Mayweather v Hatton will be the biggest AND best fight of 2007!

It's been a great year for boxing, so many great match ups, and great fights, however since July every great fight has just felt like something to keep us busy until Dec 8th. Anyone else felt this? The anticipation for Mayweather v Hatton has been unlike anything I have ever felt, I've wanted this fight for 4 years to be announced, when it was announced I thought I was gonna vomit, I couldn't believe it. Come December 8th the hype will have swelled to a new level, the world will literally stop when the 2 men face off. Unlike Mayweather v Oscar De La Hoya, these 2 men are at the very top of the food chain, in their absolute prime and the peak of their powers. It could be argued that Mayweather has never beaten a fighter regarded the top of the division, Hatton is the first one he has faced. As great as Oscar is, sadly he did seem some way past his glorious prime. Hatton however is at the top of his game. The same about Floyd could be said for Hatton, Kostya Tszyu and Jose Luis Castillo were said to be over the hill, maybe they were, maybe Hatton just made them look that way. Either way what CANNOT be argued is that if Hatton beats Mayweather, he beat the best Mayweather there has ever been, and vice versa. That's just 1 of the reasons that this is such a great fight. Add into the mix the UK v USA element, Boxer v Slugger, personality clash, ring champs, MGM Grand, demand for tickets, 24/7 etc. It has great fight written all over, it's going to be exciting to see if Mayweather can keep Hatton off, if Hatton can land to the body, if his face holds up, did Mayweather train right or was there too much on his plate? So many questions that will ALL be answered come Dec 8th!

It is definately a great fight and one worthy of being the definitive year ender as far as big fights. For me though, the anticipation I felt for Taylor/Pavlik made it the fight I wanted to see so bad, though Hatton/Mayweather comes in a close second.

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Originally Posted by 'Big' (Yoits)Dan McCarthy

Either way what CANNOT be argued is that if Hatton beats Mayweather, he beat the best Mayweather there has ever been, and vice versa. That's just 1 of the reasons that this is such a great fight. Add into the mix the UK v USA element, Boxer v Slugger, personality clash, ring champs, MGM Grand, demand for tickets, 24/7 etc. It has great fight written all over, it's going to be exciting to see if Mayweather can keep Hatton off, if Hatton can land to the body, if his face holds up, did Mayweather train right or was there too much on his plate? So many questions that will ALL be answered come Dec 8th!

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IMO, the best Floyd was 2003-2005 at his more natural weights of 135/140. Unfortunately, he was fighting lower-tier opposition during that time.

Mayweather will win handily, and NO EXCUSES. But the best FMJ is past.

Secondly, this key element in this fight is not "can Mayweather keep Hatton off him?". The key element in this fight is "can Hatton display world-class boxing skills"?

If Hatton can do what Cotto did, he has a very good chance to win. If Hatton can't box with Floyd, he gets embarrassed.

When this fight was first announced the hairs on the back of my neck stood on end.

It's Death or Glory for Ricky this time, he's going to have the fight of his life against a guy who is not going to want to engage him at all. However, from the 24/7 series I'm glad to know that Ricky knows this as in the first episode he said "he's not gonna want to go toe to toe with me, if he does he'll be eaten."

I can't predict this i can't say Ricky is going to kill him like i have over 40 times before....all i can say is December 8th i'll be 100% behind the Hitman and no matter what he's my favourite boxer.

CC Donny...he is my favourite as well. But by God this is the make or break fight of his career.

...and for me...this is by far the biggest fight of 2007. There is so much on the line...winner takes all...lose goes home!

cc returned mate...
I'm nervous already for this, i'll be a wreck that day!!!
I feel he may ned to return to the free swinging hatton we saw against Pederson and olivera for this one, but i expect 0 of the defense we saw against tackie.

This is going to be a great event,I don't see it as being a great fight,probably because I'm not a huge fan of Hatton's style,although I respect him alot and like him. I'm certainly excited about it,how can one not be but it's not the biggest fight of 07,Oscar-Floyd was and it's definitely not going to top Pavlik Taylor or Vazquez-Marquez 2.

An excellent exciting fight though which will be intense and I'll be nervous watching it,to see whether Hatton can do it! 1 thing though,for Hatton fans,if he loses,it is NOT the end,because I guarantee you Ricky will fight Oscar at some point after this fight. I guarantee it.

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

cc returned mate...
I'm nervous already for this, i'll be a wreck that day!!!
I feel he may ned to return to the free swinging hatton we saw against Pederson and olivera for this one, but i expect 0 of the defense we saw against tackie.

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;D ;D ;D what defense against Tackie ;D ;D ;D

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Originally Posted by BubbleBox

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

cc returned mate...
I'm nervous already for this, i'll be a wreck that day!!!
I feel he may ned to return to the free swinging hatton we saw against Pederson and olivera for this one, but i expect 0 of the defense we saw against tackie.

