Where does Margrito stand in the welterwieght divison

I dont know much about him i only started watching him a few years ago but what i like to know is were he stands in the mix or the welter weight divison, He has some good wins on Cintron and Clotty but after his lose to Williams i heard alot of people say his done and he was just a jouryman any how but i dont feel quiet that way i dont think he was total dominated i had it a bit closer but he still lost to williams but he still has thos good wins and if he managed to pull off an upset and beat paul maybe he has a good chance for making a legacy but who know just some thoughts

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Originally Posted by Mr140

I dont know much about him i only started watching him a few years ago but what i like to know is were he stands in the mix or the welter weight divison, He has some good wins on Cintron and Clotty but after his lose to Williams i heard alot of people say his done and he was just a jouryman any how but i dont feel quiet that way i dont think he was total dominated i had it a bit closer but he still lost to williams but he still has thos good wins and if he managed to pull off an upset and beat paul maybe he has a good chance for making a legacy but who know just some thoughts

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I Believe Margarito Can/will come back with a vengence.welter.div. is unbelievably stacked with top fighters.I think williams bout was closer than most but williams def. won.I'd like to see him rematch williams as I think paul Is there to be taken out no doubt.Theres talk of cintron rematch and I think It would end the same way,but late and cintron would be mentally prepared this time but margarito has him figured.
He'll have to come back in opponent role Or like before he'll be avoided by most.The risk/reward ratio is not worth it to them.Hopefully he gets some one who thinks "he's old,he's slow",and he's on the other side of the hill. Big mistake!

He is behind Cotto, Cintron (under Manny he is becoming the real deal), Williams, Mosely, and of course PBF wherever he happens to fight.

how is he under cintron when he destroyed them las time thy fought just to ask because that seems wierd to me

I think he is under pbf, cotto, shane, paul and hatton and is above clotty and cintron

I think Margarito can still make noises in the WW division. I think he needs to quickly get in with Clottey, Cintron, Judah, or someone who like himself is not at the top echelon of the division at the moment and give them a good beating. Otherwise his marketabilty will go down and he may quickly become just an opponent...

Maybe if he can't get a rematch with paul maybe he might try to fight clotty again that was a close fight

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Originally Posted by Mr140

how is he under cintron when he destroyed them las time thy fought just to ask because that seems wierd to me

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Because Cintron is developing into a top tier fighter, while Margarito isn't improving...or not at near the level that Kermit is. Manny baby. If they fought again I don't think you would have Marg. beating him.

Seems that egal had the idea before i could post but he might still be a marketable in california but that is were he is from not sure how he do any were else i not sure how popular he is i think either you like him or you dont there not much more then that

Besides, even if he couldn't beat Margarito EVER, that doesn't say necessarily that Margarito is higher than Cintron in the large picture of the welterwieght division. As we all know, styles make fights, and some fighters just have other fighters numbers (but it doesnt mean they are better all around or should be ranked higher).

Styles make fights and i think margarito has kermit number but who knows we will just have to wait and see what happens

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Originally Posted by boozeboxer

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Originally Posted by Mr140

how is he under cintron when he destroyed them las time thy fought just to ask because that seems wierd to me

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Because Cintron is developing into a top tier fighter, while Margarito isn't improving...or not at near the level that Kermit is. Manny baby. If they fought again I don't think you would have Marg. beating him.

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Im not completely sold on Cintron yet. I know he has looked impressive lately, and has improved but Margarito absolutely fucked him up last time they fought. Also Marg only lost too a monster in Williams and it wasn't a beat down by any means.
Just cos Cintron beat Parra Estrada Suarez and Matthysse dont mean he is top tier.
I think a rematch would be closer than the first but i think Tony could still win.

Still think margrito has better wins then cintron to i mean if he beats clotty and then avenge his only lose then i think he will be above

To be honest, both of them are behind Williams, Mosely, Cotto, and PBF.

His fastest way to climb the rankings is to fight Judah. He would KO Judah in a few rounds imo and would be right back in the mix. It wont happen though so maybe he should fight Cintron again to remind people why he was a champion.

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Originally Posted by BoomBoom

His fastest way to climb the rankings is to fight Judah. He would KO Judah in a few rounds imo and would be right back in the mix. It wont happen though so maybe he should fight Cintron again to remind people why he was a champion.

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Yeah Judah would be the guy to fight but Zab wont fight Margarito.

