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Forget Floyd Mayweather, while he was amazing, I don't think you would have seen him showing that kind of level of skill against the best middleweight in the world at the age of 43. I'm not a fan of B-Hops attitude, but as a fighter you can have nothing but respect for what he brings. Tonight was truly amazing performance. If he retires on that it is an amazing way to go out. Congrats to B-Hop, one of the most skillful fighters I've ever seen.
If you long over the long haul, for sure he is, but Roy would have beaten him in the 90's at any point. And Mayweather was better then him this decade, but over those two decades nobody in overall has compared to him.
Except for Jones. you may well be right.
No don't buy it. Great Yes but Greatest of the last 20 years - No.
He lost to Calzaghe and Jones Jnr so how can he rate above them? He doesn't.
As someone who has watched boxing for well over 30 years now,ladies and gents,be thankfull, youve gotten to watch one of the all timers.
Its a shame it wasnt appreciated until late in his career,but last night proved,youve gotten to watch one of the great ones.
Pernell Whitaker
Julio Cesar Chavez
Ricardo Lopez
Marco Antonio Barrera
Erik Morales
Roy Jones Jr
James Toney
Floyd Mayweather Jr
Would argue that ;)
Everybody?Quote:
Originally Posted by ICB
James Man Titties Toney?
He took roids, and even roided we have a picture of him on our refrigerator to remind us to watch our diet
:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyEverybody?Quote:
Originally Posted by ICB
James Man Titties Toney?
He took roids, and even roided we have a picture of him on our refrigerator to remind us to watch our diet
James Toney was a fantastic fighter that actually did win the Heavyweight title, against Samuel Peter but was robbed of a decision. He has won titles from Middleweight all the way up to Cruiserweight.
Beating names like.
Iran Barkley
Michael Nunn
Evander Holyfield
Mike McCallum x2
Tim Littles
Charles Williams
Doug DeWitt
Merqui Sosa
Reggie Johnson
Vassiliy Jirov
etc
Plus he has had 80+ fights i would say he has a good argument.
Peter wasn't world champ when he fought Toney, he won it later against Maskaev, the Toney fight, both of them were WBC eliminatorsQuote:
Originally Posted by ICB:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyEverybody?Quote:
Originally Posted by ICB
James Man Titties Toney?
He took roids, and even roided we have a picture of him on our refrigerator to remind us to watch our diet
James Toney was a fantastic fighter that actually did win the Heavyweight title, against Samuel Peter but was robbed of a decision. He has won titles from Middleweight all the way up to Cruiserweight.
Beating names like.
Iran Barkley
Michael Nunn
Evander Holyfield
Mike McCallum x2
Tim Littles
Charles William
Doug DeWitt
Merqui Sosa
Reggie Johnson
Vassiliy Jirov
etc
Plus he has had 80+ fights i would say he has a good argument.
Thought for sure he had a title ? oh well but he did really win it against John Ruiz. The steroid thing was overrated IMO, its not like it had any real effect on him :-\Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboPeter wasn't world champ when he fought Toney, he won it later against Maskaev, the Toney fight, both of them were WBC eliminatorsQuote:
Originally Posted by ICB:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey
James Toney was a fantastic fighter that actually did win the Heavyweight title, against Samuel Peter but was robbed of a decision. He has won titles from Middleweight all the way up to Cruiserweight.
Beating names like.
Iran Barkley
Michael Nunn
Evander Holyfield
Mike McCallum x2
Tim Littles
Charles William
Doug DeWitt
Merqui Sosa
Reggie Johnson
Vassiliy Jirov
etc
Plus he has had 80+ fights i would say he has a good argument.
Because styles make fights, and I'm willing to bet Hopkins beats more opposition than Jones and Calzaghe do. That's how you can put him over them.Quote:
Originally Posted by WelshDevilRob
Other than kessler and Hopkins though, who has Calzaghe beaten?
Please don't say lacy, who fought NO ONE before fighting Calzaghe.
