His name is quite big now in the boxing world and I was thinking do any of you actually think he will ever become a world champion? He has taken a tough route in boxing now and has gone down the 168 path, how do you think hes going to get on there?
Printable View
His name is quite big now in the boxing world and I was thinking do any of you actually think he will ever become a world champion? He has taken a tough route in boxing now and has gone down the 168 path, how do you think hes going to get on there?
Yes i think he becomes world champ 2008 ;)
I think the top guys at 168 are better than Miranda. So if they stick around he may not become champ anytime soon, but if the likes of Kessler, Calzaghe etc, move up to LHW he could easily grab one of the Alphabet titles.
Miranda reminds me a lot of John "The Beast" Mugabi. Big puncher but not sure if he's championship material. I wouldn't be surprised if Miranda's career played out the same as Mugabi's
Can't forget his power though i think Froch looked dodgy against Reid twice.
Hell eventually win a title but i dont see him being a dominant champion or make many sucessful defences. I do think he will hold a title but very briefly and maybe not a major belt.
I thought Miranda had what it took to beat Taylor but not many people thought Kelly Pavlik would be the wrench in the gears and I think Even Miranda was looking past Pavlik. I wonder if Miranda would ever like to avenge that loss. Will he ever be a champ? He could be. I like him and I hope he bounces back and proves the nay sayers wrong.
i'll say this he does have the potential to be.
I think he can be, as he is no push over. He has the power to put these guys to sleep, tons of heart and good boxing when he uses it. Him and Kessler would be a war, and Kessler seemingly being more of a counter puncher will not bully Miranda around and the fight could actually fall in favor of Miranda IMO. Andrade will have to be knocked out or it could go to a close decision, as he will make it ugly all night for Pantera, though he is crude to be nice about it.
Miranda's problem will be when/if JT and Pavlik move up. I think JT will beat him in a close secision and Pavlik will IMO beat him as badly as their 1st fight, depending of course if Pavlik can take his tools up to 168. Though he beat Green the 1st time, I see Alan being a very serious threat to Miranda if they meet again, as he was going through some bad medical problems, and he is a good fighter. Calzaghe won't be around I'd bet by the time Miranda gets established.
I think Mirandas Mental situation after public and solid drubbing at the hands of Pavlik will be a huge shadow.He was able to fight his exact gameplan to a tee and Pavlik overtook him.I do not think he can change his game up alot and needs to stick with what brought him.If he comes in thinking too much and trying to box more,I really think he will not go far.
From here on out he's at a different level.He has the natural power to hurt many guys & make some guys wilt but he has somewhat been exposed. He can hurt any guy at mid/s.Mid short term but Imo It's the longterm that will demand ALOT of him.
Froch took about 3 punches that he should have done better with, those being an overhand swinging wild left. No technique in them just a plain hope that he might have knocked out Carl. But he has a good chin and proved that by taking those punches, apart from that Froch BATTERED! Reid.Quote:
Originally Posted by MAYWEATHER P4P#1
With Joe Calzaghe likely to vacate his belts it is going to be a free for all at Super Middleweight.
I think Miranda could beat Mundine who holds the WBA title and I give him a good shout against the other belt holder Lucian Bute - would be quite a fight.
Miranda would beat Froch no doubt though a fight with Jeff Lacy would be an interesting clash of styles.
Miranda vs Pascal happens later this year and I favour Miranda to get past Pascal and then hopefully get a titleshot though I doubt his name is high on any Super Middleweights list as he comes to fight and does bang.
Not a bad analogy that , i do think he'll win a title of some kind , at least the guy is exciting :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
The only one who I would think would handle Miranda clearly is Joe. I see Miranda giving Kessler a good fight and can envision him actually beating Bute and Mundine.
It all depends on Miranda at this point. Does he have his confidence back? Just remember that even when getting beat up by Pavlik, he was still landing some huge bombs against him that would flatten most, and both of them were able to absorb a freakish amount of punishment in that fight. Most of the SMW guys are not aggressive like Pavlik and Miranda will be able to clip them pulling back with that long quick winging right hand.
Miranda may have the same type of success as Lacy before Lacy fought Joe, and I consider Miranda a better fighter than Lacy.
Edit: Ok I just read this post and it seems incoherent, but I just woke up and have a hangover, please forgive me!hehe
Who is Edison Miranda?
FUTURE CHAMP OF THE WORLD! THAT'S WHO! ;D
Edison had one poor showing against who is now the undistputed middleweight champ. And there is no doubt Edison was far from himself that night. He knows he needs to prove himself and has learned a tough lesson from that loss. He is more hungry than ever, and I feel bad for Banks. He will be Edison's live TV debut at 168lbs, and he is going to make a point!
