BOXINGTALK
As per boxingtalk. I can't wait to see this fight, if it happens.
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BOXINGTALK
As per boxingtalk. I can't wait to see this fight, if it happens.
Man that would be a great fight, their styles should make exciting, Kelly pressing the action and Arthur picking his shots, won't go the distance, it can't go the distance.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
No way it goes the distance. If it does, I see Pavlik's work rate carrying him to a UD.
I think this really is a pick-em fight. If Abraham just covers up and lets Pavlik wail away on him (as his is wont to do), he's fucked. But if he uses his footwork and counter-punches as he's able do, it could spell all kinds of trouble for Pavlik. I have no idea who would win, but I lean towards Pavlik.
If this one happens its going to be a cracker, these two are made for each other, got to go with Abraham he is one tough hombre and has the skills to outbox Pavlik but can Kelly out fight and out work him over 12 hard rounds, he has a good chance if Abraham gets lazy.
it has to happen
I'm gonna plump for Abraham on this one, Pavlik is a bit to straight up for me, gotta be a great fight if it happens though.
This is one of the biggest fights that can be made at the moment.......Should be a barn burner.....
Hope it happens!
I think Pavlik is sooooooooooo overated. I see Abraham in a UD over asslick.;D
Abraham tko 10.
I do think this would be a very good fight. Abraham with his sneaky counterpunching power and Kelly with his all out punching power and workrate. I think this fight would come down to Kelly's constant pressure and workrate. Sure you can shoot holes through it like Hopkins did but you really can't hurt him. Honestly we still really don't know about Abraham's chin. I know I know he fought through twelve rounds with Miranda with a broken jaw, but we still have never seen him tested. Pavlik would give him all he handle and probably stop him in eight or nine.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hunter
Agreed
It has to happen and the winner becomes a boxing superstar.
I like both guys but Abraham has more to his game. He stops Pavlik late or wins on points . Great fight !
I think Top Rank are tryna duck out of this knowin Abraham can't stay at the weight much longer. I think Abraham breaks him down by Rd 10, he's just too much slicker than Pavlik, thus leavin the Youngstown crowd silent. I like Kelly but just can't see him takin this
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fightfan
I would like to know what the hell you consider "tested"?
That has to be one of the best sentences of all time ;DQuote:
Originally Posted by The Fightfan
The only thing stopping this fight from happening is the same as it has always been...Pavlik. Pavlik and his team refuse to even negotiate a fight with King Arthur.
AA would Ko Pavlik by the 9th round... Abraham is a beast for 160, and has 1 punch Ko power, I can see Kelly getting countered by AA left hook stunned and finished off...
This fight needs to happen
The problem with this fight as far as Arum sees it is it's a VERY high risk fight--one many believe Pavlik will lose--against a guy who really brings little money to the table because he is unknown in the states. You can't really blame Top Rank from an economic view point. But Arum has said he wants Pavlik to fight three more times this year a possibly put Abraham on an undercard to build hype for the fight late this year or early next. Abraham is going to have to leave Germany and get on American TV if he wants to build the fight into something economically viable.
On the other hand, there really aren't many options for Pavlik at 160. It's a weak division right now. The only other candidates who people would care about seeing are the Winky-Williams winner and maybe Sturm. A Duddy fight would do good business at the gate but wouldn't be competitive. Forrest's name has been mentioned. Not many attractive options.
Arum seems to want to milk Pavlik for all he's worth at this point. It's understandable from a business point of view as Pavlik could sell out arenas in Ohio and Atlantic City fighting mediocre opposition. They're talking about matching him against Sergio Mora next, again in Ohio; that's even more of a gimme than Rubio was (and I'm one of the few Sergio Mora fans).Quote:
Originally Posted by ClubberLang
Someone else mentioned it earlier in this thread (I can't remember who), but I agree that Top Rank are waiting out Abraham because he's not going to be able to stay at the weight much longer. He's already has trouble making weight in the past.
Could be. But, with that said, how much longer can we expect Pavlik to make 160? He's an even bigger middleweight than Abraham, I can't see him continuing to make the weight much longer. At 168, Pavlik is going to have some problems because he won't be able to walk guys down as easily at that weight.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHArum seems to want to milk Pavlik for all he's worth at this point. It's understandable from a business point of view as Pavlik could sell out arenas in Ohio and Atlantic City fighting mediocre opposition. They're talking about matching him against Sergio Mora next, again in Ohio; that's even more of a gimme than Rubio was (and I'm one of the few Sergio Mora fans).Quote:
Originally Posted by ClubberLang
Someone else mentioned it earlier in this thread (I can't remember who), but I agree that Top Rank are waiting out Abraham because he's not going to be able to stay at the weight much longer. He's already has trouble making weight in the past.
