd8.jpg

The main point I wanted to illustrate here was how devastating the left hook is when countering a left hook.



Here is another scenario that plays out later in the fight. Once again I recommend getting a chance to see the fight for yourself as it is loaded with information.

Here we see Tito slipping the straight right over his right shoulder (notice that Tito couldve thrown a right hand with his slip here)
http://img456.imageshack.us/img456/6870/2aua1.jpg

Tito starting his counter left hook
http://img469.imageshack.us/img469/94/2bwb1.jpg

Vargas - also in a position to throw a left hook as he had just completed a right hand - also starts a left hook effectively putting both men into a double hooks scenario.
http://img483.imageshack.us/img483/9501/2cwc6.jpg

Here we see Tito taking the Vargas hook flush. The punch would knock him down instantly.
http://img123.imageshack.us/img123/4888/2drb5.jpg


The question to ask is why was Vargas able to land his left hook whereas Tito was not. This becomes evident from a different angle.

http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/5256/2xug9.jpg

What Tito had thrown was a left hook counter to the body. The reason for going to the body and not the head in response to a right hand is due to the fact that the head is naturally slipping as it is being carried in the movement of the right hand. The body however is exposed as the right arm is straightened out and raised, revealing the liver. In retrospect we can see that Tito, believing to have an open window to the liver - bit the bait accordingly. What we also see, however, is that Vargas was already finishing up his right hand as Trinidad was starting up his left hook. This allowed Vargas to bring back his right arm to block the left hook to the body whilst throwing a left hook to counter Tito's left hook. Vargas ends up landing a flush left hook with a comfortable degree of safety. He triggers Tito's left hook to the body by giving him a right hand to counter, then blocks it in the same motion as he counters with a left hook of his own. Try to get into your stance right now and act out what Vargas did while imagining Tito slipping your right hand and throwing that left hook towards your body. Try it a few times and get a good feel of it. If you notice a guy trying to use the same counter Tito was on you, this is a way to make him pay for it.


If anybody remembers The Mosley/Vargas rematch they remember seeing one of the biggest left hooks anyone has ever seen. Anyway throughout the fight Vargas was looking to parry Mosley's jab. Parrying Mosley's jab had some consequences though. Namely that by putting your hand in front of your face to parry the jab you expose the side of your face to left hooks.

Vargas, in believing what Mosley was throwing was a jab, moves his hand out to parry.
[img width=700 height=477]http://img375.imageshack.us/img375/903/x1rv5.jpg[/img]

[img width=700 height=477]http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/4628/x2lx5.jpg[/img]

I believe this punch is best set up when you're opponent comes to expect your jab and begins to parry it automatically without thinking. You can eventually get a sense of this as the fight progresses. After you allow him to develop this habit for some amount of time it becomes very hard for him to expect that something different may happen. He has no reason to think that after all as you've given him nothing that would lead him to believing something unexpected might happen to him. In my opinion its most effective when you throw your jab as a counter to his jab. Because his committed to the act of punching, its more difficult for him to maneuver out of the way. Also, because he is currently in the mindset of punching, its more difficult for him to factor in other information. He is very narrow minded and purely focused on 1. jabbing and 2. parrying your counter jab. Its decided in his mind before he even starts the jab.

Essentially, if he is automatically expecting a counter jab as he jabs then the left hook - from his disposition - literally comes from nowhere.



The last one I'll talk about is a pretty simple one using a fat yet surprisingly quick version a heavyweight James Toney and John Ruiz as examples.

Here's Toney rolling a right hand
http://img376.imageshack.us/img376/2005/73121399wa6.jpg

Here's Toney starting a counter right hand coming off his shoulder roll and Ruiz starting a left hook coming off of his right hand.
http://img398.imageshack.us/img398/4057/95885679mi8.jpg

Toney here landing his right hand inside Ruiz's left hook as his head moves away from a left hook. The yellow line represents a potential left hook to the head with the dotted line representing a potential left hook to the body
http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/2571/12896698pn3.jpg


This frame is pretty interesting because as you can see Toney's liver was very open. His arm is raised up in order to throw that roll counter exposing his body. Toney's head is moving away but his body isnt. Had Ruiz dropped the left hook to the body instead of the head he would have hurt Toney badly. It's important to note that note that the roll counter can be thrown while still protecting the body but typically those who throw it like this expose the head. Throw right hands at your opponent and make sure to watch him to see if he throws a roll counter in response. If you see him leaving something open, give him the right hand for him to counter and throw your left hook at the the exposed area.
http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/8930/80046648he7.jpg

