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Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
www.youtube.com/v/TZHIo5ylQA8&rel=1
It was always a toss up between him and Carlos but I think this highlight finally made up my mind...Sure most of you seen this one already...
(The cable company finally fixed the pole by my house and I have my DSL back so been a bit you tube crazy today)
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Great fighter but his best wins come against fighters moving up in weight i think Monzon may slighty edge it.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
'La Escopeta' by a nice margin takes it for me.
Marvin was great no doubt but what eerks me is that he walked away from the sport when he still had at least 2 maybe 3 more years in him. A loss is a loss and you take it for that, if he really felt he beat SRL then he should have took it that way and just came back and fought on. Instead he went into suclusion and disappeared from the sport. I just feel he could have went on to become even greater.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
'La Escopeta' by a nice margin takes it for me.
Marvin was great no doubt but what eerks me is that he walked away from the sport when he still had at least 2 maybe 3 more years in him. A loss is a loss and you take it for that, if he really felt he beat SRL then he should have took it that way and just came back and fought on. Instead he went into suclusion and disappeared from the sport. I just feel he could have went on to become even greater.
Totally agree his victory over Nino Benvenuti when no one expected him to win was damn impressive and it was even more impressive what he done in rematch and what is so strange is that he had worst life style possible 5 packs of cigarettes a day he would be running with a cigarette in his mouth plus all the drinking he used to do they called him iron lung didn't they ??
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
'La Escopeta' by a nice margin takes it for me.
Marvin was great no doubt but what eerks me is that he walked away from the sport when he still had at least 2 maybe 3 more years in him. A loss is a loss and you take it for that, if he really felt he beat SRL then he should have took it that way and just came back and fought on. Instead he went into suclusion and disappeared from the sport. I just feel he could have went on to become even greater.
I still dont see the controversy in that fight. It was close and really most any result would have been acceptable. I thought Hagler may have won by a round but it certainly was no robbery. I think Hagler was winding down anyway and although it was a terrible was for a champion to go out, I think he may have gotten tired of fighting by that point in his life and it was a tremendous career so I guess he earned the right to end it how he wanted....either way Monzon was the greatest Middleweight of all time.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
I prefer Hagler over Monzon, mainly because my lack of knowledge of Monzon, I will admit. The retiring part, wasnt punking out to me, it was just his way of saying nobody screws me over and gets away with it. He had his money already and he was mainly fighting for his pride and legacy, which IMO was tarnished because of a close but wrong decision. had he won that fight people wouldnt be arguing about Monzon, it would be Hagler hands down. I am asuming we arent ranking SRR? I have it SRR Hagler then Monzon if thats the case.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoomBoom
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
'La Escopeta' by a nice margin takes it for me.
Marvin was great no doubt but what eerks me is that he walked away from the sport when he still had at least 2 maybe 3 more years in him. A loss is a loss and you take it for that, if he really felt he beat SRL then he should have took it that way and just came back and fought on. Instead he went into suclusion and disappeared from the sport. I just feel he could have went on to become even greater.
I still dont see the controversy in that fight. It was close and really most any result would have been acceptable. I thought Hagler may have won by a round but it certainly was no robbery. I think Hagler was winding down anyway and although it was a terrible was for a champion to go out, I think he may have gotten tired of fighting by that point in his life and it was a tremendous career so I guess he earned the right to end it how he wanted....either way Monzon was the greatest Middleweight of all time.
I agree on the fight aspect that you typed. But I disagree on the career decision, I say this because I've seen Hagler interviews and have read how he is. Hes bitter to this day about the SRL, I'm not saying that's bad. But I can only imagine would he have went on to continue fighting he could have fought on and just made the SRL fight another page in his career. Instead he decided that the final chapter would be that loss. Now he dislikes events he rarely smiles and hes secluded himself so far off. I know boxing isn't always fair but I think Marvin could have gone out with a big bang.
And yet after saying all of that, Marvins still an all time great and P4P.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoomBoom
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
'La Escopeta' by a nice margin takes it for me.