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;D ;D ;D what defense against Tackie ;D ;D ;D

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If he could weave like that against every opponent he wouldn't make me so damn nervous all the time!!!

The thing i dislike about Hatton is he doesnt work off his jab to set up his hooks and his inability to back up resorting to holding instead. Also after watching the 24/7 show the other day he contridicts himself he said he hasnt disrespected Floyd but through the whole show he called him a Pr*ck and a Di**head amoungs other things. The type of fight we get depends on the referee, if he allows all of that holding shyte then it could get quite interesting but if he acts properly in accordance to the rules it will be a Mayweather long range target practice session. TBH Hatton is one dimentional as he has no plan B we saw this in the Collazo fight he couldnt switch his game up when he was in trouble and had to hang on for dear life.

The collazo fight has been done to death ??? Every body suffers an off day or can be ill lets move on I think you should watch some other Hatton fights before you post this rubbish ;D

which fight should i watch? Tszyu he hit and held in that fight and the Castillo fight well JLC was shot. The other fights just aint worth watching ,Maussa,Urango ect i have never seen Hatton display versitility his has one game plan come forward and work the body and if it isnt very effective just try and land a KO punch. He cant box on the back foot and holds rather than taking a step back.

See Hatton V Magee, Hatton V Tackie, Hatton V Philips.

Hadit been another poster i may have SC'd him already

It's a huge fight, don't get me wrong, and Ricky is my favourite fighter, but Calzaghe-Kessler...in terms of what it meant for boxing and for the fact it determined who was the best Super-Middle in the world meant more.

My FOTY vote is going to Pavlik-Taylor. I don't think Mayweather will make the fight exciting enough for this to contender that.

As a spectacle though, not many will come bigger than Hatton knocking out Mayweather ;D.

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

See Hatton V Magee, Hatton V Tackie, Hatton V Philips.

Hadit been another poster i may have SC'd him already

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I agree. In those fights he was tested in different ways and did change up his game to come out on top of those opponents... Lets face it, every fighter has their own strengths and their styles and you don't expect them to change styles that much during a fight... I think he's proved though that he can drop a certain tactic if he find's its not working in his favour in a particular fight.. If a tactic he is using (as straight forward as it may be)is allowing him to feel he's got the upper hand on an opponent, then he's going to stick with that.. So far his style has served him well...
Floyd will test him no doubt and he will have to adapt.. but he'll still be working within his style and working with his strengths.. If they aren't enough in the end, i'm not sure changing styles by a large amount during a fight with such a precision boxer as Floyd would serve him any better.

For me Israel Vas vs. Rafa 2 gets FOTY...

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Originally Posted by Dizaster

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

See Hatton V Magee, Hatton V Tackie, Hatton V Philips.

Hadit been another poster i may have SC'd him already

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I agree. In those fights he was tested in different ways and did change up his game to come out on top of those opponents... Lets face it, every fighter has their own strengths and their styles and you don't expect them to change styles that much during a fight... I think he's proved though that he can drop a certain tactic if he find's its not working in his favour in a particular fight.. If a tactic he is using (as straight forward as it may be)is allowing him to feel he's got the upper hand on an opponent, then he's going to stick with that.. So far his style has served him well...
Floyd will test him no doubt and he will have to adapt.. but he'll still be working within his style and working with his strengths.. If they aren't enough in the end, i'm not sure changing styles by a large amount during a fight with such a precision boxer as Floyd would serve him any better.

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On ething i feel may aid his cause greatly is the right uppercut he employed in the Castillo and Urango fights to great success...His low left hook is of course his most famed punch but for me, the right uppercut was just as valuable

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

For me Israel Vas vs. Rafa 2 gets FOTY...

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I know why you said that, but I guess it depends on what you like. Twas a superb fight, but I loved the Taylor fight because in round 2, I was sure it was over. Taylor looked awesome, and was awesome, but right up until he caught Taylor, I didn't see the KO coming. I had Taylor up on the scorecards at the time, so it made it even more dramatic. I was literally on the edge on my seat throughout.

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Originally Posted by bzkfn

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

For me Israel Vas vs. Rafa 2 gets FOTY...

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I know why you said that, but I guess it depends on what you like. Twas a superb fight, but I loved the Taylor fight because in round 2, I was sure it was over. Taylor looked awesome, and was awesome, but right up until he caught Taylor, I didn't see the KO coming. I had Taylor up on the scorecards at the time, so it made it even more dramatic. I was literally on the edge on my seat throughout.

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Yeah it was one roller coaster of a fight thats for sure!
Pavlik may actually be in strong contention for Fighter of the year, beating both Miranda and Taylor by KO!

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

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Originally Posted by bzkfn

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

For me Israel Vas vs. Rafa 2 gets FOTY...

