Does Pacquiao have any experience fighting with his back on the ropes?

I've been thinking of the upcoming Pacquiao-Hatton fight and comparing it to the Floyd-Hatton fight.

I gave Ricky almost no chance to beat Floyd, and my logic was simple: I didn't see a single spot in the ring where Ricky could beat Floyd.

In the center of the ring, Floyd would be dominant. Hatton fans were banking on Ricky's ability to push him to the ropes, but having watched Floyd over the years, I knew that Floyd knew how to protect himself on the ropes and throw quick counters. So even when Ricky did push Floyd's back against the ropes, he wasn't able to get many effective shots in.

Pacquiao should also be able to outquick Hatton in the center of the ring.

But when Ricky is able to push him to the ropes, how will Pacquiao fare? I ask because I can't think of a single instance where Pacquiao has been forced to fight with his back to the ropes.

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Originally Posted by SweetPea

I've been thinking of the upcoming Pacquiao-Hatton fight and comparing it to the Floyd-Hatton fight.

I gave Ricky almost no chance to beat Floyd, and my logic was simple: I didn't see a single spot in the ring where Ricky could beat Floyd.

In the center of the ring, Floyd would be dominant. Hatton fans were banking on Ricky's ability to push him to the ropes, but having watched Floyd over the years, I knew that Floyd knew how to protect himself on the ropes and throw quick counters. So even when Ricky did push Floyd's back against the ropes, he wasn't able to get many effective shots in.

Pacquiao should also be able to outquick Hatton in the center of the ring.

But when Ricky is able to push him to the ropes, how will Pacquiao fare? I ask because I can't think of a single instance where Pacquiao has been forced to fight with his back to the ropes.

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In all fairness to Hatton, Floyd took away anthting Ricky had by just ducking below the waist and having Cortez stop the action. Floyd took the punk biatch way out of this fight and landed one LUCKY punch (which he threw all night long) Pac will let Hatton fight more and it should be a very good match and not a borefest like Hatton/PBF. Again, I think Cortez was in PBF's money pocket and or vice versa.

PAC can be driven back and might be glued to the ropes but it only happens for a few seconds... PAC is too quick on his foot and can easily move to either side...

Just be careful when you try to corner PAC... That's where he's very dangerous and he will act like a cornered tiger... We saw this in the Morales 3rd fight...
.

I dont think so. when he does get cornerd or backed against the ropes he either gets out quickly or flurries back. but hatton likes pressuring and will be doing it all night until somebody gets ktfo. hopefully it will be Pac

Rd 2 Pac vs EM 3, EM attacks, Pac backs up makes EM missed then KaBOOM!!! One counter left & Morales was down.

Pac-MAB1... Pac was Dominating but MAB tried to attact but Pac's Good head & Body movement makes MAB Missed his shots.

Pac-Velasquez. Velasquez walking in them Boom one right hook spells doom & Pac finishes Velasquez.

See... Pac can counter even when backing up. It's just you guys are too used to seeing Pac in his forward attacks that you are becoming blind not to see the other aspects of Pac 's game.

With an offence as great as Manny's its very rare that his back will ever be against a rope!

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

Just be careful when you try to corner PAC... That's where he's very dangerous and he will act like a cornered tiger... We saw this in the Morales 3rd fight...
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OK, but Morales is a completely different fighter than Hatton. When Morales backed Pac to the ropes, Morales was standing upright at a slight distance and letting his hands go.

Hatton likes to bull his opponents into the ropes, clinch them, lean on them, etc. True "infighting." It's a completely different thing, and presents a different challenge to Pacquiao.

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Originally Posted by SweetPea

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

Just be careful when you try to corner PAC... That's where he's very dangerous and he will act like a cornered tiger... We saw this in the Morales 3rd fight...
.

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OK, but Morales is a completely different fighter than Hatton. When Morales backed Pac to the ropes, Morales was standing upright at a slight distance and letting his hands go.