I think it was Toney's highly coveted IBO title that was on the line or some shitQuote:
Originally Posted by ICBThought for sure he had a title ? oh well but he did really win it against John Ruiz. The steroid thing was overrated IMO, its not like it had any real effect on him :-\Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboPeter wasn't world champ when he fought Toney, he won it later against Maskaev, the Toney fight, both of them were WBC eliminatorsQuote:
Originally Posted by ICB
He may have lost to Calzaghe but it was a very very close SD12 but he has fought better opposition than Calzaghe through out his career so he should rank higher than Calzaghe.Quote:
Originally Posted by WelshDevilRob
Im still not sure whether I really agree with that first bit. I mean I suppose he is essentially more versatile than Jones or Calzaghe, but at the same time he didn't really beat anyone I would pick over either of those two if the fights had happened... What does seperate him from them though is that whether he was better suited to beat a wider array of top opponents or not, he did just that. He has beaten at least 5 top fighters who he wasn't really favoured to, despite being such a proven fighter long ago. That's what gives him an edge imo.Quote:
Originally Posted by intoccabileBecause styles make fights, and I'm willing to bet Hopkins beats more opposition than Jones and Calzaghe do. That's how you can put him over them.Quote:
Originally Posted by WelshDevilRob
Other than kessler and Hopkins though, who has Calzaghe beaten?
Please don't say lacy, who fought NO ONE before fighting Calzaghe.
Well if we are talking about the last 25 years i would say Sugar Ray Leonard was a better fighter then Hopkins was but just a thought.
My bad i read the title wrong for some reason i thought you said 20 years my mistake what about the body snatcher he has to be up there i would think as well.
He has the best resume of the last 20yrs imo.
Yeah, that Eubank was shite, wasnt he.Quote:
Originally Posted by intoccabileBecause styles make fights, and I'm willing to bet Hopkins beats more opposition than Jones and Calzaghe do. That's how you can put him over them.Quote:
Originally Posted by WelshDevilRob
Other than kessler and Hopkins though, who has Calzaghe beaten?
Please don't say lacy, who fought NO ONE before fighting Calzaghe.
Name ONE fighter who Bernard haas beaten that you don't think Calzaghe would have beaten?Quote:
Originally Posted by intoccabileBecause styles make fights, and I'm willing to bet Hopkins beats more opposition than Jones and Calzaghe do. That's how you can put him over them.Quote:
Originally Posted by WelshDevilRob
Other than kessler and Hopkins though, who has Calzaghe beaten?
Please don't say lacy, who fought NO ONE before fighting Calzaghe.
Are people forgetting Bernard was 43 against Calzaghe, and his loss is heavil disputed? I still don't think Calzaghe would do very well against Winky Wright, nor that he would able to duplicate this performance against Kelly Pavlik, much of what Bernard has done is attributed to his defensive skills that Calzaghe simply doesn't have, Winky would land that jab of his on Calzaghe all night, and he would block 90% of the punches Calzaghe throws because they are so wide, and Winky wouldn't be backed up by Joe either. I think Pavlik would land on Calzaghe with that right hand, I don't think he could beat Calzaghe, but I think he would win a few rounds, and who knows he hits harder then anyone Calzaghe has ever faced, and that might lead to something though I would heavily doubt it.
I honestly think Winky Wright beats Joe Calzaghe, I think Glen Johnson could be very difficult for Joe. I also don't think Calzaghe could beat that Trinidad or Pavlik or Tarver to the degree that Hopkins did. I also think that Roy Jones Jr would have destroyed Calzaghe, while Hopkins made a lot of people doubt Roy's abilities after that fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboName ONE fighter who Bernard haas beaten that you don't think Calzaghe would have beaten?Quote:
Originally Posted by intoccabileBecause styles make fights, and I'm willing to bet Hopkins beats more opposition than Jones and Calzaghe do. That's how you can put him over them.Quote:
Originally Posted by WelshDevilRob
Other than kessler and Hopkins though, who has Calzaghe beaten?
Please don't say lacy, who fought NO ONE before fighting Calzaghe.