Librado Andrade vs Lucian Bute My Thoughts.

I thought Bute fought a good fight but he did clinch way too much, and the ref should have been on his case more for that. But regarding the 12th round i don't think the fight should have been stopped personally.

I thought Bute showed great heart getting up, and i think if it would have been stopped it would of been just as worse and just as controversial as it is now. It would be Julio Cesar Chavez vs Meldrick Taylor all over again. Which i thought was a robbery by the way.

And i don't really see why people are making such a big deal, of the ref telling Andrade to go to the neutral corner. Because even if he wouldn't have, it wouldn't have changed the outcome of the fight because the fight was already over anyway 3 minutes of the round had passed.

And the only reason the fight wasn't stopped sooner was because, a fighter cannot be saved in the final round. But i did think Lucian Bute deserved to win, because of the great heart he showed pulling himself up when he almost had nothing left.

I'm with you there...I guess one can argue that Bute wasn't able to fight back when the ref gave the fight free again and that if the round would have been 30 seconds longer Bute would have been knocked out badly,but it wasn't...But e got up the round had only 2 seconds to go and that is that...I mean how many times did a ref gave the fight free again with a boxer out on his feet...its not that uncommon...

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Originally Posted by JohnnyKickAss

I'm with you there...I guess one can argue that Bute wasn't able to fight back when the ref gave the fight free again and that if the round would have been 30 seconds longer Bute would have been knocked out badly,but it wasn't...But e got up the round had only 2 seconds to go and that is that...I mean how many times did a ref gave the fight free again with a boxer out on his feet...its not that uncommon...

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I agree i also think people are going a bit over the top IMO, im not saying there opinions are wrong. I just think because the fight is not long over, there letting there emotions come into play.

Bute had won almost every round before that. He made a mistake wanting to exchange in the last round, he almost payed for it. But he pulled himself up like a champion and won the fight deservedly so IMO.

I was pissed off at the time, probably because I was cheering for Andrade, but the more I think about it, the more I think the same way as you Ice.

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Originally Posted by CFH

I was pissed off at the time, probably because I was cheering for Andrade, but the more I think about it, the more I think the same way as you Ice.

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I thought you would be cheering for your fellow Canadian Bute, i guess you like Andrade's exciting style better. But anyway i think what people are making too much of deal over is the ref telling off Andrade, about not being in a neutral corner.

But the fact is it wouldn't have changed the outcome of the fight what so ever, because the time was already up in the round so Andrade wouldn't have got another chance to finish Bute. I just think the ref may of been excited and didn't deal with the situation well, or he could of been trying to help Bute.

But either way it makes no difference because like i said, the time was up in the round. I think the real debate is whether the ref made a good call letting Bute survive the fight. And i think he made a good call IMO, Bute pulled himself up like a true champion at the count of 8 there was no long count.

And Bute was looking at his corner infact he looked twice at his corner, so IMO he was still aware. Although there was no question he was in serious trouble, but i think Bute deserved to win based on winning almost every single round. And also for showing champions heart for pulling himself off the canvas like a true champion, and the ref decided he wanted to let the fight continue and Bute won.

End of IMO the ref telling Andrade to go into the neutral corner is irrelvant, it was all about the ref's decision whether to let Bute to continue nothing else.

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Originally Posted by ICB

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Originally Posted by CFH

I was pissed off at the time, probably because I was cheering for Andrade, but the more I think about it, the more I think the same way as you Ice.

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Thought you would be cheering for your fellow Canadian Bute, i guess you like Andrade's exciting style better. But anyway i think what people are making too much of deal over is the ref telling off Andrade, about not being in a neutral corner.

But the fact is it wouldn't have changed the outcome of the fight what so ever, because the time was already up so Andrade wouldn't have got another chance to finish Bute. I just think the ref may of been excited and didn't deal with the situation well, or he who could of been trying to help Bute.

But either way it makes no difference because like i said, the time was up in the round. I think the real debate is whether the ref made a good call letting Bute survive the fight. And i think he made a good call IMO, Bute pulled himself up like a true champion at the count of 8 there was no long count.