Not that it is necessarily true, but I've always read the Pavlik camp say that he can make 160 comfortably and that certainly isn't the case with Abraham. At some point though you would think that Pavlik has to move up.Quote:
Originally Posted by ClubberLangCould be. But, with that said, how much longer can we expect Pavlik to make 160? He's an even bigger middleweight than Abraham, I can't see him continuing to make the weight much longer. At 168, Pavlik is going to have some problems because he won't be able to walk guys down as easily at that weight.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHArum seems to want to milk Pavlik for all he's worth at this point. It's understandable from a business point of view as Pavlik could sell out arenas in Ohio and Atlantic City fighting mediocre opposition. They're talking about matching him against Sergio Mora next, again in Ohio; that's even more of a gimme than Rubio was (and I'm one of the few Sergio Mora fans).Quote:
Originally Posted by ClubberLang
Someone else mentioned it earlier in this thread (I can't remember who), but I agree that Top Rank are waiting out Abraham because he's not going to be able to stay at the weight much longer. He's already has trouble making weight in the past.
Pavlik - AA could potentially be a FOY fight. Pavlik takes him out though on shear will, home ring (USA) and conditioning. I've come accustomed to watching Kelly KO or just flat out beat down and punish every opponent since his 1st pro fight but I can see this one possibly going the distance with both champs even possibly getting knocked down. Kelly prevails and rules every part of the division!!!
This would be a great match.Guarenteed action.There is not a whole lot happening at 160,it has to come off.The blueprint to get to Pavlik is there,movement,combination punching,do not stand in front of him.He really did not show many changes at all in with sheepish Rubio,...what you see is what you get.I think Abraham is too varied for straight line frontal Pavlik,could keep him off balance,punch in between thoses long arms....might just get a TKO late if he can stun him on the temple and clean him up but most likely a distance fight.
Graat fight,if it happens.I`d favor Pavilik in the fight,but it`s A toss up really,both Guy`s can punch,and both Guy`s can take punches,could easily be FOTY.The thing is Abraham likes to lay in there and play his defence for good stints of alot of rounds,and for some reason it seems guy`s look at Kelly,and because they dont see A rippled 6 pack stomach they get the impression that he`s not strong.Then they get in the ring with him and find out.
Abraham would have to get lucky because pavlik will pummel him all night. It could go either way if a lucky punch does occur.
Ya?!?!?!?! that what I thought:confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by boozeboxerI would like to know what the hell you consider "tested"?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fightfan
Quote:
Originally Posted by JazMerkinThat has to be one of the best sentences of all time ;DQuote:
Originally Posted by The Fightfan
Huh!!!! "I know I know he fought through twelve rounds with Miranda with a broken jaw, but we still have never seen him tested."
The guy was spitting blood from a grotesquely swollen jaw which forced him to fight with his mouth open, he was getting hit in the nuts :-X constantly, and still he got through and did enough to win the fight. That was a test KP has never even comtemplated. No, I see AA exploding from his peek-a-boo and icing KP with a hook from hell---or at keast I hope that's what I see. This one has the same importance of Calzaghe-Kessler.
I also think AA has a better corner.
Cant see it happening if you ask me
arum and sauerland are miles apart and both can probably make decent money fighting others in their respective countrys.
I fear we could once again miss out on a great european talent because of their unwillingness to put their necks on the line stateside and i genuinely dont see this coming off
OK, so you think his overrated, certainly you're entitled to your opinion, but what has he done to deserve that kind of disrespect?Quote:
Originally Posted by mrbig1
This is the fight I most want to see this year I think! I just don't know which way to go. I think i'd just favour Pavlik but nothing would surprise me in this fight.
I think you are right about Kelly winning by decision if it goes to the cards, but I see that as a likely outcome. Abraham could definitely catch him with a counter and put him down and I give him a good chance to stop Pavlik, but I see Pavlik by UD as the most likely outcome. But not by much.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
Quote:
Originally Posted by holmcallQuote:
Originally Posted by JazMerkinThat has to be one of the best sentences of all time ;DQuote:
Originally Posted by The Fightfan
Huh!!!! "I know I know he fought through twelve rounds with Miranda with a broken jaw, but we still have never seen him tested."