Hatton likes to bull his opponents into the ropes, clinch them, lean on them, etc. True "infighting." It's a completely different thing, and presents a different challenge to Pacquiao.

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PAC will try to avoid and evade any intention by his opponent to push him to the ropes... but if he's cornered, his instincts is to fight back like a cornered cat... very dangerous...
.

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

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Originally Posted by SweetPea

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

Just be careful when you try to corner PAC... That's where he's very dangerous and he will act like a cornered tiger... We saw this in the Morales 3rd fight...
.

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OK, but Morales is a completely different fighter than Hatton. When Morales backed Pac to the ropes, Morales was standing upright at a slight distance and letting his hands go.

Hatton likes to bull his opponents into the ropes, clinch them, lean on them, etc. True "infighting." It's a completely different thing, and presents a different challenge to Pacquiao.

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PAC will try to avoid and evade any intention by his opponent to push him to the ropes... but if he's cornered, his instincts is to fight back like a cornered cat... very dangerous...
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I'm not questioning his instincts.

What I was hoping to start with this thread is a discussion on whether or not Pacquiao has ever faced an opponent who physically bulled him to the ropes and leaned on him the way Hatton will attempt to do.

I think it's an important element of the fight that hasn't been discussed enough.

I favor Pacquiao to win, but I do think there are unanswered questions about his ability to deal with an opponent who will attempt to be very physical in close quarters with him.

Will Hatton be allowed to do it? If the ref keeps breaking them and Manny does what Floyd did and ducks below the waist a lot it could be another long night for Ricky. I'm sure Vegas would rather have Manny Mayweather rather than a Mayweather Hatton rerun, so maybe we get another Joe Cortez-style refereeing performance. If that's the case Manny will only have to deal with being swarmed a few times in the fight.

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Originally Posted by SweetPea

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

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Originally Posted by SweetPea

OK, but Morales is a completely different fighter than Hatton. When Morales backed Pac to the ropes, Morales was standing upright at a slight distance and letting his hands go.

Hatton likes to bull his opponents into the ropes, clinch them, lean on them, etc. True "infighting." It's a completely different thing, and presents a different challenge to Pacquiao.

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PAC will try to avoid and evade any intention by his opponent to push him to the ropes... but if he's cornered, his instincts is to fight back like a cornered cat... very dangerous...
.

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I'm not questioning his instincts.

What I was hoping to start with this thread is a discussion on whether or not Pacquiao has ever faced an opponent who physically bulled him to the ropes and leaned on him the way Hatton will attempt to do.

I think it's an important element of the fight that hasn't been discussed enough.

I favor Pacquiao to win, but I do think there are unanswered questions about his ability to deal with an opponent who will attempt to be very physical in close quarters with him.

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If your intention is to bully PAC, you must have the size (or length) to push him and the speed to corner him... Talking about size, I don't consider Hatton having an advantage in this department... In fact, it's PAC who enjoys a considerable reach advantage over Hatton... They're just about evenly sized... Now about speed, it's very obvious PAC has the big advantage... So, I don't really think Hatton can successfully bully PAC inside the ring...

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

PAC can be driven back and might be glued to the ropes but it only happens for a few seconds... PAC is too quick on his foot and can easily move to either side...

Just be careful when you try to corner PAC... That's where he's very dangerous and he will act like a cornered tiger... We saw this in the Morales 3rd fight...
.

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If I can recall Morales backed Pacman up plenty in their first fight.
AND if i may add he initiated the backin up by hittin his body.
Which is somethin Hatton does well.

Hatton isn't big but he cuts of the ring great, and he has incredible footspeed, its really hard to get away from him as Malignaggi and Mayweather fought out, but Mayweather didn't really use a whole lot of lateral movement against Hatton or De La Hoya, he is so good defensively he goes straight back into the ropes either comes forward quickly(which he did, and landed cleanly a ton of times on Hatton) or he avoids everything that is thrown his way off the ropes.

