Where would you rank these guys all time?

Ok if their careers ended (some already have) today where would you rank these guys in the top 100 list? Of course you may not have them in the top 100 at all.

Ricardo Lopez

Joe Calzaghe

Bernard Hopkins

Manny Pacquaio

Juan Manuel Marquez

James Toney

Sugar Shane Mosley

Roy Jones

I'm not going to put down my rankings yet as I'm not totally sure yet

a couple of observations

-I'd have Hopkins higher than anyone else, somewhere probably between 20-30 although that's a guess considering I'd have to make a top twenty or thirty to figure that out. The general consensus that a 44 year old should be the favorite if he moves up 25 pounds to face a well regarded cruiser weight champion is crazy.

-I don't know where to put Ricardo Lopez. I know he has some followers that put him way up towards the top of the list but I just can't put him anywhere near there as he simply doesn't have the big wins that others have even though he was never beaten. He certainly has the skills and I think he's one of the best fighters I've seen but compare his competition to even the other people on this list, its not a good comparison IMO. I would have him towards the bottom side of the 100.

-I have no idea where I'd put Calzaghe. I think he'd be a successful fighter in any era but not sure what to make of his competition.

-At least act like there's some objectivity about Pac and JMM. Twenty years from now they will be thought of as serious All time greats. I would have Pac tentatively at the bottom half of the top 50 and JMM somewhere between 50-75.

Granted I'd probably change my mind a lot about these if I actually made a top 100 list. I'm just happy that I made a boxing thread that wasn't about Lorissa Rivas.

I may close this thread if it turns into the stupid

couldnt really say. I would definatly have Bhop in the top 20 though. just the way he has kept himself going despite his age is incredible.

Joe is the same sorta thing. despite his hand problems and the stick he gets for his slapping he has just got on with it. Won most of his fights on pure workrate wich is what sets him apart i think. aint seen noone who can hold a pace like Joe.

I'm mainly thinking people would just put an estimate, like somewhere between 40-50, etc., if you come out and say you have Shane at number 73, that's a bit too Britkiddish.

With Calzaghe he's a great fighter, he's got two real good wins recently with Kessler and Hopkins, with Lacy its a question of do you believe Lacy was more of a never was or was he ruined, and Jones does nothing for me, from day one I said that was an absolute farce. Then you've got Eubank who though not in his prime was still a good win. And then there's a lot of iffiness even though he was still winning (granted you could say the same for a stretch of Hopkins career)

Going undefeated has to count for something.

I think Hopkins age is overplayed. He's been in a no lose situation for years because of it.

The guy should be greatly respected for what he's achieved with a lack of natural talent.

But no fighter that boringly ugly should be rated near the pinnacle. If he's top 20-30 all time boxing is shit. Serious.

I don't know, I don't see how the age factor could be overplayed, he's 44 and still at the top of the sport.

And as far as boring goes, I don't see how that plays into ratings. For one its totally subjective, I find guys like Sam Peter, Edwin Valero, guys that aren't seen by most as boring, even Calzaghe boring and ugly to watch, more so than Hopkins, its just a matter of preference. I suspect a lot of all out war type fans wouldn't be thrilled by Willie Pep. And Hopkins has only really been boring in the conventional sense since his mid 30's.

There should be a rule that fighters don't get ranked on all time lists unless they are dead or really retired or something... there is way too much recognition with modern day fighters to be objective.

I agree, everyone get out

Even if Hopkins only became boring as he aged it's where his best wins are.

You're rating him top 20-30 ALL TIME because of his recent achievements, no?

Without doubt he should be commended for being at the top of the sport at his age.. but he's been the underdog because of it in all his recent fights. He has nothing to lose.

The recent achievements put him over the top, push him past Roy IMO yes. The longevity in general.
Its just a matter of I don't think boring should play a part in it is all.

Ricardo Lopez 40-50

Joe Calzaghe 50-60

Bernard Hopkins 40-50

Manny Pacquaio 50-60

Juan Manuel Marquez 50-60

James Toney 70-80

Sugar Shane Mosley 60-70

Roy Jones 10-20

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Originally Posted by OumaFan

The recent achievements put him over the top, push him past Roy IMO yes. The longevity in general.
Its just a matter of I don't think boring should play a part in it is all.

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Fair enough, I guess being boring shouldn't really be a factor, he has proven to be a great fighter.. but I think he's horrible to watch.

This feeling has been greatly influenced by staying awake till 4am to watch him.. err.. bore many times.

If you had experienced this you may feel different. Serious.

I was a fan and I don't know if I'd have stayed up till 4, if you live in the US they come on at like 10, something to think about

who would you have rated the highest out of those listed?

Good Thread. I'd say of the group you've mentioned...

