-
Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Read a couple of articles in the Daily Telegraph where their reporters and chief sports writer talked about Hatton being exposed and well beaten. That's fair enough, but the fact that these pieces went on to suggest that Hatton has nothing left and should retire, and that he was never that great in the first place really irritates me, especially as they weren't saying that before the fight. The fact is that he was beaten by the best fighter of his generation, and to criticise Hatton so blindly is to lessen Mayweather's accomplishments and skills, and to weaken their points about the fighters they were critisicing and praising. I just think that Hatton still has a great future in boxing, and Mayweather has even more options open to him. One thing I do know - boxing would be a poorer sport if either chose to pack it in.
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Can't speak for the Telegraph but if it makes you feel any better I've been saying Ricky Hatton is shit for months ^-^
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Stuff like thatis expected...It happens after every big fight...There have been guys a whole lot better then Hatton who have fallen to such criticizm
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Bilbo - hope you're being sarcastic, otherwise some village is missing its idiot.
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wright
Bilbo - hope you're being sarcastic, otherwise some village is missing its idiot.
No, he's still in the same village. They just keep him locked up and never let him see daylight ;)
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
At best Hattons a B level fighter and after saturday night i'm being a little generous. You saw absolutely no technique from a so called world class fighter. He should stay in england and fight english competition like he did most of his career and he will be remembered. But competition in the states at 147 is way too deep for him, he would be seriously hurt if he continued any further at 147. I keep saying 147 because whos that great at 140.
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Legion - it's not Bilbo's fault that people keep him out of the daylight; they just remember waking up next to his mom (joke Bilbo). As for Hatton being a B class fighter, anyone who says that does not know boxing. He is absolute quality at 140, and has beaten some very good fighters. Judge him on one fight if you will, but then that would be ridiculous.
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wright
Legion - it's not Bilbo's fault that people keep him out of the daylight; they just remember waking up next to his mom (joke Bilbo). As for Hatton being a B class fighter, anyone who says that does not know boxing. He is absolute quality at 140, and has beaten some very good fighters. Judge him on one fight if you will, but then that would be ridiculous.
He's a good fighter no doubt but he's not great.
He dominated 140 only because all the talent in that division moved up to welter.
Name a single fighter at 140 whose better than Floyd Mayweather, Miguel Cotto, Paul Williams, Shane Mosely, Antonio Margarito, Kermit Cintron or Andre Berto.
All the talent is at 147, the guys at 140 are just those not good enough to break that group.
Credit to Hatton he beat an ageing Tyszu who hadn't fought in a year and showed his heart that night by quitting on his stool. You really think that version of Tyszu would have beaten any of the names above?
Hatton is a world class brawler with excellent conditioning but only slightly above average boxing skills. He's not on the same level as Cotto or Mayweather and it has nothing to do with weight.
A great fighter can win in more than one division. If you can only succeed in a single division then you are not a great fighter, as it means you only have one style where you rely on your opponents being not as strong as you.
Hatton would barely break the top 10 at welter, you'd have to fancy all of the above plus guys like Quintana, Judah, Collazo, Alfonso Gomez, Joshua Clottey and probably a couple others to beat him also.
140 is without a doubt one of the weakest divisions in boxing and he'll have his work cut out winning back his titles there against the likes of Malignaggi and Witter imo.
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigsexy
At best Hattons a B level fighter and after saturday night i'm being a little generous. You saw absolutely no technique from a so called world class fighter. He should stay in england and fight english competition like he did most of his career and he will be remembered. But competition in the states at 147 is way too deep for him, he would be seriously hurt if he continued any further at 147. I keep saying 147 because whos that great at 140.
I agree his 'performance' was no better than Sakio Bika's against Calzaghe. He sought only to rough Floyd up, there was no boxing involved.
It was an embarrassment imo.
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wright
Legion - it's not Bilbo's fault that people keep him out of the daylight; they just remember waking up next to his mom (joke Bilbo). As for Hatton being a B class fighter, anyone who says that does not know boxing. He is absolute quality at 140, and has beaten some very good fighters. Judge him on one fight if you will, but then that would be ridiculous.
He's a good fighter no doubt but he's not great.
He dominated 140 only because all the talent in that division moved up to welter.
