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De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Another topic that sufficed within boxing conversation between my friends and I is the legacy of De La Hoya. We were torn, being that half of us thought he had a monumental career and the other half felt he was slightly less than great. Personally I was in between both arguments.
Without a doubt, he did not shy away from the big fights but he also rarely pulled those fights off. His notable wins come from Julio Caesar Chavez (old by that time), Pernell Whitaker, Ike Quartey, Arturo Gatti, Fernando Vargas, and Ricardo Mayorga. I feel that Gatti and Mayorga are just names, not good fighters. His losses come from Felix Trinidad, Shane Mosley (twice), Bernard Hopkins, and Floyd Mayweather. He did well against the "B"-Class fighters, but when it came to the "cream-of-the-crop" he couldn't win.
I feel if he didn't lose focus and go grammy hunting he could've been one of the best ever. I was wondering what everyone thought of Oscar's career?
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
The judges thought he lost to Tito & Shane twice. A lot of boxing fans thought he should have been 2-1 in these 3 fights instead of 0-3 as the record book shows. So the question would be, does he get kept out of the hall of fame because some judges might have been wrong in 2 of his biggest fights?
Hopkins was just too big for him but I think Oscar deserves some credit for taking that challenge.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
de la hoya is an ATG, HOF, tbh i didn't even think this topic was even up for debate or that anyone other than a silly hater (not calling you one) would even question it...
world champion at 6weights, fought pretty much every big name in his eara... most have him 1-1 with shane and 1-0 over tito... even if you count him as lossing all there they were by razor thin descisons... and worthy of a shit load of respect, and as shane and tito are cert for the HOF razor thin losses to them is easily good enough to get in along with them...
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Preme
de la hoya is an ATG, HOF, tbh i didn't even think this topic was even up for debate or that anyone other than a silly hater (not calling you one) would even question it...
world champion at 6weights, fought pretty much every big name in his eara... most have him 1-1 with shane and 1-0 over tito... even if you count him as lossing all there they were by razor thin descisons... and worthy of a S*** load of respect, and as shane and tito are cert for the HOF razor thin losses to them is easily good enough to get in along with them...
I'm in no way a De La Hoya hater. I've been fan even before the grammy nomination. I'm just asking for the sake of debating. I totally forgot to mention he was champion at numerous weightclasses (i think he was champ in 5 not 6: lightweight, super lightweight, welterweight, junior middleweight and middlewieght)
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by caleoh12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Preme
de la hoya is an ATG, HOF, tbh i didn't even think this topic was even up for debate or that anyone other than a silly hater (not calling you one) would even question it...
world champion at 6weights, fought pretty much every big name in his eara... most have him 1-1 with shane and 1-0 over tito... even if you count him as lossing all there they were by razor thin descisons... and worthy of a S*** load of respect, and as shane and tito are cert for the HOF razor thin losses to them is easily good enough to get in along with them...
I'm in no way a De La Hoya hater. I've been fan even before the grammy nomination. I'm just asking for the sake of debating. I totally forgot to mention he was champion at numerous weightclasses (i think he was champ in 5 not 6: lightweight, super lightweight, welterweight, junior middleweight and middlewieght)
like i said, i wasn't say you were a hater;)
and it was 6.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Even with his record as is, he is still a lock in the Hall of Fame. He is still the only fighter to win world titles in 6 different weight divisions (if you count WBO which many now do). He still gave us great fights and remained competitive in the elite level for the better part of 10 years. He is arguably the most popular fighter since Sugar Ray Leonard. You can say that the last part has nothing to do with it, but I beg to differ, it is called the Hall of FAME not Hall of All Time Greats.
Just because he was not the best of his era does not mean he was not hall of fame material. His era was arguably one of the best in boxing. Whitaker, Trinidad, Quartey, Hopkins, Wright, Vargas, Mosley, Chavez, Forrest, Maywether, most of these guys would easilly make a top 30 P4P all time great list. Oscar fought most of them and won his share. The names on his record are a who's who of the greats of his time.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
he did beat mosley in the second fight but wasn't given the decision
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
I think Delahoya whole career is suspect. He won fights he should have lost and he lost a couple that he should have won. At the same time he became the face of boxing and put it back on the map for ten plus years. I think he is a hall of farmer just off the strength of that.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Hall of Famer,DEFINTELY,all time great,I'm not so sure but most probably no. He has fought everyone there is to fight.
