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Indonesian champion Chris John successfully defended his WBA featherweight title against Japanese challenger Hiroyuki Enoki in Tokyo,Japan on October 24, 2008...
I always considered Chris John a real fighter and champion after he defeated Juan Manuel Marquez before...
I thought he got a gift vs Marquez.
Is Enoki any good?
Quote:
Originally Posted by napoleon336
http://d.yimg.com/a/p/sp/getty/59/fu...ba-ina-jpn.jpg
Look at John's face, he got battered by Enoki... Juan Manuel Marquez was not able to do even one third of that damage...
Enoki must be good...
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Marquez couldn't do that to John's face, but he did beat him. That was a good example of a hometown decision. Not one of the worst, but I think Marquez won that fight...Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerQuote:
Originally Posted by napoleon336
http://d.yimg.com/a/p/sp/getty/59/fu...ba-ina-jpn.jpg
Look at John's face, he got battered by Enoki... Juan Manuel Marquez was not able to do even one third of that damage...
Enoki must be good...
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...John's face is pretty busted up though!
Yeah that was the other time JMM got robbed. Chris John's a good fighter no doubt, but will definately be staying in Indonesia for a while, save a few trips to Japan.Quote:
Originally Posted by caleoh12Marquez couldn't do that to John's face, but he did beat him. That was a good example of a hometown decision. Not one of the worst, but I think Marquez won that fight...Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerQuote:
Originally Posted by napoleon336
http://d.yimg.com/a/p/sp/getty/59/fu...ba-ina-jpn.jpg
Look at John's face, he got battered by Enoki... Juan Manuel Marquez was not able to do even one third of that damage...
Enoki must be good...
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...John's face is pretty busted up though!
JMM always cried he got robbed everytime he lost a fight... JMM a good boxer and he's always a difficult opponent... His fights were competitive but he always cry when he can't get the judges nods...Quote:
Originally Posted by killersheepYeah that was the other time JMM got robbed. Chris John's a good fighter no doubt, but will definately be staying in Indonesia for a while, save a few trips to Japan.Quote:
Originally Posted by caleoh12Marquez couldn't do that to John's face, but he did beat him. That was a good example of a hometown decision. Not one of the worst, but I think Marquez won that fight...Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer
...John's face is pretty busted up though!
I favor Chris John over JMM if they have a rematch...
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I sent some Neg. Reps your way SaddoBoxer...
I wont even reply to your comments cause they are not even debatable but like I told you in the message.
I can respect good posts, I can respect debatable posts but what you've done for sometime now is just nonsense.
I tried many times to just say you were not being given an opp. when people said things about your posting ways but time after time you proved them right and me wrong.
I think you'll find that once you re-read your posts when you've logged out you'll silly how silly they are.
Remember this be a fan of the sport 1st, THEN be a fan of a boxer.
Then and only then will you appreciate the sport.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
No problem at all MOD Mick... You have the right to neg rep me if you don't agree what I posted...
I just said in the post (the one you don't agree with) that "Enoki must be good"... "since he was able to inflict damage on Chris John that JMM wasn't able to do"...
I think I have some good basis on my assessment on Enoki based on this John fight... Plus he's undefeated coming to this fight... and he has a draw with Aoh, the same boxer who floored Larios last week and gave Larios a very difficult fight...
I still stick to my opinion that "Enoki is a good boxer"...
By the way, what's your assessment of Enoki?
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Some peeps here agreed with me that Chris John is for real... I hope JMM is interested to avenge his loss to John... A rematch will be a real good competitive fight maybe at 130 lbs.
I always put John up in the higher level of the top tier of the sport but he has little recognition mainly due to his fights staying in Indonesia...I was blasted by guys here for giving him soo much respect that many felt was undeserved....
The guy has all the skills and I wish he would venture out to the states or UK where he would be in some higher profile bouts but that is his choice...
IMO he will start to lose his natural ability before this happens and end up being taken out by an underdog eventually
Whats damage on a opponents face got anything to do with it ? Julio Cesar Chavez busted up Meldrick Taylor's face, but he was still miles behind on points.Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerQuote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
No problem at all MOD Mick... You have the right to neg rep me if you don't agree what I posted...
I just said in the post (the one you don't agree with) that "Enoki must be good"... "since he was able to inflict damage on Chris John that JMM wasn't able to do"...
I think I have some good basis on my assessment on Enoki based on this John fight... Plus he's undefeated coming to this fight... and he has a draw with Aoh, the same boxer who floored Larios last week and gave Larios a very difficult fight...
