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Host: Ok, in your case as a boxer and champion I imagine that decision was very hard to make because you're thinking “I'm the champion with no losses,” was it you that made the decision or your corner?
Cotto: I was the one that made it, my family was there, my children were present and I was thinking more about them rather than the beating I was getting
Of course he did!
Do i hold it against him? no! but like i said before it is what it is.
I will only label Cotto a "quitter" or "not a warrior" if he will quit again in a future fight...
.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer
Im not saying he is a quitter but when the guy admits himself he "quit" why all this discussion saying he didnt! he made the right choice i dont think sane fans hold it against him move on. All these Cottos crazies throwing around neg rep for just quoting what Cotto said its completely mad. I like Miguel but his fans are a real bunch and if not careful could turn fans against Cotto just as Pacquaios fans have (not in my case) and Pavliks quite insane fans (in everybodies case lol)
Well then call me deranged cus here comes some NEG rep. LOLQuote:
Originally Posted by MarkusdarkusQuote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer
Im not saying he is a quitter but when the guy admits himself he "quit" why all this discussion saying he didnt! he made the right choice i dont think sane fans hold it against him move on. All these Cottos crazies throwing around neg rep for just quoting what Cotto said its completely mad. I like Miguel but his fans are a real bunch and if not careful could turn fans against Cotto just as Pacquaios fans have (not in my case) and Pavliks quite insane fans (in everybodies case lol)
I'd hardly say he quit....More like he was out on his feet and had nothing left in his legs when he went down.
You can't give more than everything youv'e got.
Is it called quiting when your hands can't even raise up from your sides to defend a punch, and the only way you can avoid taking more beating is by walking backwards... In not to many steps time, your back is going to be against a rope, and Cotto had nothing left to stop the onslaught....
Does a "warrior" need to stand there, with nothing left in the tank to defend, and take punches to the head willingly until the drop them to the floor, for them to not be labeled a quitter?
Come on.. It's not like he was just tired, or decided he was to far behind on points to come back and didn't give himself a chance at a knockout win.. The guy was beaten to the point he had nothing left, whether he stood there as a human punching bag until getting dropped to the floor, or admitting he's done for the sake of not getting totally wasted makes no difference..
I don't consider the point where he could not fight on anymore quitting...
nothing personal, but kinda pointless thread
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dizaster
LAST TIME!
Thats not what Cotto said he said he took the knees not because he couldnt take anymore but because he wanted too.
Do you guys speed read or read and actually not get what someone is saying?
He didnt quit, It was Tony made Him theres a difference, if youve been there you would know.
Markus depend in what sense you wants use this word buddy , he really wanted mean that he in that moment would not have to take unnecessary punches , he knew that cant give anymore , he in any moment abandoned the fight , he fought a damn 11 rounds bro , so i think that you really wanted like others , to see that Cotto had to died in the line unnecessarly taking punches until the end , do you think if he would make this , he would be intelligent ?Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkusdarkusQuote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer
Im not saying he is a quitter but when the guy admits himself he "quit" why all this discussion saying he didnt! he made the right choice i dont think sane fans hold it against him move on. All these Cottos crazies throwing around neg rep for just quoting what Cotto said its completely mad. I like Miguel but his fans are a real bunch and if not careful could turn fans against Cotto just as Pacquaios fans have (not in my case) and Pavliks quite insane fans (in everybodies case lol)
I know that your answer have to be No , so if you want to say quit , he just wanted mean that he didn't want to take unnecessary punches , thats all , he thought on his Health and his family , that is first after all ......