He beat alot of good names but just as you can say his losses were against guys who were just superb fighters(b hOP tITO,SSM ) his wins can easily be viewed as being more impressive than they were. He beat a Vargas who was just DESTROYED by Tito.Ditto Mayorga. He beat Quartey but alot of fans(not myself)think Ike should have got the decision.JCC was old as heck and had been through war after war,he had nothing left to give.He beat other good names at the lower weights but none were as big as the names mentioned above.
It's a double edged sword. You can't say,oh he lost to the best and he's an ATG at the same time,that doesn't make sense,especially seeing as his biggest wins were not as clear cut either. Hall of Famer for sure but for a guy who will be rememberd more for his losses than his wins,and as harsh as that sounds,it's true,you cannot classify him as an ATG,not imo.
And there is no way he would make top 30 ATG imo.Great fighter,great fighter,very skilled BUT lost his biggest fights and his biggest wins were close.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
He's a shoe in for the Hall of Fame no doubt, he'll be a first ballot pick the moment he's eligable.
I'd also say he's an all-time great as well.
Boxing at the highest level if often about luck and there is every chance that if Oscar would have his career over, some of those controversial decisions would have gone his way and people would rank him up there with the likes of Pernell Whittaker and Leonard.
Imagine if the Trinidad and second Mosely fight had gone his way, he'd be probably seen as top 20 of all time.
As it is he must still surely make the top 50, probably top 40 and he's not done yet.
I'd give him every chance of beating Hatton, Cotto, Cintron, Forrest, possibly Mosely and who knows maybe even Floyd in a rematch.
Some people talk of him as if he didn't achieve anything and that's crazy. Winning belts in 6 different divisions isn't easy ::**
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
He's a shoe in for the Hall of Fame no doubt, he'll be a first ballot pick the moment he's eligable.
I'd also say he's an all-time great as well.
Boxing at the highest level if often about luck and there is every chance that if Oscar would have his career over, some of those controversial decisions would have gone his way and people would rank him up there with the likes of Pernell Whittaker and Leonard.
Imagine if the Trinidad and second Mosely fight had gone his way, he'd be probably seen as top 20 of all time.
As it is he must still surely make the top 50, probably top 40 and he's not done yet.
I'd give him every chance of beating Hatton, Cotto, Cintron, Forrest, possibly Mosely and who knows maybe even Floyd in a rematch.
Some people talk of him as if he didn't achieve anything and that's crazy. Winning belts in 6 different divisions isn't easy ::**
Agree CC very well put...
You look at his losses, and they have come agasint guys who could of beaten basicaly anyone of the greats at that weight, they may of been a slight underdog or what not, but hopkins in his prime had a good chance to beat whomever you consider to be the best middleweight of all time. SSM and tito to welter weights whom i would pick to play hell with any weleterweight and push them to their limits, with th exppetion of maybe SRR...
apart form hopkins whom everyone knew oscar was well out of his depth, his losses could of gone either way, and they were to greats, nothing wrong with that...
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Winning 6 belts in 6 weight classes is not easy but it's not as hard as it used to be either. Guys like Pernell used to fight the best to win the fight and defend it v the best.
Oscar won the title at 160 from Sturm in a fight which he should easily have lost,then he lost the title in the next fight. He won the 154 pound title from Mayorga,then lost it in his next fight. Are those achievements really those of an ATG? I don't think so. And saying IF he had won v Shane,IF he had won v Tito,is nothing but hypothetical thinking. He didnt win. We are using facts.
Like I said,and no-one has refuted me convincingly yet,when a guy is remembered more for his losses than his wins,as evidenced by some of the posts here,I don't think he should be an ATG. Should George Chvalo be high as an ATG simply because he lasted with the best HW's ever?I know it's an extreme example but you get the point.
I can see why you guys would have him as an ATG but I believe that term is flung around far far too much and is confused with Hall of Famer.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Gamo
Winning 6 belts in 6 weight classes is not easy but it's not as hard as it used to be either. Guys like Pernell used to fight the best to win the fight and defend it v the best.