The reason why they got hit was because of there lack of oral stability because there feet are wrong. Every shot you throw you can be countered by the same shot its the biomechanics of the opposite side of the body to the shot youre throwing that give the clues

watch alot of joe frazier videos

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Originally Posted by Scrap

The reason why they got hit was because of there lack of oral stability because there feet are wrong. Every shot you throw you can be countered by the same shot its the biomechanics of the opposite side of the body to the shot youre throwing that give the clues

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Whats a lack of oral stability and what do you mean by the feet are wrong?

Oral Thomas, is above the kneck, head the bodys biomechanics stablise it volentary its the bodys job to do so 2 major things that give us balance are the inner ear and our big toe depending on there allignment tells us whether someone is in balance, simple example is when someone is walking. Its the first thing we do when as a child we learn to walk its a natural trait. most good balaced fighters box in there walking gait with the back foot turned to suite shoulder movement and defence and punching mechanics with the back foot being able if it had an eye to see the other guys chin. Tito in the photos back foot cant see vargas chin so he starts with a wide left hook in that position the body recruitment pattern will make him drop his right hand for balance bad technique bad balance trouble. In fairness vargas isnt much better hes all over the place too

Thanks Thomas I checked out that fight. Great example and thanks for frame by frame break down.

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Originally Posted by Scrap

Tito in the photos back foot cant see vargas chin so he starts with a wide left hook in that position the body recruitment pattern will make him drop his right hand for balance bad technique bad balance trouble. In fairness vargas isnt much better hes all over the place too

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When you say his back foot cant see the chin, do you mean because his body is blocking it? I'm not sure I understand.


On another note, I've been throwing a better tighter hook lately, and was wondering these two things

1.) When I drop my shoulder to set the punch, is it better to have my thumb pointing up or left?

2.) What is better when it makes contact with the chin, thumb up or thumb facing towards you?

I've been feeling most comfortable with thumb facing towards me on impact, but I know what seems comfortable isnt always best in the long term. Feel fine both ways at the starting position.

To the 1st question yes about the body and front foot 2nd why drop the shoulder 3rd turn it to you it gives you protection shoulder to chin stabalises the shoulder and puts the knuckles in line with his jaw less risk of injuring yourself plus it moves the right shouldermore fluent a good left hook is caused by the work done by the right side

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Originally Posted by Scrap

To the 1st question yes about the body and front foot 2nd why drop the shoulder 3rd turn it to you it gives you protection shoulder to chin stabalises the shoulder and puts the knuckles in line with his jaw less risk of injuring yourself plus it moves the right shouldermore fluent a good left hook is caused by the work done by the right side

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I think I just got used to dipping my shoulder from when I would real wide hooks, just a bad habit i guess. Didnt realize it till i just tried it out, guess i dont need to do it lol.

Thanks, everything made sense.

I have some other questions

1.) What is the proper way to throw a lead hook? I know its a once in awhile punch to throw and not a staple, but the weight distribution seems strange as you need to step in, yet you are throwing a hook.

2.) Assuming im at an equal distance between two opponents, one taller and one shorter, besides either lengthening or shortening the angle of my elbow, are their any other adjustments to mechanics that should be made?

Funny I boxed orthodox and am a leftie. When doing it, its all about where the back foot is as with everything.Im assumming you are talking the shot Tyson use to throw. Give them something else to look at whether it be a jab or right turn the shoulder by turning the back foot and bending the knees without leaning its all about posture and fast feet its all part of a complete package which is why I never try this as a rule on here. I havent a clue who and what you are your style or stature and ability what you do with your coach, everybodys different, but what I can do is put a demo up of one of the lads doing it. It will take a few days. I at the uni next week and a bit busy bare with me

thats one hell of a post thomas, thanks

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Originally Posted by Scrap

Funny I boxed orthodox and am a leftie. When doing it, its all about where the back foot is as with everything.Im assumming you are talking the shot Tyson use to throw. Give them something else to look at whether it be a jab or right turn the shoulder by turning the back foot and bending the knees without leaning its all about posture and fast feet its all part of a complete package which is why I never try this as a rule on here. I havent a clue who and what you are your style or stature and ability what you do with your coach, everybodys different, but what I can do is put a demo up of one of the lads doing it. It will take a few days. I at the uni next week and a bit busy bare with me

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I am the same way Scrap. I am leftie and box orthodox. I'm 5'9 163 very lean, 71inch reach, smaller frame more muscle(like holyfield at hw) noticable speed/power but nothing standout. very good strength. long legs, shorter upperbody, lots of back strength.