Edison Miranda vs Jeff Lacy that would be a lamb to the slaughter Miranda would KO Lacy quick
JT Rock is viewing this topic now your in trouble ;DQuote:
Originally Posted by MAYWEATHER P4P#1
Lacy were'nt all that good before he fought Calzaghe but now he is useless unless he was rusty against Manfredo he ain't going nowhere he got a cut now he will be out for abit again gathering rust.If he fought Miranda he would be stopped inside 3 rounds i would like Miranda vs Calzaghe but it ain't ever going to happen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
CC mate....Miranda and Mugabi are very simular in more ways then one....
Both feared punchers early in their career...Both extremly dangerous in their offensive game and both hard KO punchers....both have big hearts and are willing to trade with anyone
Both also have poor defense...and both a bit too brave for their own good......
Mugabi was RUINED and I can not stress that enough...RUINED by Marvin Hagler...Mugabi took shots that were absolutely thunderous for about 3 rds after giving Marvin all he could handle in the first rounds of their fight....
Mugabis team should have thrown in the towel for him and he would have gone on to be more successful IMO....His chin was never the same after that fight.....
Miranda is also too brave for his own good and his team is also a bit too reliant and has a bit too much faith in his power.....
Edison has a shot at being champion for sure but one or two wars IMO he will be ruined like Mugabi was just due to his defense.....I just dont understand if everyone else can see why the hell doesn't his team make sure they do something about it?
I'm not sure.It depends on 2 main things for me:can Edison carry his power up? And will he improve other aspects of his game rather than relying purely on his power? If it's yes to both of those then he may very well become a champ. At the moment,I'm not too sure.168 is STACKED right now,and I still feel he believees too much in his power and has a lack of plan B. We shall see. I'll always watch him though,he's an exciting fighter.
His team is well aware of his defense problems. If you watch the Allan Green fight, you could see improvements in this area. He was moving well and keeping his hands up. Again against Porras he looked better. His fight with Pavlik was a big back step. His power was not there to save him and he said he had trouble moving his legs. He has been working hard in the gym on his defense so we should see a very improved Pantera on Jan 11th.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daxx Kahn
to be honest though pantera, you cant even call it a poor showing he faced a tough challenger in Pavlik and showed great heart and lost to the better fighter on the night. As for Banks he will prove his point, but Banks is a nobody so it doesnt do too much for his record.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pantera
I say it was a poor showing because his punches had no power. He hit Pavlik flush a few times with not much results. We know Edison has great power, and Kelly has been put to the canvas by much lessor punchers. If he had the same power that dazzed Eastman, broke Abarahm's jaw, twisted Gibbs body all the way around and dropped Allan Green, well, I think Pavlik may have not have continued his coming forward.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tam Seddon
Regardless, Pavlik surprised many people and well deserves his crown. Banks will not do much for his record, but it will draw a big TV audience and a good showing by Edison will surely get him into another big fight on HBO. By mid/end 2008 he will get a shot at some title. Hopefully I am right, and the Pavlik night was an off night. Only time will tell. He will need to prove himself in the ring.
you tell Kelly Pavik, Miranda had no power... He had awesome power, but the fact that Pavlik wanted the fight more and he showed great heart/chin, it got him through the fight. I was proad of Miranda that fight and if anything it was a good experience for him and not a bad one. Pavlik went on to beat Taylor, who beat a legend if Hopkins. I dont take anything away from Miranda for that!Quote:
Originally Posted by Pantera
Miranda's power wasn't the same because Pavlik put him on his back foot and Miranda doesn't know how to fight going backwards at all, didn't get the same leverage on his shots. Nothing to do with being off or some sort of excuse IMO. Miranda just looked bothered all night by the fact that somebody was coming at him, not the other way around.
I don't see him being a champion at 168 honestly, seems like a decent enough guy so I hope he does well but I just don't see it IMO.
Edison Miranda is one of my favourite fighters and I do think he had problems with the weight for the Pavlik fight and he certainly looked lethargic and weaker than he has done in the past.
But at the end of the day he is easy to hit and if your gonna take full blooded shots from Kelly Pavlik then your not gonna win.
Miranda cant use weight as an excuse against a determined Pavlik. He put up a good fight and lost to the better fighter! END OF STORY ;D
And that is how most fans will see it. I was there and saw the struggles first hand. Yes, Pavlik was good. But Allan Green or Abraham would have KO'd Miranda is that condition.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tam Seddon
He had a fever going into the ring. I gotta believe that took a decent amount of power from his punch.
At 100%, I really do not see Pavlik keeping Miranda going backwards.
