Which fighters would do best

If you made all the fighters train hard as if they were getting ready for a prize fight, but they had no idea who they were fighting, which fighters would be the best this?

Guys I think are obvious are
Roy JOnes Jr
Joe Calzaghe
Miguel Cotto
Floyd Mayweather Jr
Whitaker
Leonard
James Toney
Mosley(maybe not the most natural, but he is too fast and too durable to not give anyone a hard fight... except Winky)

IMO these are guys who are so natural in there that they can adapt really easily in fights that preparation for them is more to get their body in shape and their minds focused and sharp.

Guys who I don't think would do as well
Lennox Lewis
Manny Pacquiao
Bernard Hopkins
Oscar De La Hoya
Mike Tyson
Jermain Taylor


These guys IMO seem to train perfectly for who they are fighting, they know how they are going to fight a fight before it happens.



This is a silly little thing, but you can add whoever you want to either list.

hmmm, Hopkins is a smart guy, I'm sure he could adapt to the situation. Tyson on his game it really would not matter, he'd mow them down anyway.

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Originally Posted by CGM

hmmm, Hopkins is a smart guy, I'm sure he could adapt to the situation. Tyson on his game it really would not matter, he'd mow them down anyway.

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agree. i think of all bhop and ali would do best without knowing who their oppenent will be.

I like this thread. I think Hop would do well with his natural defensive style.

As for Tyson, it works both ways, at his best he'd follow a specific game plan with the combos meticulously prepared. However, imagine coming into the ring against him having never even heard of him or seen him fight, okay he might not have that fear factor over you, but damn that speed and power would catch most guys unawares.

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Originally Posted by Bomp

I like this thread. I think Hop would do well with his natural defensive style.

As for Tyson, it works both ways, at his best he'd follow a specific game plan with the combos meticulously prepared. However, imagine coming into the ring against him having never even heard of him or seen him fight, okay he might not have that fear factor over you, but damn that speed and power would catch most guys unawares.

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Ya think so about Tyson and planning? I just saw him as a natural scrapper. Meticulous planning doesn't come to mind when I think of Tyson.

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Originally Posted by CGM

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Originally Posted by Bomp

I like this thread. I think Hop would do well with his natural defensive style.

As for Tyson, it works both ways, at his best he'd follow a specific game plan with the combos meticulously prepared. However, imagine coming into the ring against him having never even heard of him or seen him fight, okay he might not have that fear factor over you, but damn that speed and power would catch most guys unawares.

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Ya think so about Tyson and planning? I just saw him as a natural scrapper. Meticulous planning doesn't come to mind when I think of Tyson.

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I see what you mean, thinking about it most of his preparation was geared at studying himself early in his career, which they were meticulous at doing, so maybe the actual opponent didn't matter that much, he pretty much new every time out he'd be fighting a taller opponent.

I think nobody prepared themselves like Mike Tyson did.

Also about B-Hop I have heard plenty of stories that he isn't the same boxer in sparring that you see in fights. I think he studies every weakness and knows how to exploit it before going into the ring, I don't think he would do terribly without preparation but thats the biggest asset he has.

I don't know a lot about the specific methods that Tyson and D'Amato used, so you guys are probably right about preparation then.

Well from what I've heard. Mayweather watches no film's of his oppenent's just trains hard as hell. So I take him as the top pick I guess.

To do well:
Mike Tyson - his training never really took the other fighter's style into account anyway, it was all have YOUR style perfect and nobody can beat you.

Bernard Hopkins - He's got such a tough style and he's so crafty

James Toney - Very good defensive fighter and did extremely well putting his punches together in the leaner years

Evander Holyfield - Heart of a warrior and difficult style to fight against

Roy Jones Jr./Floyd Mayweather Jr. - they seem to be able to adapt easily during a fight

Pernell Whittaker - Defensive master, would have baffled most anybody training or no training.

Vitali Klitschko - The guy is 6'8, punches hard as hell, and is awkward as fuck, as long as he is in shape for the fight nothing else matters.

Paul Williams/Juan Manuel Lopez - Southpaw + 100(or more) punches a round is trouble for anyone.

Julio Cesar Chavez - Just a street tough fighter who would weather any storm and land his shots and win fights.

All the old school fighters would have done well because that is all they used to do, train hard and let the other fighter worry about his style. Marciano, Louis, Ali, Moore, Charles, Walcott, Robinson, Pep, LaMatta, Zale etc.

To do poorly:
Lennox Lewis - as smart as he is he seems to me to be the type of guy to plot out a chain of events/course of action to win a fight and knowing the other fighter's style would benefit that.

Wladimir Klitschko - Same as Lewis, he's smart but he has plans of attack that depend on knowing a fighter's style.

Ray Leonard - He could get suckered into brawls when it didn't suit him and if he knew that before hand his skill was such that he wouldn't have allowed himself to get off track like that, I think taking away his knowledge of a fighter's style only hurts him.