The guy was spitting blood from a grotesquely swollen jaw which forced him to fight with his mouth open, he was getting hit in the nuts :-X constantly, and still he got through and did enough to win the fight. That was a test KP has never even comtemplated. No, I see AA exploding from his peek-a-boo and icing KP with a hook from hell---or at keast I hope that's what I see. This one has the same importance of Calzaghe-Kessler.
Listen people we all have seen fighter's fight with broken jaws,broken hands,busted eardrums,cuts all over the face. What usually happens after a round or two it gets numb. Though it may look grotesque to us I will go on a limb here and say he most likely didn't feel it after that round or two until the fight was over and he was at a calm state. As most fighter's would state who have had thing's broken in battles. In his fight's against Eastman,Ikeke,Jantuah,etc. none of these fighter's pressured him the way Kelly would or not nearly hit as hard as Kelly would. Kelly was beaten by Hopkins, Downed against Taylor to get up and stop him, in the rematch was in a tightly tested battle until the championship rounds and won. The man has been tested in championship fights. One encounter of being a fighter by having a broken jaw show's that you are a tough son of a bitch but that is one encounter.
I don't dislike Abraham he is a good fighter and with this fight if he wins he could be great. But I think this man's career and reputation is solely based on that one incident and fight.
This fight could be as even as it gets, but the one thing that can't be measured is heart. Sure AA has heart but Kelly has allot to prove to those haters who wrote him out when he lost to the great Hopkins, and still overlooked the beating he handed to Rubio. With all that aside nothing hits home to the heart like family, and the most driving motivation to Kelly now is the new baby his wife gave birth to days after Rubio. He will continue and finish his career as the champ and one of the best MW ever. A father wanting to make not only his daughter proud but now his FIRST BOY this is motivation that I believe will pull Kelly through.
I appreciate that you're a fan of his, & I have to say I do like Pavlik, but I can see no way that he can become one of the great MWs, other than through sheer hype and popularity. He's a good fighter, but he's just not & IMO never will be up there with the best. There's just too many greats in that division, the likes of Greb, Cerdan, Hagler, Robinson, Monzon & Hopkins to name just a few, and I just don't think Kelly has what it takes to be up there with them.Quote:
Originally Posted by mexirican
I don't think that's a valid statement. People are stating that as evidence of his chin, and also his toughness and heart. That's one aspect, but is far from all the positives that've been said about AA even in just this thread. Give at least some of us more credit than that!Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fightfan
So getting knocked down and going 12 hard rounds is more of a test then getting your jaw broken by probably one of the biggest punching middle/super middleweights of this generation and THEN going the rest of the fight to a decision?Quote:
Originally Posted by The FightfanQuote:
Originally Posted by holmcallQuote:
Originally Posted by JazMerkin
Huh!!!! "I know I know he fought through twelve rounds with Miranda with a broken jaw, but we still have never seen him tested."
The guy was spitting blood from a grotesquely swollen jaw which forced him to fight with his mouth open, he was getting hit in the nuts :-X constantly, and still he got through and did enough to win the fight. That was a test KP has never even comtemplated. No, I see AA exploding from his peek-a-boo and icing KP with a hook from hell---or at keast I hope that's what I see. This one has the same importance of Calzaghe-Kessler.
Listen people we all have seen fighter's fight with broken jaws,broken hands,busted eardrums,cuts all over the face. What usually happens after a round or two it gets numb. Though it may look grotesque to us I will go on a limb here and say he most likely didn't feel it after that round or two until the fight was over and he was at a calm state. As most fighter's would state who have had thing's broken in battles. In his fight's against Eastman,Ikeke,Jantuah,etc. none of these fighter's pressured him the way Kelly would or not nearly hit as hard as Kelly would. Kelly was beaten by Hopkins, Downed against Taylor to get up and stop him, in the rematch was in a tightly tested battle until the championship rounds and won. The man has been tested in championship fights. One encounter of being a fighter by having a broken jaw show's that you are a tough son of a bitch but that is one encounter.
I don't dislike Abraham he is a good fighter and with this fight if he wins he could be great. But I think this man's career and reputation is solely based on that one incident and fight.