Marvin was great no doubt but what eerks me is that he walked away from the sport when he still had at least 2 maybe 3 more years in him. A loss is a loss and you take it for that, if he really felt he beat SRL then he should have took it that way and just came back and fought on. Instead he went into suclusion and disappeared from the sport. I just feel he could have went on to become even greater.
I still dont see the controversy in that fight. It was close and really most any result would have been acceptable. I thought Hagler may have won by a round but it certainly was no robbery. I think Hagler was winding down anyway and although it was a terrible was for a champion to go out, I think he may have gotten tired of fighting by that point in his life and it was a tremendous career so I guess he earned the right to end it how he wanted....either way Monzon was the greatest Middleweight of all time.
I agree on the fight aspect that you typed. But I disagree on the career decision, I say this because I've seen Hagler interviews and have read how he is. Hes bitter to this day about the SRL, I'm not saying that's bad. But I can only imagine would he have went on to continue fighting he could have fought on and just made the SRL fight another page in his career. Instead he decided that the final chapter would be that loss. Now he dislikes events he rarely smiles and hes secluded himself so far off. I know boxing isn't always fair but I think Marvin could have gone out with a big bang.
And yet after saying all of that, Marvins still an all time great and P4P.
If Hagler was as bitter as that and was still as angry he should of took his frustration out on Leonard in a rematch ;)
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by No Contest
I prefer Hagler over Monzon, mainly because my lack of knowledge of Monzon, I will admit. The retiring part, wasnt punking out to me, it was just his way of saying nobody screws me over and gets away with it. He had his money already and he was mainly fighting for his pride and legacy, which IMO was tarnished because of a close but wrong decision. had he won that fight people wouldnt be arguing about Monzon, it would be Hagler hands down. I am asuming we arent ranking SRR? I have it SRR Hagler then Monzon if thats the case.
Well NC, thats were your opinion comes into play.
It's up to you to decide where you rank SRR. :)
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Robinson had too many ups and downs to be considered the best Middleweight of all time i would rate him as Welterweight.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
No doubt Monzon For me.His come from behind fairwell fight against R.Valdes was a thing of beauty.Faced some of the best,more than Once.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoomBoom
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
'La Escopeta' by a nice margin takes it for me.
Marvin was great no doubt but what eerks me is that he walked away from the sport when he still had at least 2 maybe 3 more years in him. A loss is a loss and you take it for that, if he really felt he beat SRL then he should have took it that way and just came back and fought on. Instead he went into suclusion and disappeared from the sport. I just feel he could have went on to become even greater.
I still dont see the controversy in that fight. It was close and really most any result would have been acceptable. I thought Hagler may have won by a round but it certainly was no robbery. I think Hagler was winding down anyway and although it was a terrible was for a champion to go out, I think he may have gotten tired of fighting by that point in his life and it was a tremendous career so I guess he earned the right to end it how he wanted....either way Monzon was the greatest Middleweight of all time.
I agree on the fight aspect that you typed. But I disagree on the career decision, I say this because I've seen Hagler interviews and have read how he is. Hes bitter to this day about the SRL, I'm not saying that's bad. But I can only imagine would he have went on to continue fighting he could have fought on and just made the SRL fight another page in his career. Instead he decided that the final chapter would be that loss. Now he dislikes events he rarely smiles and hes secluded himself so far off. I know boxing isn't always fair but I think Marvin could have gone out with a big bang.
And yet after saying all of that, Marvins still an all time great and P4P.
I think a lot of the discust over the outcome had to do with his fans and the people around him. That could have rubbed off on him easily especially being at the peak of his stardom with so many people around him. He had two fights that he lost prior to that that most would consider legitimate robberies (well at least one of them) and he continued to fight after them.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Hey man i had SRL winning that fight Hagler gave away the early rounds and that screwed him he lost end of story. As far as the best Middle weights i have it Monzon, Hagler, and SRR sure SRR was champion many times at middle weight but he also lost a hell of alot at middle weight. Monzon and Hagler were way more domainate then SRR was so they both for me get the nod to be above him in that division.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Personally...I think that it's all a bit subjective opinion.