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Originally Posted by eagle

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Originally Posted by BoomBoom

His fastest way to climb the rankings is to fight Judah. He would KO Judah in a few rounds imo and would be right back in the mix. It wont happen though so maybe he should fight Cintron again to remind people why he was a champion.

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Yeah Judah would be the guy to fight but Zab wont fight Margarito.

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Yeah I doubt it..but than again Zab aint afraid of taking a dangerous fight so maybe hell surprise us.

Tony Will Tko Cintron Late.He will def. have to come back as opponent and cause someone to relize there major mistake.clottey losses again,waywither,mosley beat tony now,williams Losses Imo.I dont think kleenex kermit is all that improved.Margarito has his # .

Margarito is easily still top 5,he holds wins over 7 RING top 10 ranked opponents and has beaten Cintron and Clottey who are both easily top 10. And he is facing Williams early in next year in a rematch ;D Remember where you heard it first ;) ;) Although I'm HUGELY annoyed he is not more active,it's his biggest weakness. He should try and fght this year v Judah or another gatekeeper.

This is how I see the Welters right now.

Cotto
SSM
Williams
Margarito
Cintron

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Originally Posted by El Gamo

Margarito is easily still top 5,he holds wins over 7 RING top 10 ranked opponents and has beaten Cintron and Clottey who are both easily top 10. And he is facing Williams early in next year in a rematch ;D Remember where you heard it first ;) ;) Although I'm HUGELY annoyed he is not more active,it's his biggest weakness. He should try and fght this year v Judah or another gatekeeper.

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Valid points Game

Thank you for the info on the rematch with Margarito and Williams that should be a very good match to watch

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Originally Posted by boozeboxer

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Originally Posted by El Gamo

Margarito is easily still top 5,he holds wins over 7 RING top 10 ranked opponents and has beaten Cintron and Clottey who are both easily top 10. And he is facing Williams early in next year in a rematch ;D Remember where you heard it first ;) ;) Although I'm HUGELY annoyed he is not more active,it's his biggest weakness. He should try and fght this year v Judah or another gatekeeper.

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Valid points Game

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Thanks bro :D :D

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Originally Posted by Mr140

Thank you for the info on the rematch with Margarito and Williams that should be a very good match to watch

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Always a pleasure :) I'm glad to see topics on Margarito,the guy is still a dangerman AND is pretty well known if you ask me.

Im not trying to cause offence here, i like Tony honestly i do, but in this era of great welters Antonio is second tier.
He's a good fighter, he's got a lotta power and for an opponent to take him lightly would be a mistake, but he's not a Terminator. A guy of his size at welterweight should equate to a guy who can sharply end fights, not grind out wins. I no he's got a lot of stoppages but they were mainly attritional or rough house Ko's. (Again im not tryin to offfend!)

So it becomes apparent that he is good but not great. Therein lies his problem, he is active in an era where there are a number of fighters who can potentially achieve greatness. Fighters such as PBF, Cotto, Mosely and even Williams, these popular talented fighters will overshadow Margarito and he will be forgotten in the wake of their legacies.

Furthermore, it have been scrutinising for some time as to why Tony stays at Welter. Surely bigger money is accessible at Light Middle, what with the publics natural attraction to bigger fighters and the somewhat easier climb to the top. (Since Winky vacated the building n Oscar is inactive LM also needs a top fighter.) And Tony because of his height n size should surely be able for 154??????

Well...My hypothesis is that Margarito and his camp feel that he does not have sufficient POWER to be KO the campaigners at 154 nor does he have the adequate boxing skills to compensate for this lack of power.
Think of Kassim Ouma, Corey Spinks...they took JT's punches, u think they couldn't take Antonio Margarito's?

Once agin, i'm not tryin to disrespect any of Margarito's loyal followers or Him either, thats jus my opinion.

That loss to Williams did him a lot of damage IMO. None of the top fighters will bother with him unless he wins the rematch. Cotto, Mosely, Mayweather and Hatton (not strictly a welterweight I know) are way above him.

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Originally Posted by Hughesd

That loss to Williams did him a lot of damage IMO. None of the top fighters will bother with him unless he wins the rematch. Cotto, Mosely, Mayweather and Hatton (not strictly a welterweight I know) are way above him.

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If you're saying Hatton is above Margarito'your points have lost all significance.