Oscar won the title at 160 from Sturm in a fight which he should easily have lost,then he lost the title in the next fight. He won the 154 pound title from Mayorga,then lost it in his next fight. Are those achievements really those of an ATG? I don't think so. And saying IF he had won v Shane,IF he had won v Tito,is nothing but hypothetical thinking. He didnt win. We are using facts.
Like I said,and no-one has refuted me convincingly yet,when a guy is remembered more for his losses than his wins,as evidenced by some of the posts here,I don't think he should be an ATG. Should George Chvalo be high as an ATG simply because he lasted with the best HW's ever?I know it's an extreme example but you get the point.
I can see why you guys would have him as an ATG but I believe that term is flung around far far too much and is confused with Hall of Famer.
Well first off winning a title and then losing it in the next fight doesn't make you any less great, Ray Robinson did it 5 times.
Saying it's hypothetical how a result could have turned out is not correct. We're talking about his performance here. If the judges would have been different Oscar could have won those fights with the exact same performance.
Do you assess a fighter's performance based on the whim of a judge or do you assess his performance as he performed in the ring.
There is no doubt that for most of his fight against Tito he made him look one dimensional a and cluess, and lets remember that this was a prime Trinidad at his best weight, not the old Trinidad that Winky beat or the one who lost to the much bigger Bernard Hopkins.
If winning titles in 6 divisions is getting easier then it seems that none of the other boxers have been told as nobody has replicated his feat yet.
You can pick holes in virtually any fighters record and Oscar has beaten two of the greatest fighters of all time in Chavez and Whittaker anyhow.
I think his record is impressive.
Stopped Chavez twice
Won a UD against Whitteker
lost a SD and a MD against Mosely with most thinking he won the second fight
lost a MD against Trinidad with most thinking he won the fight
Knocked out Fernando Vargas when Vargas was still a world rated fighter
Beat Ike Quartey who is one the most underatted fighters in recent years.
Lost a split decision to the greatest fighter of the last decade in his last fight.
The only time he's ever been truly beat was against Bernhard Hopkins, a much bigger man and one of the top 3 or 4 greatest middleweights of all time.
His record is solid, he's a top 40 all time great without question, and he's still got some life in him yet.
It wouldn't suprise me at all if he were to fight and beat the winner of Cotto Mosely and then everyone will be posting on here how Oscar is truly an ATG. ;)
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
There's an interesting link here.
ESPN's top 50 boxers of all time.
Oscar is at number 39 above Mayweather, Jones Jr, Whittaker, Holyfield, Barrera, Monzon, Hopkins, Morales, Arguello and Tyson.
http://boxing.about.com/od/history/a/50_greatest.htm
I can see this list causing a shat load of controversy :o ;D
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Gamo
Winning 6 belts in 6 weight classes is not easy but it's not as hard as it used to be either. Guys like Pernell used to fight the best to win the fight and defend it v the best.
Oscar won the title at 160 from Sturm in a fight which he should easily have lost,then he lost the title in the next fight. He won the 154 pound title from Mayorga,then lost it in his next fight. Are those achievements really those of an ATG? I don't think so. And saying IF he had won v Shane,IF he had won v Tito,is nothing but hypothetical thinking. He didnt win. We are using facts.
Like I said,and no-one has refuted me convincingly yet,when a guy is remembered more for his losses than his wins,as evidenced by some of the posts here,I don't think he should be an ATG. Should George Chvalo be high as an ATG simply because he lasted with the best HW's ever?I know it's an extreme example but you get the point.
I can see why you guys would have him as an ATG but I believe that term is flung around far far too much and is confused with Hall of Famer.
Well first off winning a title and then losing it in the next fight doesn't make you any less great, Ray Robinson did it 5 times.
Saying it's hypothetical how a result could have turned out is not correct. We're talking about his performance here. If the judges would have been different Oscar could have won those fights with the
exact same performance.
Do you assess a fighter's performance based on the whim of a judge or do you assess his performance as he performed in the ring.
There is no doubt that for most of his fight against Tito he made him look one dimensional a and cluess, and lets remember that this was a prime Trinidad at his best weight, not the old Trinidad that Winky beat or the one who lost to the much bigger Bernard Hopkins.