I still stick to my opinion that "Enoki is a good boxer"...
By the way, what's your assessment of Enoki?
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The fact is JMM clearly beat Chris John this isn't even debatable, its not the worst decision i've ever seen. But JMM clearly won by 3 rounds, and JMM has every right to cry about that decision, and his decision losses to Manny Pacquiao.
Many people felt he won both Manny Pacquiao fights, they wern't robberies. But i felt he won both fights by 1 point, i don't know what you have against JMM. He is a great boxer and is always willing to fight the best.
John is a crafty boxer with good movements. He can also bang and take a punch if he wants to. I consider his resume better than Edwin Valero. Valero is more known since he's a puncher and KOs his bum opponents...
John is considered among the top 20 P4P... He just need another win over other champs in order to barge into the top 10... Not necessarily the fight to occur in the US, for example John can fight Jorge Linares in Japan....
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That damage answers the question "Is Enoki any good?"Quote:
Originally Posted by ICBWhats damage on a opponents face got anything to do with it ? Julio Cesar Chavez busted up Meldrick Taylor's face, but he was still miles behind on points.Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerQuote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
No problem at all MOD Mick... You have the right to neg rep me if you don't agree what I posted...
I just said in the post (the one you don't agree with) that "Enoki must be good"... "since he was able to inflict damage on Chris John that JMM wasn't able to do"...
I think I have some good basis on my assessment on Enoki based on this John fight... Plus he's undefeated coming to this fight... and he has a draw with Aoh, the same boxer who floored Larios last week and gave Larios a very difficult fight...
I still stick to my opinion that "Enoki is a good boxer"...
By the way, what's your assessment of Enoki?
.
The fact is JMM clearly beat Chris John this isn't even debatable, its not the worst decision i've ever seen. But JMM clearly won by 3 rounds, and JMM has every right to cry about that decision, and his decision losses to Manny Pacquiao.
Many people felt he won both Manny Pacquiao fights, they wern't robberies. But i felt he won both fights by 1 point, i don't know what you have against JMM. He is a great boxer and is always willing to fight the best.
Some people scored the John-JMM fight to John, it's highly debatable... Like you said, it's not the worst decision so isn't it a rematch is the best answer to this controversy?
Absolute nonsense. I'll believe it when I see it. This title defense does nothing for me. Chris John is criminally overrated until he fights a decent opponent on TV. It's not even a case of insisting that everything be geared towards western fans' terms. But I'll consider him protected and irrelevant unless he fights someone in a reputable judging.
Chris John is nobody.
The man has been world champion for 4 years has a 42-0-1 record with a 50% + KO ratio....He may not fight outside Indonesia or Japan or may not fight the comp you think he should but the man is far from being a Nobody, Any fighter who goes out there and apply's his craft champion or contender, love him or hate him can not be considered a nobody....Quote:
Originally Posted by hairymadness6
Think before you post it makes you sound like an idiot....
Pretty easy to sit back on a computer in a boxing forum and make such assumptions
He needs to get his ass to the USA IMO. Nobody knows him at all and its a shame really because he has so much potential. Hopefully he can be offererd enough money to go to the USA and really progress his career and name.
I haven't seen one person who thought Chris John deserved to the JMM fight, i would say it was a clear win for JMM by atleast 3 rounds. It was competitive no doubt but i think its hard to see, anything else but a clear cut win for JMM.Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerThat damage answers the question "Is Enoki any good?"Quote:
Originally Posted by ICBWhats damage on a opponents face got anything to do with it ? Julio Cesar Chavez busted up Meldrick Taylor's face, but he was still miles behind on points.Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer
The fact is JMM clearly beat Chris John this isn't even debatable, its not the worst decision i've ever seen. But JMM clearly won by 3 rounds, and JMM has every right to cry about that decision, and his decision losses to Manny Pacquiao.
Many people felt he won both Manny Pacquiao fights, they wern't robberies. But i felt he won both fights by 1 point, i don't know what you have against JMM. He is a great boxer and is always willing to fight the best.
Some people scored the John-JMM fight to John, it's highly debatable... Like you said, it's not the worst decision so isn't it a rematch is the best answer to this controversy?
The rematch is out of the question JMM is a Lightweight, Chris John is a Featherweight. And i don't really think JMM needs to revenge the loss that bad. Because nearly everyone who see the fight thought he won. If Chris John was willing to move to Super Featherweight then JMM might consider it, but i highly doubt it.