Miguel Cotto - As much as I love the guy when he goes in careless and wreckless he is a piss poor fighter who has no defense.

I think most of your modern Boxer/Punchers fall into this category because they don't know when to sit down on their punches or when the other fighter is dangerous.

calzaghe

The Marquez brothers. Especially Juan would adapt no matter the opponent

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Originally Posted by Violent Demise

The Marquez brothers. Especially Juan would adapt no matter the opponent

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Goddamn you, I thought I was going to be the first to mention them.

They're both so intelligent in the ring that I think they could quickly adapt to whoever they were facing.

Have too agree on Marquez.Good call.Dude is a formula in adaptability and maximizing/exploiting flaws

I dont know about Toney.?. As far as last minute.Always struck me as a master in building up to opponents outside and inside the ring,liked to be comfortable?.

George Foreman probably wouldn't care if he didn't know a fighter's style before the match....hell the guy had only boxed 1 year before winning the gold medal in the Olympics.

It's really hard to choose who would do well in this situation...guys like Lennox Lewis and Wlad Klitschko are very cerebral fighters and have great boxing IQ but IMO they like a blueprint for victory and that depends on seeing a style beforehand and going over film. And guys like the Marquez Brothers are also extremely smart fighters but just seem to be able to think faster in the ring and are more comfortable with that.

recokn hopkins would

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Originally Posted by CGM

I don't know a lot about the specific methods that Tyson and D'Amato used, so you guys are probably right about preparation then.

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I've read that Tyson and D'Amato watched a lot of film together. I'm not sure if they spent a lot of time looking at specific opponents for preparation, but he studied the game. When he was young and focused, at least some thought when into his aggression.

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Originally Posted by Taeth

If you made all the fighters train hard as if they were getting ready for a prize fight, but they had no idea who they were fighting, which fighters would be the best this?

Guys I think are obvious are
Roy JOnes Jr
Joe Calzaghe
Miguel Cotto
Floyd Mayweather Jr
Whitaker
Leonard
James Toney
Mosley(maybe not the most natural, but he is too fast and too durable to not give anyone a hard fight... except Winky)

IMO these are guys who are so natural in there that they can adapt really easily in fights that preparation for them is more to get their body in shape and their minds focused and sharp.

Guys who I don't think would do as well
Lennox Lewis
Manny Pacquiao
Bernard Hopkins
Oscar De La Hoya
Mike Tyson
Jermain Taylor


These guys IMO seem to train perfectly for who they are fighting, they know how they are going to fight a fight before it happens.



This is a silly little thing, but you can add whoever you want to either list.

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I'll just do one for each weightclass that makes it easier for me.

Heavyweight: Muhammad Ali
Cruiserweight: Evander Holyfield
Light Heavyweight: Archie Moore/Roy Jones Jr/Ezzard Charles
Super Middleweight: James Toney/Joe Calzaghe
Middleweight: Marvin Hagler/Bernard Hopkins
Jr Middleweight: Mike McCallum/Winky Wright
Welterweight: Sugar Ray Leonard
Jr Welterweight: Aaron Pryor
Lightweight: Pernell Whitaker
Super Featherweight: Floyd Mayweather Jr/Azumah Nelson
Featherweight: Salvador Sanchez/Willie Pep/Juan Manuel Marquez
Super Bantamweight: Wilfredo Gomez/Marco Antonio Barrera
Bantamweight: Rafael Marquez
Super Flyweight: Johnny Tapia
Flyweight: Miguel Canto
Jr Flyweight: Michael Carbajal
Minimumweight: Ricardo Lopez

Well i lied i couldn't do one for each weightclass because it was too hard but whatever.

Don't belittle Manny Pacquiao in this department.

He has this shock and awe factor. His fury atop the ring. That's his basic style. That's a good style for a round-robin boxing competition where you don't know who your opponents will be. With this style, any unprepared opponent will get the shock of their lives. Though he was considered a one-trick pony during his early days in the US, boxing greats Barrera and Marquez got a taste of this fury, but even with their preparation, they did not know what hit them. But knowing the grit of Marquez, he adapted but he was almost victimized.

His opponents were always surprised by his speed and power. And he's awkward. And they were prepared for him but still lost because people tend to underestimate his speed. His sheer volume of punches and non-stop pressure will overwhelm any unprepared opponent. What more if they're not prepared for his style?

He's an adapter too if you watched his fights against Jorge Solis, and Hector Velasquez where he had trouble early. He hardly knew Lehonolo Ledwaba, a master boxer, and had only two weeks to prepare. Look what happened.

In his pre-Roach days, he got into early trouble with the then undefeated Nedal Hussein but he blasted him away round after round after getting knocked down in the 2nd round. Another pre-Roach fight was the one with Chatchai Sasakul. He outboxed him badly but he summoned enough will to turn the tide. He has the heart or the ability to "suck it up" when the going gets tough.

Great fighters are adaptable to various unknown situations, or else, they wouldn't be called great.