If winning titles in 6 divisions is getting easier then it seems that none of the other boxers have been told as nobody has replicated his feat yet.
You can pick holes in virtually any fighters record and Oscar has beaten two of the greatest fighters of all time in Chavez and Whittaker anyhow.
I think his record is impressive.
Stopped Chavez twice
Won a UD against Whitteker
lost a SD and a MD against Mosely with most thinking he won the second fight
lost a MD against Trinidad with most thinking he won the fight
Knocked out Fernando Vargas when Vargas was still a world rated fighter
Beat Ike Quartey who is one the most underatted fighters in recent years.
Lost a split decision to the greatest fighter of the last decade in his last fight.
The only time he's ever been truly beat was against Bernhard Hopkins, a much bigger man and one of the top 3 or 4 greatest middleweights of all time.
His record is solid, he's a top 40 all time great without question, and he's still got some life in him yet.
It wouldn't suprise me at all if he were to fight and beat the winner of Cotto Mosely and then everyone will be posting on here how Oscar is truly an ATG. ;)
If winning titles in six weight does not make him enter to the hall of fame, I'm not sure what will make. Definitely a hall of famer, although I would not give too much credit for his victories over the declining Chavez.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Definatly a Hall of Famer.
De La Hoya was a FANTASTIC fighter. He gave a prime Tito Trinidad a boxing lesson (but was robbed). He beat Mosley in the second fight. The guy had the skills and assets of an All Time Great.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Preme
de la hoya is an ATG, HOF, tbh i didn't even think this topic was even up for debate or that anyone other than a silly hater (not calling you one) would even question it...
world champion at 6weights, fought pretty much every big name in his eara... most have him 1-1 with shane and 1-0 over tito... even if you count him as lossing all there they were by razor thin descisons... and worthy of a S*** load of respect, and as shane and tito are cert for the HOF razor thin losses to them is easily good enough to get in along with them...
You said it all Preme! I wish he had of fought Kostya!!!
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Absolutely a Hall of Famer. He should be in on the first draw unanimously. Hes been the face of boxing for well over a decade.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by caleoh12
Another topic that sufficed within boxing conversation between my friends and I is the legacy of De La Hoya. We were torn, being that half of us thought he had a monumental career and the other half felt he was slightly less than great. Personally I was in between both arguments.
Without a doubt, he did not shy away from the big fights but he also rarely pulled those fights off. His notable wins come from Julio Caesar Chavez (old by that time), Pernell Whitaker, Ike Quartey, Arturo Gatti, Fernando Vargas, and Ricardo Mayorga. I feel that Gatti and Mayorga are just names, not good fighters. His losses come from Felix Trinidad, Shane Mosley (twice), Bernard Hopkins, and Floyd Mayweather. He did well against the "B"-Class fighters, but when it came to the "cream-of-the-crop" he couldn't win.
I feel if he didn't lose focus and go grammy hunting he could've been one of the best ever. I was wondering what everyone thought of Oscar's career?
for you to debate with this topic means that you must have just started watching boxing, oscar is 6 division champ, olympic gold medalist fought all the top guys during his time, won some & lost some. I always look at his 2 most controversial losses to assess de la hoya's caliber as a fighter, he outboxed and frustrated 2 future hall of famers in trinidad and mosley(2nd fight) somehow judges wanted ultimate fighting rather than boxing that night.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
He lost to some of the finest boxers at that time and there was plenty of them. De La Hoya (for me anyway) is a hall of famer. When you get 2 elite fighters in the ring, nine times out of ten one has to lose. His losses take nothing away from his fantastic performances and a great career fighting top opposition.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Definitely hall of famer. What he is doing now should not cloud our mind with what he has done before. Title holder in 6 weight classes.... If he is not qualified in the hall of fame, then who is?
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Title: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Do I really need to answer. :D
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
Title: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Do I really need to answer. :D
Without a doubt in my mind.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Gamo
Oscar won the title at 160 from Sturm in a fight which he should easily have lost,then he lost the title in the next fight. He won the 154 pound title from Mayorga,then lost it in his next fight. Are those achievements really those of an ATG? I don't think so.