Obviously Pacquiao isn't the same type of fighter, but he used a lot more movement against Oscar, and I think that trumped Oscar a lot, because when he get Floyd on the ropes Mayweather stayed there and allowed Oscar to get off ineffective flurries that looked good if you aren't counting what is landing. Against Hatton, he tied Hatton up more, Joe Cortez jumped in too quickly, but eventually his pot shots cought up with Ricky. I think Pacquiao has similar if not a little better footspeed than Hatton, and he will move around and catch Hatton coming/leaping in with that left cross. If Hatton can get Manny on the ropes it should be really interesting, but I think when Morales and Marquez and Barrera have had Pacquiao on the ropes, he looks crazy with all his body movement, but I don't think they land as much as the commentators give them credit for landing. I think he is a lot harder to hit than some people think.

I think Roach is going to come up with a good game plan for Ricky's attack..

A bit like the one time in the DLH fight were Oscar had him against the ropes for a few seconds and landed a couple of gimme's.. Roach immediately said once he returned to the corner "As soon as you feel your back touch the ropes, get out of there.. You don't belong against the ropes"..
It was obviously an emphasis of that fight and a genuine part of the game plan to keep the fight in the middle and don't let DLH have any advantage by having up against the ropes and limiting his space..

Ricky is much much better at cutting off the ring though, and if he gets the chance to overpower Pac and doesn't suffer from to many lefts coming in, Pac will have a little more to worry about... But I think Pac will train and train at turning Hatton when he feels the ropes closing in behind him, and honestly I think that could be a very key part of a Pac victory if he wins.. The ability he has to turn out of trouble as often as possible when Hatton starts to get the upper hand and pushing him back..

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Originally Posted by Taeth

Hatton isn't big but he cuts of the ring great, and he has incredible footspeed, its really hard to get away from him as Malignaggi and Mayweather fought out, but Mayweather didn't really use a whole lot of lateral movement against Hatton or De La Hoya, he is so good defensively he goes straight back into the ropes either comes forward quickly(which he did, and landed cleanly a ton of times on Hatton) or he avoids everything that is thrown his way off the ropes.

Obviously Pacquiao isn't the same type of fighter, but he used a lot more movement against Oscar, and I think that trumped Oscar a lot, because when he get Floyd on the ropes Mayweather stayed there and allowed Oscar to get off ineffective flurries that looked good if you aren't counting what is landing. Against Hatton, he tied Hatton up more, Joe Cortez jumped in too quickly, but eventually his pot shots cought up with Ricky. I think Pacquiao has similar if not a little better footspeed than Hatton, and he will move around and catch Hatton coming/leaping in with that left cross. If Hatton can get Manny on the ropes it should be really interesting, but I think when Morales and Marquez and Barrera have had Pacquiao on the ropes, he looks crazy with all his body movement, but I don't think they land as much as the commentators give them credit for landing. I think he is a lot harder to hit than some people think.

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:) I should have just pointed up and wrote "What he said"... I think I said the exact same thing as you just different words..

Brilliant people think alike right!

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Originally Posted by SaddoBoxer

PAC can be driven back and might be glued to the ropes but it only happens for a few seconds... PAC is too quick on his foot and can easily move to either side...

Just be careful when you try to corner PAC... That's where he's very dangerous and he will act like a cornered tiger... We saw this in the Morales 3rd fight...
.

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Very true!

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Originally Posted by SweetPea

I've been thinking of the upcoming Pacquiao-Hatton fight and comparing it to the Floyd-Hatton fight.

I gave Ricky almost no chance to beat Floyd, and my logic was simple: I didn't see a single spot in the ring where Ricky could beat Floyd.

In the center of the ring, Floyd would be dominant. Hatton fans were banking on Ricky's ability to push him to the ropes, but having watched Floyd over the years, I knew that Floyd knew how to protect himself on the ropes and throw quick counters. So even when Ricky did push Floyd's back against the ropes, he wasn't able to get many effective shots in.