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

Im not trying to cause offence here, i like Tony honestly i do, but in this era of great welters Antonio is second tier.
He's a good fighter, he's got a lotta power and for an opponent to take him lightly would be a mistake, but he's not a Terminator. A guy of his size at welterweight should equate to a guy who can sharply end fights, not grind out wins. I no he's got a lot of stoppages but they were mainly attritional or rough house Ko's. (Again im not tryin to offfend!)

So it becomes apparent that he is good but not great. Therein lies his problem, he is active in an era where there are a number of fighters who can potentially achieve greatness. Fighters such as PBF, Cotto, Mosely and even Williams, these popular talented fighters will overshadow Margarito and he will be forgotten in the wake of their legacies.

Furthermore, it have been scrutinising for some time as to why Tony stays at Welter. Surely bigger money is accessible at Light Middle, what with the publics natural attraction to bigger fighters and the somewhat easier climb to the top. (Since Winky vacated the building n Oscar is inactive LM also needs a top fighter.) And Tony because of his height n size should surely be able for 154??????

Well...My hypothesis is that Margarito and his camp feel that he does not have sufficient POWER to be KO the campaigners at 154 nor does he have the adequate boxing skills to compensate for this lack of power.
Think of Kassim Ouma, Corey Spinks...they took JT's punches, u think they couldn't take Antonio Margarito's?

Once agin, i'm not tryin to disrespect any of Margarito's loyal followers or Him either, thats jus my opinion.

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You can have your opinion but the going to 154 is a silly point.A really silly point. First all the big fights are at 147 and second what is he going to do at 154 when the better fighter are at 147?

Also,he earned his biggest payday thus far v Williams($1.25million if I remember correctly) and has become a draw of sorts where he fights.

Finally,what relevance does Ouma taking JT's punches have to do with anything? Ouma was stopped by Karmazin? Spinks was KTFO by Zab, a blown up 140 pounder? I'm not seeing the relevance.

And at first I thought it would be hard for him to find fights BUT hypothetically speaking,IF Cotto loses to Mosley,you can guarantee a Cotto-Margarito fight will happen at some point. If not,he can rematch Cintron,Judah etc. I really really really don't see why the heck he would or should move to 154.

No offence.

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Originally Posted by El Gamo

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Originally Posted by Hughesd

That loss to Williams did him a lot of damage IMO. None of the top fighters will bother with him unless he wins the rematch. Cotto, Mosely, Mayweather and Hatton (not strictly a welterweight I know) are way above him.

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If you're saying Hatton is above Margarito'your points have lost all significance.

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

Im not trying to cause offence here, i like Tony honestly i do, but in this era of great welters Antonio is second tier.
He's a good fighter, he's got a lotta power and for an opponent to take him lightly would be a mistake, but he's not a Terminator. A guy of his size at welterweight should equate to a guy who can sharply end fights, not grind out wins. I no he's got a lot of stoppages but they were mainly attritional or rough house Ko's. (Again im not tryin to offfend!)

So it becomes apparent that he is good but not great. Therein lies his problem, he is active in an era where there are a number of fighters who can potentially achieve greatness. Fighters such as PBF, Cotto, Mosely and even Williams, these popular talented fighters will overshadow Margarito and he will be forgotten in the wake of their legacies.

Furthermore, it have been scrutinising for some time as to why Tony stays at Welter. Surely bigger money is accessible at Light Middle, what with the publics natural attraction to bigger fighters and the somewhat easier climb to the top. (Since Winky vacated the building n Oscar is inactive LM also needs a top fighter.) And Tony because of his height n size should surely be able for 154??????

Well...My hypothesis is that Margarito and his camp feel that he does not have sufficient POWER to be KO the campaigners at 154 nor does he have the adequate boxing skills to compensate for this lack of power.
Think of Kassim Ouma, Corey Spinks...they took JT's punches, u think they couldn't take Antonio Margarito's?

Once agin, i'm not tryin to disrespect any of Margarito's loyal followers or Him either, thats jus my opinion.

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You can have your opinion but the going to 154 is a silly point.A really silly point. First all the big fights are at 147 and second what is he going to do at 154 when the better fighter are at 147?

Also,he earned his biggest payday thus far v Williams($1.25million if I remember correctly) and has become a draw of sorts where he fights.

Finally,what relevance does Ouma taking JT's punches have to do with anything? Ouma was stopped by Karmazin? Spinks was KTFO by Zab, a blown up 140 pounder? I'm not seeing the relevance.