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I know why you said that, but I guess it depends on what you like. Twas a superb fight, but I loved the Taylor fight because in round 2, I was sure it was over. Taylor looked awesome, and was awesome, but right up until he caught Taylor, I didn't see the KO coming. I had Taylor up on the scorecards at the time, so it made it even more dramatic. I was literally on the edge on my seat throughout.

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Yeah it was one roller coaster of a fight thats for sure!
Pavlik may actually be in strong contention for Fighter of the year, beating both Miranda and Taylor by KO!

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If Hatton KO's Mayweather though, it has to be Hatton. He's already the only man to KO Castillo.

Yeah thats a fact!
I'd be on cloud nine for a month if it happens!

i can't wait for this fight.

hope hatton wins big

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

For me Israel Vas vs. Rafa 2 gets FOTY...

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Originally Posted by Dizaster

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

See Hatton V Magee, Hatton V Tackie, Hatton V Philips.

Hadit been another poster i may have SC'd him already

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I agree. In those fights he was tested in different ways and did change up his game to come out on top of those opponents... Lets face it, every fighter has their own strengths and their styles and you don't expect them to change styles that much during a fight... I think he's proved though that he can drop a certain tactic if he find's its not working in his favour in a particular fight.. If a tactic he is using (as straight forward as it may be)is allowing him to feel he's got the upper hand on an opponent, then he's going to stick with that.. So far his style has served him well...
Floyd will test him no doubt and he will have to adapt.. but he'll still be working within his style and working with his strengths.. If they aren't enough in the end, i'm not sure changing styles by a large amount during a fight with such a precision boxer as Floyd would serve him any better.

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On ething i feel may aid his cause greatly is the right uppercut he employed in the Castillo and Urango fights to great success...His low left hook is of course his most famed punch but for me, the right uppercut was just as valuable

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He has a terrific Patterson-esque leaping left hook too which he used to close the gap on Castillo and he also nearly ripped Carlos Maussa's head clean off with. His straight right to the body is wicked too, he stuck that shot into Tszyu many times.

He seems to be concentrating a lot on wide hooks, from what ive seen of his bag work, This may be a good idea against an opponent who moves along the ropes a lot as it will allow Ricky to controlhis movement (the downside being he's open to THAT straight right counter.)

Defensively Ricky seems to have abandoned ducking and weaving in favour of utilising his arms. This may be helpful and certainly it will aid him when moving forward seeking to pin floyd to the ropes

Ricky's power may well win him this fight.

I mean, a punch could come from no where like the castillo one and it may be the only punch Floyd doesn't see during that fight but if it connects as well as castillo's then who knows... Watching Floyd drop to his knees in pain/shock and Hatton bouncing up on to the ropes throwing his hands in the air,,, the english crowd going freaking insannnne.... ;D Ahhh the anticipation.. Only a few weeks to go now!

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Originally Posted by DIOS DOMINICANO

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Originally Posted by 'Big' (Yoits)Dan McCarthy

Either way what CANNOT be argued is that if Hatton beats Mayweather, he beat the best Mayweather there has ever been, and vice versa. That's just 1 of the reasons that this is such a great fight. Add into the mix the UK v USA element, Boxer v Slugger, personality clash, ring champs, MGM Grand, demand for tickets, 24/7 etc. It has great fight written all over, it's going to be exciting to see if Mayweather can keep Hatton off, if Hatton can land to the body, if his face holds up, did Mayweather train right or was there too much on his plate? So many questions that will ALL be answered come Dec 8th!

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IMO, the best Floyd was 2003-2005 at his more natural weights of 135/140. Unfortunately, he was fighting lower-tier opposition during that time.

Mayweather will win handily, and NO EXCUSES. But the best FMJ is past.

Secondly, this key element in this fight is not "can Mayweather keep Hatton off him?". The key element in this fight is "can Hatton display world-class boxing skills"?

If Hatton can do what Cotto did, he has a very good chance to win. If Hatton can't box with Floyd, he gets embarrassed.

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I disagree how is Mayweather past it ?? he made Oscar De La Hoya only landed 21 percent of his punches plus that was at a weight he had never fought at before and as for what Cotto done you honestly think that Hatton will be backing away from Mayweather and countering Mayweather ?? if you do then you are seriously mistaken because if Hatton trys to box with Mayweather he will get a beating pure and simple Hatton isn't stupid he knows he can't outbox Mayweather.

Hatton should swarm Mayweather and use all different angles on inside like he can do Hatton is very good at seeing openings on inside and has punishing body shots plus amazing stamina.

Mayweather should fight a similar gameplan to what he did in 2nd Castillo fight and thats keep the fight in middle of the ring and when Hatton gets him near the ropes he needs to circle Hatton straight away and get the fight back in the middle of the ring Mayweather will need to use his jab aswell sometimes if you have lazy jab you can duck under it and counter with good shot to the ribs but Mayweather never has a lazy jab so it will be very hard for Hatton to counter.