Name a single fighter at 140 whose better than Floyd Mayweather, Miguel Cotto, Paul Williams, Shane Mosely, Antonio Margarito, Kermit Cintron or Andre Berto.
All the talent is at 147, the guys at 140 are just those not good enough to break that group.
Credit to Hatton he beat an ageing Tyszu who hadn't fought in a year and showed his heart that night by quitting on his stool. You really think that version of Tyszu would have beaten any of the names above?
Hatton is a world class brawler with excellent conditioning but only slightly above average boxing skills. He's not on the same level as Cotto or Mayweather and it has nothing to do with weight.
A great fighter can win in more than one division. If you can only succeed in a single division then you are not a great fighter, as it means you only have one style where you rely on your opponents being not as strong as you.
Hatton would barely break the top 10 at welter,
you'd have to fancy all of the above plus guys like Quintana, Judah, Collazo, Alfonso Gomez, Joshua Clottey and probably a couple others to beat him also.
140 is without a doubt one of the weakest divisions in boxing and he'll have his work cut out winning back his titles there against the likes of Malignaggi and Witter imo.
He beat Collazo so that puts an end to that one. Judah would get murdered by Hatton. I'm sorry but Judah has no heart at all. He doesn't fucking fight after the 2nd round anymore! Hatton would bust him up badly.
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
this makes sense...hatton is shit now....that's bullshit hatton is still easily one of the best 10 fighters between 140-147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigsexy
At best Hattons a B level fighter and after saturday night i'm being a little generous. You saw absolutely no technique from a so called world class fighter. He should stay in england and fight english competition like he did most of his career and he will be remembered. But competition in the states at 147 is way too deep for him, he would be seriously hurt if he continued any further at 147. I keep saying 147 because whos that great at 140.
and calling hatton b-rated is dumb..IMO because he made KT quit and b-level fighters don't do that...
this is just what flash in the pan fans do.. had hatton ko'ed PBF all of the othersiders would have been claiming that floyd wasn't that good to begin with and so forth... same thing happened with roy, sugar shane, the same will happen when/if calzaghe loses.
The fighter out there that I believe still and always has been an overrated B-Rated fighter is Margarito...
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
A great fighter can win in more than one division. If you can only succeed in a single division then you are not a great fighter
So by that logic you must rate Hatton as a great fighter no? At least better than say Marvin Hagler ;)
I dont think Rick is half as good as some people make out. Im not going to pretend that he lost fights he won to baulster my case though.
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweather+Mosley
this makes sense...hatton is S*** now....that's bullshit hatton is still easily one of the best 10 fighters between 140-147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigsexy
At best Hattons a B level fighter and after saturday night i'm being a little generous. You saw absolutely no technique from a so called world class fighter. He should stay in england and fight english competition like he did most of his career and he will be remembered. But competition in the states at 147 is way too deep for him, he would be seriously hurt if he continued any further at 147. I keep saying 147 because whos that great at 140.
and calling hatton b-rated is dumb..IMO because he made KT quit and b-level fighters don't do that...
this is just what flash in the pan fans do.. had hatton ko'ed PBF all of the othersiders would have been claiming that floyd wasn't that good to begin with and so forth... same thing happened with roy, sugar shane, the same will happen when/if calzaghe loses.
The fighter out there that I believe still and always has been an overrated B-Rated fighter is Margarito...
:coolclick: for you. I agree with pretty much everything you've written.
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
A great fighter can win in more than one division. If you can only succeed in a single division then you are not a great fighter
So by that logic you must rate Hatton as a great fighter no? At least better than say Marvin Hagler ;)
I dont think Rick is half as good as some people make out. Im not going to pretend that he lost fights he won to baulster my case though.
HAHAHAH,how are you going to get out of that 1 Bil! Poor statement imo. A fighter does not need to be a multi weight champ to solidify themselves as a legend. Hagler is the perfect point in case.Excellent analysis Memph.
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
;D
Have a CC Memphis.
Think they call that shooting yourself in the foot.
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweather+Mosley
this makes sense...hatton is shit now....that's bullshit hatton is still easily one of the best 10 fighters between 140-147
Hatton is at best,a top 8 WW. If you think he can beat Cotto,Tony,PW,Cintron,Clottey,more fool you. Berto,Quintana,Gutirrez would all be tough fights for him too as would a Collazo rematch. I'm not dissing Hatton,I think he wipes the floor with eeryone at 140,I just don't think he carries the weight at 147 well at all be it trying to bulk up OR coming in light.
