Will or Skill ?

It's probably been asked on here before but I'm pretty new so indulge me....

Which is the most valuable attribute...I've met so many guys over the years who were naturally gifted but just didn't have the will or desire to either stick with the training or stick with the fight when it got rough or things didn't go there way in a fight. I've also seen guys walk in off the street and they instantly grasp some of the timing and punching ability that it takes others years to almost master.


In the pro's you had a fighter like Kirland Laing who was so immensley naturally gifted... and others who don't have the skill but have a heart the size of George Foremans feet... so which is the most valuable to a fighter and which would ou take... Will or Skill ?

Can get out of trouble and win with skill.
Will is heart I suppose and is great,but if you got massive skill you dont have to call on heart so much; like you would hane to do if you had no skill .
So definatley Skill for me.

Hi Shamrock,
The mind controls the body thus will supersedes skill in the overall scheme of things combative. With that said, a primary goal in fight training is to infuse will with skill and skill with will. Now, when you genuinely have a three-dimensional integration of the two, you're another breed of "animal;" you're a true warrior...

For example, analogy-wise, what good is it having the most souped-up high-performance Porsche, Mercedes, Ferrari, etc (metaphorically representing skill) if you have no gas in the tank (metaphorically representing will). Gas (i.e. Will) is what's needed to power and drive the car (i.e. skill). No gas>no power>no drive>no good.

Here's another analogy to drive the point home. Imagine your body being a gun, your hands being the bullets, and your mind the trigger. Without the trigger, the gun and the bullets are impotent.

The development of a strong mind (i.e. strong will) is of the utmost importance in functionalizing and maximizing skill. How do you do this? First and foremost, learn how to proactively control and positively channel fear...

Take Care,
Lito

You can train up and refine skillset over time,But Will is the core,Instinct,willingness to endure and confidence In said skills.Some say boxing is 3/4 mental...I agree.

Boxing is 90% mental. The other half is physical. :cool:

It takes will to produce skill, so really they're both important. :)

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Originally Posted by Clubber

It takes will to produce skill, so really they're both important. :)

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Lol you ducked the question clubber ;D

Really depends where you draw a boundary in defining skill.. I mean I think of skill as entirely aquired tactics, therefore a great skillset is indeed something that requires a strong will to develop, they go hand in hand. If your talking talent, or natural ability, that's entirely different. I'd go with talent and ability any day over will, if I had to choose. As with great talent and skills, as Andre said, you don't need to call upon your will as much. Wheras no matter how strong your will, you will always run into a fighter at some point that wants it as much as you. And if he's the better skilled fighter, your in for a beating. Just my take on it I guess. I also believe that you can develop a strong will by setting goals and making sacrifices etc, that brushing up on your skills will actually increase your will to succeed at the same time. You can't exactly acquire talent.

I think it's more focus than anything else and it takes both WILL and SKILL to be able to focus during physical abuse and the draining of energy and it takes will and skill to impliment what you are focusing on doing.


So FOCUS

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Originally Posted by Shamrock

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Originally Posted by Clubber

It takes will to produce skill, so really they're both important. :)

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Lol you ducked the question clubber ;D

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What I'm sayin' is you've got to want whenever you train. Raw will alone in the ring will probably not be enough. However, if you are willing to put some hours into training and put some effort into those hours, you can learn new skills..... :-X :confused:

I doubt that many boxers are naturally gifted, although they will have some attributes that initially stand out.
There are obviously exceptions to this, but its quite common for coaches to say Such and Such a fighter wasnt a natural talent or the best in the gym when he was young. Some fighters that I could include in that would be Pavlik, Hearns, Marciano, Tyson (Atlas said on camera that Tyson wasnt a natural), Ali. All of whom have had their trainers remark on the fact that they were no great shakes when they started.

My broken rib,and nose are saying a bit of both would be nice.
Hadnt been training,but got suckered in to bare knuckle MMA.
The will made it good,the lack of training on the other hand..........
What is both for 500 Alex

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Originally Posted by Shamrock

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Originally Posted by Clubber

It takes will to produce skill, so really they're both important. :)

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Lol you ducked the question clubber ;D

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Haha, I'd have to go with letter c, brains. ;)

Fact is, will is only useful if it's the will to learn, develop and adapt.

Reliance on Will will see a fighter set up for glorious failure.
Reliance on Skill will see a fighter extended to the limits of his skill and beyond.

The most important thing you have in the boxing ring is your mind. You need to exercise good judgement, analyse quickly and make informed decisions in split seconds.

So I'd turn down both will and skill in favour of a boxing brain, which would serve me with the mental capacity to develop skill and the desire to develop great will.

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

Fact is, will is only useful if it's the will to learn, develop and adapt.

Reliance on Will will see a fighter set up for glorious failure.
Reliance on Skill will see a fighter extended to the limits of his skill and beyond.