Another thing is that Mayweather has excellent timing so he will be able to time Hatton coming in and counter Hatton with sharp crisp counters.

But like i said earlier Hatton has good angles on the inside and it doesn't matter where he plants his feet he can still land punches at any angle Hatton is also good at getting his whole body into the shot Hatton is a very ferocious man on the inside so Mayweather will not be able to stay on the ropes as much like he did vs Chavez or Castillo in the 1st fight i also would like to see more headmovement from Hatton aswell because against Collazo he had no headmovement and he was a sitting duck.

I think this will be more exciting than people think because Mayweather does his best work when someone is constantly pressuring him and Hatton will keep coming all night long so i expect a good action packed fight

This will either be a great fight or an impressive but boring one sided clinic, i'm not sure which. Either way the winner will be the same.

The best Mayweather is past Ice. Sure he's still miles away from the competition, but as i posted in another thread, he's beginning (like Bernard hopkins) to rely on his guile and expierience rather than his physical ability.
However i do feel this is a factor which has arisen from Floyd's numerous jump in weight, at lower weights, up until lightweight he was incredibly slick and lithe, since moving up toward light welter his body is more mechanical, practised in it's movements.

However this offers little to offer the Hatton fan hope, it merely indicates that Floyd is now drawing on his wealth of expierience from fights and training now in order to win fights.

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

The best Mayweather is past Ice. Sure he's still miles away from the competition, but as i posted in another thread, he's beginning (like Bernard hopkins) to rely on his guile and expierience rather than his physical ability.
However i do feel this is a factor which has arisen from Floyd's numerous jump in weight, at lower weights, up until lightweight he was incredibly slick and lithe, since moving up toward light welter his body is more mechanical, practised in it's movements.

However this offers little to offer the Hatton fan hope, it merely indicates that Floyd is now drawing on his wealth of expierience from fights and training now in order to win fights.

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Its nothing like Bernard Hopkins Mayweather is nowhere near past it if he can outbox Oscar De Le Hoya at a weightclass he has never fought at before and make him only landed 21 percent of his punches he certainly isn't past it yes i know he was better at Superfeatherweight i have watched most of Mayweather's fights and i see him stop guys with 1 shot and he had incredible upper bodymovement and plus he was incredibly slick at that weight but just because he was more effective at Superfeatherweight doesn't mean he is past it he can still beat anyone in his weight range plus he has matured as a fighter.

I would say Hatton has looked more past it in recent fights minus the Castillo fight but that only went 4 rounds

Again Ice i find myself surprised that you are an amaateur boxer yet you answer like this. When you move continuously and stay out of range it is easy not to get hit, and it is no great achievement to stay out of range or move just out of range as an opponent attacks.
You speak as if staying out of trouble alone is enough to warrant the merit of being called a great fighter. Let me pose this question to you Ice, when De la Hoya got close and Mayweather used his shoulder roll defence was it as effective as it had been earlier in his career?

I don't think it was, in fact the reason DLH scored so little was largely as a result of Floyd's superior movement.
I never claimed Floyd was pst it, i incinuated that he is not what he once was, perhaps he went through a stale patch as many great fighters do, perhaps he is feeling the effects of the muscle on his body or perhaps age is beginning to crinkle his physical abilities, i'm not sure, but Floyd is not what he was earlier.

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

Again Ice i find myself surprised that you are an amaateur boxer yet you answer like this. When you move continuously and stay out of range it is easy not to get hit, and it is no great achievement to stay out of range or move just out of range as an opponent attacks.
You speak as if staying out of trouble alone is enough to warrant the merit of being called a great fighter. Let me pose this question to you Ice, when De la Hoya got close and Mayweather used his shoulder roll defence was it as effective as it had been earlier in his career?

I don't think it was, in fact the reason DLH scored so little was largely as a result of Floyd's superior movement.
I never claimed Floyd was pst it, i incinuated that he is not what he once was, perhaps he went through a stale patch as many great fighters do, perhaps he is feeling the effects of the muscle on his body or perhaps age is beginning to crinkle his physical abilities, i'm not sure, but Floyd is not what he was earlier.

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Why are you surprised ?? and you say Mayweather was out of range but infact Oscar De La Hoya got close to Mayweather many times and got him on the ropes plenty of times and yes his shoulder roll defense still worked like a treat because all of Oscar De La Hoya's flurries missed due to Mayweather's shoulder roll defense Oscar would throw about 6 or 8 punches and he would only landed 1 and sometimes 0 Oscar De La Hoya threw alot more punches than Mayweather and he only landed 21 percent that in itself is an amazing achievement making a great boxer like Oscar De La Hoya miss as many times as Mayweather did.

Like i said Hatton has looked more past it than Mayweather.