And at first I thought it would be hard for him to find fights BUT hypothetically speaking,IF Cotto loses to Mosley,you can guarantee a Cotto-Margarito fight will happen at some point. If not,he can rematch Cintron,Judah etc. I really really really don't see why the heck he would or should move to 154.

No offence.

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I meant Hatton is more of a draw than Margerito. Hatton is the one fighting Mayweather in a blockbuster fight while Tony will be sitting at home.

What i was referring to was the fact that Margarito at this stage of his career will never reach the upper echelon of the welterweight division again. The WW's is a hotbed of talent right now and there are plenty of those fighters capable of easily beating margarito. Yes he could make money but he would be making money getting beaten.

This would suggest that a move of division would be a good idea. And as there is no way in hell 5'10'' margarito is gonna make light welter Lm is the natural move. However, a move to LM.

The reason Kassim ouma and Corey spinks were mentioned in my post is because they are commonly viewed as LM's no???? (Actually Spinks seems to be ranked in a few divisions at the moment!) These guys took a middleweights punches, Margarito hits them, they're not gonna get knocked out, Margarito can't hurt you then he's not likely to win as it doesn't take a boxing analyst to dewtermine Tony doesn't have the greatest skills in prizefighting. I was speaking hypothetically, under the context that Margarito were active in the LM's

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

What i was referring to was the fact that Margarito at this stage of his career will never reach the upper echelon of the welterweight division again. The WW's is a hotbed of talent right now and there are plenty of those fighters capable of easily beating margarito. Yes he could make money but he would be making money getting beaten.

This would suggest that a move of division would be a good idea. And as there is no way in hell 5'10'' margarito is gonna make light welter Lm is the natural move. However, a move to LM.

The reason Kassim ouma and Corey spinks were mentioned in my post is because they are commonly viewed as LM's no???? (Actually Spinks seems to be ranked in a few divisions at the moment!) These guys took a middleweights punches, Margarito hits them, they're not gonna get knocked out, Margarito can't hurt you then he's not likely to win as it doesn't take a boxing analyst to dewtermine Tony doesn't have the greatest skills in prizefighting. I was speaking hypothetically, under the context that Margarito were active in the LM's

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I'm not dealing with hypothetical situations here firstly and secondly,Margarito not beating the elite is your opinion. He has the style to beat Williams,and to give my other boy Cotto nightmares.He would beat Zab and would probably beat Kermit in a rematch. Mayweather is the only one I'd choose as a HOT favourite over Margarito. I question the amount of Margarito fights you've seen.

He's already beaten Cintron and Clottey who are top 10. He has the style to give anyone nightmares(tall,strong,superbly tough,powerful with great stamina). Like I said,I have zero idea where you are going with this.

Hell i think Margarito has a good chance against Cotto because i don't think Cotto can knock Margarito out and Margarito i think can knock him out so i think he could beat Cotto and also beat Hatton Williams i would count margarito out but i think Mosley and Mayweather would win over him

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Originally Posted by El Gamo

Margarito is easily still top 5,

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I have a hard time not putting PBF, Cotto, Mosley and Williams ahead of him (in that order, although Mosley/Cotto are just about equal). So if Margarito is 'easily top 5', he is also number 5 at best. Just to put things into perspective...

I probably agree he is no5 though, but Cintron, Clottey and indeed Hatton are all closing in on him.

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Originally Posted by Mikkel_K

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Originally Posted by El Gamo

Margarito is easily still top 5,

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I have a hard time not putting PBF, Cotto, Mosley and Williams ahead of him (in that order, although Mosley/Cotto are just about equal). So if Margarito is 'easily top 5', he is also number 5 at best. Just to put things into perspective...

I probably agree he is no5 though, but Cintron, Clottey and indeed Hatton are all closing in on him.

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Regardless of where in the top5,he's top 5. And how can Hatton be closing in on him? Cintron needs much much better wins and ditto Clottey. Let's not get over excited,Cintron has beaten a few C level fighters,same for Clottey(although Gutirrez could be B level) and Hatton has 1 win at 147?!

Well hell cotto best win is over Zab Juhda but if he bets mosely i think he will be the number 1 at welter for me

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Originally Posted by El Gamo

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

What i was referring to was the fact that Margarito at this stage of his career will never reach the upper echelon of the welterweight division again. The WW's is a hotbed of talent right now and there are plenty of those fighters capable of easily beating margarito. Yes he could make money but he would be making money getting beaten.