Pacquiao should also be able to outquick Hatton in the center of the ring.

But when Ricky is able to push him to the ropes, how will Pacquiao fare? I ask because I can't think of a single instance where Pacquiao has been forced to fight with his back to the ropes.

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I think Pacquiao has been the one coming forward through his career that's why we really haven't seen him fighting against the ropes. On occasions against Marquez, Morales, Barrera when they let their hands go did Pac have to fight on the ropes. IMO, seeing how Pac guards his face when he's on the ropes leaves him open for body shots. I think Marquez was the only fighter that went to his body whenever Pac was on the ropes.

Against De La Hoya, Roach kept telling Pacquiao "As soon as you feel the ropes behind you, move to the side and get out of there right away." I'm assuming they'll go with a similar game plan for Hatton.

It's gonna be hell for Pac if he stays long there. Ricky is a butcher when he corners his opponent. That ring is gonna be his slaughter house. Pac better make it a target range so thing turns out well for him.

"in and out, side to side, and if you feel your back touching the ropes... go under and out".

-Freddie Roach

I think what Sweet Pea is asking was already answered by Chubby.

The only time that I can recall Pacquiao being on the ropes one too many a time for his own good, was in the Pacquiao VS Morales I. This is with the Pacquiao version we all know in this side of the globe.

The oriental version... he did a bit of fighting on the ropes, but not excessively as a weapon defensively. More than anything, it was more of a situation more enforced by the opposition, as he has not learnt the ability to stay out of the ropes, and the necessity to do so in those days was not a priority nor a concern.

Prior to his US campaign, I remember seeing Pacquiao on the ropes on his fights, "occasionally", employing this as defensive stance in times of confusion. He got away with it because the opposition is not the same caliber as the big three, MAB, EM, and JMM, and the like.

I think he was on the ropes and on the defensive, heavily attacked, when Nadel Hussein dropped him, but Pac still somehow managed to finish the fight winning it by a TKO. At this time, still escaping with the win, did not make him realize that with his skillset, staying away from the ropes is playing to his advantage, and strength.

It was later on with Roach, and after the beating he experienced at the hands of Morales in the first fight, did I notice a conscious effort to stay off the ropes whenever he fights. Most especially the Morales 2, when Viloria working as a color analyst for a Philippine PPV station, and who trained with Pacquiao prior to the fight, unconsciously provided inside information repeatedly in his side commentaries indicating this guideline of Roach to Pacquiao in staying off the ropes.

Since then, seldom will you find Pacquiao doing his version of the rope-a-dope. This adjustment is such a source of accomplishment, for he has never lost any fight since!

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Originally Posted by KananKrus

I think what Sweet Pea is asking was already answered by Chubby.

The only time that I can recall Pacquiao being on the ropes one too many a time for his own good, was in the Pacquiao VS Morales I. This is with the Pacquiao version we all know in this side of the globe.

The oriental version... he did a bit of fighting on the ropes, but not excessively as a weapon defensively. More than anything, it was more of a situation more enforced by the opposition, as he has not learnt the ability to stay out of the ropes, and the necessity to do so in those days was not a priority nor a concern.

Prior to his US campaign, I remember seeing Pacquiao on the ropes on his fights, "occasionally", employing this as defensive stance in times of confusion. He got away with it because the opposition is not the same caliber as the big three, MAB, EM, and JMM, and the like.

I think he was on the ropes and on the defensive, heavily attacked, when Nadel Hussein dropped him, but Pac still somehow managed to finish the fight winning it by a TKO. At this time, still escaping with the win, did not make him realize that with his skillset, staying away from the ropes is playing to his advantage, and strength.

It was later on with Roach, and after the beating he experienced at the hands of Morales in the first fight, did I notice a conscious effort to stay off the ropes whenever he fights. Most especially the Morales 2, when Viloria working as a color analyst for a Philippine PPV station, and who trained with Pacquiao prior to the fight, unconsciously provided inside information repeatedly in his side commentaries indicating this guideline of Roach to Pacquiao in staying off the ropes.