He's mincing words and he knows it... Just being degrading to Cotto, why bring it up if you think he did the right thing:confused: Because you are using the word QUIT to denote something a heartless loser would do.. Like how Golata quit against Tyson, Andrew would deserve to have that Quitter tag and negative condintation attached to him. Cotto on the other hand fought his heart out and had nothing left anymore to intelligently defend himself... Thats the difference
Quote:
Originally Posted by MachoMarkus depend in what sense you wants use this word buddy , he really wanted mean that he in that moment would not have to take unnecessary punches , he knew that cant give anymore , he in any moment abandoned the fight , he fought a damn 11 rounds bro , so i think that you really wanted like others , to see that Cotto had to died in the line unnecessarly taking punches until the end , do you think if he would make this , he would be intelligent ?Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkusdarkusQuote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer
Im not saying he is a quitter but when the guy admits himself he "quit" why all this discussion saying he didnt! he made the right choice i dont think sane fans hold it against him move on. All these Cottos crazies throwing around neg rep for just quoting what Cotto said its completely mad. I like Miguel but his fans are a real bunch and if not careful could turn fans against Cotto just as Pacquaios fans have (not in my case) and Pavliks quite insane fans (in everybodies case lol)
I know that your answer have to be No , so if you want to say quit , he just wanted mean that he didn't want to take unnecessary punches , thats all , he thought on his Health and his family , that is first after all ......
Nothing wrong with what he did but im not going to label him a warrior for it. Many a fighter has done that before. Cotto is still P4P and a great fighter one of my favorates. He will go down in modern history as a great fighter but a warrior no.
If you say so , that is your Opinion Markus..............Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkusdarkusQuote:
Originally Posted by MachoMarkus depend in what sense you wants use this word buddy , he really wanted mean that he in that moment would not have to take unnecessary punches , he knew that cant give anymore , he in any moment abandoned the fight , he fought a damn 11 rounds bro , so i think that you really wanted like others , to see that Cotto had to died in the line unnecessarly taking punches until the end , do you think if he would make this , he would be intelligent ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Markusdarkus
I know that your answer have to be No , so if you want to say quit , he just wanted mean that he didn't want to take unnecessary punches , thats all , he thought on his Health and his family , that is first after all ......
Nothing wrong with what he did but im not going to label him a warrior for it. Many a fighter has done that before. Cotto is still P4P and a great fighter one of my favorates. He will go down in modern history as a great fighter but a warrior no.
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Originally Posted by MachoIf you say so , that is your Opinion Markus..............Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkusdarkusQuote:
Originally Posted by Macho
Nothing wrong with what he did but im not going to label him a warrior for it. Many a fighter has done that before. Cotto is still P4P and a great fighter one of my favorates. He will go down in modern history as a great fighter but a warrior no.
Ok then Cotto was knocked out and he didnt give an interview saying he took those knees.
I really dont know what really you want to know my friend.........:-\
Cotto is a warrior and also a family man, we're forever proud of him. What counts is he gave his all, no excuses. Like a soldier Cotto will re-group and prepare for a counter strike.
he had nothing left physically and mentally and his corner did the right thing in stopping the fight.
I am ready to say this now. IMO Cotto quit in that fight.Watch that 12th round again after the first kneel down.He get's up and into an exchange against the ropes Margarito around then backs up to the corner and kneel's again without a punch landing. I will always remember that kneel down in the eleventh to stop the fight and so will many others. I am not calling Cotto a quitter he fought his ass off but in that exchange of punches he kneeled down twice and gave up.
Phuking guy. The 12th round eh?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fightfan
Did you watch the fight?
I don't remember a 12th round.
Yes Cotto did quit, honestly he had nothing left and would have been knocked the phuk out, he could barely stand and he could barely keep his hands up. Miguel exuberated every ounce of energy in this fight and Tony with all of the punches he landed on Miguel especially the ones to the body, just zapped Cotto.
How do I say this delicately?
Did Cotto quit? Yes...
Did he do it because he was scared of Tony or Tony just ruined him?...No
Did he do it for his family and maybe his pride in not wanting to get stopped? Only he knows; but you could see him looking towards his family, and maybe he just knew that whatever he gave to Tony it wasn't going to be enough; as Tony was possessed that night.
Cotto put on a masterclass of boxing and any other man in the division would have fallen from the beating he was giving to Tony. But I saw Cotto give almost everything he had and he must have known Tony was going to stop him in that 11th round or the last round, as nothing that night was going to hinder Margo from that win.