This would suggest that a move of division would be a good idea. And as there is no way in hell 5'10'' margarito is gonna make light welter Lm is the natural move. However, a move to LM.

The reason Kassim ouma and Corey spinks were mentioned in my post is because they are commonly viewed as LM's no???? (Actually Spinks seems to be ranked in a few divisions at the moment!) These guys took a middleweights punches, Margarito hits them, they're not gonna get knocked out, Margarito can't hurt you then he's not likely to win as it doesn't take a boxing analyst to dewtermine Tony doesn't have the greatest skills in prizefighting. I was speaking hypothetically, under the context that Margarito were active in the LM's

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I'm not dealing with hypothetical situations here firstly and secondly,Margarito not beating the elite is your opinion. He has the style to beat Williams,and to give my other boy Cotto nightmares.He would beat Zab and would probably beat Kermit in a rematch. Mayweather is the only one I'd choose as a HOT favourite over Margarito. I question the amount of Margarito fights you've seen.

He's already beaten Cintron and Clottey who are top 10. He has the style to give anyone nightmares(tall,strong,superbly tough,powerful with great stamina). Like I said,I have zero idea where you are going with this.

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Your'e not dealing with hypothetical yet you speak of all these potential fights ???
Iv actually seen nearly all of his fights and have gone to quite a few, altho i haven't been to any in the past two years. He has the style to beat Williams yet Williams beat him last time out? ???
I'm not going anywhere with anything, i made my point you disagree, yet to be honest the only point u validly made in ur disagreement was that he had beaten Clottey. Honestly El Gamo, I respect that ur a fan opf his and i applaud you for standing up for him, but i think ur being more than a little clouded here.

Well hitman if margrito beat cotto would you still feel that he is not talented i mean the only ones ahead of him are pbf cotto mosely and williams i think he can come back and have a good chance of beating william then he is closing in on the number one stop he just needs to beat cotto and williams

Absolutley. Even if he returned to beat Williams id give him serious respect. However, my sentiment is that Margaritos repuatation, his record, his career they have all been built on the foundation of being naturally bigger, stronger and rougher than his opposition rather than having any actual advantage in skills over the opponent.
Now in a sense i respect that, i mean my favourite fighters include JCC, Ricky Hatton, Gerald McClellan and Roberto Duran, guys famous for out muscling their opposition, but my issue is that when Antonio Margarito was faced with a fighter big enough to nullify his size advantage (Williams,) even tho he was more expierienced, even tho he was favourite and champion he failed. To me this illustrated Margaritos Lack of technical background and highlighted his reliance on his size advantage.

Now should he beat the fighters you have named i would greatly respect him, but as El Gamo stated earlier i'm not allowed speak hypothetically so il believe it when ni see it i guess.

Finally i never said Tony was a bad fighter, i simply said he was second tier, behind boxing's superstars at the moment.

So who do you think would win in a fight cotto or margarito who you think would win

I could see Margarito at #4 or 5 or even 6 and see valid arguments being made, what I don't understand is why he doesn't move up to 154, he has the build to be stronger there, and there isn't nearly the competition at 147.

I mean really who's left at 154?

Cory Spinks
Vernon Forrest
Joel Julio
Carlos Baldomir
Jamie Moore
Sechew Powell

He would have a great chance of beating most of those guys easily.
I've never seen him fight against a slick boxer, so I don't know how
he would do against Spinks.
Forrest wouldn't be able to bring it.
Against Julio it would be a repeat of his fight against Cintron.
Against Baldomir, his courage and durability wouldn't match up to Margarito's activity
Against Moore again the volume would be too much.
Sechew Powell would be an entertaining fight, but Margarito should be able to take it quick.

Think his thought pattern is better money and better legacy if he stays at welters and beats the competion at welter

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Originally Posted by killersheep

I could see Margarito at #4 or 5 or even 6 and see valid arguments being made, what I don't understand is why he doesn't move up to 154, he has the build to be stronger there, and there isn't nearly the competition at 147.

I mean really who's left at 154?

Cory Spinks
Vernon Forrest
Joel Julio
Carlos Baldomir
Jamie Moore
Sechew Powell

He would have a great chance of beating most of those guys easily.
I've never seen him fight against a slick boxer, so I don't know how
he would do against Spinks.

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If Margarito fought Spinks, Spinks would win a 12 round unaminous decision without being hit once in the whole fight.