The most important thing you have in the boxing ring is your mind. You need to exercise good judgement, analyse quickly and make informed decisions in split seconds.

So I'd turn down both will and skill in favour of a boxing brain, which would serve me with the mental capacity to develop skill and the desire to develop great will.

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Quoted for awesomeness. :)

I can't think of this question without picturing most Mayweather fights... That is will vs skill.... Floyd makes other fighters will look completely useless...

So straight down the line I would have to say that having skill is more valuable over the long haul...
I have also seen plenty of bouts though where will has carried boxers through to some of the greatest wins in boxing... So it a trait that I always want in a champion... And boxing certainly wouldn't be what it is without the endless fighters that have unbeleivable strong will's to get through 12 gruelling rounds and still be putting in the same effort as round 1.

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Originally Posted by thecontender13

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

Fact is, will is only useful if it's the will to learn, develop and adapt.

Reliance on Will will see a fighter set up for glorious failure.
Reliance on Skill will see a fighter extended to the limits of his skill and beyond.

The most important thing you have in the boxing ring is your mind. You need to exercise good judgement, analyse quickly and make informed decisions in split seconds.

So I'd turn down both will and skill in favour of a boxing brain, which would serve me with the mental capacity to develop skill and the desire to develop great will.

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Quoted for awesomeness. :)

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I agree with that.. Chalk one up for Donny in the reps owed department..

I still think you'll be a great candidate to take over the "ask the trainer" section one day

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Originally Posted by Dizaster

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Originally Posted by thecontender13

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

Fact is, will is only useful if it's the will to learn, develop and adapt.

Reliance on Will will see a fighter set up for glorious failure.
Reliance on Skill will see a fighter extended to the limits of his skill and beyond.

The most important thing you have in the boxing ring is your mind. You need to exercise good judgement, analyse quickly and make informed decisions in split seconds.

So I'd turn down both will and skill in favour of a boxing brain, which would serve me with the mental capacity to develop skill and the desire to develop great will.

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Quoted for awesomeness. :)

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I agree with that.. Chalk one up for Donny in the reps owed department..

I still think you'll be a great candidate to take over the "ask the trainer" section one day

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Ha I'm not so sure about that.
I've got a lot to learn, but thanks mate.

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Originally Posted by hitmandonny

Fact is, will is only useful if it's the will to learn, develop and adapt.

Reliance on Will will see a fighter set up for glorious failure.
Reliance on Skill will see a fighter extended to the limits of his skill and beyond.

The most important thing you have in the boxing ring is your mind. You need to exercise good judgement, analyse quickly and make informed decisions in split seconds.

So I'd turn down both will and skill in favour of a boxing brain, which would serve me with the mental capacity to develop skill and the desire to develop great will.

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Thanks for the reply's guys. Some great ones... this being my favourite. A few of you added a 3rd dimension to the equation - the boxing brain. It's put a whole new spin on the question for me.

Cheers fellas ;)

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Originally Posted by Clubber

It takes will to produce skill, so really they're both important. :)

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True, but there is a difference between the will/dedication it takes to get skill and the will/heart it takes spar and compete.

It's a continuum. If a guy with more heart that skill gets in with a more skilled guy with less heart, a guy who gets hesitant once you hit him hard, the less skilled guy can impose his will if the skill gap isn't too big and if the gap in will/heart is significant. If the guy is so much more skilled that the guy with tons of will, the will won't become a factor.

I'd rather be Roy Jones Jr. any day over Micky Ward.
Lets put it that way. lol.

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Originally Posted by Hulk

I'd rather be Roy Jones Jr. any day over Micky Ward.
Lets put it that way. lol.

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Yeah, me too, but I'd rather root for Micky Ward than Roy Jones Jr, but I'd rather be Micky Ward than Zab Judah, even though Micky lost to Zab.

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Originally Posted by Hulk

I'd rather be Roy Jones Jr. any day over Micky Ward.
Lets put it that way. lol.

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Yeah thats the way around I was thinking as well.
depends on how you read the question too, there are two ways and three answers if you combine the two, Umm :rolleyes: , I think.

What about Joe Frazier, Evander Holyfield, or Rocky Marciano??? Will vs Skill???

I see what you mean Lyle, while I also think that Marciano wouldn't have gotten far without the skills that went along with his style.

Rocky did go up against guys that were more experienced and skilled than him though, examples being Walcott, Charles, and Moore. He did have that special forces, take-no-prisoners attitude that allowed him to give his opponents hell for how ever long that it would take, even if it meant going through hell himself.

Tough, strong willed bastard, + super cutman, and superb trainer = next to unstoppable. One hell of a combination. Although Rocky wasn't at a lack for skill, he certainly could have used more of it.

Anyway I don't see how will and skill can be compared on absolute terms. You'll find fighters that had a lot of both, Carlos Monzon, Emile Griffith, Ezzard Charles, ad infinitum. Now if you have a high level of both, you can triumph over the competition.