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Gamo
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
A great fighter can win in more than one division. If you can only succeed in a single division then you are not a great fighter
So by that logic you must rate Hatton as a great fighter no? At least better than say Marvin Hagler ;)
I dont think Rick is half as good as some people make out. Im not going to pretend that he lost fights he won to baulster my case though.
HAHAHAH,how are you going to get out of that 1 Bil! Poor statement imo. A fighter does not need to be a multi weight champ to solidify themselves as a legend. Hagler is the perfect point in case.Excellent analysis Memph.
Actually I don't meed to get out of anything. Middleweight is and always has been the most glamourous division in boxing after the heavyweights, there was never any need for Hagler to move up.
If you think junior welterweight is or ever has been one of boxings glamour divisions and can be compared with the 80's middleweight scene then I give up trying to debate.
When Hagler fought the super middleweight division didn't even exist or was in its infancy. Do you really think if Hagler fought now he'd remain at middleweight once Taylor and Pavlik moved up?
Hell no he'd be where the action was, right up at 168 or 175 with Calzaghe, Hopkins, Jones Jr etc.
Anyone HONESTLY going to disagree with that? ^-^
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Gamo
Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweather+Mosley
this makes sense...hatton is S*** now....that's bullshit hatton is still easily one of the best 10 fighters between 140-147
Hatton is at best,a top 8 WW. If you think he can beat Cotto,Tony,PW,Cintron,Clottey,more fool you. Berto,Quintana,Gutirrez would all be tough fights for him too as would a Collazo rematch. I'm not dissing Hatton,I think he wipes the floor with eeryone at 140,I just don't think he carries the weight at 147 well at all be it trying to bulk up OR coming in light.
Top 10 or top 8 is splitting hairs. Either way you both agree he's barely in the top 10 of fighters within 140 - 147 lbs yet disagree with me over how good he is ???
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Gamo
Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweather+Mosley
this makes sense...hatton is S*** now....that's bullshit hatton is still easily one of the best 10 fighters between 140-147
Hatton is at best,a top 8 WW. If you think he can beat Cotto,Tony,PW,Cintron,Clottey,more fool you. Berto,Quintana,Gutirrez would all be tough fights for him too as would a Collazo rematch. I'm not dissing Hatton,I think he wipes the floor with eeryone at 140,I just don't think he carries the weight at 147 well at all be it trying to bulk up OR coming in light.
Top 10 or top 8 is splitting hairs. Either way you both agree he's
barely in the top 10 of fighters within 140 - 147 lbs yet disagree with me over how good he is ???
I don't really see how Hatton can be rated top 8 Welterweight, he had one victory over a virtually unknown Collazo and struggled badly in the process, and he had only one other fight at Welterweight and lost, his record is 1-1 at Welterweight.
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Gamo
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
A great fighter can win in more than one division. If you can only succeed in a single division then you are not a great fighter
So by that logic you must rate Hatton as a great fighter no? At least better than say Marvin Hagler ;)
I dont think Rick is half as good as some people make out. Im not going to pretend that he lost fights he won to baulster my case though.
HAHAHAH,how are you going to get out of that 1 Bil! Poor statement imo. A fighter does not need to be a multi weight champ to solidify themselves as a legend. Hagler is the perfect point in case.Excellent analysis Memph.
Actually I don't meed to get out of anything. Middleweight is and always has been the most glamourous division in boxing after the heavyweights, there was never any need for Hagler to move up.
If you think
junior welterweight is or ever has been one of boxings glamour divisions and can be compared with the 80's middleweight scene then I give up trying to debate.
When Hagler fought the super middleweight division didn't even exist or was in its infancy. Do you really think if Hagler fought now he'd remain at middleweight once Taylor and Pavlik moved up?
Hell no he'd be where the action was, right up at 168 or 175 with Calzaghe, Hopkins, Jones Jr etc.
Anyone HONESTLY going to disagree with that? ^-^
Well yeah, because you said and I quote "A great fighter can win in more than one division. If you can only succeed in a single division then you are not a great fighter" Hagler proved you don't. It's a real variable. I would say if any of the welters cleaned up that division right now they'd never need to move up. You did make the point to diss Hatton.