And Bute was looking at his corner infact he looked twice at his corner, so IMO he was still aware. Although there was no question he was in serious trouble, but i think Bute deserved to win based on winning almost every single round. He also pulled himself off the canvas like a true champion, and the ref decided he wanted to let the fight continue and Bute won.

End of IMO the ref telling Andrade to go into the neutral corner is irrelvant, it was all about the ref's decision nothing else.

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Again I agree totally, many people are overreacting in absurd ways on here IMO.

As I agree with everything else you said, I'll just address your first post. Not that I don't like Bute, but I'm not much of a nationalist when it comes to boxing (except for Molitor). Bute's not Canadian anyways, unless he's been granted citizenship, he's a Romanian who lives in Canada (not that it really matters). I really like Andrade's personality, more than I like his style, which is limited, and I almost always cheer for the underdog as well, which is why I was cheering for Andrade.

The ref's decision was crooked because bute couldn't continue and he could not be saved by the bell. He was in no shape to continue therefore it is a tko victory for andrade if not for a crooked ref.

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Originally Posted by awdleyfuturehalloffamer

The ref's decision was crooked because bute couldn't continue and he could not be saved by the bell. He was in no shape to continue therefore it is a tko victory for andrade if not for a crooked ref.

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All Bute had to do was stand up he didn't have to continue, when im debating Chavez vs Taylor. People always use the argument that it was the ref's decision to stop it and thats final ETC. And to be honest i can't really argue that because there right.

So if these same people are saying that regarding that fight, why are they saying differently in this fight ? no matter what anyone thinks. It was the ref's decision to let Bute continue and Bute won so wheres the controversy ?

Bute was still aware he looked at his corner twice, he responded to the ref's instruction's so again i don't really understand the controversy here ?

From what i saw, Bute could barely stand. Now the one thing i had a problem with was that bute was leaning against the ropes when the ref was counting him and when asked to walk forward, he didnt look very stable and didnt really walk forward. In my book, if i was the ref i would of stopped it. If a fighter can not walk forward properly without the use of something to hold them up then the fighter can not continue whether or not it is 20 seconds or 3 seconds to go.

i think personaly the referere was correct in not stopping the fight because if it had been at the end of round 6 say for example the fighter would have been allowed to go to his corner to recover for the next round, it would not have been stopped then so why should it of been in the last round

I agree with you pretty much Ice. It would have been a robbery just to wave Bute off and call of the fight after he had it completely in the bag like that.

Andrade left his assualt too late imo. He should have got busy earlier and as for the long count, I guess if Andrade had been in the nuetral corner where he was supposed to be the ref wouldn't have sent him back there.

It may have been a bit pedantic from the ref but you can clearly see how when he's giving Bute the count he catches sight of Andrade in his peripheral vision and tells him to go back.

It may have been over the top but if he thought Andrade was making his way to the center of the ring he had to stop him.

And it's easy for us to judge but in the heat of the moment it all happens so fast and the ref isn't a machine incapable of making mistakes.

Well in the interview after the fight the ref. said that he would have counted Bute out and that Andrade made the mistake by being more than a few inches away from the corner.

In my book the ref. gave Bute much help :kissasskc4: and still Bute was totally gone , I have never seen something like this. I was pissed afterwards and still feel that the ref. looked for a way to help Bute.

I dont doubt for a second had it been Andrade on the floor we would have been counted out right away !!!!!.

Here is something for Bute that fought clever in 11 rounds

:hippy::beatup2::banllama:

What the hell is wrong with some people ? everyone keeps saying how Lucian Bute will get beat by any top Super Middleweight. And he will never travel outside his comfort zone ETC.

Lucian Bute fought a terrific fight against Librado Andrade, and used great upper body movement. Aswell as good moblity and good handspeed to totally outbox Librado Andrade.

I thought he fought an almost perfect fight against Librado Andrade, until the last round when he exchanged punches stupidly. And got caught and was almost stopped, but i think that was a good learning experience for him.