Historians fan Monzon up there...but for some reason...it's always a toss up for me with Hagler & Carlos.
Hopkins is a third for me...no matter what critics & writers say.
That's where it all get's a bit gray.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
The thing with bernard was he was a great champion but his greatest wins were people that were at lower weight classes. Oscar started at Superfeatherweight, Tito who was a welterweight and both fought Bernard at his weight middle. Same with Winky best weight was Lightmiddleweight and eh fights Bernard at Lightheavyweight. Sure Hagler did the same thing but Hitman and Duran had success at the weight and Hitman even had success at Crusierweight so he was not a blown up middleweight but all that said Bernard still was a good champion.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
The thing with bernard was he was a great champion but his greatest wins were people that were at lower weight classes. Oscar started at Superfeatherweight, Tito who was a welterweight and both fought Bernard at his weight middle. Same with Winky best weight was Lightmiddleweight and eh fights Bernard at Lightheavyweight. Sure Hagler did the same thing but Hitman and Duran had success at the weight and Hitman even had success at Crusierweight so he was not a blown up middleweight but all that said Bernard still was a good champion.
People seem to forget that Trinidad and Wright were both favored to beat Hopkins going in there fight with him.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Hagler could switch from righty to lefty so cleanly, you could not even notice the transition. He was also a master of cutting off the ring and had great footwork.
He was just so great at the little things. People remember the slugger in him when he fought Hearns, but he was actually a masterful boxer. I rate him the best middle ever. He really did have it all.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
The thing with bernard was he was a great champion but his greatest wins were people that were at lower weight classes. Oscar started at Superfeatherweight, Tito who was a welterweight and both fought Bernard at his weight middle. Same with Winky best weight was Lightmiddleweight and eh fights Bernard at Lightheavyweight. Sure Hagler did the same thing but Hitman and Duran had success at the weight and Hitman even had success at Crusierweight so he was not a blown up middleweight but all that said Bernard still was a good champion.
You have a point...but it's not all together a 100% accurate one.
Hopkins greatest wins weren't over lighter men. Go through Hopkins list of opponents & count all of the ones that campaigned as middleweights...not just on the rise...but middles. You'll be surprised with researching it yourself instead of going with the general consensus...
I aint saying that to be a smart ass either...I'm being literal.
Hopkins has some fantastic wins over some of the tuffest game at 160lbs...the problem was that during Hopkins rise 160lbs wasn't the flag ship of boxing nor was it as extravagent as were the time frames of Hagler, Hearns, & Leonard. Not Hopkins fault...he did what he did when he was active & should still get props.
Hopkins beat everyone on the list that was in his division & he did it with style...one that many didn't appreciate.
While I see what your'e saying about Tito & Oscar...that's a huge crux that many hold against Hopkins as a rip on his record...but they forget the early part of his career when he was destroying middles coming up & for some reason all the other names become useless.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Yea your right i give you that i was being harsh his wins over Joppy, Holmes, Eastman and even Johnson when Johnson was undefeated and beat him good. So yea i like your points wacko and i can agree with you putting him higher then SRR but no higher then that CC for good input.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
roy jones would have beaten haglar if he had stayed at middle weight. those triple left hooks would have done some damage
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
I think i pick Hagler and Monzon over Jones to be fair Jones did not even face enough or achieve enough to compare to them.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
I think i pick Hagler and Monzon over Jones to be fair Jones did not even face enough or achieve enough to compare to them.
Hagler and Monzon are considered greater than Jones cuz they stayed at middleweight. But Jones was without a doubt the most gifted of them all. And I would favor him over both Monzon and Hagler.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Well VD your welcome to your opinion and i know that you know that.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
Yea your right i give you that i was being harsh his wins over Joppy, Holmes, Eastman and even Johnson when Johnson was undefeated and beat him good. So yea i like your points wacko and i can agree with you putting him higher then SRR but no higher then that CC for good input.
DAMN...my laptop just bottomed out on me for some reason...sorry about that...lost my post.