And he was also hurting; as no other man in that division would have taken what Miguel took and lasted as long; not even Clottey IMO. If you think Tony won because Cotto got tired of hitting him in the face than you are an idiot. Tony hurt that man several times during the fight; and that coupled with the sheer physical output Cotto was giving must have been wreaking havoc on his system physically. Cotto only lacks in one thing, and that is the steel plated chin Tony has; and so does everyone else in the WW. Cotto can beat Tony if he stays off the ropes; simple as that. It won't be a thrilling fight, but he can win.
If you want to see a quitter go look at Cintron; that p#ssy boy sat down and started crying and hadn't taken anywhere near what Cotto took from Margarito. And I don't care if Cintron did "better" in the rematch, he still looked like he wanted out of there after the 1st few rounds. That is a quitter.
Cotto had took a lot of punishment and was on his last legs, he knew he wasn't gonna finish the fight so did the sensible thing, saved himself from further punishment so he save himself for future fights.
He is gonna get criticism though form people for not being 10 counted or having the ref stop it
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Originally Posted by Danny_GPhuking guy. The 12th round eh?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fightfan
Did you watch the fight?
I don't remember a 12th round.
Yes Cotto did quit, honestly he had nothing left and would have been knocked the phuk out, he could barely stand and he could barely keep his hands up. Miguel exuberated every ounce of energy in this fight and Tony with all of the punches he landed on Miguel especially the ones to the body, just zapped Cotto.
What the fuck you babling on about you basically agreed with everything I said why so nast and negative.
I think saying he quit was a little harsh, he gassed out and took a knee knowing that he was in for a battering unless he did as he had nothing left.
I think some fighters get it into their heads that they are unbeatable and stop putting the effort into training/lifestyle etc, Boxing is a tough sport and if you don't put 100% preparation into every fight you are risking defeat, especially if you are a champion or have something that someone else wants as they will certainly be giving their all. I think that happened with Cotto, he landed the better shots on Margarito for the majority of the fight it was only the later rounds that Margarito really started pressing him and landing the solid shots. A Cotto of a few years ago never would have gassed.
If he wants to return and be the fighter he can be he needs to make sure he has that desire to give it his all, or it will happen again. he lost something in the ring that night, just like Tyson lost it to Buster Douglas, other fighters find out you are human and you can be beaten and it takes away a little bit of your advantage, you have to fight twice as hard to get that back.
I see Cotto as giving every ounce of what he had that night and simply had nothing left in him to give.
He did the right thing and I will never question his heart for it. He basically preserved what he could so he can come back and try again another day.
I would much rather a fighter play it smart like he did, than a fighter to take unnecessary punishment for the pure sake of bravado alone. He had nothing left and could not even hold his arms up.
exactlly mate , there is no one on this forum imo that would have fought on in his state, and there has to come a point when you think this isnt worht risking serious and possible permenant damage for.Quote:
Originally Posted by Deanrw
he gave as much as he could and we should all be gratefull that he and margarito gave us a great fight, rather than refering to him as quiter when he is nothing of the sort, there is only so much the human body can take before it will start to let you down and at that point you have to get out of there before you are seriously injured
oh and btw markus, judging by what youve said , do you consider the g-man to be a quitter for letting himself be counting out after taking a knee ???
Simply, That was one of the better Fights say it again Fights Ive seen in a long time. No it was a great Fight, and for that to happen it takes two great Fighters for it to Happen ;D Got it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer
Excuse me people for quoting myself. I have to bring this up again since I was neg rep for this comment. I only have one question, will you label Cotto a "quitter" or "not a warrior" if he will do it again in a future fight?
If you quit once, it will not necessarily makes you a "quitter" but if you do it regularly then it's just right to call you a "quitter".
When you're under heavy attack and you can't take any more punishments since you're already totally zapped out then take a knee. It's the smartest form of quitting.