Well I dont see them ever fighting again. I rekon Miranda did well in the fight which is my own opinion in the fight. Miranda doesnt like going backwards and like Taylor when he noticed how good Kellys chin was it really did get to him. Maybe knocking out Pavlik isnt the way to do, boxing to a decision is the likely thing to do. I rekon Miranda would loose even at full strength against Pavlik, hes just too good.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pantera
Pavlik got lucky. Miranda underestimated him and was weight drained. If a powder puncher like Jermain Taylor can put Pavlik on his ass then a fully fit Super Middle like Edison would destroy him. :)
that post was naughty. You will have people replying telling you how wrong you are. Pavlik wasnt lucky, Luck isnt being undefeated and Undiputed Middleweight champion and knocking out both of the toughest competion in becoming the champion. Taylor isnt a powder puncher either. hes strong and big for a middleweight. Edison at 168 wouldnt destory Pavlik, he would get knocked out again ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by WelshDevilRob
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tam Seddon
Come on Tom, old Taylor has never full ko'd anyone and went the distance with little people like Spinks. :)
Pavlik won't give Miranda a rematch cos he would get hurt. :D
I hope you just didnt refer to me as tom !?!??!?! ;D Pavlik wont give Miranda a rematch because he hasnt done shit to earn one. Why should Pavlik take one? He knocked him out and Miranda doesnt have anything Pavlik needs; a belt,reputation and money. It wouldnt mean too much at this stage if they faught to be honest.Quote:
Originally Posted by WelshDevilRob
As for taylor hes going through a hard patch, maybe time will tell. But to put Pavlik on the mat was an achievement. Spinks is a slippery bastard, but at the end of the day Taylor still won.
Well it is also known that Pavlik has been having trouble making weight, but I guess that doesn't count.
I don't understand why if Miranda was having so much trouble making weight; why did he fight Pavlik in the 1st place? Why didn't he just move up to SMW? Maybe he thought Pavlik was an easy win weight drained or not? Guess he found out the hard way that night.
But what I really don't understand is whether or not he thought Pavlik was a gimme fight{which he obviously did, you could tell at the pre fight press conference}, why on earth would he want to continue on and fight J. Taylor for the belts after a win over Pavlik? If his weight was such an issue, surely fighting a guy in Taylor who was undefeated and the long time champ couldn't be considered a walk through opponent? You'd think Miranda and his camp would be worried about fighting Taylor if the weight issues were so severe. He could have skipped Pavlik and a shot at Taylor and just moved up to 168 without getting KTFO.
Pantera, I'm not trying to get you hot under the collar, as me and you already talked about this. I'm just wondering about those above mentioned things and why they weren't addressed before Pavlik and a possible meeting with Taylor if he had beat Pavlik. Seems kind of stupid to take those risks knowing his weight was an issue.
Making 160lbs was always difficult for Edison. The last time before Pavlik he had to make that weght was against Abraham in Germany. He had a long training camp, and a 1 month delay from Arthur's bullshit sick story, to be in prime shape and make the weight.
Against Gibbs and Green he was at a catch weight. And I remember during those fights he was really struggling to get down, but was able to do it and still keep his strength.
The problem with Pavlik was he had fought back to back to back without much of a break. After the Green fight he went back to Colombia and blew up to almost 210lbs (suprisingly at that weight he has no fat, just looks freakin huge!). It was short notice to take the Pavlik fight and he admits he took training a little less serious. His good friend Zuniga kept telling him he will destroy Pavlik and not too worry to much. Unfortunately putting it all together he screwed up. He kept his weight problems a secret, thinking he could still manage to get to 160lbs and be OK. He was wrong.
He decided to move up to 168lbs so he did not have to kill himself anymore to make 160. I think it is a good move. He had Jermain in his sites and wanted nothing more. Once he lost that opportunity there was nothing left for him at 160lbs, and it was not worth the struggle.
I think many of you will be surprised at what Edison will offer at 168lbs. His power seems to be even stronger and he is boxing and jabbing better and better. I know Banks wont tell us too much, but I think you will see what I am talking about. I am hoping he grabs a belt at 168lbs and this might influence Pavlik to give him a rematch when he moves up.
Thanks Pantera, CC. I hope he does well at 168, and would love to see him fight Taylor some time next year. It will be a GOOD fight. And I'd like to see Pavlik move up as well, and see a rematch, as I am intrigued to see how much stronger he will be, and it will be a war for sure as 'm sure Miranda would like to avenge that loss.
In ways I can see that weight must have been an issue for him Pantera. But if it was such a problem and because Miranda had such a good name, why did he risk it by fighting Pavlik? He should have gone straight to 168 if that was the case, at least he would have prevented a loss. I rekon if Pavlik had taken the fight at 168 it might have been another story, but I dont believe he can take that loss away from him. Who knows what will happen now, I hope that he can get a big name on his record at 168 and lets see what he can do. If he does well and Pavlik does well, maybe they can rematch. I will believe this weight issue if Miranda beats Pavlik in a rematch at 168, but if he doesnt there is no excuses.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tam Seddon
Pavlik was the number 1 contender and the bout was ordered. At the press conference Miranda spent most of the time calling out Jermain Taylor and saying that Taylor was avoiding him.
I think Miranda knew he didn't have much time left at Middleweight.
Pavlik and Miranda are 2 of my favourite fighters and I hope they do have a rematch at some point.
i believe he could win a world title. hope he does