Anywho...back to what I was saying...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
Yea your right i give you that i was being harsh his wins over Joppy, Holmes, Eastman and even Johnson when Johnson was undefeated and beat him good. So yea i like your points wacko and i can agree with you putting him higher then SRR but no higher then that CC for good input.
:coolclick: #54. Glad you got what I was saying. Often you seem to think that I'm trying to one up you...not the case.
You really really REALLY need to check out his early EARLY career though. While all the wins you listed are goodies...I'm really big on Bernard's wins over fighters like Lipsey (who he KTFO & retired), Daniels (batterd him too), & Steve Frank (one of his 13 or 14 1st round blowouts) that I think many fight fans missed or just forgot about.
Now as far as me putting him over Sugar Ray...as I said...that's subjective...not logical thinking. Like I said...I have Hopkins at 3rd or 4th place...& again...that's a fan talking.
You feel me?
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
I think i pick Hagler and Monzon over Jones to be fair Jones did not even face enough or achieve enough to compare to them.
Hagler and Monzon are considered greater than Jones cuz they stayed at middleweight. But Jones was without a doubt the most gifted of them all. And I would favor him over both Monzon and Hagler.
I pretty much have to agree with both of you...because you both tipped good points...but I have to go on with Mr140...I'd pick Hagler and Monzon over Jones...but...it's the same reason that I would have picked Calzaghe over Jones's accomplishments.
That's where I agree with what you said VD. Jones was the most gifted...but he fluctuated to much from weight to weight & IWHO he was most successful & dominant at 175lbs.
The Jones that competed at 160lbs in my opinion wouldn't have been able to handle Hagler due to the fact that Hagler's prime & Jones prime were in opposite weight classes...just like saying a prime Jones would have beaten a prime Hopkins...it's hard to gauge because prime for prime they were at different weights.
I love Jones skill level...it's almost unmatched...actually...athletically...it is...or was.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
No wacko i think your right about Bernard being above SRR. SRR best days were at welter and he lost alot at middle weight and Bernard was champion for 10 years and had 20 defences and no matter if his era was lower then some and no matter how i feel you must respect that. And yea i can sound like i think i am all knowing and right when i post which i do not mean to do that the thing with typing really can not hear how the person would say it in real life.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
The thing with bernard was he was a great champion but his greatest wins were people that were at lower weight classes. Oscar started at Superfeatherweight, Tito who was a welterweight and both fought Bernard at his weight middle. Same with Winky best weight was Lightmiddleweight and eh fights Bernard at Lightheavyweight. Sure Hagler did the same thing but Hitman and Duran had success at the weight and Hitman even had success at Crusierweight so he was not a blown up middleweight but all that said Bernard still was a good champion.
People seem to forget that Trinidad and Wright were both favored to beat Hopkins going in there fight with him.
Your 100% right. Trinidad and Wright were favored to beat Hopkins going into there fight. It seems like being the smaller fighter didn\'t matter going into the fight. But once Hopkins beat them all of a sudden they are considered smaller men. Bullshit if you ask me
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Lets do stats for 4 best Middleweights.
Carlos Monzon's Best Wins.
Rodrigo Valdez x2
Emile Griffith x 2
Nino Benvenuti x2
Jose Angel Napoles
Tony Licata
Denny Moyer
Tom Bogs
Jean Claude Bouttier x2
Bennie Briscoe
Marvin Hagler's Best Wins.
Alan Minter
Fulgencio Obelmejias x2
Tony Sibson
Mustafa Hamsho
Roberto Duran
John Mugabi
Thomas Hearns
Juan Domingo Roldan
Vito Antuofermo
Bernard Hopkins's Best Wins.
Segundo Mercado
John David Jackson
Glen Johnson
Robert Allen x3
Antwun Echols x2
Simon Brown
William Joppy
Felix Trinidad
Syd Vanderpool
Oscar De La Hoya
Howard Eastman
Keith Holmes
Sugar Ray Robinson's Best Wins
Gene Fullmer
Carl Bobo Olson x3 i think.
Randy Turpin
Rocky Graziano
Carmen Basilio
Jake Lamotta x2 At Middleweight i think.
Overall Record In Middleweight Title Fights.
