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I used to say I wouldn't compete with an injury but in my old age I'm beginning to see how easily I could go back on that.
Just wondering how many people have competed with an injury, what it was and what would be the cut off for you? How much worse would that injury have to be before you'd pull out?
I have done it many times, I never talk about it, never let the opponent know what it is. even past injuries, because you don’t want to give insight to your problem areas even after they heal. truth is almost always something sore going into a match . a knuckle a rib, strained back, shoulder... I once fought with cracked ribs, money and venue had been set, a bit too late for a pullout and truth was it hadn’t flared up on me os what the hell ! .. in hind sight I would have come down with the FLU. if you know what i mean ? hahaQuote:
Originally Posted by Sharla
anyway. There were no problems till the 3rd. and fuck all. got hit with a shot to body it like to kill me, Had to keep moving forward reluctantly vs. this monster. Praying for inner strength to finish on my feet. I did !
Boxed a four rounder with my shoulder dislocated...
Will regret it until the day i die!!!
I thought i had just pulled a muscle in it...
Then i got hit on it and i thought i would die...
bOXED IN REVERSE FOR THE REMAINDER KEEPING HIM AT JABS LENGTH AND DIDNT THROW 1 RIGHT!
I have to fight totally flat footed now because of an ankle I wouldnt let heal so I dont know how much Id recomend that
Thanks for sharing - CC all round. So everyone who has competed with an injury regrets it?
I've inflamed a disc in my back. I think it's probably a pre-existing thing that's just been stirred up by field work and perhaps Judo (throwing guy 30 kg heavier with beginner's technique  :-[)
Can't run at all. Skipping irritates it, bag work is not possible, shadow seems OK most of the time but once it's irritated say by a few rounds skipping even swimming is enough to make it burn!
I have nationals not this weekend but next weekend. Have been waiting since last year to be here again and really, REALLY don't want to pull out. I've paid for my flight, got the uniform, a few people flying over to watch me and everything!
OK sorry to have a big public sooky la la about it - I think my situation is a little different to others here though.
Luckily my movement is not constricted and there's nowhere I know of on my body which is particularly vulnerable to being hit.
I'm going to go but I just won't be able to train hard leading up to it so it's going to be an extra loooong taper! I can still do shadow though so I guess that's something at least!
Well Sharla if you have to, i suppose the best advice i can give you is stay as loose as possible. I no Aus is hot, but if you can get to a Sauna every couple of days itl be a help, Shadow box a lot, quick and loose...Thatl be all you need.
You know,and I know,youve allready made your decisionQuote:
Originally Posted by Sharla
Cant say Im blaiming you,as I said,I made a similar decision
Just warning you in advance theres going to be some cold nights coming youll regret it.
But if you win,you wont,hey,thats just being battle tested then,right?
I see your point thanks Monkey - still, since it's not restrictive, just painful if I stir it up, it's no excuse to loose. If I loose it'll be because the better person won on the day.
The only thing is that I have to go easy with training right now so my lead up is not going to be very structured. To be honest though it never is - no one's ever really taught me how to tell how long I should be tapering for, how hard to go in the preceding weeks to a comp etc. I guess that's something I still have to research and trial myself!
I am getting it treated by the chiro and so far she's only giving me advice for a few days in advance and telling me to come back if it's still bad. Technically I haven't been banned from competing :) - but at the same time I haven't exactly mentioned it's happening :-[ Still she was very positive this morning so it's possible I'm just blowing it all out of proportion because the timing bothers me!
Went to see her this morning and she was able to adjust a few points that have refused to move in the past so I'm hoping that's a good sign. I've been sleeping on the floor instead of my bed too and not waking up crunching my back into place 3 times before I move. I always thought I had a good mattress (still not very old and was expensive when I bought it) but maybe it's not as good as I thought! The cat and dog at my mum's place think I'm crazy though - sleeping on the floor there is an invite for the dog to pester me non stop! :)
There is a sauna close to my house so I might give that a go too thanks hitmandonny. I'm also trying to self massage and paying for a few. So typical that I have to be in pain to remember the stuff I should be doing anyway! :-[
Hey Sharla,
You might want to try keeping the back supported at all times.
Ironically my father has a back problem and it was an Austrailian guy who comes over during the summer who taught him how to look after his back like this.
