Which Former Tyson Opponents Could Of Beat The Tyson Who Fought Douglas ??

I personally think Tony Tucker would have but whats your opinion ??

all of them after and including Berbick he was crap that night against Douglas.

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Originally Posted by MAYWEATHER P4P#1

all of them after and including Berbick he was crap that night against Douglas.

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See i disagree even though he was a shell of his former self he still had the power to turn your lights out and weak chinned fighters like Biggs and Williams would of still lost imo, and how about the Tillis who fought Tyson vs Tyson who fought Douglas ??

Ok Berbick,Tillis,Tucker,Smith,Bruno and Holmes could have been trouble

i can still feel that uppercut tyson landed on Douglas. Any other day of the week that shot would of killed anyone god has put on this planet, but for some strange reason, Douglas survived it.

After 13 seconds ;)

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Originally Posted by Big_Deuce

i can still feel that uppercut tyson landed on Douglas. Any other day of the week that shot would of killed anyone god has put on this planet, but for some strange reason, Douglas survived it.

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Plenty would have, Holmes, Ali, McCall, Quarry, Mercer, the list goes on and on you make it sound like it was the most brutal punch ever landed, Douglas even said it was more of a grazing shot and he wasn't really hurt from it.

You have to say at least Tucker and Tillis, but it's hard to prove.

I always figured Bowe would have whipped Tyson very bad at any points in their careers

This Tyson would have been too much for Danny Williams and McBride

At that stage but fit he would have beaten Holyfield who was having trouble with mediocre heavys then

Maybe Lewis as well, Lewis wasnt the jab and grab artist that Steward made him

Pinklon Thomas

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Originally Posted by ross

This Tyson would have been too much for Danny Williams and McBride

At that stage but fit he would have beaten Holyfield who was having trouble with mediocre heavys then

Maybe Lewis as well, Lewis wasnt the jab and grab artist that Steward made him

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Holyfield had trouble with who???

Evander at any stage of his career would beat Tyson at any stage of his career!

Lennox Lewis got shocked twice and that means Tyson would have beaten him??? No, Lewis got up for big fights as we can see in the rematches vs McCall and Rahman.

I always wondered how Rahman and Morrison would have done vs the post prison Tyson

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Originally Posted by Lyle

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Originally Posted by ross

This Tyson would have been too much for Danny Williams and McBride

At that stage but fit he would have beaten Holyfield who was having trouble with mediocre heavys then

Maybe Lewis as well, Lewis wasnt the jab and grab artist that Steward made him

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Holyfield had trouble with who???

Evander at any stage of his career would beat Tyson at any stage of his career!

Lennox Lewis got shocked twice and that means Tyson would have beaten him??? No, Lewis got up for big fights as we can see in the rematches vs McCall and Rahman.

I always wondered how Rahman and Morrison would have done vs the post prison Tyson

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Holyfield had trouble with who???

Bert Cooper
Alex Stewart
Old Michael Dokes

Are we only talking about opponents who Tyson fought BEFORE he fought Douglas? Because if that's the question, then my answer would be ZERO. Tyson was off his game, but he still would have beaten guys like Bruno, Berbick, and Thomas.

People forget that the Douglas upset didn't just happen because Tyson was at less than his best, it was also because Douglas was in phenomenal shape and fought an incredible fight.

Douglas could have defeated any heavyweight in the world on that night.

Yeah Holyfield was getting battered around by a poor version of Mike in Cooper and if the Mcall fight hadnt happened Mike might have done it instead

Infact, Mike f*cking his life up really opened up the division

I dont think Holyfield would have wanted to move up so quickly if Mike wasnt having trouble putting away Bruno

If Mikes management had got their way, not Don King, they would have taken Mike out of boxing while still on top and waited a few years for the division to get some good oponents and got Mike back in

None of those other heavys would have developed because Mike would have still been there

Lewis wouldnt be trying to regain his title from Mikes sparring partner

Holyfield and Bowe wouldnt have been going life and death

In fact it would have looked similar to what f1 did with Schumacher, boring

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Originally Posted by SweetPea

Are we only talking about opponents who Tyson fought BEFORE he fought Douglas? Because if that's the question, then my answer would be ZERO. Tyson was off his game, but he still would have beaten guys like Bruno, Berbick, and Thomas.

People forget that the Douglas upset didn't just happen because Tyson was at less than his best, it was also because Douglas was in phenomenal shape and fought an incredible fight.

Douglas could have defeated any heavyweight in the world on that night.

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Douglas could have defeated any heavyweight in the world on that night.