If he had knocked out Miranda after he had his jaw broken then we can say that. But the fact that Abraham went a tough distance against Miranda is much more difficult then just going 12 rounds and or getting knocked down.
The one time Pavlik was extremely tested an dealing with serious adversity was against Hopkins, and he lost. He was knocked down against Jermain Taylor but Taylor blew his load trying to knock him out and I doubt Jermain hits as hard as Miranda, and I also doubt that Jermain broke Pavlik's jaw.
The only thing Pavlik comes close to in "test" that Abraham has endured, was him fighting Hopkins, and he lost. Abraham has been tested in some of the worst ways a boxer could.
Ok so what your saying is, if pavlik pulls out a halliburton or Battle axe and severs a limb, thats being tested?Quote:
Originally Posted by The FightfanQuote:
Originally Posted by holmcallQuote:
Originally Posted by JazMerkin
Huh!!!! "I know I know he fought through twelve rounds with Miranda with a broken jaw, but we still have never seen him tested."
The guy was spitting blood from a grotesquely swollen jaw which forced him to fight with his mouth open, he was getting hit in the nuts :-X constantly, and still he got through and did enough to win the fight. That was a test KP has never even comtemplated. No, I see AA exploding from his peek-a-boo and icing KP with a hook from hell---or at keast I hope that's what I see. This one has the same importance of Calzaghe-Kessler.
Listen people we all have seen fighter's fight with broken jaws,broken hands,busted eardrums,cuts all over the face. What usually happens after a round or two it gets numb. Though it may look grotesque to us I will go on a limb here and say he most likely didn't feel it after that round or two until the fight was over and he was at a calm state. As most fighter's would state who have had thing's broken in battles. In his fight's against Eastman,Ikeke,Jantuah,etc. none of these fighter's pressured him the way Kelly would or not nearly hit as hard as Kelly would. Kelly was beaten by Hopkins, Downed against Taylor to get up and stop him, in the rematch was in a tightly tested battle until the championship rounds and won. The man has been tested in championship fights. One encounter of being a fighter by having a broken jaw show's that you are a tough son of a bitch but that is one encounter.
I don't dislike Abraham he is a good fighter and with this fight if he wins he could be great. But I think this man's career and reputation is solely based on that one incident and fight.
I just dont understand what in Fuks name you allude to 3/4 of the time... your standard related to anything aside from superman ability, is deemed inferior...
AA's reputation is absolutely stellar.... Certainly on Par with Pavlik
From the posts, it seems most people favor Abraham. For me,this fight is too tough to call. I've seen Abraham go to sleep for half a round too many times. Pavlik too has definite faults. Hopkins showed the blueprint to beating him. Yet, Abraham doesn't have a style that is similar to Hopkins. Nothing like it really. Also, in the same way that Hatton jumped up in weight to get knocked out by PBF, Pavlik jumped up in weight to be schooled by Hopkins, but at junior welterweight and at middleweight, it is difficult to see someone beating them (that's why it is hard to pick Manny in Hatton's next fight).
One thing that is certain is that Pavlik isn't ducking anyone and neither is Abraham. They are both warriors. I'm sure they'd fight king kong if you put him in the ring with them.
Since losing to Hopkins, Pavlik knocked out Rubio. Since beating Miranda, Abraham beat Marquez and is now fighting Simon. Each needs to fight a more elite name soon. I've heard there is talk of Pavlik fighting Forrest. That's a scrap.
hopkins is a slick mover with a great defence. Abraham has a good defence but is nowhere near the slick mover that hopkins is. Therefore abraham is much much more hittable than hopkins. When pavlik lands his punches he wears down an opponent very quickly. Abraham has hands of cement so either has a good chance of winning. it could easily go either way. I'd love to see this fight.
It's much a clash of styles as who's the harder puncher.
Pavlik the pursuer will probably win a decision and outland AA.
Pavlik is not as open as Mirinda and Abraham is suspect workwise .
I think AA likes to work on the front foot but is adept on the backfoot his level of opponent has been pretty average whereas Pavlik with the exception of Rubio has been pretty much consistent.
Comparing Hopkins and Abraham defensivly is a bit misleading , Abraham likes to throw hard shots and then get out of range whereas Hopkins picks straight punches in particular the well timed right and then likes to smother , AA uses the ring more but is obviously stealing a rest as he does .
That could play into Pavliks hands he doesnt mind taking a few to get his own home and if he can cut the ring off and engage AA consistently over the 12 rounds I see him winning.