Because that will learn him that you never have the fight in the bag, until all 12 rounds over. And he also had to use his survival instincts and heart/will which he has never had to do his pro career, to win the fight.

Lucian Bute has also fought solid opposition for so early in his career. I just think this hating needs to stop, and im also disappointed certain people calling Canada one of the most biased boxing countries, because of what two fights ? please some people need to seriously grow up.

I rate him i think he is pretty good fighter.

ICB, I guess people are not hating Bute. They hate the referee.:cool:

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Originally Posted by ICB

What the hell is wrong with some people ? everyone keeps saying how Lucian Bute will get beat by any top Super Middleweight. And he will never travel outside his comfort zone ETC.

Lucian Bute fought a terrific fight against Librado Andrade, and used great upper body movement. Aswell as good moblity and good handspeed to totally outbox Librado Andrade.

I thought he fought an almost perfect fight against Librado Andrade, until the last round when he exchanged punches stupidly. And got caught and was almost stopped, but i think that was a good learning experience for him.

Because that will learn him that you never have the fight in the bag, until all 12 rounds over. And he also had to use his survival instincts and heart/will which he has never had to do his pro career, to win the fight.

Lucian Bute has also fought solid opposition for so early in his career. I just think this hating needs to stop, and im also disappointed certain people calling Canada one of the most biased boxing countries, because of what two fights ? please some people need to seriously grow up.

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So,can you tell me why Marlon Wright has been referee in Bute last five fight(three title fight),he is a Canadian

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Originally Posted by brucelee

ICB, I guess people are not hating Bute. They hate the referee.:cool:

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Your right,noboby hate Bute,he is a great fighter,but the referee suks

Bute clearly was winning the fight, and in a dominating way...feeding Andrade leather for the better part of 11 rounds.

He was 1 round short of the conditioning he needed to win the fight, and got some hometown help which, even though I was rooting for him, admit was disgusting. Also though, don't underestimate his skill. he was a much better, faster and skilled boxer then Andrade was.

Andrade too has admirable qualities. A rock steady chin. An unflinching desire to win, and a never quit mentality. He took a lot of seriously hard, and well-executed shots, again and again.

And as has been stated, people who are hating on Bute because of the results are showing nearly as much bias as the ref. who botched the ending.

Both fighters need to be respected for their performance, and abilities and merits...and Marlon needs a serious talking to.

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Originally Posted by jangeorg

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Originally Posted by ICB

What the hell is wrong with some people ? everyone keeps saying how Lucian Bute will get beat by any top Super Middleweight. And he will never travel outside his comfort zone ETC.

Lucian Bute fought a terrific fight against Librado Andrade, and used great upper body movement. Aswell as good moblity and good handspeed to totally outbox Librado Andrade.

I thought he fought an almost perfect fight against Librado Andrade, until the last round when he exchanged punches stupidly. And got caught and was almost stopped, but i think that was a good learning experience for him.

Because that will learn him that you never have the fight in the bag, until all 12 rounds over. And he also had to use his survival instincts and heart/will which he has never had to do his pro career, to win the fight.

Lucian Bute has also fought solid opposition for so early in his career. I just think this hating needs to stop, and im also disappointed certain people calling Canada one of the most biased boxing countries, because of what two fights ? please some people need to seriously grow up.

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So,can you tell me why Marlon Wright has been referee in Bute last five fight(three title fight),he is a Canadian

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I love people who are using this argument, but dismiss the arguement. When Richard Steele had been biased to Don King fighters in the past, when debating Chavez vs Taylor.

I don't know why, I just don't like him because of the hype he gets, as a Canadian I really like Steve Molitor because his is the complete package, but I am not sold on Bute, and I am definitely not sold on Pascal.

I think Bute is a good fighter but personally i feel he lost.

The ref should have stopped it, Bute was totally out on his feet.

Well we know that Bute and Marlon Wright can beat Andrade. But can Bute beat Andrade? I am not so sure.