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Gamo
Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweather+Mosley
this makes sense...hatton is S*** now....that's bullshit hatton is still easily one of the best 10 fighters between 140-147
Hatton is at best,a top 8 WW. If you think he can beat Cotto,Tony,PW,Cintron,Clottey,more fool you. Berto,Quintana,Gutirrez would all be tough fights for him too as would a Collazo rematch. I'm not dissing Hatton,I think he wipes the floor with eeryone at 140,I just don't think he carries the weight at 147 well at all be it trying to bulk up OR coming in light.
Top 10 or top 8 is splitting hairs. Either way you both agree he's
barely in the top 10 of fighters within 140 - 147 lbs yet disagree with me over how good he is ???
I don't disagree with you over how good he is.Hatton is a grade at 140,no way higher than b at 147.And I said "at best" top 8,an argument can be made that he is not even top 10 at WW.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pernell "Sweet Pea" Whitaker
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Gamo
Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweather+Mosley
this makes sense...hatton is S*** now....that's bullshit hatton is still easily one of the best 10 fighters between 140-147
Hatton is at best,a top 8 WW. If you think he can beat Cotto,Tony,PW,Cintron,Clottey,more fool you. Berto,Quintana,Gutirrez would all be tough fights for him too as would a Collazo rematch. I'm not dissing Hatton,I think he wipes the floor with eeryone at 140,I just don't think he carries the weight at 147 well at all be it trying to bulk up OR coming in light.
Top 10 or top 8 is splitting hairs. Either way you both agree he's
barely in the top 10 of fighters within 140 - 147 lbs yet disagree with me over how good he is ???
I don't really see how Hatton can be rated top 8 Welterweight, he had one victory over a virtually unknown Collazo and struggled badly in the process, and he had only one other fight at Welterweight and lost, his record is 1-1 at Welterweight.
Yup,I agree,I was trying to give Hatton the benefit of the doubt.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Gamo
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
A great fighter can win in more than one division. If you can only succeed in a single division then you are not a great fighter
So by that logic you must rate Hatton as a great fighter no? At least better than say Marvin Hagler ;)
I dont think Rick is half as good as some people make out. Im not going to pretend that he lost fights he won to baulster my case though.
HAHAHAH,how are you going to get out of that 1 Bil! Poor statement imo. A fighter does not need to be a multi weight champ to solidify themselves as a legend. Hagler is the perfect point in case.Excellent analysis Memph.
Actually I don't meed to get out of anything. Middleweight is and always has been the most glamourous division in boxing after the heavyweights, there was never any need for Hagler to move up.
If you think
junior welterweight is or ever has been one of boxings glamour divisions and can be compared with the 80's middleweight scene then I give up trying to debate.
When Hagler fought the super middleweight division didn't even exist or was in its infancy. Do you really think if Hagler fought now he'd remain at middleweight once Taylor and Pavlik moved up?
Hell no he'd be where the action was, right up at 168 or 175 with Calzaghe, Hopkins, Jones Jr etc.
Anyone HONESTLY going to disagree with that? ^-^
Still doesn't change the fact you said a fighter needs to succeed in more than 1 weight class. If a weight clas is packed with star fighters,like WW now for example,and someone were to clean it out,that's good enough imo.B Hop is another example,and there are lots more. Jumping weights and winning titles is admirable but only when you fight good fighters in the weight class. Anyone can win an BAC title v the weakest champ in the division and proclaim greatness.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nfkzb
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Gamo
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
A great fighter can win in more than one division. If you can only succeed in a single division then you are not a great fighter
So by that logic you must rate Hatton as a great fighter no? At least better than say Marvin Hagler ;)
I dont think Rick is half as good as some people make out. Im not going to pretend that he lost fights he won to baulster my case though.
HAHAHAH,how are you going to get out of that 1 Bil! Poor statement imo. A fighter does not need to be a multi weight champ to solidify themselves as a legend. Hagler is the perfect point in case.Excellent analysis Memph.
Actually I don't meed to get out of anything. Middleweight is and always has been the most glamourous division in boxing after the heavyweights, there was never any need for Hagler to move up.
If you think
junior welterweight is or ever has been one of boxings glamour divisions and can be compared with the 80's middleweight scene then I give up trying to debate.
When Hagler fought the super middleweight division didn't even exist or was in its infancy. Do you really think if Hagler fought now he'd remain at middleweight once Taylor and Pavlik moved up?
Hell no he'd be where the action was, right up at 168 or 175 with Calzaghe, Hopkins, Jones Jr etc.
Anyone HONESTLY going to disagree with that? ^-^
Well yeah, because you said and I quote
"A great fighter can win in more than one division. If you can only succeed in a single division then you are not a great fighter" Hagler proved you don't. It's a real variable. I would say if any of the welters cleaned up that division right now they'd never need to move up. You did make the point to diss Hatton.
Agreed.Great minds.. ;)
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Quote:
Originally Posted by nfkzb
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Gamo
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
A great fighter can win in more than one division. If you can only succeed in a single division then you are not a great fighter
So by that logic you must rate Hatton as a great fighter no? At least better than say Marvin Hagler ;)
I dont think Rick is half as good as some people make out. Im not going to pretend that he lost fights he won to baulster my case though.
HAHAHAH,how are you going to get out of that 1 Bil! Poor statement imo. A fighter does not need to be a multi weight champ to solidify themselves as a legend. Hagler is the perfect point in case.Excellent analysis Memph.
Actually I don't meed to get out of anything. Middleweight is and always has been the most glamourous division in boxing after the heavyweights, there was never any need for Hagler to move up.
If you think
junior welterweight is or ever has been one of boxings glamour divisions and can be compared with the 80's middleweight scene then I give up trying to debate.
When Hagler fought the super middleweight division didn't even exist or was in its infancy. Do you really think if Hagler fought now he'd remain at middleweight once Taylor and Pavlik moved up?
Hell no he'd be where the action was, right up at 168 or 175 with Calzaghe, Hopkins, Jones Jr etc.
Anyone HONESTLY going to disagree with that? ^-^
Well yeah, because you said and I quote
"A great fighter can win in more than one division. If you can only succeed in a single division then you are not a great fighter" Hagler proved you don't. It's a real variable. I would say if any of the welters cleaned up that division right now they'd never need to move up. You did make the point to diss Hatton.
How can you disagree though? Hagler fought in a great middleweight era. All the action was at middleweight. There was no super middleweight division to speak of. Hagler fought the best of his era in the best division.
Hatton has NOT been competitive in the division where all the action is. He fights in the JUNIOR welterweight division which compared to the welterweights is a virtual wasteland devoid of talent and competition.
It's a completely different scenario. Look at Calzaghe as a case in point. He's reigned undefeated as the 168 lb king for 10 years. Yet because of the lack of competition it has taken him until his fight with Kessler to finally get the worldwide recognition and respect he deserves.
Furthermore for Calzaghe to be considered on a par with Hagler he will have to fight and beat either Hopkins, Pavlik, Taylor etc in fights that will most likely necessitate a move up in weight class.
Halger fought in a different era where not only was his weight class the most competitive to be in but also where the junior weight divisions carried less emphasis.
Therefore it was right and proper that his career was at middlewight where all the great fighters were.
In Hatton's case all the great fighters are at 147 and as we have seen twice now Hatton simply can't mix in the company of the elite at welterweight.
He's NOT an elite fighter.
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Gamo wrote
Still doesn't change the fact you said a fighter needs to succeed in more than 1 weight class. If a weight clas is packed with star fighters,like WW now for example,and someone were to clean it out,that's good enough imo.B Hop is another example,and there are lots more. Jumping weights and winning titles is admirable but only when you fight good fighters in the weight class. Anyone can win an BAC title v the weakest champ in the division and proclaim greatness.
Yes I agree with you ok it's not the rising through the weight classes that is important here but rather being the champ in the BEST weight class.
Either way you look at it Hatton failed.
And BHop isn't a great example as Hopkins IS a two weight world champ and his reputation improved MASSIVELY with his win over Antonio Tarver.
-
Re: Tired of people slagging Hatton in hindsight
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
Do you really think if Hagler fought now he'd remain at middleweight once Taylor and Pavlik moved up?
Hell no he'd be where the action was, right up at 168 or 175 with Calzaghe, Hopkins, Jones Jr etc.
Anyone HONESTLY going to disagree with that? ^-^
I dunno mate, he seemed happy enough beating up smaller guys, until one got the better of him of course. Then he did what any great champion did, he moved to Italy and made some films ;D