I think it's your wording that makes it confusing Donny(no offence)He does rely on his defence alot more than his offence(which wasn't necessarily the case 140 and below). The older he gets,the more defensive minded he is getting,so in that sense,maybe it is abit like B Hop,but hey,Mayweather is 100 times more fun to watch and does whatever he needs to to get the W.

How does Mayweather look past it because a fast fighter like OScar got him on the ropes a few times, when Mayweather wanted him to? Was nobody listening to him leading up to the fight, and his corner during the fight, they wanted Oscar to have him on the ropes so that he would tire himself out. Oscar is much faster than Hatton, and he barely landed anything. I think Hatton presents the same trouble Castillo did in that he can hold and punch which gave Mayweather problems, but this fight won't be as big as Mayweather-Oscar, it might be close, but its not that big. Also Mayweather is too much better than Hatton for this be the best fight of 2007, Mayweather will win it by too large of a margin... unless you ask those people who somehow thought Oscar made it a close fight. Oscar made the fight competitive for a few rounds and won three or four of them, but in the end Mayweather outboxed him. Hatton will have nightmares with Mayweather just like everyone else.

You need knock downs, no holding, and a lot of sway in momentum is basically what I am trying to say, and this doesn't have that.

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Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

Again Ice i find myself surprised that you are an amaateur boxer yet you answer like this. When you move continuously and stay out of range it is easy not to get hit, and it is no great achievement to stay out of range or move just out of range as an opponent attacks.
You speak as if staying out of trouble alone is enough to warrant the merit of being called a great fighter. Let me pose this question to you Ice, when De la Hoya got close and Mayweather used his shoulder roll defence was it as effective as it had been earlier in his career?

I don't think it was, in fact the reason DLH scored so little was largely as a result of Floyd's superior movement.
I never claimed Floyd was pst it, i incinuated that he is not what he once was, perhaps he went through a stale patch as many great fighters do, perhaps he is feeling the effects of the muscle on his body or perhaps age is beginning to crinkle his physical abilities, i'm not sure, but Floyd is not what he was earlier.

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Why are you surprised ?? and you say Mayweather was out of range but infact Oscar De La Hoya got close to Mayweather many times and got him on the ropes plenty of times and yes his shoulder roll defense still worked like a treat because all of Oscar De La Hoya's flurries missed due to Mayweather's shoulder roll defense Oscar would throw about 6 or 8 punches and he would only landed 1 and sometimes 0 Oscar De La Hoya threw alot more punches than Mayweather and he only landed 21 percent that in itself is an amazing achievement making a great boxer like Oscar De La Hoya miss as many times as Mayweather did.

Like i said Hatton has looked more past it than Mayweather.

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Well i'm in disagreement with you there.
Percentages or compubox numbers are not readily available to be considered by the judges during a fight.
What is evident is a boxer flurrying and connecting. One of the reasons that Floyd won by a SD was because Oscar threw punches while floyd was on the ropes and floyd's shoulder roll wasn't effective enough to show the judges that he was handling DLH's aggression. We saw clearly that Dlh was missing via tv, the crowd and judges saw Floyd trapped on the ropes being flurried on....
So where as it appeared like a clean cut win to you and rightfully so the judges who are supposedly in the best seat in the house looked upward to see a closer fight.

Unfortunately this is where debate collapses, You hold one belief firmly, I hold another opposing belief firmly...we can't change each other's minds.

I still don't know how any one professional judge could have scored that fight 115-113 for DLH...That was ridiculous..the judge who got it best was the one who scored 116-112. That was more accurate. I remember Kellerman going ape shit at the judge who scored it DLH...'9 rounds to 3 Floyd, maybe 8 rounds to 4, even if you scored 7 rounds to 5 Mayweather you got a problem with me!'

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Originally Posted by Althugz

I still don't know how any one professional judge could have scored that fight 115-113 for DLH...That was ridiculous..the judge who got it best was the one who scored 116-112. That was more accurate. I remember Kellerman going ape S*** at the judge who scored it DLH...'9 rounds to 3 Floyd, maybe 8 rounds to 4, even if you scored 7 rounds to 5 Mayweather you got a problem with me!'

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So, I scored it 7 to 5.

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

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Originally Posted by ICE COLD BOXING

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

Again Ice i find myself surprised that you are an amaateur boxer yet you answer like this. When you move continuously and stay out of range it is easy not to get hit, and it is no great achievement to stay out of range or move just out of range as an opponent attacks.
You speak as if staying out of trouble alone is enough to warrant the merit of being called a great fighter. Let me pose this question to you Ice, when De la Hoya got close and Mayweather used his shoulder roll defence was it as effective as it had been earlier in his career?

I don't think it was, in fact the reason DLH scored so little was largely as a result of Floyd's superior movement.
I never claimed Floyd was pst it, i incinuated that he is not what he once was, perhaps he went through a stale patch as many great fighters do, perhaps he is feeling the effects of the muscle on his body or perhaps age is beginning to crinkle his physical abilities, i'm not sure, but Floyd is not what he was earlier.