He uses a "back warner." Almost like a belt, 12 inches thisck which circles his back and keeps pressure on it. It doesn't cure the problem but it will prevent it flairing up before the fight and may allow you to train more.
I myself am going to invest in a heap of Neoprene shirts. Mayb Ever shield by Everlast (SINCE THE uS DOLLAR IS SO WEAK AT THE MOMENT!) to support my shoulder and theoretically prevent it flaring up before February, mayb it's worth a go?
Sounds like a good idea CC hitmandonny :)
Also seems pretty likely they sell what you're talking about here which is good :)
Yeah I don't know much about shoulders so can't give any advice but I guess there's only one way to find out whether or not it works for you! :)
In a way I'm learning more about what's going on with my back because I'm pushing it. The hop is that I won't end up a screwed up in my old age as I would if I was inactive because by then maybe I've learnt how to manage my weak points.
Chiro said I've inflamed the 'bursa' of the joints where the spine and the rib cage meet. Common issue with movements which involve some rotation. Based on that while I think a soft bed, cycling posture and phD stress (tense up my muscles when POd!) are all factors I think the cause of my problem might be the coach who tried to ban me from pivoting with my cross.
After all I was used to pivoting with it before coming to the gym and kept trying to do as i was told with the same amount of rotation. Thing is the ribs are meant to reduce the rotation of the spine - we are structurally limited there - where they join and the knee is not meant to rotate sideways - so what two areas pull up injured - that part of my spine and my left knee! i should have trusted myself more since I knew watching him he had a small pivot and wasn't actually able to do what he said to do.
I guess it's a similar story with your shoulder isn't it htimandonny? A coach made you overwork it? I don't like being obstinate but might need to be more assertive next time I find myself in a similar position!
First off CC sharl, saw ur other post in my thread and agree il do some more stability work.
I didn realise that a coach was responsible for your injury! And your right it was a national coach here tried to teach me something and i kept doing exactly as he said and when i tried it one day in sparring it dislocated!
(Recently i have discovered how to do the technique correctly and found that he was showing me the completely wrong way. He had obviously just seen it done and said "i'm a boxing trainer i can teach that.")
I really hope you can get some really good treatment for your back after the nationals, its a horrible area to injure and you should definitely look after it!
Hi Sharla,
You asked:
Just wondering how many people have competed with an injury, what it was and what would be the cut off for you? How much worse would that injury have to be before you'd pull out?
I competed with various injuries during my competitive career a long time ago. Anyway, I've competed with inflammed shoulders, elbows, knees, and a partially torn retina. In some cases, it was okay, in others, not so smart...
The criteria I recommend you use to base your decision on whether or not to compete with an injury is this: 1) Will the injury you are saddled with significantly affect your ability to perform at your best (or at least your near best)? and 2) What is the potential for permanent damage?
Oftentimes, unless you are a professional fighter with a lot at stake on many fronts, it's ideally best to rest, rehab, and fully recover from an injury before training hard (this precludes training around an injury) and competing. Besides the aformentioned criteria, another concern is the higher probability of you being hurt/knocked out to an easier, greater extent by your opponent due to not being at full strength/capacity.
Anyway, hope this helps. Take care...
Thanks Hitmandonny - Yeah - this particular back issue I have is a long term 'weak link'.
I think the reason it's inflamed recently is as a result of field work and perhaps Judo but originally it developed when I was trying to force a strong right cross (without setting it up with any left step - otherwise I think would be OK) without a pivot and being told I should be able to rotate just as far ans as fast as with a pivot.
Now I know better but at the time I guess I felt I had to at least try my best to do as I was told despite being frustrated by it. I think the coach who told me to do it also made the mistake of - "I've seen this so I'll teach it". Fine if you understand it well but he didn't. I actually trained with the coach he was trying to emulate for a while and he didn't teach it the same way.
I have been getting treatment and I guess at least now I have a better understanding of what's been going on all this time so I guess that's a plus.
You're right - thanks for the input StrictlySP. I do have to weigh up all the repercussions. I guess I'm banking on the fact that I'm going easy on it will allow the inflammation to decrease. I'm taking a cold pack with me aswell and have learnt some safe positions I can sleep in on the floor to keep my back supported. I guess at some stage I should test my back out in a hard workout but I'm thinking I'd rather let it have the max amount of time to improve and just lay it all out on fight night.