Since then, seldom will you find Pacquiao doing his version of the rope-a-dope. This adjustment is such a source of accomplishment, for he has never lost any fight since!

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I think that is a definitive answer to the question... If Hatton were to use his strengths against Pacquiao then Hussien's tactics were pretty effective.
YouTube - Manny Pacquiao v Nedal Hussein rd 4

But unless Mayweather Sr. words are just a smoke screen we won't see any of the old Hatton.

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Originally Posted by fan johnny

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Originally Posted by KananKrus

I think what Sweet Pea is asking was already answered by Chubby.

The only time that I can recall Pacquiao being on the ropes one too many a time for his own good, was in the Pacquiao VS Morales I. This is with the Pacquiao version we all know in this side of the globe.

The oriental version... he did a bit of fighting on the ropes, but not excessively as a weapon defensively. More than anything, it was more of a situation more enforced by the opposition, as he has not learnt the ability to stay out of the ropes, and the necessity to do so in those days was not a priority nor a concern.

Prior to his US campaign, I remember seeing Pacquiao on the ropes on his fights, "occasionally", employing this as defensive stance in times of confusion. He got away with it because the opposition is not the same caliber as the big three, MAB, EM, and JMM, and the like.

I think he was on the ropes and on the defensive, heavily attacked, when Nadel Hussein dropped him, but Pac still somehow managed to finish the fight winning it by a TKO. At this time, still escaping with the win, did not make him realize that with his skillset, staying away from the ropes is playing to his advantage, and strength.

It was later on with Roach, and after the beating he experienced at the hands of Morales in the first fight, did I notice a conscious effort to stay off the ropes whenever he fights. Most especially the Morales 2, when Viloria working as a color analyst for a Philippine PPV station, and who trained with Pacquiao prior to the fight, unconsciously provided inside information repeatedly in his side commentaries indicating this guideline of Roach to Pacquiao in staying off the ropes.

Since then, seldom will you find Pacquiao doing his version of the rope-a-dope. This adjustment is such a source of accomplishment, for he has never lost any fight since!

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I think that is a definitive answer to the question... If Hatton were to use his strengths against Pacquiao then Hussien's tactics were pretty effective.
YouTube - Manny Pacquiao v Nedal Hussein rd 4

But unless Mayweather Sr. words are just a smoke screen we won't see any of the old Hatton.

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Hussein lost the fight bro!!! Imitating a loser won't help Hatton!;)

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Originally Posted by Danny_G

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Originally Posted by SweetPea

I've been thinking of the upcoming Pacquiao-Hatton fight and comparing it to the Floyd-Hatton fight.

I gave Ricky almost no chance to beat Floyd, and my logic was simple: I didn't see a single spot in the ring where Ricky could beat Floyd.

In the center of the ring, Floyd would be dominant. Hatton fans were banking on Ricky's ability to push him to the ropes, but having watched Floyd over the years, I knew that Floyd knew how to protect himself on the ropes and throw quick counters. So even when Ricky did push Floyd's back against the ropes, he wasn't able to get many effective shots in.

Pacquiao should also be able to outquick Hatton in the center of the ring.

But when Ricky is able to push him to the ropes, how will Pacquiao fare? I ask because I can't think of a single instance where Pacquiao has been forced to fight with his back to the ropes.

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In all fairness to Hatton, Floyd took away anthting Ricky had by just ducking below the waist and having Cortez stop the action. Floyd took the punk biatch way out of this fight and landed one LUCKY punch (which he threw all night long) Pac will let Hatton fight more and it should be a very good match and not a borefest like Hatton/PBF. Again, I think Cortez was in PBF's money pocket and or vice versa.

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Jesus Christ...

So Cortez hates Mexicans and British trolls huh?
lol

I hope Hatton can get Pacquiao on the defensive and beat him.