There is a point where it stopps being called quitting and it starts being called knowing you are not going to win. Cotto just realized there was no way he was going to win after that first KD. What would be the point of continuing.
If you want to call it quitting than go ahead but you might as well call the visiting team in a baseball game as quiters for not taking the field in the 2nd half of the last inning in a game they are loosing. It just makes no sense.
Exactly. Some boxers have gotten their careers ruined, severely injured, or even died trying to show how much of a "Warrior" they were or trying to please their fans by continuing to get punished.Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerQuote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer
Excuse me people for quoting myself. I have to bring this up again since I was neg rep for this comment. I only have one question, will you label Cotto a "quitter" or "not a warrior" if he will do it again in a future fight?
If you quit once, it will not necessarily makes you a "quitter" but if you do it regularly then it's just right to call you a "quitter".
When you're under heavy attack and you can't take any more punishments since you're already totally zapped out then take a knee. It's the smartest form of quitting.
I wouldn't call any fighter 'quitter' its downright rude. Do it to Miguels face one day instead of in here all safe and sound and see who quits first. They are all their own men who dont have to bend over for the two bit fans who only want more blood or ko's, they do what they feel is right for their own progression in life.Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerQuote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer
Excuse me people for quoting myself. I have to bring this up again since I was neg rep for this comment. I only have one question, will you label Cotto a "quitter" or "not a warrior" if he will do it again in a future fight?
If you quit once, it will not necessarily makes you a "quitter" but if you do it regularly then it's just right to call you a "quitter".
When you're under heavy attack and you can't take any more punishments since you're already totally zapped out then take a knee. It's the smartest form of quitting.
I will call a boxer a "quitter" if he quit in several fights. But I will also objectively consider the reasons why he quit.Quote:
Originally Posted by AndreI wouldn't call any fighter 'quitter' its downright rude. Do it to Miguels face one day instead of in here all safe and sound and see who quits first. They are all their own men who dont have to bend over for the two bit fans who only want more blood or ko's, they do what they feel is right for their own progression in life.Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerQuote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer
Excuse me people for quoting myself. I have to bring this up again since I was neg rep for this comment. I only have one question, will you label Cotto a "quitter" or "not a warrior" if he will do it again in a future fight?
If you quit once, it will not necessarily makes you a "quitter" but if you do it regularly then it's just right to call you a "quitter".
When you're under heavy attack and you can't take any more punishments since you're already totally zapped out then take a knee. It's the smartest form of quitting.
For me, quitting in more than one fight makes the boxer a "quitter".
To say he Quit in its truest form is an insult to both Cotto & Tony.When a man is beat physically,tired,exhausted,and finding no answers while being over whelmed ....he losses.Margarito put him in that position,brought him there.I have always had a problem believing a man Chooses to loss by his own hand.Cotto has honor and fought his heart out,NO quitter he but with big time respect, it was not his descision to make at that point! Be it devastating or not,a No-mas or a beat down.....Spoils and Respect as well to the victor.
Now, Rahman in the Toney Fight..............:dontknow: :-X
quit, quit·ted, quit·ting
1. to stop, cease, or discontinue: She quit what she was doing to help me paint the house.
2. to depart from; leave (a place or person): They quit the city for the seashore every summer.
3. to give up or resign; let go; relinquish: He quit his claim to the throne. She quit her job.
4. to release one's hold of (something grasped).
5. to acquit or conduct (oneself).
6. to free or rid (oneself): to quit oneself of doubts.
7. to clear (a debt); repay. –verb (used without object)
8. to cease from doing something; stop.
9. to give up or resign one's job or position: He keeps threatening to quit.
10. to depart or leave.
11. to stop trying, struggling, or the like; accept or acknowledge defeat.
Yawn....Whats the matter,No Pac vs. DelaHoya circus to rave about Mr. Barnum ;D;D
I think to make this whole thing simpler, the original topic should have been called, "I don't think cotto is a warrior because he took a knee"... That's what your opinion is...