Totally disagree, Holmes, Lewis, Bowe, Ali, all in there primes would of beaten Douglas so would of alot of HW's. Tyson was basically punch bag in Douglas fight one of his best assets his headmovement wasn't there and he was eating shot after shot plus his timing was well off. Douglas performed well but he wasn't nowhere near perfect either remember he got floored and he was lucky the ref gave him a long count.

THAT NIGHT I don't think Douglas was going to get beat by Tyson no matter what Tyson threw at him. Douglas was always an under achiever but he had the style to give Tyson fits.


Evander Holyfield had trouble with those guys but Evander won those fights and that's big considering everyone at that time thought he was just a cruiserweight....and let's remember that Tyson had trouble with more than just Douglas, especially guys who wouldn't let him rest on the inside

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Originally Posted by Pernell "Sweet Pea" Whitaker

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Originally Posted by SweetPea

Are we only talking about opponents who Tyson fought BEFORE he fought Douglas? Because if that's the question, then my answer would be ZERO. Tyson was off his game, but he still would have beaten guys like Bruno, Berbick, and Thomas.

People forget that the Douglas upset didn't just happen because Tyson was at less than his best, it was also because Douglas was in phenomenal shape and fought an incredible fight.

Douglas could have defeated any heavyweight in the world on that night.

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Douglas could have defeated any heavyweight in the world on that night.

Totally disagree, Holmes, Lewis, Bowe, Ali, all in there primes would of beaten Douglas so would of alot of HW's.

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I'm not talking about every heavyweight in history. When I said he could "beat any heavyweight in the world that night," I meant any heavyweight that was actually fighting at that time (1990). Douglas could have beaten any heavyweight on the scene at that time. Holyfield certainly would have been a tough matchup, but Douglas "could" have beaten him that night when he was in great shape and completely focused.

I've seen some great combinations but the combination that Douglas lands that night is one of the most beautiful combos I've ever seen my life.

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Originally Posted by Pernell "Sweet Pea" Whitaker

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Originally Posted by Big_Deuce

i can still feel that uppercut tyson landed on Douglas. Any other day of the week that shot would of killed anyone god has put on this planet, but for some strange reason, Douglas survived it.

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Plenty would have, Holmes, Ali, McCall, Quarry, Mercer, the list goes on and on you make it sound like it was the most brutal punch ever landed, Douglas even said it was more of a grazing shot and he wasn't really hurt from it.

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His own trainer said he thought douglas had fell off. That shot looks like it was alot more damage than just a grazing blow. Not to mention you could of almost counted until 15 until he was actually up. But never the less, i still think that uppercut would of done a tone of damage to any one of the ATG heavies.

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Originally Posted by SweetPea

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Originally Posted by Pernell "Sweet Pea" Whitaker

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Originally Posted by SweetPea

Are we only talking about opponents who Tyson fought BEFORE he fought Douglas? Because if that's the question, then my answer would be ZERO. Tyson was off his game, but he still would have beaten guys like Bruno, Berbick, and Thomas.

People forget that the Douglas upset didn't just happen because Tyson was at less than his best, it was also because Douglas was in phenomenal shape and fought an incredible fight.

Douglas could have defeated any heavyweight in the world on that night.

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Douglas could have defeated any heavyweight in the world on that night.

Totally disagree, Holmes, Lewis, Bowe, Ali, all in there primes would of beaten Douglas so would of alot of HW's.

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I'm not talking about every heavyweight in history. When I said he could "beat any heavyweight in the world that night," I meant any heavyweight that was actually fighting at that time (1990). Douglas could have beaten any heavyweight on the scene at that time. Holyfield certainly would have been a tough matchup, but Douglas "could" have beaten him that night when he was in great shape and completely focused.

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True. Hadn't his mother just died? Sure she had and he said he even suprised himself with that performance that he dedicted to his mum.

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Originally Posted by CutMeMick

I've seen some great combinations but the combination that Douglas lands that night is one of the most beautiful combos I've ever seen my life.

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Awsome combo!

First of all I don't think people are being fair to Buster Douglas by saying anyone could have beaten Tyson that night. Tyson was still unbeaten and in virtually everybody's eyes unbeatable and therefore to face him and be the first person to win is a exceptional task, like being the first to climb Everest or run the 4 minute mile.

Once he had lost the invicibility aura was gone and he was always going to be easier to beat from then on.

Secondly I don't belive in the myth that Tyson was unbeatable in his prime either. I belive Tyson could have been beaten down like that at ANY stage in his career, it's just he hadn't faced anyone who believed they could do the job before.

It's like saying Edison Miranda was unbeatable before Pavlik knocked him out and that now he's past his prime.

Tyson was in his mid 20's when he lost to Douglas, still very much in his prime. He didn't age quicker than other fighters, he just got exposed and his confidence wasn't the same after that.