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Why are you surprised ?? and you say Mayweather was out of range but infact Oscar De La Hoya got close to Mayweather many times and got him on the ropes plenty of times and yes his shoulder roll defense still worked like a treat because all of Oscar De La Hoya's flurries missed due to Mayweather's shoulder roll defense Oscar would throw about 6 or 8 punches and he would only landed 1 and sometimes 0 Oscar De La Hoya threw alot more punches than Mayweather and he only landed 21 percent that in itself is an amazing achievement making a great boxer like Oscar De La Hoya miss as many times as Mayweather did.

Like i said Hatton has looked more past it than Mayweather.

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Well i'm in disagreement with you there.
Percentages or compubox numbers are not readily available to be considered by the judges during a fight.
What is evident is a boxer flurrying and connecting. One of the reasons that Floyd won by a SD was because Oscar threw punches while floyd was on the ropes and floyd's shoulder roll wasn't effective enough to show the judges that he was handling DLH's aggression. We saw clearly that Dlh was missing via tv, the crowd and judges saw Floyd trapped on the ropes being flurried on....
So where as it appeared like a clean cut win to you and rightfully so the judges who are supposedly in the best seat in the house looked upward to see a closer fight.

Unfortunately this is where debate collapses, You hold one belief firmly, I hold another opposing belief firmly...we can't change each other's minds.

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Well i'm in disagreement with you there.
Percentages or compubox numbers are not readily available to be considered by the judges during a fight.
What is evident is a boxer flurrying and connecting.

Well im using the stats since we can't count the numbers are selves, but i did watch Oscar De La Hoya throwing his flurries in slow motion and most of them missed i can gurantee you that.

One of the reasons that Floyd won by a SD was because Oscar threw punches while floyd was on the ropes and floyd's shoulder roll wasn't effective enough to show the judges that he was handling DLH's aggression.

Or maybe the judges just made a bad error like they have done in the past ?? your basing your arguement on Mayweather being past it based on the judges scoring the fight SD, its hard for the judges to tell if Oscar De La Hoya was missing with those flurries with the view they have got his flurries came so quick that they wouldn't be able to tell but it doesn't really matter, i think your being too hard on Mayweather. Considering that was at a weight he had never fought at before, and he still made Oscar De La Hoya only landed 21 percent of his punches.


We saw clearly that Dlh was missing via tv, the crowd and judges saw Floyd trapped on the ropes being flurried on....
So where as it appeared like a clean cut win to you and rightfully so the judges who are supposedly in the best seat in the house looked upward to see a closer fight.

I don't really understand what your saying ?? so your saying the judges and the crowd saw Mayweather getting flurried on the ropes even though clearly when watching it on the TV they missed. And thats your arguement for Mayweather being past it ?? Sosa got completey outboxed by Mayweather but the crowd thought it was close it doesn't really matter what the crowd think or how close the judges scored it. Mayweather still outboxed Oscar De La Hoya and did not look past it i don't see how many can think Mayweather is past it making a great fighter like Oscar De La Hoya only landed 21 percent of his punches, and outboxed Oscar De La Hoya plus this was at a weightclass Mayweather had never fought at before so of course he won't be as good or as effective at a weightclass he had never fought at before but that doesn't mean he is past it.

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

The best Mayweather is past Ice. Sure he's still miles away from the competition, but as i posted in another thread, he's beginning (like Bernard hopkins) to rely on his guile and expierience rather than his physical ability.
However i do feel this is a factor which has arisen from Floyd's numerous jump in weight, at lower weights, up until lightweight he was incredibly slick and lithe, since moving up toward light welter his body is more mechanical, practised in it's movements.

However this offers little to offer the Hatton fan hope, it merely indicates that Floyd is now drawing on his wealth of expierience from fights and training now in order to win fights.

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I totally disagree. I think Mayweather has gotten slower than what he was when he was younger, but he has also gotten a lot stronger, not p4p wise, but in terms of how strong in general he is also. Also he is always improving technically... you look back to the G. Hernandez fight, you see mistakes he didn't make two years after that, and now he doesn't make mistakes he made 2 years past. His speed has diminished all that much, and I think most of it is due to the fact he has to plant his feet more now, and he has to push a little more with his punches.

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Originally Posted by Taeth

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

The best Mayweather is past Ice. Sure he's still miles away from the competition, but as i posted in another thread, he's beginning (like Bernard hopkins) to rely on his guile and expierience rather than his physical ability.
However i do feel this is a factor which has arisen from Floyd's numerous jump in weight, at lower weights, up until lightweight he was incredibly slick and lithe, since moving up toward light welter his body is more mechanical, practised in it's movements.

However this offers little to offer the Hatton fan hope, it merely indicates that Floyd is now drawing on his wealth of expierience from fights and training now in order to win fights.