Hate to change the subject, but this sounds like a certain, horribly overrated heavyweight.............
Evander Holyfield fans, where are you??
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Hall of Famer:
1. Never dodged anyone despite the fact that his popularity allowed him to.
2. Was the first fighter to outbox and expose then undefeated P4Per Felix Trinidad. (i don't care that the judges went the other way anymore than i care that they gave Hearns a draw in the 2nd leonard fight)
3. Great comeback victory against then undefeated P4Per ike quartey
4. Excellent performace in Mosley II (as i mentioned, i don't take decisions as gospel)
5. convincingly defeated chavez, Miguel Angel Gonzalez, Jesse James Leija, Genaro Hernandez, Rafael Ruelas, John John Molina, Jorge Paez, Ricardo Mayorga, Fernando Vargas, Arturo Gatti...all top flight fighters
Only Hopkins KO'd him. Mosely and Whitiaker (arguably) narrowly outboxed him and Mayweather schooled hm at the end. But that's not enough to keep him out.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
DLH is without a doubt going to the hall of fame...might as well say he is already in but they are just waiting for him to actually retire....
DLH like him or hate him is boxings only 6 division champion....He has garnered a reputation for insisting to fight only the best there is....I can not think of the last time he has fought an easy or tune up bout....
His last 7 fights were against PBF, Hopkins, Sturm, Vargas, Campas, Mosley and Castillejo.....I have seen fighters get in the HOF with less then that on their resume...add the fights against Trinidad, Pernell, Quartey, Carr, Camacho, Rueles, Molina, Leija, Paez, Brehal, and Chavez weather they were all in their prime or not is not just impressive it is going to be a long long long time before we see someone with that many quality names on their resume....Win or lose....He has also never lost to anyone other then a future HOF bound fighter...not many can say that
Not to mention the fact that when boxing was down and when we were in need of that superstar name to keep it in the mainstream Oscar was the man....
Then there is GBP that is right now the hottest promotion company in the sport.........
DLH is not only going to the Hall he is also one of our P4P of all time.....and he still has more left to offer....not too many more fights but he still has some....
He may before all is over be entered in not only as a fighter but in the non participant catagory for GBP if it continues to thrive like it has
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by caleoh12
Another topic that sufficed within boxing conversation between my friends and I is the legacy of De La Hoya. We were torn, being that half of us thought he had a monumental career and the other half felt he was slightly less than great. Personally I was in between both arguments.
Without a doubt, he did not shy away from the big fights but he also rarely pulled those fights off. His notable wins come from Julio Caesar Chavez (old by that time), Pernell Whitaker, Ike Quartey, Arturo Gatti, Fernando Vargas, and Ricardo Mayorga. I feel that Gatti and Mayorga are just names, not good fighters. His losses come from Felix Trinidad, Shane Mosley (twice), Bernard Hopkins, and Floyd Mayweather. He did well against the "B"-Class fighters, but when it came to the "cream-of-the-crop" he couldn't win.
I feel if he didn't lose focus and go grammy hunting he could've been one of the best ever. I was wondering what everyone thought of Oscar's career?
I'm going to make this simple for you and your friends. Obviously you guys are judging him on his recent years and not judging him on his whole career.
A guy with 1 gold medal, 10 different titles in 6 weight divisions. That is an automatic bid. He defeated many fighters who were in their prime or were at the top of the divisions. He Ko'd Rafael Ruelas(43-1) in round 2. TKO'd Genaro Hernandez (32-0) in 6. Defeated Julio Ceasar Chavez(34 yrs old at the time with a record of 96-1-1) the first time by TKO in the 4th. Also forgetting about wins over Hector Macho Camacho(63-3-1) and Miguel Angel Gonzalez (41-0).
With all do respect to your topic, this shouldn't even be a debate. He beat Tito Trinidad and me being Puerto Rican I admit. He beat Mosley in the 2nd fight.
I have a question for you? Do you think Mike Tyson should be a HOF despite his 2 losses with Holyfield, loss to Lewis,upset loss to Douglas and his other 2 losses? I think Tyson is an automatic bid, but according to what you guys are saying he too has only beaten "B" class fighters. What about Roy Jones Jr? are you guys going to question his HOF? There are plenty more guys I could think of, I'm just giving you these as an example. This is why this topic should not be debated and if you truly know much about boxing, DLH & HOF should be unanimous.