I'm not sure who my style most resembles, but I do throw alot of left hooks lol. I'm pretty adaptable and can switch between out fighter/inside depending on my opponents build though I do like to throw my hooks from more of a middle range. I'm more of a slugger on the inside though, but I do work the body and not just headhunt. I can philly shell from the inside well if i feel like doing that. Medium punch output with distance, lower punch output in close(usually cause im against a taller opponent who either backs away or locks up so I cant stand toe to toe.

Yeah, i've seen tyson do it, i've seen mayweather from lead hooks which is strange cause alot of the time he does it from such a wide stance. I guess PBF is just a freak.

That would be awesome if you could post up some stuff when you get a chance. Thanks

Be good to move this stuff into a permament on show place Chris.
Great stuff in this post.
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So your in reverse stance and leading with your strongest hand!

Couple of thoughts for fun,

Hmmm , later on in the rounds when you are in closer to him and you already know the feeling of his movments, you can use his right hand to rebound your left hook around .

You 'feel' the attack and allow your left to come across slightly with his glove but you re adjust your feet, drop your stance and your reply left hook goes around his right arm as it expends and moves back you can head that way with your feet at the outset but turn in with every thing as you hook,or double hook above and then below his right arm on and around his reaction.

.When in close, A strong high hook from in close can be nullified by not even moving your arm or glove away from your face if you choose; if your guard is high up already and they are trying to move you with power by hooking your arm away or trying to land around it with short power, you can just turn and face it and throw any punch to suit their distance with your rear hand as you move forwards and out to that original side; opening them up as you go or chokeing that side down as you move into it if they stand fast.

Look at Vargas he also got away with that hook as well by turning and facing the point of contact (of titos hook) so that his right hand slightly checked the end of titos hook as his own hook landed.

I like that idea Andre.

I'm gonna also try to sucker people into throwing a rear hand uppercut and then jack em with the hook as they recoil.

Gonna work those on the mitts like crazy. Good countering ideas. I'm a whole lot of offense right now, good defense, but not much countering.

Most fighters who have switched stance are attacking fighters its a mindsett because of the eyes. Andre I loved doing that cc

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Originally Posted by Scrap

Most fighters who have switched stance are attacking fighters its a mindsett because of the eyes.

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I dont understand what that means. Its a mindset because of the eyes? Could you explain what that means?

Because, your dominant side is leading all movement, get a good coach who understands the principle and it can be a winner. I know in the 80s the Cubans experimented with changing there fighters with that Technique. Ive lost touch with what they are doing now, but it was a success. Having to lead with the dominant side is commitment to have it I did it because my coach couldnt train southpaws I conformed its all mindsett. Be aware and work more on understanding that the otherside and understand its the less dominant side that makes it work it can be a winner. Two that did it in recent times who spring to mind are Dela Hoya and Hagler.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Scrap

Because, your dominant side is leading all movement, get a good coach who understands the principle and it can be a winner. I know in the 80s the Cubans experimented with changing there fighters with that Technique. Ive lost touch with what they are doing now, but it was a success. Having to lead with the dominant side is commitment to have it I did it because my coach couldnt train southpaws I conformed its all mindsett. Be aware and work more on understanding that the otherside and understand its the less dominant side that makes it work it can be a winner. Two that did it in recent times who spring to mind are Dela Hoya and Hagler.

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love hearing the science behind it. excellent reads mate. 8) cc556

This was the best thing I've read in a long time, but I'm suprised that nobody mentioned a guy I consider to be one of the very best at landing a left hook- that being Bob Foster. The left hook is my favorite punch and I think he was able to camouflage it and deliever it in more ways than anybody else. He didn't just hammer away with it.
Personally I think there is too much talk these days of long, leaping and lead left hooks. To me, it is primarily a short countering blow. In leading with a long hook you commit the same sin as when being less than judicious in leading with the right: you leave yourself far too open. These are, essentially, set punches, meaning that you plant your feet in order to get your weight behind a hard punch. Thus it is best to have your opponent coming forward when you throw them. To make this happen even when you are the 'aggressor' is the whole point of boxing.
Circle right, then hook. Not many do it these days and you avoid the right hand. Beware his hook but, since you should know it is coming, you should be able to avoid it and counter it.