Haven't seen one person who scored it for John? How about the 3 persons whose scores mattered most? I for one saw it as a John win tho it's a very close fight...Quote:
Originally Posted by ICBI haven't seen one person who thought Chris John deserved to the JMM fight, i would say it was a clear win for JMM by atleast 3 rounds. It was competitive no doubt but i think its hard to see, anything else but a clear cut win for JMM.Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerThat damage answers the question "Is Enoki any good?"Quote:
Originally Posted by ICB
Some people scored the John-JMM fight to John, it's highly debatable... Like you said, it's not the worst decision so isn't it a rematch is the best answer to this controversy?
The rematch is out of the question JMM is a Lightweight, Chris John is a Featherweight. And i don't really think JMM needs to revenge the loss that bad. Because nearly everyone who see the fight thought he won. If Chris John was willing to move to Super Featherweight then JMM might consider it, but i highly doubt it.
They fought at the same weight in the past and no reason they can't fight again on an agreed weight... Everybody knows JMM can easily make 130... JMM did go up in weight coz of his obsession on the boxer who closely defeated him recently... Why is JMM not itching to avenge his loss to John? Maybe he thinks John is a difficult style for him to tackle...
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I like you as a poster but i truly do think you hate JMM and are biased towards him, you might aswell say using your logic that because the judges. Scored Holyfield vs Lewis 1 a draw that it was a draw because they scored it that way ?Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerHaven't seen one person who scored it for John? How about the 3 persons whose scores mattered most? I for one saw it as a John win tho it's a very close fight...Quote:
Originally Posted by ICBI haven't seen one person who thought Chris John deserved to the JMM fight, i would say it was a clear win for JMM by atleast 3 rounds. It was competitive no doubt but i think its hard to see, anything else but a clear cut win for JMM.Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer
The rematch is out of the question JMM is a Lightweight, Chris John is a Featherweight. And i don't really think JMM needs to revenge the loss that bad. Because nearly everyone who see the fight thought he won. If Chris John was willing to move to Super Featherweight then JMM might consider it, but i highly doubt it.
They fought at the same weight in the past and no reason they can't fight again on an agreed weight... Everybody knows JMM can easily make 130... JMM did go up in weight coz of his obsession on the boxer who closely defeated him recently... Why is JMM not itching to avenge his loss to John? Maybe he thinks John is a difficult style for him to tackle...
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And i would love to see your scorecard for John vs JMM, because i didn't really think it was a fight that could go either way. And majority of the fans who see the fight would also see it my way aswell.
The reason JMM ain't revenging his loss to John is because he doesn't need to. Just like Pacquiao didn't need to revenge his early losses. Because he is a big name now where as John still isn't, and JMM has many options. Most people thought JMM won so his loss to John doesn't hurt his legacy, just like Pacquiao's early losses don't hurt his legacy. And the Ring Magazine also agree with me regarding JMM because they have him high up in there P4P rankings.
Granting PAC will fight Torrecampo or Singsurat again (Morales was already brutally avenged), there's no meaning to it... PAC will be a heavy favorite to put these names into oblivion...Quote:
Originally Posted by ICBI like you as a poster but i truly do think you hate JMM and are biased towards him, you might aswell say using your logic that because the judges. Scored Holyfield vs Lewis 1 a draw that it was a draw because they scored it that way ?Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerHaven't seen one person who scored it for John? How about the 3 persons whose scores mattered most? I for one saw it as a John win tho it's a very close fight...Quote:
Originally Posted by ICB
They fought at the same weight in the past and no reason they can't fight again on an agreed weight... Everybody knows JMM can easily make 130... JMM did go up in weight coz of his obsession on the boxer who closely defeated him recently... Why is JMM not itching to avenge his loss to John? Maybe he thinks John is a difficult style for him to tackle...
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And i would love to see your scorecard for John vs JMM, because i didn't really think it was a fight that could go either way. And majority of the fans who see the fight would also see it my way aswell.
The reason JMM ain't revenging his loss to John is because he doesn't need to. Just like Pacquiao didn't need to revenge his early losses. Because he is a big name now where as John still isn't, and JMM has many options. Most people thought JMM won so his loss to John doesn't hurt his legacy, just like Pacquiao's early losses don't hurt his legacy. And the Ring Magazine also agree with me regarding JMM because they have him high up in there P4P rankings.
Regarding JMM vs. John rematch, John is a very live opponent and in his prime... I'm even leaning on John to defeat JMM again...