I'm only an amateur so the bouts are relatively short and being in a light weight division with protective gear I think it's unlikely I'll get KOd. If the first bout is too painful i might conceed the next one - unless I'm eliminated anyway in which there is no next one at this comp.
Well Sharla? Hows it goin? The back hold out for you?
Its holding right now,let me PM youQuote:
Originally Posted by hitmandonny
Yeah the back wasn't a problem at all. I'm going to get the vid and post it since if I write my version of what happened it'll sound bad. I'd rather just let other people judge for themselves. I'm also going to put a few other bouts up which surprised me. The girl who won the title in the end got a walk over for her second bout.
The other girl was forbidden to compete based on the medical - there's a rule that you have a pregnancy test done within 2 days but last year it wasn't an issue since people arrive from interstate Thursday and the finals are on Sunday - it's a little difficult to pay for and have a pregnancy test done both in your home state and at the nationals. Incidentally the coach of the girl who won that title by walk over is also the coach of the Australian women's team. Perhaps a coincidence - perhaps not.
Ultimately I've decided to take my training in another direction. Looking to go pro now. The last girl i fought before the nationals just went pro. She was a weight class heavier than me and I still - in my opinion - gave her a decent run for my money once I got started. I think I started a little better at the nationals (although still not perfectly) so I've improved there.
Judging by that I'm hoping that girls at the pro level aren't too much for me to handle and I'm going to give myself maybe 6 months to train specifically for all the little things which will be different in the pros. At least I'm counting on having a contract which says my opponent makes weight or forfeits. Everyone makes weight at the nationals but all other interstate bouts I've had I've had to go against girls who end up being heavier than the agreed weight.
The nice thing about Pro,is you generally have the tab for your tests paid for by the promoter,and they almost allways have Doctors lined up to hot line your tests(some states have a ton of tests they want so this is a god send)Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharla
my last fight i was sick as a dog...i broke a fever that day maybe 3 hours before the fight. i went thinking i will bow out and get better. but once at the venue, i got the urge to fight. yeah i was sick, and tired but well wtf i just had to go for it as for your old age, unless you can say 40 and mean it please don't mention it again. you can hang tuff with some injuries, but as a boxer the hands,wrists and back are ones that can cause long term problems...so watch these and remember most likely if you are hurting and your opponent is a serious boxer they are also not in prime shape. most combat athletes compete with injuries or at the very least not being 100% ...but always step back and consider what will this do to you in the long run? and what in the short term.. better to heal as much a spossible, but let some things go as they are. hope this helps
Ankles as well,trust me on this one,its your base and if they go,your done as done could beQuote:
Originally Posted by iceman
Good point CC iceman - at 27 I feel old compared to the other amateurs competing - I was the oldest on the team. Also with my back bothering me I felt a lot older than I was 2 years ago but a lot of that is attitude.Quote:
Originally Posted by iceman
I know a lot of others including some on this forum don't allow age to be an excuse and I like that attitude. When I first started to get niggling injuries I had that attitude and then after a while I guess it wore me down a bit.
That's stupid though because I've had to learn o lot which I hope will ultimately make my training more effective than it was before when I could just hammer myself day in day out without planning anything for recovery or injury prevention.
The comp is over now and it's given me a lot to think about. I found a few new things the week before which have helped my back more than ever and I'm on the way to feeling young again. :)
I've got a basic training plan written up to cover me until the end of April next year. I figure by then I'll know what's around, where I have to go and what I need to do to take the next step.
One thing I do think is odd is that over the last few months I've been able to make weight more easily but still had a bit more muscle than the other girls in my division. I've often heard people say that women will 'fill out' with muscle later than men (but reproductively develop earlier) so I'm wondering if being a little older might mean I have the ability to become more powerful with time even though i need to be more careful not to injure myself.