Some people would say you need to be a warrior to even go 5 rounds with Margarito in the form he's been in.. Going a full 11 rounds and maintaining competitiveness throughout, even winning possibly half the rounds.. Taking some of Margarito's best drillings and still coming to the last minute... If that doesn't earn warrior status in someone's book, then they need a new book...
Taking a knee when under extreme pressure gives you a quick breather to regroup and try again to win the fight instead of getting knocked out right there.. It is as much strategy as anything..
Do you also take the win away from Coralles and say that he wasn't a warrior against Castillo because he spat out his mouthguard a few times to get a breather.... That fight was the definition of 2 warriors going at it... Both showed more heart that most people do in their entire lives... But i'm sure you'll find purpose to take that status away from Coralles as well...
Maybe you should step into the ring for a few round with someone who's got it over you, and see how long you can take punishing for....
I can truely name only FEW boxers who you could not call warriors...
Ha ha :lolhaha: me getting negative rep for posting the definition or meaning of the word "quit"...
:lolhaha: this is unbelievable...
Did Cotto quit? Ya, in some ways he did. He succumbed to the will of Margarito. In the 11th round, Cotto reached a point physically and mentally where he had nothing left to give and took a knee (twice) as a result. He made the conscious choice to drop to his knees.
But that doesn't mean Cotto lacks heart. He fought his ass off for 11 rounds, he just ran out of gas. It happens, even to good/great fighters.
Quitting after giving your all is better than quitting because things aren't going your way. I'd say cotto gave it his all. You can't blame a guy for quitting to avoid serious permanent damage. He gave it his all and it just wasn't enough against Margarito.
Look it is mincing words,most of us in here fuk but people dont come up and call us fucker, out of plain respect and a certain intelligence linked to their survival.Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerI will call a boxer a "quitter" if he quit in several fights. But I will also objectively consider the reasons why he quit.Quote:
Originally Posted by AndreI wouldn't call any fighter 'quitter' its downright rude. Do it to Miguels face one day instead of in here all safe and sound and see who quits first. They are all their own men who dont have to bend over for the two bit fans who only want more blood or ko's, they do what they feel is right for their own progression in life.Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer
For me, quitting in more than one fight makes the boxer a "quitter".
Notice the word Quitter has the same context; its disrespectful (a label )because it has exactly the same intent behind it!
Quitters dont give it their best shot, quitters in the true sence of the word and how we all feel about it 'fold early'.
We need to leave the implication of being a chicken out of it cause its in there with the word quitter and you know it is.
Exactly.... I mean, going by some sort of dictionary definition, you could say Floyd quit... If there is someone knocked out on the canvas, but there is 1% of them that can get up but 99% that can't, then they are a quiter for not using that 1% to get up... It's ridiculous..Quote:
Originally Posted by AndreLook it is mincing words,most of us in here fuk but people dont come up and call us fucker, out of plain respect and a certain intelligence linked to their survival.Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerI will call a boxer a "quitter" if he quit in several fights. But I will also objectively consider the reasons why he quit.Quote:
Originally Posted by Andre
For me, quitting in more than one fight makes the boxer a "quitter".
Notice the word Quitter has the same context; its disrespectful (a label )because it has exactly the same intent behind it!
Quitters dont give it their best shot, quitters in the true sence of the word and how we all feel about it 'fold early'.
We need to leave the implication of being a chicken out of it cause its in there with the word quitter and you know it is.
It's also ridiculous to try to find a context in which you can use the word "quit" with regards to how the Cotto/Margarito fight ended.. Becuase you can find SOME context to call just about anything in life "quitting", but is it truely necessary to search for that context in order to make things negative?
In terms of boxing where two fighters in there with the potential of giving each other permanent brain damage, then our standards need to be a little bit fucking higher with throwing around words that have the purpose of degrading a boxers performance in such a way that the word quiter uses..
And prizefight boxing is the terms that we are talking here... Under those terms, the word quitter has very very little place... Especially in ANY 12 rounder..