1. Hopkins, Jones to me they clearly lead the pack ( probably top 30 )

2. The rest. Too close to call, but probably Mosely leads the rest. anywhere from 40 - 100. I'd say they could all be top 100 material.

Great names, one and all. I actually hate ranking fighters in a scale like this, and would rather just throw out a thumbs up or down as to if they are top 100 quality. But, I'll try to play along in this instance.

I think Pacquaio and Marquez still have a lot left in the tank and possibly some career-defining fights in their future, even though Pacman is claiming he's retiring soon - as it stands, they both belong in the top 100 for sure. Pacman is always exciting to watch and entertainment-wise, the man is definately in the top 40. Marquez is one of the most consistent fighters around and has vulnerabilities, bringing drama to every fight he is in. No one can deny that both men have been great for boxing.

Ricardo Lopez : Top 25. Retiring undefeated while successfully defending his title 26 times makes this a no-brainer.

Joe Calzaghe : Top 50. Before he obliterated the over-rated Lacy, many people had no idea just how talented and adaptable Joe C was (including myself). Retiring in his prime may be the best decision he ever made and should secure his legacy.

Bernard Hopkins : Top 25. Boring for the casual fan but he embodies the sweet science for those of us who recognize it. His greatest talent is the ability to nullify the strengths of his opponent, and for many, that's just plain boring. That should not however, diminish his standing.

James Toney : Top 50. I really wish he would have retired a decade ago and I wish RJJ would have given him the rematch. His early-mid career was absolutely amazing. When his character began to take center stage over his talent, his legitmacy began to be diminished.

Shane Mosley : Top 50 or better. The only things that outshines Sugar Shane's talent is his heart and class. He had a lot of ups and downs, but brings it all when he steps into the ring. Is very rarely in a boring fight and as shown vs Margarito, still has a lot of fight in him.

Roy Jones : 75-100 at best. If ego was rated this guy would be right up there with Ali. He hand-picked far too many of his opponents in his prime. I actually felt bad for the guy when Joe C got ahold of him.

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Originally Posted by OumaFan

I was a fan and I don't know if I'd have stayed up till 4, if you live in the US they come on at like 10, something to think about

who would you have rated the highest out of those listed?

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Why have you made a serious thread? This is quite worrying.. am i meant to say Pac is no.1 :-\

Roy is the best of that lot.

Roy beat Hopkins, Toney and way past his best had some success (decked him) against Calzaghe.

Lopez has no star names.

Pac and Marquez are basically the same. Mosley is a hot-&-cold merchant.

Well for me if Mosley keeps wining and few more big wins he could be put above Hopkins and Jones he has same quailty wins as they do and has kept strong longer then Jones did and as far as Calzaghe not sure were to put him but he deserves to be some where in the 100 but as far as Mosley and Hopkins they still fighting hard to call Jones i would say some were in the top 30 but tell you the truth think people while always rank those guys below people like Whitker Hearns and Leonard type of fighters.

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Originally Posted by Fenster

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Originally Posted by OumaFan

I was a fan and I don't know if I'd have stayed up till 4, if you live in the US they come on at like 10, something to think about

who would you have rated the highest out of those listed?

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Why have you made a serious thread? This is quite worrying.. am i meant to say Pac is no.1 :-\

Roy is the best of that lot.

Roy beat Hopkins, Toney and way past his best had some success (decked him) against Calzaghe.

Lopez has no star names.

Pac and Marquez are basically the same. Mosley is a hot-&-cold merchant.

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I used to make serious threads all the time when I was a boxing fan

Not like I'm really gonna argue against Roy being rated the highest but I do think you can't just write off the last six or so fights

anyways

Morales

Barrera

ODLH

LOL, just kidding ODLH isn't a top 100 fighter

i really hope marquez doesnt do a morales and fight on 1-2 fights longer than he should do (not that he should retire yet)

Of the current batch only pac, marquez, mosley can be considered potential hall of famers

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Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

i really hope marquez doesnt do a morales and fight on 1-2 fights longer than he should do (not that he should retire yet)

Of the current batch only pac, marquez, mosley can be considered potential hall of famers

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Bernard Hopkins :confused::-X

Floyd obviously is a lock

Some of his fans will never admit but he did deserve some of the shit he got there for a while but his resume is there, even if he doesn't come back he's clearly top 100 no doubt, top 50 I would say.