It's a nice thought anyway and seems to mesh with the impressions I've got of the few female boxers I've met who are in their thirties. Here once you turn thirty-four you can no longer compete as an amateur so I haven't met many but those I've met were scary!
boxing is also a fickle sport, at 12 and 0 you are good,as a pro but lose number 13 to a shmuck who just had a perfect day and you may never really fight again....mma is better in this, but that is a totally different sport...so keep in mind esp as you decide about pro fighting, what will it cost if i lose when i could put it off to heal...as a side thought i'd hate to have a nick attatched to me like th boxer with brittle hands...forgot who that was but that would suck
Sorry to hear it didn't go to plan Sharla. But for you to react this way shows ssome serious determination and I applaud you for that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharla
The best of Luck on your pro journey anything can happen when you set your mind and body to it.
Yeah I see your point Iceman - which is why I'm giving myself 6 months to prepare. I want to make sure I'm ready for it and I think amateur boxing is so different from professional boxing - especially with the lighter female weight classes - that i won't learn anything by having more amateur bouts that will help me in the pros. I know a couple of small pro male fighters who I've sparred before who I might get to help me out ......... glad you made me think of that Iceman - I might get my finances in order and pay them for some training since they know the pro game! :)
CC for the encouragement hitmandonny. A compliment on determination is especially meaningful coming from someone like you :)
personally i think amateur boxing gives you very little to take to the pro ring, i mean watch americans...always coming forward..left right etc...no real deception and no time to set a strategy....pro is pro Andre Ward looked like hsit in his first pro fight...and this was the much touted olympic boxer..learn the game exploit the rules..have fun thats the bottom line when it isn't fun quit...thats my opinion
WrongQuote:
Originally Posted by iceman
It gives your trainers time to find the holes in your game,and to beat out the little hiccups you have in your game,without it counting against your record that much.
In the pro's,early on,they call,you go,and if your doing something wrong your trainer missed
Oh well
Good luck Sharla. If you always intended to turn pro this seems as good a time as any. LIke Ice said, you're not that old ;).
Take your time, and look after your body.
Thanks for the encouragement CC Bomp. :)
I know what you mean TM and I agree the amateurs is the best place to start. The real difference between pro and amateurs I think is most obvious in the smaller weight divisions though.
Look at the pro female bantamweights and a lot of them have KOs on the records - no such thing in the amateurs. Over three 2 min rounds, wearing headgear, scoring points for either anything or nothing depending on the judges, with refs who give eight counts very quickly - there's really not much of the fight element left - it's all point scoring. Even what scores and what doesn't seems to be different every bout here which makes it a bit of a head f**k to train for sometimes.
In the bigger amateur divisions you have people who can KO their opponents and having power is still an advantage. In the smaller divisions you're not given enough time and opportunity to use power as a strategy. The less bodyweight you have the more time/opportunity you need to win by KO in my opinion. TKOs sometimes happen but often the eight counts are awarded for a flurry of punches rather than effective ones. I doubt as many pro bouts would be stopped that way.
monkey how could you say that? the rules are not even remotely the same, in amateur no technique is given aproval, ot is all agression and straight hits...no time to play hurt, or attack by drawing or even hook...it is knock him out or straight punches only...i doubt ameteur anything will help my boxing...i am too old to fight that way and i lay traps for my younger opponets which you never face as an ameteur . just even competion not that 19 year old that heals between rounds, you face the worst in pro and as far as ametuer you don't get tested all that much...i mean in 3 or 4 rounds, what do you get? ya gotta hit the deep water some time.........
Pretty easily,its ring timeQuote:
Originally Posted by iceman
Real ring time,not sparring
It counts now,your trainer has a chance to see what your made of when your scared.Most fighters arent "scared" in sparring,they know the trainer has some control over whats happening.
But when theres a crowd watching,and theres no real control,well you find things out.
That right there will save you from choking when theres a 1000 people who want to see a fight
On top of that,you can find a way to brush it off as,"It doesnt matter" if its amateur
Its a hell of a lot harder to brush that off once its on your pro-record
On top of that,as you say,you face the worst,all fighters develop little ticks they probably shouldnt,well not probably definitly,its hard for your trainer to see them all even in sparring,and definitly not on the heavy bag.
Amateurs are a way to find them
Also when you start competing at a high amateur level you learn work ethic, dedication and how to deal witrh getting smashed on the jaw.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey
See thats alot of it right there,most of the time when you go down,its because your distracted and tight as a drumQuote:
Originally Posted by hitmandonny
Amateurs give you a way to get that out of your system
Actually here's a point...
I'm an amateur, but I was used as a sparring partner for a pro in the summer...