This isn't meant to detract from Tysons acheivements, he was a monster at his best, but he didn;t lose to Douglas because he had an off night, or had suddenly gone past his prime. He lost because he faced someone who in that fight at least had a stronger will than he did.

If Douglas would have fought Tyson a year earlier and in exactly the same fashion imo he could have knocked Tyson then as well.

Steve Zouski :D.....

It's hard to say really...Douglas was given a gift in that fight...he was down more then 10 seconds...it was a referee era...simple as that...don't get me wrong it does not change anything but considering some of the guys Tyson KO's before that he may have KO'd any of them again......

One I can probably say with Confidence is Bonecrusher Smith....Tyson did not KO him during his best and on that night it would not have been different...Smith would have KO'd Tyson...an out of shape Tyson who would have gassed from the holding of Smith and been easy picking by the 8th

I know this has been discussed on this board a million times, but let's clear it up again....

The Douglas "Long count" conspiracy is not valid. Douglas was ready to get up at 5 or 6, and then he purposely stared right at the ref and waited for him to get to 8 or 9 (which any veteran fighter is taught to do.)

If the ref had been a few seconds faster, then Douglas simply would have gotten up a few seconds earlier. Douglas didn't get saved by the count. He was ready to get up ahead of time.

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Originally Posted by SweetPea

I know this has been discussed on this board a million times, but let's clear it up again....

The Douglas "Long count" conspiracy is not valid. Douglas was ready to get up at 5 or 6, and then he purposely stared right at the ref and waited for him to get to 8 or 9 (which any veteran fighter is taught to do.)

If the ref had been a few seconds faster, then Douglas simply would have gotten up a few seconds earlier. Douglas didn't get saved by the count. He was ready to get up ahead of time.

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Judah got up in 3 against Tszyu but he was not ready to fight again....Douglas got up up the extra seconds saved him...you can nsee on the tape he was hurt...his legs were like jelly on the way back to the corner...If Tyson had those extra few to get in and land a couple more shots Douglas who more then likely may have made it to the next round but might not have recovered well enough....

To think or Even say Douglas got up just fine and ready to fight is pure BS......the 10 second rule means up and back into the center eady to fight in 10 not up and preparing yourself at 11

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Originally Posted by Daxx Kahn

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Originally Posted by SweetPea

I know this has been discussed on this board a million times, but let's clear it up again....

The Douglas "Long count" conspiracy is not valid. Douglas was ready to get up at 5 or 6, and then he purposely stared right at the ref and waited for him to get to 8 or 9 (which any veteran fighter is taught to do.)

If the ref had been a few seconds faster, then Douglas simply would have gotten up a few seconds earlier. Douglas didn't get saved by the count. He was ready to get up ahead of time.

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Judah got up in 3 against Tszyu but he was not ready to fight again....Douglas got up up the extra seconds saved him...you can nsee on the tape he was hurt...his legs were like jelly on the way back to the corner...If Tyson had those extra few to get in and land a couple more shots Douglas who more then likely may have made it to the next round but might not have recovered well enough....

To think or Even say Douglas got up just fine and ready to fight is pure BS......the 10 second rule means up and back into the center eady to fight in 10 not up and preparing yourself at 11

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The Tyson camp alledged that the count was 2 seconds too long. 2.

Douglas was staring at the ref for much longer than 2 seconds. If the count had been 2 seconds faster, Douglas still would have made it to his feet. And 2 seconds isn't a significant enough difference. Tyson would have lunged in and tried one big punch, just like he did in the actual fight itself.

The long count conspiracy was nothing but sour grapes from Tyson fans who couldn't believe that he lost.

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Originally Posted by SweetPea

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Originally Posted by Daxx Kahn

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Originally Posted by SweetPea

I know this has been discussed on this board a million times, but let's clear it up again....

The Douglas "Long count" conspiracy is not valid. Douglas was ready to get up at 5 or 6, and then he purposely stared right at the ref and waited for him to get to 8 or 9 (which any veteran fighter is taught to do.)

If the ref had been a few seconds faster, then Douglas simply would have gotten up a few seconds earlier. Douglas didn't get saved by the count. He was ready to get up ahead of time.

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Judah got up in 3 against Tszyu but he was not ready to fight again....Douglas got up up the extra seconds saved him...you can nsee on the tape he was hurt...his legs were like jelly on the way back to the corner...If Tyson had those extra few to get in and land a couple more shots Douglas who more then likely may have made it to the next round but might not have recovered well enough....

To think or Even say Douglas got up just fine and ready to fight is pure BS......the 10 second rule means up and back into the center eady to fight in 10 not up and preparing yourself at 11

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The Tyson camp alledged that the count was 2 seconds too long. 2.