Thanks for the idea olds. I've done this before, but do you move right, then set, let him step and then throw it? or are you moving right, then cutting back left as you deliver the hook?

Since im generally the aggressor, yet I liek to use the hook, I've been feinting alot of other punches to open em up or atleast disguise the motions if they wont. I usually will feint a right in the course of a short combination to set up the hook. It's been working pretty well. The good thing about throwing the hooks alot and only feinting or throwing petty rights is that when you do decide to commit to the right it lands well.

Try this. To circle right move your LEFT foot first- maybe 2" to the right, then pivot on your left foot, moving your right foot until you are again in position. It will change your angles and open up hooks to the left side of your opponent's body and to his chin- watch Bob Foster. Punch as you pivot, letting the weight settle back onto your right foot.
Also puts you in a great spot to follow up with a right hand that MUST have your weight behind it.

They showed Foster/Frazier :jawdrop: on espn the other night. I was half asleep but I remember Frazier and Foster exchanged left hooks at the same time and well Joe Frazier had a pretty good left hook too I'll just say.

Not half bad...
How about the hooks Foster hit Quarry and Tiger with?

a Bob Foster fan I take it

Theres more variations on a hook than any shot the variables are many depending on the changes of distance direction and levels you create for yourself. As long as you dont create them for the other guy in the process.

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Originally Posted by Scrap

Theres more variations on a hook than any shot the variables are many depending on the changes of distance direction and levels you create for yourself. As long as you dont create them for the other guy in the process.

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True that. :laugh:

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Originally Posted by greynotsoold

Not half bad...
How about the hooks Foster hit Quarry and Tiger with?

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Quarry out cold, and Tiger starring up at the lights. Those hooks sent a shiver up my spine.

Yeah, Foster is my guy. I'm 6'3" and weighed 178 or so and my hook was my best shot. Foster didn't just throw the hook, he set it up in so many ways. Some of them, granted, are really only effective for tall guys.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBBjjuUujLc


watch at 35 seconds

Watch all Cotto's past fights.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tendaii

So, I'm a lefty that fights orthodox. I got a big left hook as can be expected, and I have alot of success landing it. Naturally, everyone in the gym knows it and I have been having to get crafty and sneaky to land it. I got a bunch of ways that I set it up, but I'm looking for any advice that may help me.

Throw me whatever good set-ups you have and what subtle things you do to set it up. I'd also like some tips on how to make it quicker. And any good drills you may do to further develop it.

I've been doing alot of studying on good ol youtube. Watchin all the left hookers I can find. Who are the best guys to watch? I've been watching alot of Tommy Morrison clips, he definetly had a badass left hook, and I fight somewhat similar to him.

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In the third Zale vs Graziano fight, Zale set the left hook up by throwing a right to the body, and after landing it, Zale unleashed a deadly left hook
to the chin.

Hey,

I'm back after sometime lost the pw to my old account anyways. I'm still training and I have some things to add.

Obviously, this aspects of technique can be found elsewhere in this thread and others on the left hook, but i figure i'd emphasize.

The two biggest things ive found when it comes to getting great speed and explosiveness on the hooks is to make sure your on your forefoot as you set, you dont have to be raised up to high, just keep the heel slightly off the ground so you get some spring outa your ankles and knees.

The other word of advice, is when you set, whether off a jab, after sitting down on a cross, or however you end up there, dont overdo the drop in your hips, if you go to low, youll lose both speed and explosion and itll be to slow, drop your hips somewhere between 1-4inches and then pop right back up exploding off your forefoot up and hips up, that will make sure the punch is thrown with your body and not the arm..

the difference is unmistakable, itll seriously be like 3x faster. keep them hooks short too.

anyways read the other left hook posts in here and on other left hook threads, all the info is on these boards.

This video shows how to throw a blinding jab to set-up a left hook.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vysbW8bvwAw