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I meant at the time bro not now as for John vs JMM, if they did fight again and it was on neutral ground then i'll have a bet with you on the fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerGranting PAC will fight Torrecampo or Singsurat again (Morales was already brutally avenged), there's no meaning to it... PAC will be a heavy favorite to put these names into oblivion...Quote:
Originally Posted by ICBI like you as a poster but i truly do think you hate JMM and are biased towards him, you might aswell say using your logic that because the judges. Scored Holyfield vs Lewis 1 a draw that it was a draw because they scored it that way ?Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer
And i would love to see your scorecard for John vs JMM, because i didn't really think it was a fight that could go either way. And majority of the fans who see the fight would also see it my way aswell.
The reason JMM ain't revenging his loss to John is because he doesn't need to. Just like Pacquiao didn't need to revenge his early losses. Because he is a big name now where as John still isn't, and JMM has many options. Most people thought JMM won so his loss to John doesn't hurt his legacy, just like Pacquiao's early losses don't hurt his legacy. And the Ring Magazine also agree with me regarding JMM because they have him high up in there P4P rankings.
Regarding JMM vs. John rematch, John is a very live opponent and in his prime... I'm even leaning on John to defeat JMM again...
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Hope John and JMM will fight again so that we can have a friendly bet...Quote:
Originally Posted by ICBI meant at the time bro not now as for John vs JMM, if they did fight again and it was on neutral ground then i'll have a bet with you on the fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerGranting PAC will fight Torrecampo or Singsurat again (Morales was already brutally avenged), there's no meaning to it... PAC will be a heavy favorite to put these names into oblivion...Quote:
Originally Posted by ICB
Regarding JMM vs. John rematch, John is a very live opponent and in his prime... I'm even leaning on John to defeat JMM again...
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerQuote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
No problem at all MOD Mick... You have the right to neg rep me if you don't agree what I posted...
I just said in the post (the one you don't agree with) that "Enoki must be good"... "since he was able to inflict damage on Chris John that JMM wasn't able to do"...
I think I have some good basis on my assessment on Enoki based on this John fight... Plus he's undefeated coming to this fight... and he has a draw with Aoh, the same boxer who floored Larios last week and gave Larios a very difficult fight...
I still stick to my opinion that "Enoki is a good boxer"...
By the way, what's your assessment of Enoki?
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Chris John said it all... Enoki was as tough as JMM... Enoki must be good...
link --> Chris John Says Enoki Was as Tough as Juan M. Marquez - Boxing News
John is skilled and has heart. I like him I want to see this fight as I heard it was a war of attrician
http://www.fightnews.com/johnstitches.jpg
John receives 70 stitches!
WBA featherweight champion Chris John had to undergo minor surgery at the MMC Hospital in Jakarta, as soon as he arrived in Indonesia on Saturday night after his hard fought twelve-round title defense against the tough boxer Hiroyuki Enoki in Tokyo, Japan.
According to Chris John Management's press release, the doctors needed more than 2 hours to operate Chris John wound under his right eye and over his left eye. In total, John needed 70 stitches, and it will take at least one month for recovery. About the very tough fight in Tokyo, John commented that Enoki as tough as Juan Manuel Marquez.
He admitted his wounds were suffered due to Enoki's punches and headbutts. During the fight, John was injured under his right eye and over his left eye, while Enoki's left eye was completely closed. John finally won by unanimous decision (118-110 by two judges and 117-111).
i like John and from the couple of fights I've seen he looks good, its a shame he doesn't fight the top fighters in his division in the US
you been drinking, Mick ?Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
That's because john refused to exchange with jmm, knowing that he would have a gift decision if the fight has gone the distance, which eventually happened.Quote:
Originally Posted by SaddoBoxerQuote:
Originally Posted by napoleon336
http://d.yimg.com/a/p/sp/getty/59/fu...ba-ina-jpn.jpg
Look at John's face, he got battered by Enoki... Juan Manuel Marquez was not able to do even one third of that damage...
Enoki must be good...
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And the fact that enoki made dents on john's face proved my point: john is not a good boxer. And Jmm is ten times better than enoki.I pressume john knew the negative comments he got after the jmm fight that's why he chose to slug it out this time against enoki. If john chose to do that against jmm, he would end up being ktfo...;)
finally managed to see the chris john-JM Marquez fight the other night.
Marquez got fucking robbed
Clearly won the fight and got royally screwed over by the partizan judging.
If MOD Mick been drinking, that must be some good stuff... I like to try that booze... (joke)Quote:
Originally Posted by hitmanhattonyou been drinking, Mick ?Quote:
Originally Posted by CutMeMick
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Plopeater
Mmmm... True. But I don't care if it's in the US or not. He's got the goods. I just wanna see 'em against the best. e's a solid fighter!