Had I not been an amateur I wouldn't have been given that opportunity nor woiuld I have been of any use.
I don't want to sound like I'm against amateur boxing. I don't regret the time I've spent in the amateurs. I just think with everything it's important to know what you will and won't get out of it.
I only know of one amateur bantamweight female in Australia I haven't fought yet. She was the national champ last year but this year for some reason gave up her division for the girl who 'won' it (from the same state). Unless I want to keep competing against the same girls over and over again plus a few more with much less experience than me theres not much point in me continuing in the amateurs. I won't get the opportunity to compete outside of Australia as an amateur because other states and teams with money behind them are the only ones who can do that. I need to start planning my own travel if I want to expand my horizons - although I know I'll have to plan it very, very carefully.
I will say that in amateurs I started out only having a cross under pressure, which we couldn't predict from sparring. I've experienced the crowds and am better at dealing with nerves etc. I know how I like to have things in my corner and what my warm up should be. I've learnt a few things that can go wrong which I will remember to avoid. I have had some good sparring at state trainings etc which I'll need to negotiate to get now.
I guess to be honest i don't see pro boxing as a career for myself. I don't expect to make any money from it at all. I've pretty much made the decision not to worry a whole lot about my record. I'd like to do well but if I run into a better opponent and loose fairly then I can accept that and hopefully learn from it. For me to feel motivated at all I need to think of boxing as something i do for myself - not to impress anyone else anyway.
valid points all, but i still say the ring gets you more experience than competing under two sets of rules...as for your record, that imho is what is wrong with pro boxing, beat the hell out of 10 guys,and then lose to number 11 going in hurt, or worse just have a night you can't get it together and then you are a bum...you have no heart...everyone that watches boxing is an expert after 3 or so fights...they claim that guy with 40 pro fights and 150 ametur has no heart...what the f*&^ do you know about heart? is what i will tell most people saying that. that really is my only problem with pro boxing. unless we need to get into corruption the mob etc etc... i also think it is absurd that after 34 you become magically unfit to box unless you find geriatrics like yourself...(in amateur) this is stupid, you got head gear and such, why not let older guys(girls) enjoy a way to test themselves in a ring with a few safety factors thrown in? the olympica are fine, but not everyone will EVER be an olympian. few pro's will ever ever make real money...and like i said one bad fight can derail your carreer...i heard that about Tommy Morrison forever before the hIV stufff,he lost to chumps and killed the guys he should never have beat...anyway just some thoughts, not a personal attack hope this is something we can all use...
I don't know why they came up with the 34 year old rule myself. I would think they should have some sort of medical test that pronounces you fit or unfit rather than a specific age.
A 25 year old whose been boxing 20 years might have more head injuries than a 35 year old who would like to have their first bout but the 35 year old isn't allowed!
I guess the problem is that catscans are soooo very expensive!
Thats a very good point Sharla.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharla
The age can be appealed though can't it?
I'm not sure if the age rule can be appealed. I'd guess it depends on how they do things in your area. In Australia you can lodge a complaint or an appeal if you disagree with the decision of a bout. Problem is it costs a few hundred dollars and no on has ever won an appeal - in other words they'll take your money but you've got no hope of winning your argument no matter how compelling the evidence because they just don't believe in allowing people to complain.
One of the guys at the nationals KOed his opponent. The crowd was going nuts, his opponent was leaning dazed against the ropes and because he didn't hear the ref say stop (standing 2 m behind him) he was disqualified. They lodged a complaint about that but no one expects it to go through. I guess if they did then others would lodge more complaints. Pretty soon they'd either have to give their refs and judges a lot more training or be inundated with complaints.
It's easier for them not to be too flexible here perhaps because we don't have the same numbers in the sport to keep standards high. Get rid of all of the ref or judges that make mistakes and pretty soon you have none left. Find good people to train them and there'd be so few it'd be a huge job - especially for a sport which has very little funding.
Yeah I understand completely.
Have you a gym/trainer in mind for your pro career?
same here, no real avenue to complain and if ya find a masters division fight (HA) they basically castrate you...1 minute rounds and huge 16 oz. gloves...what's the point? i mean i assume a level of risk just by training why not let me test myself...besides i got insurance for a cat scan or mri..