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I totally disagree. I think Mayweather has gotten slower than what he was when he was younger, but he has also gotten a lot stronger, not p4p wise, but in terms of how strong in general he is also. Also he is always improving technically... you look back to the G. Hernandez fight, you see mistakes he didn't make two years after that, and now he doesn't make mistakes he made 2 years past. His speed has diminished all that much, and I think most of it is due to the fact he has to plant his feet more now, and he has to push a little more with his punches.

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Read virtually every post iv made on Mayweather, iv said the same thing as you.

Well im using the stats since we can't count the numbers are selves, but i did watch Oscar De La Hoya throwing his flurries in slow motion and most of them missed i can gurantee you that.
The Judges didn have slow motion either, my point stands.

Or maybe the judges just made a bad error like they have done in the past ?? your basing your arguement on Mayweather being past it based on the judges scoring the fight SD, its hard for the judges to tell if Oscar De La Hoya was missing with those flurries with the view they have got his flurries came so quick that they wouldn't be able to tell but it doesn't really matter, i think your being too hard on Mayweather. Considering that was at a weight he had never fought at before, and he still made Oscar De La Hoya only landed 21 percent of his punches.

Once again, the judges didn't look up at the action and say to each other, wow Oscar is only landing 21% of his punches!!! You just reiterated what i mentioned previously, it was hard for the judges to see him missing.
As for your claim that im being to hard on Floyd, well why? Yes i respect him for climbing weights it's very admirable, but it doesn't entitle him for any special treatment. Furthermore i don't judge Floyd harder than any other fighter climbing weights and losing momentum as a result. I was as if not more critical of my man Ricky after the faltering display against Collazo. No excuses if you want to climb weight you have to realisethat your against bigger guys and there are no extra poiunts for being the little guy.

I don't really understand what your saying ?? so your saying the judges and the crowd saw Mayweather getting flurried on the ropes even though clearly when watching it on the TV they missed. And thats your arguement for Mayweather being past it ?? Sosa got completey outboxed by Mayweather but the crowd thought it was close it doesn't really matter what the crowd think or how close the judges scored it. Mayweather still outboxed Oscar De La Hoya and did not look past it i don't see how many can think Mayweather is past it making a great fighter like Oscar De La Hoya only landed 21 percent of his punches, and outboxed Oscar De La Hoya plus this was at a weightclass Mayweather had never fought at before so of course he won't be as good or as effective at a weightclass he had never fought at before but that doesn't mean he is past it.
Ice i'm repeating myself now, it doesn't matter what the crowd, you or I think, it's the opinion of the judges that matters. Supplementary to that the Sosa fight has no bearing on this particular issue.
Once again, fighting at a new weightclass for the first time does not score you points, once the fight begins the impartial judges can only make their decision on the boxing they witness before them.

In all your arguement, you picked at my points, you attempted to sway my beliefs and prove me wrong, but you never once offered me a counter point from the De la Hoya fight to prove Mayweather is not past it or a moment in the DLh fight wher Floyd displayed moments of the sheer brilliance he forged his name on...a couple of years ago.

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

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Originally Posted by Taeth

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

The best Mayweather is past Ice. Sure he's still miles away from the competition, but as i posted in another thread, he's beginning (like Bernard hopkins) to rely on his guile and expierience rather than his physical ability.
However i do feel this is a factor which has arisen from Floyd's numerous jump in weight, at lower weights, up until lightweight he was incredibly slick and lithe, since moving up toward light welter his body is more mechanical, practised in it's movements.

However this offers little to offer the Hatton fan hope, it merely indicates that Floyd is now drawing on his wealth of expierience from fights and training now in order to win fights.

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I totally disagree. I think Mayweather has gotten slower than what he was when he was younger, but he has also gotten a lot stronger, not p4p wise, but in terms of how strong in general he is also. Also he is always improving technically... you look back to the G. Hernandez fight, you see mistakes he didn't make two years after that, and now he doesn't make mistakes he made 2 years past. His speed has diminished all that much, and I think most of it is due to the fact he has to plant his feet more now, and he has to push a little more with his punches.

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Read virtually every post iv made on Mayweather, iv said the same thing as you.

Well im using the stats since we can't count the numbers are selves, but i did watch Oscar De La Hoya throwing his flurries in slow motion and most of them missed i can gurantee you that.
The Judges didn have slow motion either, my point stands.

Or maybe the judges just made a bad error like they have done in the past ?? your basing your arguement on Mayweather being past it based on the judges scoring the fight SD, its hard for the judges to tell if Oscar De La Hoya was missing with those flurries with the view they have got his flurries came so quick that they wouldn't be able to tell but it doesn't really matter, i think your being too hard on Mayweather. Considering that was at a weight he had never fought at before, and he still made Oscar De La Hoya only landed 21 percent of his punches.