I'd hate to see the list most of your friends would come up with for who they think are Hall of Famers....... ???
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by caleoh12
Another topic that sufficed within boxing conversation between my friends and I is the legacy of De La Hoya. We were torn, being that half of us thought he had a monumental career and the other half felt he was slightly less than great. Personally I was in between both arguments.
Without a doubt, he did not shy away from the big fights but he also rarely pulled those fights off. His notable wins come from Julio Caesar Chavez (old by that time), Pernell Whitaker, Ike Quartey, Arturo Gatti, Fernando Vargas, and Ricardo Mayorga. I feel that Gatti and Mayorga are just names, not good fighters. His losses come from Felix Trinidad, Shane Mosley (twice), Bernard Hopkins, and Floyd Mayweather. He did well against the "B"-Class fighters, but when it came to the "cream-of-the-crop" he couldn't win.
I feel if he didn't lose focus and go grammy hunting he could've been one of the best ever. I was wondering what everyone thought of Oscar's career?
6 weight world champion. The only fighter he should have fought and hasn't is Winky Wright. Oscar has given more to our sport than we could have asked for, and now he's turned promoter and has put on some of the best fights this year. Without any doubt in my mind, Oscar will take his rightful place in the hall of fame someday. When was the last time he had a meaningless fight against a no name?
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
For whatever he has done outside of boxing,those are not sufficient to not consider him in the Hall of Fame. De La Hoya has a secured place in the Hall of Fame.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
With all the publicity he's done and the amount of people he has drawn to the sport he's undoubtedly the most positively influential figure in boxing in well over 20 years.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eli_jr24
Quote:
Originally Posted by caleoh12
Another topic that sufficed within boxing conversation between my friends and I is the legacy of De La Hoya. We were torn, being that half of us thought he had a monumental career and the other half felt he was slightly less than great. Personally I was in between both arguments.
Without a doubt, he did not shy away from the big fights but he also rarely pulled those fights off. His notable wins come from Julio Caesar Chavez (old by that time), Pernell Whitaker, Ike Quartey, Arturo Gatti, Fernando Vargas, and Ricardo Mayorga. I feel that Gatti and Mayorga are just names, not good fighters. His losses come from Felix Trinidad, Shane Mosley (twice), Bernard Hopkins, and Floyd Mayweather. He did well against the "B"-Class fighters, but when it came to the "cream-of-the-crop" he couldn't win.
I feel if he didn't lose focus and go grammy hunting he could've been one of the best ever. I was wondering what everyone thought of Oscar's career?
I'm going to make this simple for you and your friends. Obviously you guys are judging him on his recent years and not judging him on his whole career.
A guy with
1 gold medal, 10 different titles in 6 weight divisions.
That is an automatic bid. He defeated many fighters who were in their prime or were at the top of the divisions.
He Ko'd Rafael Ruelas(43-1) in round 2. TKO'd Genaro Hernandez (32-0) in 6. Defeated Julio Ceasar Chavez(34 yrs old at the time with a record of 96-1-1) the first time by TKO in the 4th. Also forgetting about wins over
Hector Macho Camacho(63-3-1) and
Miguel Angel Gonzalez (41-0).
With all do respect to your topic, this shouldn't even be a debate. He beat
Tito Trinidad and me being Puerto Rican I admit. He beat
Mosley in the 2nd fight.
I have a question for you? Do you think Mike Tyson should be a HOF despite his 2 losses with Holyfield, loss to Lewis,upset loss to Douglas and his other 2 losses? I think Tyson is an automatic bid, but according to what you guys are saying he too has only beaten "B" class fighters. What about Roy Jones Jr? are you guys going to question his HOF? There are plenty more guys I could think of, I'm just giving you these as an example.
This is why this topic should not be debated and if you truly know much about boxing, DLH & HOF should be unanimous.
I'd hate to see the list most of your friends would come up with for who they think are Hall of Famers....... ???
:coolclick: #18 Eli. That post ruins any opposing argument for me.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
good thread but as soon as I saw the title I thought ?!?!??