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Originally Posted by lance Uppercut

Well we know that Bute and Marlon Wright can beat Andrade. But can Bute beat Andrade? I am not so sure.

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Lucian Bute fought great fight against Librado Andrade until he exchanged punches in the last round, there will be a rematch and Lucian Bute will win the sameway except for the 12th round disaster.

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Originally Posted by ICB

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Originally Posted by lance Uppercut

Well we know that Bute and Marlon Wright can beat Andrade. But can Bute beat Andrade? I am not so sure.

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Lucian Bute fought great fight against Librado Andrade until he exchanged punches in the last round, there will be a rematch and Lucian Bute will win the sameway except for the 12th round disaster.

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I just hope it wont be another handicap match. Maybe they should fight in a steel cage, to prevent Marlon Wright from interfering.

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Originally Posted by Taeth

I don't know why, I just don't like him because of the hype he gets, as a Canadian I really like Steve Molitor because his is the complete package, but I am not sold on Bute, and I am definitely not sold on Pascal.

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I'm a Molitor fan as well but technically I don't think he's better than Bute.

Bute is a great boxer, has got decent power but as we have no found out, has a rather suspect resistance level.

Molitor has looked great so far but he's not yet taken a punch or been in with a tough fighter.

I want to see him in with Cabellero and then guys like De Leon, Marquez, Vazquez etc before I call him the complete package. Not saying he isn't just that he's not quite faced the opposition level that Bute has faced yet.

Andrade maybe technically limited but he's a tough sob

Some people are going overboard on the Bute hate. However, I do think that Kessler would beat him up and knock him out.

Bute definitely didn't look like the guy who can be the man at the division even before the 12th. He was doing a good job of potshotting but when he got his legs taken away from him he had relatively nothing on the inside except to hold. When I took notes on the fight I first noted that in the second round and seemingly every round thereafter. So it's not like he was beating Andrade in every facet of the game, he was doing a nice job potshotting and moving but otherwise it wasn't like a vintage performance. It definitely wasn't half of what Kessler did to Andrade and it definitely doesn't put confidence into your mind that this is going to be the guy who nobody in the division can beat. Kessler needs to reemerge and fast. Oh and Mundine, Mundine should too haha

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Originally Posted by ICB

And got caught and was almost stopped,

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ALMOST? dude, i don't take anything from Bute (Boo-tay; my wife laughed all night at the pronunciation of his name)

he fought brilliantly for 11 rounds. But he got KTFO in the final seconds same as Mayorga did.

Bute is a good fighter, but he lost.

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Originally Posted by ICB

I thought he fought an almost perfect fight against Librado Andrade,

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Disagree here. His inside game is pants. He is a great boxer, when he can move away and potshot, but when Andrade got inside, he just held, and held often and held more. This is not a hate letter against Bute, just an observation, Kessler is much more the complete package IMO. Because of all the holding he was doing I couldn't say that he fought a perfect fight anymore than I could say John Ruiz has ever fought a perfect fight.

When I think perfect fight I think Mayweather vs. Gatti, or Calzaghe vs. Lacy.

Bute was gone after the knock down :stars: you can´t get saved by the bell, but you can get saved by your friend Marlon Wright.:kissing:

I bet that Andrade fells real f.... now. :bananasex:

PS I think that Bute is a very good SMW, that just got careless in the end and that it should have cost him the victory

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Originally Posted by killersheep

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Originally Posted by ICB

I thought he fought an almost perfect fight against Librado Andrade,

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Disagree here. His inside game is pants. He is a great boxer, when he can move away and potshot, but when Andrade got inside, he just held, and held often and held more. This is not a hate letter against Bute, just an observation, Kessler is much more the complete package IMO. Because of all the holding he was doing I couldn't say that he fought a perfect fight anymore than I could say John Ruiz has ever fought a perfect fight.

When I think perfect fight I think Mayweather vs. Gatti, or Calzaghe vs. Lacy.

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or hopkins-pavlik ;)