Douglas was staring at the ref for much longer than 2 seconds. If the count had been 2 seconds faster, Douglas still would have made it to his feet. And 2 seconds isn't a significant enough difference. Tyson would have lunged in and tried one big punch, just like he did in the actual fight itself.

The long count conspiracy was nothing but sour grapes from Tyson fans who couldn't believe that he lost.

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If your including me in the Tyson fan list then your wrong....better fighters then Tyson have been upset in bigger ways then he was aginst Douglas...Anyone who comes into a pro fight in that shape deserves to lose....As far as the cut man etc...I have known Matt Baranski Tysons origional cut man since I was 12 or 13...he was going to work the fight and was in Japan but Tyson and the antics of his camp made him pull out a few days before the fight.....

http://youtube.com/watch?v=xIhTQGWzuvc&feature=related

You look at Douglas going back to the corner and tell me his legs weren't like Jelly...The video cuts out some parts but as far as Douglas on the way back to the corner

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Originally Posted by SweetPea

I know this has been discussed on this board a million times, but let's clear it up again....

The Douglas "Long count" conspiracy is not valid. Douglas was ready to get up at 5 or 6, and then he purposely stared right at the ref and waited for him to get to 8 or 9 (which any veteran fighter is taught to do.)

If the ref had been a few seconds faster, then Douglas simply would have gotten up a few seconds earlier. Douglas didn't get saved by the count. He was ready to get up ahead of time.

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:coolclick:

I agree completely. Those who grumble must not have watched the fight in years.

Not only was he ready to get up but the knockdown happened right on the bell as well. As soon as he stands up the bell goes for the end of the round. Why doesn't anyone ever mention this?

Fact is Douglas was chosen because he had stamina problems and a weak chin.
This is a simple fact , Tucker had stopped him , so was a safe bet.
Fact is Tyson got his ass kicked , the fact that Douglas lost in his first defence , kinda tells us how Tyson was over rated .
and to answer if the upercut would have killed anyone , then NO Tyson would never at any stage been able to KO an Oliver Mccall , fact is he was kept away from guys with rock chins.

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Originally Posted by Daxx Kahn

You look at Douglas going back to the corner and tell me his legs weren't like Jelly...The video cuts out some parts but as far as Douglas on the way back to the corner

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When did I ever say his legs weren't jelly? Of course his legs were wobbly.

My point is that if the count were 2 seconds quicker, then Douglas still would have been able to get up (on wobbly legs) and that the extra 2 seconds of time wouldn't have been enough for Mike to knock him out.

I think that Paranoid and Scizophrenic would have beaten the Tyson that fought Douglas. I know they did beat him later on in his career as well, and don't forget that they also defeated the mighty Joe Louis and Sonny Liston as well.

Buster was not to be denied that night. It would have been interesting to see him in that form against Holyfield. He was favourite for the fight, he could have beaten Holyfield (like the first Bowe fight) and may have ended Holyfield's career a bit earlier than 2007. ^-^

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Originally Posted by SweetPea

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Originally Posted by Daxx Kahn

You look at Douglas going back to the corner and tell me his legs weren't like Jelly...The video cuts out some parts but as far as Douglas on the way back to the corner

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When did I ever say his legs weren't jelly? Of course his legs were wobbly.

My point is that if the count were 2 seconds quicker, then Douglas still would have been able to get up (on wobbly legs) and that the extra 2 seconds of time wouldn't have been enough for Mike to knock him out.

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OK whatever

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Originally Posted by Daxx Kahn

OK whatever

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Are you saying Douglas was on the verge of getting KO'd???? That's crap he took that shot better than anyone else could have, I mean he didn't stumble around the ring or have to hang on for dear life like so many other Tyson opponents......Buster knew Tyson's barrage of power punches was coming at the begining of the next round and he nullified it and it mentally broke Mike, after that round it was even more one sided than the rest of the fight!

Buster Douglas completely whipped Mike Tyson's ass....there is no way you can give Tyson the lead at any point in that fight!!! And at no point in that fight was Buster ever in danger of losing the lead in the fight!

What Buster Douglas did to Mike Tyson is what Larry Holmes WISHED he could have done to Tyson

I actually think Tyson could have beat the count too but he felt the need to pick up his mouthpeice before getting up lol. I kind of felt bad for him but either way Douglas would have put him back down.

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Originally Posted by BoomBoom

I actually think Tyson could have beat the count too but he felt the need to pick up his mouthpeice before getting up lol. I kind of felt bad for him but either way Douglas would have put him back down.

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I dont know ,Not a need to pick up the mouthpeice...But an instinct.He was KTFO to the second power.Mike sagged into the ref when up,mouth piece all crooked.If he was aware he could have done a Corrales (R.I.P),and rose with out to buy time. IMO Douglas that night could have damaged MANY top heavy,past & present.