Carlos Monzon = 15-0
Marvin Hagler = 13-1-1
Bernard Hopkins = 20-3-1 1 No Contest
Sugar Ray Robinson = 8-6-1
I think i got this all right not sure though but i just done this so everyone can see the stats.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
CC again for the list ice that makes it alot clearer looking at it all at the same time.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
Point 1 : No wacko i think your right about Bernard being above SRR. SRR best days were at welter and he lost alot at middle weight and Bernard was champion for 10 years and had 20 defences and no matter if his era was lower then some and no matter how i feel you must respect that.
Point 1 : Agreed. That's actually the best & right way to look at it...whether you (not just you...all fans) like one fighter better than another...you have to focus on the weight that they did what they did in.
In my opinion...many people hastily right off these great fighters that move up from their standard weight class to a higher spot if they lose.
I hate that. I mean...so they tried to fight out of their normal weight & it cost them. If you can't recognize that some fighters are successful being small & their best attributes are in a smaller frame where they are faster at defense, volume, & accuracey...then that's just being blinded by the facts that you dislike the fighter.
Not just you....fans in general.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
Point 1 : And yea i can sound like i think i am all knowing and right when i post which i do not mean to do that the thing with typing really can not hear how the person would say it in real life.
Hence the reason that I always try to "corny my shit up"...that sounded gross. ;D
It's hard for us to know who means what unless we "know one another"...if you know what I mean.
To many of us get into discussions in which we are just trying to learn...& it ends up coming off as if we are trying to teach.
I love sharing knowledge...but as I said about...it's hard to keep from sounding like you are either preaching or pulling out the knowledge dick & trying to man up one another.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
Lets do stats for 4 best Middleweights.
Carlos Monzon's Best Wins.
Rodrigo Valdez x2
Emile Griffith x 2
Nino Benvenuti x2
Jose Angel Napoles
Tony Licata
Denny Moyer
Tom Bogs
Jean Claude Bouttier x2
Bennie Briscoe
Marvin Hagler's Best Wins.
Alan Minter
Fulgencio Obelmejias x2
Tony Sibson
Mustafa Hamsho
Roberto Duran
John Mugabi
Thomas Hearns
Juan Domingo Roldan
Vito Antuofermo
Bernard Hopkins's Best Wins.
Segundo Mercado
John David Jackson
Glen Johnson
Robert Allen x3
Antwun Echols x2
Simon Brown
William Joppy
Felix Trinidad
Syd Vanderpool
Oscar De La Hoya
Howard Eastman
Sugar Ray Robinson's Best Wins
Gene Fullmer
Carl Bobo Olson x3 i think.
Randy Turpin
Rocky Graziano
Carmen Basilio
Jake Lamotta x2 At Middleweight i think.
Overall Record In Middleweight Title Fights.
Carlos Monzon = 15-0
Marvin Hagler = 13-1-1
Bernard Hopkins = 20-3-1 1 No Contest
Sugar Ray Robinson = 8-6-1
I think i got this all right not sure though but i just done this so everyone can see the stats.
I agree with Wacko im quoting this again so people can actually look and see that Hopkins is well and truly top 3 Middleweight of all time Robinson is slighty overrated at Middleweight if people go and study his record at Middleweight it is far from impressive and if people go study Hopkins record they would realize his opposition wasn't as bad as some people make out i think Hopkins is a bit underrated.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Yea wacko that some pretty funny stuff you said about the preaching stuff and has alot of truth to it.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
I think i got this all right not sure though but i just done this so everyone can see the stats.
Ofcourse it's right.
Unless you don't know how to copy and paste the right way. :D
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
I think i got this all right not sure though but i just done this so everyone can see the stats.
Ofcourse it's right.
Unless you don't know how to copy and paste the right way. :D
Mick instead of keep making jokes about me why don't we have good convo about the subject.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Ice i already probably know the answer but who would you pick to win Monzon or Hagler vs Roy Jones Jr.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
Ice i already probably know the answer but who would you pick to win Monzon or Hagler vs Roy Jones Jr.