I'm rootin for Hatton in this one.

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Originally Posted by Hulk

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Originally Posted by Danny_G

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Originally Posted by SweetPea

I've been thinking of the upcoming Pacquiao-Hatton fight and comparing it to the Floyd-Hatton fight.

I gave Ricky almost no chance to beat Floyd, and my logic was simple: I didn't see a single spot in the ring where Ricky could beat Floyd.

In the center of the ring, Floyd would be dominant. Hatton fans were banking on Ricky's ability to push him to the ropes, but having watched Floyd over the years, I knew that Floyd knew how to protect himself on the ropes and throw quick counters. So even when Ricky did push Floyd's back against the ropes, he wasn't able to get many effective shots in.

Pacquiao should also be able to outquick Hatton in the center of the ring.

But when Ricky is able to push him to the ropes, how will Pacquiao fare? I ask because I can't think of a single instance where Pacquiao has been forced to fight with his back to the ropes.

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In all fairness to Hatton, Floyd took away anthting Ricky had by just ducking below the waist and having Cortez stop the action. Floyd took the punk biatch way out of this fight and landed one LUCKY punch (which he threw all night long) Pac will let Hatton fight more and it should be a very good match and not a borefest like Hatton/PBF. Again, I think Cortez was in PBF's money pocket and or vice versa.

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Jesus Christ...

So Cortez hates Mexicans and British trolls huh?
lol

I hope Hatton can get Pacquiao on the defensive and beat him.

I'm rootin for Hatton in this one.

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Cortez hates British and Mexicans trolls for sure... ;)

But what Cortez hates more is a British Mexican troll (like the one below?)... ;D

http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/4900/hatton55754ur9.jpg

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Originally Posted by Pacdbest2

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Originally Posted by fan johnny

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Originally Posted by KananKrus

I think what Sweet Pea is asking was already answered by Chubby.

The only time that I can recall Pacquiao being on the ropes one too many a time for his own good, was in the Pacquiao VS Morales I. This is with the Pacquiao version we all know in this side of the globe.

The oriental version... he did a bit of fighting on the ropes, but not excessively as a weapon defensively. More than anything, it was more of a situation more enforced by the opposition, as he has not learnt the ability to stay out of the ropes, and the necessity to do so in those days was not a priority nor a concern.

Prior to his US campaign, I remember seeing Pacquiao on the ropes on his fights, "occasionally", employing this as defensive stance in times of confusion. He got away with it because the opposition is not the same caliber as the big three, MAB, EM, and JMM, and the like.

I think he was on the ropes and on the defensive, heavily attacked, when Nadel Hussein dropped him, but Pac still somehow managed to finish the fight winning it by a TKO. At this time, still escaping with the win, did not make him realize that with his skillset, staying away from the ropes is playing to his advantage, and strength.

It was later on with Roach, and after the beating he experienced at the hands of Morales in the first fight, did I notice a conscious effort to stay off the ropes whenever he fights. Most especially the Morales 2, when Viloria working as a color analyst for a Philippine PPV station, and who trained with Pacquiao prior to the fight, unconsciously provided inside information repeatedly in his side commentaries indicating this guideline of Roach to Pacquiao in staying off the ropes.

Since then, seldom will you find Pacquiao doing his version of the rope-a-dope. This adjustment is such a source of accomplishment, for he has never lost any fight since!

---

I think that is a definitive answer to the question... If Hatton were to use his strengths against Pacquiao then Hussien's tactics were pretty effective.
YouTube - Manny Pacquiao v Nedal Hussein rd 4

But unless Mayweather Sr. words are just a smoke screen we won't see any of the old Hatton.

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Hussein lost the fight bro!!! Imitating a loser won't help Hatton!;)

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;D I'm a dummy, "KananKrus" has the astute answer! :bashtroll4cx4: hahahahaha.... I have to learn to use that preview button more often.