Ricardo Lopez--Very High

Joe Calzaghe-- Very high

Bernard Hopkins--very high

Manny Pacquaio - tbd

Juan Manuel Marquez -tbt

James Toney. high but he is ruining his legacy by staying on too long

Sugar Shane Mosley- tbd

Roy Jones-very high

Ricardo Lopez - 20-30

Joe Calzaghe - 70-80

Bernard Hopkins - 10-20

Manny Pacquaio - 70-80

Juan Manuel Marquez - 80-90

James Toney - 70-80

Sugar Shane Mosley- 60-70

Roy Jones - 10-25

Floyd Mayweather - 10-20

Some of those can change & get higher such as Pac & JMM & even Floyd & JC if they were to come back. The RJJ one I found the hardest as in his prime, I would have had him easily up in the top 10, however, the last few years have really damaged. I honestly don't think I could make a decent assessment until at least 5 years after all these guys are retired

I think it's nuts to try and just put them into a top 100 list... I wouldn't even know where to start.

Ricardo Lopez
Joe Calzaghe
Bernard Hopkins
Manny Pacquaio
Juan Manuel Marquez
James Toney
Sugar Shane Mosley
Roy Jones

Instead I would rate them as follows. In a all around career look.

Lopez
RJJ
JMM
SSM
Hopkins
Toney
Pac
Joe

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Originally Posted by CutMeMick

I think it's nuts to try and just put them into a top 100 list... I wouldn't even know where to start.

Ricardo Lopez
Joe Calzaghe
Bernard Hopkins
Manny Pacquaio
Juan Manuel Marquez
James Toney
Sugar Shane Mosley
Roy Jones

Instead I would rate them as follows. In a all around career look.

Lopez
RJJ
JMM
SSM
Hopkins
Toney
Pac
Joe

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I decided to rate them in order like u Mick. My picks are a bit different tho.

RJJ
Lopez
BHOP
SSM
Pac
Joe
JMM
Toney

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CutMeMick

I think it's nuts to try and just put them into a top 100 list... I wouldn't even know where to start.

Ricardo Lopez
Joe Calzaghe
Bernard Hopkins
Manny Pacquaio
Juan Manuel Marquez
James Toney
Sugar Shane Mosley
Roy Jones

Instead I would rate them as follows. In a all around career look.

Lopez
RJJ
JMM
SSM
Hopkins
Toney
Pac
Joe

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The order isnt a million miles away . I am happy with those picks.

Ricardo Lopez - Around 25ish all time. His problem was his size. Not enough coverage.

Joe Calzaghe - Barring Lennox the greatest british fighter of all time. World maybe 20th.

Bernard Hopkins - Very similar ranking to Calzaghe but a place above.

Manny Pacquaio - Still has a bit to do but i'd say top 50.

Juan Manuel Marquez - Same as Pacquiao.

James Toney - I'd say top 100. If he'd stayed around LHW and kept in shape maybe higher.

Sugar Shane Mosley - Again top 50 but he could rise if he repeats his last performance.

Roy Jones - The only man in this list that makes the top 10 for me. He was so naturally gifted that he could do pretty much what he wanted in the ring in his prime and it was a real shame to see his fall from grace. Hopefully he wins next week and goes out on a high!

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Originally Posted by eagle

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CutMeMick

I think it's nuts to try and just put them into a top 100 list... I wouldn't even know where to start.

Ricardo Lopez
Joe Calzaghe
Bernard Hopkins
Manny Pacquaio
Juan Manuel Marquez
James Toney
Sugar Shane Mosley
Roy Jones

Instead I would rate them as follows. In a all around career look.

Lopez
RJJ
JMM
SSM
Hopkins
Toney
Pac
Joe

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I decided to rate them in order like u Mick. My picks are a bit different tho.

RJJ
Lopez
BHOP
SSM
Pac
Joe
JMM
Toney

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Not bad. Not bad at all. :appl:

Well to be honest i say Jones is ranked near were Mosley and Hopkins are mean he had good wins but he also fought some cans as well i would say. And his loses also hurt his legacy i would not rate him in the top10 maybe some where in the top 30 or somthing like that though.

I def wouldn't have Hopkins as high as all you guys, my reasoning below.

His biggest fights;

Loss to RJJ
Beats Trinidad (smaller guy moving up)
Beats ODLH (as above)
Loss to Taylor x 2 (could've one both)
Beats Tarver (demolishes bigger guy)
Beats Wright
Loss to Calzaghe (close)
Beats Pavlik (smaller guy - new kid on the block)

For me this isn't a top 20 career, his best wins were against smaller guys, picking on the names moving up. His reign at Middle contained an awful lot of average guys - his or his era's fault?

Tarver is never an opponent to have to point to when securing your legacy.

Hopkins title run gets praised as much as Calzaghe's gets hammered - both are equally shoddy in my eyes.

Neither he nor Calzaghe would be anywhere near that high for me.

And the fact that he's old and still doing it is a reflection on his competition not how great he is in my eyes.