As much as i like Monzon he was quite slow to slow for prime Roy Jones i think Jones outpoint's Monzon but Monzon's jab would trouble Jones plus Monzon has good straight right hand.
Hagler like Monzon is tad too slow for prime Roy Jones i think Jones outpoints Hagler although Jones would have some trouble when Hagler gets him against the ropes and Hagler would be able to steal some rounds when he gets Jones on the ropes and outworks him but Hagler wouldn't be able to walkthrough Jones shots as tough as Hagler is Jones hits damn hard he even knocked out Tate in 2 rounds who went 12 rounds with hardest hitting Middleweight of all time Julian Jackson.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
Lets do stats for 4 best Middleweights.
Carlos Monzon's Best Wins.
Rodrigo Valdez x2
Emile Griffith x 2
Nino Benvenuti x2
Jose Angel Napoles
Tony Licata
Denny Moyer
Tom Bogs
Jean Claude Bouttier x2
Bennie Briscoe
Marvin Hagler's Best Wins.
Alan Minter
Fulgencio Obelmejias x2
Tony Sibson
Mustafa Hamsho
Roberto Duran
John Mugabi
Thomas Hearns
Juan Domingo Roldan
Vito Antuofermo
Bernard Hopkins's Best Wins.
Segundo Mercado
John David Jackson
Glen Johnson
Robert Allen x3
Antwun Echols x2
Simon Brown
William Joppy
Felix Trinidad
Syd Vanderpool
Oscar De La Hoya
Howard Eastman
Sugar Ray Robinson's Best Wins
Gene Fullmer
Carl Bobo Olson x3 i think.
Randy Turpin
Rocky Graziano
Carmen Basilio
Jake Lamotta x2 At Middleweight i think.
Overall Record In Middleweight Title Fights.
Carlos Monzon = 15-0
Marvin Hagler = 13-1-1
Bernard Hopkins = 20-3-1 1 No Contest
Sugar Ray Robinson = 8-6-1
I think i got this all right not sure though but i just done this so everyone can see the stats.
I agree with Wacko im quoting this again so people can actually look and see that Hopkins is well and truly top 3 Middleweight of all time Robinson is slighty overrated at Middleweight if people go and study his record at Middleweight it is far from impressive and if people go study Hopkins record they would realize his opposition wasn't as bad as some people make out i think Hopkins is a bit underrated.
Hopkins is truely underratted...& totally underappreciated.
Imagine if someone young & rising had Hopkins skills. Hopkins craft...his cageiness.
While Floyd is a beaut in the ring...he still doesn't have all the Nards tricks & tactics...if he did...Floyd would probably be more appreciated.
As far as studying the opposition...not many people will or want to do that. You get a whole different outlook on how great Hopkins truely was when you see what he did to some of the people when they were a force.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
Yea wacko that some pretty funny stuff you said about the preaching stuff and has alot of truth to it.
Trust me babe...I sound like a fwockin ordained minister when it comes to Floyd, Calzaghe, Hopkins, & basically the middleweight division. ;D
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
I think i got this all right not sure though but i just done this so everyone can see the stats.
Ofcourse it's right.
Unless you don't know how to copy and paste the right way. :D
Mick instead of keep making jokes about me why don't we have good convo about the subject.
Oh come on now Ice...if everything in life was serious...if everything in boxing was serious...errrrrrrmmmmm...if everything said on this site was serious...well...
WE'D ALL BE TOSSING OUR COOKIES OVER THE RELEASE OF THOUSANDS OF GAY PORN VIDS OF A CERTAIN SOMEONE IN LEATHER WEARING A BIG OLE' FAT ASS PAIR OF SUNGLASSES BLOWING OUR FAVORITE BOXERS FOR AUTOGRAPHS & PHOTO'S.
Now I aint callin any names...or anything like that...this year they hung a sign outside of the men's room of the 28th Annual World Boxing Hall of Fame Induction ceremony that was titled the "The Hall of Shame"...now I don't want to post any photo's of this offender...just like I didn't want to call any names...BUT...here's a photo of said offender...with another satisfied customer :
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
The Hall of Shame.