It's like having one saying 'Does a bear shit in the woods ?'
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark TKO
good thread but as soon as I saw the title I thought ?!?!??
It's like having one saying 'Does a bear S*** in the woods ?'
Well...it depends. If the bear lives at the zoo, then I doubt they let him out to S*** in the woods. However, a wild bear might S*** in the woods. I think the only way to get a true reflection of the ratio of bears that S*** in the woods to bears that don't, is to compile a questionnaire/survey to send out to all bears asking them where they prefer to S***. Then you get it from the horses...I mean bear's mouth.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaxxKahn
DLH is without a doubt going to the hall of fame...might as well say he is already in but they are just waiting for him to actually retire....
DLH like him or hate him is boxings only 6 division champion....He has garnered a reputation for insisting to fight only the best there is....I can not think of the last time he has fought an easy or tune up bout....
His last 7 fights were against PBF, Hopkins, Sturm, Vargas, Campas, Mosley and Castillejo.....I have seen fighters get in the HOF with less then that on their resume...add the fights against Trinidad, Pernell, Quartey, Carr, Camacho, Rueles, Molina, Leija, Paez, Brehal, and Chavez weather they were all in their prime or not is not just impressive it is going to be a long long long time before we see someone with that many quality names on their resume....Win or lose....He has also never lost to anyone other then a future HOF bound fighter...not many can say that
Not to mention the fact that when boxing was down and when we were in need of that superstar name to keep it in the mainstream Oscar was the man....
Then there is GBP that is right now the hottest promotion company in the sport.........
DLH is not only going to the Hall he is also one of our P4P of all time.....and he still has more left to offer....not too many more fights but he still has some....
He may before all is over be entered in not only as a fighter but in the non participant catagory for GBP if it continues to thrive like it has
I was about to say that myself. At this rate he will most likely enter the HoF as a promoter as well as a fighter.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Oscar's induction into the HoF is non debatable.
But on a side note. I see the word robbery being terribly overused. All his losses, with the exception of Hopkins, and some of those wins were very very close fights. I would call none of them robberies. His reccord as is is still great and there is no need to try and make more or less of it. He is a great fighter.
Mosley was at the time what Maywether is now. Simply the fastest fighter in the sport, with good power and great skills.
Trinidad was arguably the best WW of his era and possibly top 10 WW of all time with devastating power in both hands.
Quartay was also undefeated with the best jab in the game and a powerful left hook to go with it.
Whitaker was NOT way past his prime like some people insist. He had been WW champion for 4 years and only lossed once in a very controversial fassion.
Hopkins is most likely a top 5 MW of all time.
Sturm, say what you want about him but he is still today a MW title holder and DLH has no business to be in 160 anyway.
Maywether is universally considered the #1 P4P fighter in the world.
To tell you the trueth. If he had lossed to all of them, he might still be considered a hall of famer.
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by bzkfn
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark TKO
good thread but as soon as I saw the title I thought ?!?!??
It's like having one saying 'Does a bear S*** in the woods ?'
Well...it depends. If the bear lives at the zoo, then I doubt they let him out to S*** in the woods. However, a wild bear might S*** in the woods. I think the only way to get a true reflection of the ratio of bears that S*** in the woods to bears that don't, is to compile a questionnaire/survey to send out to all bears asking them where they prefer to S***. Then you get it from the horses...I mean bear's mouth.
Ok 'Is the Pope Catholic ?' then
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark TKO
Quote:
Originally Posted by bzkfn
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark TKO
good thread but as soon as I saw the title I thought ?!?!??
It's like having one saying 'Does a bear S*** in the woods ?'
Well...it depends. If the bear lives at the zoo, then I doubt they let him out to S*** in the woods. However, a wild bear might S*** in the woods. I think the only way to get a true reflection of the ratio of bears that S*** in the woods to bears that don't, is to compile a questionnaire/survey to send out to all bears asking them where they prefer to S***. Then you get it from the horses...I mean bear's mouth.
Ok 'Is the Pope Catholic ?' then
Maybe, he could be lying to get on worldwide tv news though ;D
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Re: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
Title: De La Hoya, future hall of famer?
Do I really need to answer. :D
cc mick
there no explanation