Once again, the judges didn't look up at the action and say to each other, wow Oscar is only landing 21% of his punches!!! You just reiterated what i mentioned previously, it was hard for the judges to see him missing.
As for your claim that im being to hard on Floyd, well why? Yes i respect him for climbing weights it's very admirable, but it doesn't entitle him for any special treatment. Furthermore i don't judge Floyd harder than any other fighter climbing weights and losing momentum as a result. I was as if not more critical of my man Ricky after the faltering display against Collazo. No excuses if you want to climb weight you have to realisethat your against bigger guys and there are no extra poiunts for being the little guy.

I don't really understand what your saying ?? so your saying the judges and the crowd saw Mayweather getting flurried on the ropes even though clearly when watching it on the TV they missed. And thats your arguement for Mayweather being past it ?? Sosa got completey outboxed by Mayweather but the crowd thought it was close it doesn't really matter what the crowd think or how close the judges scored it. Mayweather still outboxed Oscar De La Hoya and did not look past it i don't see how many can think Mayweather is past it making a great fighter like Oscar De La Hoya only landed 21 percent of his punches, and outboxed Oscar De La Hoya plus this was at a weightclass Mayweather had never fought at before so of course he won't be as good or as effective at a weightclass he had never fought at before but that doesn't mean he is past it.
Ice i'm repeating myself now, it doesn't matter what the crowd, you or I think, it's the opinion of the judges that matters. Supplementary to that the Sosa fight has no bearing on this particular issue.
Once again, fighting at a new weightclass for the first time does not score you points, once the fight begins the impartial judges can only make their decision on the boxing they witness before them.

In all your arguement, you picked at my points, you attempted to sway my beliefs and prove me wrong, but you never once offered me a counter point from the De la Hoya fight to prove Mayweather is not past it or a moment in the DLh fight wher Floyd displayed moments of the sheer brilliance he forged his name on...a couple of years ago.

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The Judges didn have slow motion either, my point stands.

What point ??


Once again, the judges didn't look up at the action and say to each other, wow Oscar is only landing 21% of his punches!!! You just reiterated what i mentioned previously, it was hard for the judges to see him missing.
As for your claim that im being to hard on Floyd, well why? Yes i respect him for climbing weights it's very admirable, but it doesn't entitle him for any special treatment. Furthermore i don't judge Floyd harder than any other fighter climbing weights and losing momentum as a result. I was as if not more critical of my man Ricky after the faltering display against Collazo. No excuses if you want to climb weight you have to realisethat your against bigger guys and there are no extra poiunts for being the little guy.

No they didn't but who the hell cares if they did or not ?? your basing your arguement on how close the judges scored the fight to support your arguement so i suppose Whitaker looked past it against Chavez just because the judges had it a draw and it was close in there eyes ??

Im not asking you to give him special treatment but i don't really understand what your saying you have brought up about how close the judges scored the fight to support your arguement that Mayweather is past it when thats total crap because we have the stats and we have slow mo and we have better view of the fight and he made Oscar only landed 21 percent of his punches forgetting what judges scored it we know ourselves so who really cares about the judges ??

Ice i'm repeating myself now, it doesn't matter what the crowd, you or I think, it's the opinion of the judges that matters. Supplementary to that the Sosa fight has no bearing on this particular issue.
Once again, fighting at a new weightclass for the first time does not score you points, once the fight begins the impartial judges can only make their decision on the boxing they witness before them.

In all your arguement, you picked at my points, you attempted to sway my beliefs and prove me wrong, but you never once offered me a counter point from the De la Hoya fight to prove Mayweather is not past it or a moment in the DLh fight wher Floyd displayed moments of the sheer brilliance he forged his name on...a couple of years ago.

Why does the judges opinion matter ?? they get it wrong most of the time, the reason why i brought up Sosa fight is because you brought up the crowd so i pointed out the crowd thought it was much closer fight even though clearly on the tele Mayweather won easily.

Once again, fighting at a new weightclass for the first time does not score you points, once the fight begins the impartial judges can only make their decision on the boxing they witness before them.

You have lost me completey i have never said moving up in weightclass scores you points i was saying that when you move way above your natural weight you won't be as effective that was my whole point.

In all your arguement, you picked at my points, you attempted to sway my beliefs and prove me wrong, but you never once offered me a counter point from the De la Hoya fight to prove Mayweather is not past it or a moment in the DLh fight wher Floyd displayed moments of the sheer brilliance he forged his name on...a couple of years ago.

I think i made plenty of good points all you keep saying is about the judges and how close they scored the fight to support your arguement that Mayweather is past his best when thats not true at all.

Floyd displayed moments of the sheer brilliance

Outboxing Oscar De La Hoya at 154 is sheer brillance standing in one spot and making your opponent miss with 8 punches in a row when your way above your natural weight is sheer brillance.