What goes on behind closed doors... :-X
Heh heh heh.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
OK while your on the post wacko who would you pick on the Monzon or Hagler vs Roy Jones Jr.
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Re: Looking at this Hagler was The Best MW of All Time
Quote:
Originally Posted by wacko3205
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
Lets do stats for 4 best Middleweights.
Carlos Monzon's Best Wins.
Rodrigo Valdez x2
Emile Griffith x 2
Nino Benvenuti x2
Jose Angel Napoles
Tony Licata
Denny Moyer
Tom Bogs
Jean Claude Bouttier x2
Bennie Briscoe
Marvin Hagler's Best Wins.
Alan Minter
Fulgencio Obelmejias x2
Tony Sibson
Mustafa Hamsho
Roberto Duran
John Mugabi
Thomas Hearns
Juan Domingo Roldan
Vito Antuofermo
Bernard Hopkins's Best Wins.
Segundo Mercado
John David Jackson
Glen Johnson
Robert Allen x3
Antwun Echols x2
Simon Brown
William Joppy
Felix Trinidad
Syd Vanderpool
Oscar De La Hoya
Howard Eastman
Sugar Ray Robinson's Best Wins
Gene Fullmer
Carl Bobo Olson x3 i think.
Randy Turpin
Rocky Graziano
Carmen Basilio
Jake Lamotta x2 At Middleweight i think.
Overall Record In Middleweight Title Fights.
Carlos Monzon = 15-0
Marvin Hagler = 13-1-1
Bernard Hopkins = 20-3-1 1 No Contest
Sugar Ray Robinson = 8-6-1
I think i got this all right not sure though but i just done this so everyone can see the stats.
I agree with Wacko im quoting this again so people can actually look and see that Hopkins is well and truly top 3 Middleweight of all time Robinson is slighty overrated at Middleweight if people go and study his record at Middleweight it is far from impressive and if people go study Hopkins record they would realize his opposition wasn't as bad as some people make out i think Hopkins is a bit underrated.
Hopkins is truely underratted...& totally underappreciated.
Imagine if someone young & rising had Hopkins skills. Hopkins craft...his cageiness.
While Floyd is a beaut in the ring...he still doesn't have all the Nards tricks & tactics...if he did...Floyd would probably be more appreciated.
As far as studying the opposition...not many people will or want to do that. You get a whole different outlook on how great Hopkins truely was when you see what he did to some of the people when they were a force.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
Yea wacko that some pretty funny stuff you said about the preaching stuff and has alot of truth to it.
Trust me babe...I sound like a fwockin ordained minister when it comes to Floyd, Calzaghe, Hopkins, & basically the middleweight division. ;D
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING
I think i got this all right not sure though but i just done this so everyone can see the stats.
Ofcourse it's right.
Unless you don't know how to copy and paste the right way. :D
Mick instead of keep making jokes about me why don't we have good convo about the subject.
Oh come on now Ice...if everything in life was serious...if everything in boxing was serious...errrrrrrmmmmm...if everything said on this site was serious...well...
WE'D ALL BE TOSSING OUR COOKIES OVER THE RELEASE OF THOUSANDS OF GAY PORN VIDS OF A CERTAIN SOMEONE IN LEATHER WEARING A BIG OLE' FAT a** PAIR OF SUNGLASSES BLOWING OUR FAVORITE BOXERS FOR AUTOGRAPHS & PHOTO'S.
Now I aint callin any names...or anything like that...this year they hung a sign outside of the men's room of the 28th Annual World Boxing Hall of Fame Induction ceremony that was titled the "The Hall of Shame"...now I don't want to post any photo's of this offender...just like I didn't want to call any names...BUT...here's a photo of said offender...with another satisfied customer :
I like Mick always have and i take his humour with pinch of salt but he has said this to me many times and i find it just little insulting because its implying i don't know anything.
As for Hopkins yes Wacko you are correct about Hopkins imagine young Hopkins with the skills of old Hopkins damn what a force he would of been shame Hopkins reached his peak in his later years.
Hopkins opposition is underrated he beat some good names i don't think he gets enough credit.
