A History Question for the Brits (English?)

Here's a song by Dire Straits. I'm pretty sure they are singing about an event in English History. "Iron Hand" may refer to Thatcher. Anyone want to take a guess as to what this is all about ? Just curious.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQNTY9Nrocs

Dire Straits - Iron Hand
With all the clarity of dream
The sky so blue, the grass so green
The rank and file and the navy blue
The deep and strong, the straight and true

The blue line they got the given sign
The belts and boots march forward in time
The wood and leather the club and shield
Swept like a wave across the battlefield

Now with all the clarity of dream
The blood so red, the grass so green
The gleam of spur on chestnut flank
The cavalry did burst upon the ranks

Oh the iron will and iron hand
In englands green and pleasant land
No music for the shameful scene
That night they said it had even shocked the queen

Well alas weve seen it all before
Knights in armour, days of yore
The same old fears and the same old crimes
We havent changed since ancient times

Sounds like the Miners Strike, Thatcher at Her worst to me.

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Originally Posted by Scrap

Sounds like the Miners Strike, Thatcher at Her worst to me.

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Thanks man. From what I know, it kind of fits. I love the song, words and tone. I'll do a little research and get back to you.

Cgm, I was at there first audition on stage. Thought with the others there that they were Brilliant but wouldnt make it, it was in the punk days. Got that fucking wrong. ;D

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Originally Posted by Scrap

Cgm, I was at there first audition on stage. Thought with the others there that they were Brilliant but wouldnt make it, it was in the punk days. Got that fucking wrong. ;D

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heh heh , there's some history for you. I remember crystal clear the first time I heard Sultans of Swing on the radio. WTF? Who is this, Dylan or something? I knew it was something special. Called a buddy to ask "You heard of this song?" and he filled me in on the details. Never did see them live though. Knopfler did a show in Toronto sharing the stage with Emmylou Harris earlier this year.

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Originally Posted by Scrap

Sounds like the Miners Strike, Thatcher at Her worst to me.

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Yeah, that sure sounds like it. There's lots of info available on the net. In summary...

1984 Margaret Thatcher announces closure of many unprofitable UK coal pits, which will cost upwards of 100,000 jobs in the coal industry. Communities will be decimated.

Tens of thousands of miners go out on strike in protest. The strike is very long and bitter. Thatcher brands the strikers as "enemies within" and responds with force. Tensions are increased by "scab labour", miners who cross the lines supported by police.

There are several violent and bloody clashes between police and strikers. One in particular seems to relate to the song, it occurs at a place called Orgreave. A copy/paste from wiki...

A widely reported clash during the Miners' Strike took place at the Orgreave Coking Plant near Rotherham on 18 June 1984. This confrontation between striking miners and police, dubbed by some 'The Battle of Orgreave', was the subject of a TV re-enactment in 2001, conceived and organised by artist Jeremy Deller and recorded by Mike Figgis for Channel 4. Violence flared after police on horse-back charged the miners with truncheons drawn and inflicted serious injuries upon several individuals. In 1991, the South Yorkshire Police were forced to pay out £425,000 to thirty-nine miners who were arrested in the events at the incident.[15]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UK_mine...ike_(1984-1985)

I live 3 miles away from Orgeave, but was living in London at the time of the Strikes. The Police did some terrible things, curfews and breaking into houses and beating people up. The press were in with Thatcher nothing got much of a mention. Where there were communitys theres nothing now, sad.

So closing UNPROFITABLE coal mines is wrong? I look at that kind of the way I look at the mills closing here in North Carolina, sure the mills provide jobs and money for people and communities but they end up becoming an anchor weighing down people and basically giving them very little chance to go out and acheive away from the mills and now North Carolina has gotten better jobs now.

Change isn't always fun and easy as Barry Obama may have us find out

I dunno Lyle, is closing it down the only thing you can do with a coal mine that is unprofitable? In this case, maybe maybe not. I think there is something wrong with the way the whole thing went down. But I'm not into a debate on gov't vs union actions. I was just wondering what the song was about. And learning a little about what happened.

A) Yes the song is about the miners strike
B) Mr Empathy as allways Lyle,I got news for you Mr Bright New Jobs, apparantly Ive driven around your glorious new future state more then you have,because most of it is an impoverished S-hole. Some bright and glorious future. I love guys who are doing well off,saying a job(if your lucky) working at the Cracker Barrell so you can barely make payments on your double wide is a great and glorious future. Has it ever occured to you to look at it from the other guys point of view? Gee I worked my ass off for ten years at a union job,and even if it wasnt a fast track to the good life,it paid the bills,now Im trying to get by on what I make washing dishes at the truck stop?
Goes to show,those that view the entire world in terms of dollars and cents,usually dont have any sense.

Interestingly enougth, the mines were making money, it was political, after the goverment got coal from Germany at £10 a ton dearer, work that one out ;D

Thatcher broke up communities and worked on a system that would cement many people in poverty for the rest of their lives. I may live in London, but there's no denying the damage that cow did to people living in the north of England.

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Originally Posted by Scrap

Interestingly enougth, the mines were making money, it was political, after the goverment got coal from Germany at £10 a ton dearer, work that one out ;D

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Political as in what? The unions need to be brought down a notch or two?

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Originally Posted by CGM

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Originally Posted by Scrap

Interestingly enougth, the mines were making money, it was political, after the goverment got coal from Germany at £10 a ton dearer, work that one out ;D

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Political as in what? The unions need to be brought down a notch or two?

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Thats more or less what Reagan did with the Air Traffic Controlers,it wasnt that the demands couldnt have been easily met,it was to show they could do it.

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Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey

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Originally Posted by CGM

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Originally Posted by Scrap

Interestingly enougth, the mines were making money, it was political, after the goverment got coal from Germany at £10 a ton dearer, work that one out ;D

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Political as in what? The unions need to be brought down a notch or two?

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Thats more or less what Reagan did with the Air Traffic Controlers,it wasnt that the demands couldnt have been easily met,it was to show they could do it.

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OK, I can see that, except in England miners case case if I read it right, there was some kind of political motive in shutting down the mines, some motive that existed befiore the strike ever got started? And I was hypothesizing that the unions were too powerful for Thatcher's liking even before the big strike. See the difference?

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Originally Posted by CGM

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Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey

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Originally Posted by CGM

Political as in what? The unions need to be brought down a notch or two?

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Thats more or less what Reagan did with the Air Traffic Controlers,it wasnt that the demands couldnt have been easily met,it was to show they could do it.

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OK, I can see that, except in England miners case case if I read it right, there was some kind of political motive in shutting down the mines, some motive that existed befiore the strike ever got started? And I was hypothesizing that the unions were too powerful for Thatcher's liking even before the big strike. See the difference?

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There was fear over the Unions becoming too powerful & too great a force for the left. In the 70's they had said that Arthur Scargill, leader of the National Union of Mineworkers, had more clout than the Prime Minister. I think this is why Thatcher wanted to break them

Oh there was a political motive behind the Reagan firings as well,it was like when a mobster hits another mobster,a not so nice way of saying,"See what I can do to you" as a way to keep the unions from actually pressuring for better pay,and better rights.
It was strike breaking on a goverment level

If I remember correctly we had just entered the European Market. Now if as I remember, there was some funny dealings going on with Countrys giving concessions to others for Political gain and money. :rolleyes: