How does anyone think a 25 year old jones would fair against Dirrel? Or even in the tournament?
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How does anyone think a 25 year old jones would fair against Dirrel? Or even in the tournament?
A 25 year old Jones would be up on a murder charge if he fought Dirrell, Now at almost 41 he would still beat him to a pulp, no doubt. Too fast and he has real power in his shots, just not like he used to.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweather
A 25 year old RJJ would not be head and shoulders above Dirrell but he would a head above Dirrell. But this is a good comparison. Dirrell is the athletic freak that RJJ once was. Its just that RJJ would be more daring and actually had one punch knockout power. Dirrell will come of age and he will be one of the rare fighters who will learn to dominate on both sides, offense and defense.
I disagree. You could see Jones was going to be something special when he was way younger than Dirrell is now. No-one could stand up to Jones' power until he fought Castro who was freakish in the chin department back then and then Hopkins went the distance but Roy only had one hand in that fight, not saying Roy would have KO'd Bernard but it would have been interesting had he had both hands in full working order.Quote:
Originally Posted by blegit
Roy had great combo's too whereas Dirrell only seems to have 1-2's in his arsenal when it comes to putting his punches together. I wish Roy was taking Taylor's place in this tournament because apart from Kessler I think he is still clearly better than everyone else in this tournament.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rjj tszyuI disagree. You could see Jones was going to be something special when he was way younger than Dirrell is now. No-one could stand up to Jones' power until he fought Castro who was freakish in the chin department back then and then Hopkins went the distance but Roy only had one hand in that fight, not saying Roy would have KO'd Bernard but it would have been interesting had he had both hands in full working order.Quote:
Originally Posted by blegit
Roy had great combo's too whereas Dirrell only seems to have 1-2's in his arsenal when it comes to putting his punches together. I wish Roy was taking Taylor's place in this tournament because apart from Kessler I think he is still clearly better than everyone else in this tournament.
I'm not saying that Dirrell is what RJJ was at 25. Nobody would probably say that. I'm saying he is the athletic freak RJJ was at 25. Dirrell is probably the most athletic boxer today. His agility, insane speed, and ability to move is on par with a young RJJ.
He has good athleticism but on a par with a young Roy Jones? I don't think so. At times against Froch his balance was all over the place which is why he kept throwing himself on the floor when Froch got near him.Quote:
Originally Posted by blegitQuote:
Originally Posted by rjj tszyuI disagree. You could see Jones was going to be something special when he was way younger than Dirrell is now. No-one could stand up to Jones' power until he fought Castro who was freakish in the chin department back then and then Hopkins went the distance but Roy only had one hand in that fight, not saying Roy would have KO'd Bernard but it would have been interesting had he had both hands in full working order.Quote:
Originally Posted by blegit
Roy had great combo's too whereas Dirrell only seems to have 1-2's in his arsenal when it comes to putting his punches together. I wish Roy was taking Taylor's place in this tournament because apart from Kessler I think he is still clearly better than everyone else in this tournament.
I'm not saying that Dirrell is what RJJ was at 25. Nobody would probably say that. I'm saying he is the athletic freak RJJ was at 25. Dirrell is probably the most athletic boxer today. His agility, insane speed, and ability to move is on par with a young RJJ.
As for speed, yes he has speed but not on the level Jones did. Even at 40 Jones threw 7 left hooks in just over a second against Lacy and he is not as fast as he once was in that fight, not by a long way.
A 25 year old RJJ would have had no problem with anyone in this competition.
Dirrell has quick hands and all but comparing ANYONE to RJJ is a bit of a stretch. Andre Ward was billed as "the new RJJ" early on in his career, I haven't seen it yet.
I agree, even now I think there is only Kessler and maybe Abraham who would beat him and neither would be easy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
Your name has just reminded me of a good point about Dirrell. His ability to change stance so freely could be really confusing if he learns to use it right.Quote:
Originally Posted by switch-hitter;D:rolleyes:I would sooner compare Dirrell to Usain Bolt!He runs and runs.He does not like getting hit, a pointless career is in the making.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
RJJ i don't think so. Maybe if you take half of Jones Junior for the flash accurate punches and movement and blend it with a half of Junior Witter for the negativity and switch hitting bull crap. Really, i'm a guy who can like Dirrell a lot, i just want to see him take it to his opponent like he did to Froch in 10 and 11. Because when he did, he looked excellent.
The announcers/people said Dirrell's speed is comparable to Roy Jones. They didnt say Dirrell as a fighter is comparable to Roy Jones. At least that is what I heard. Dirrell is pretty fast and may be close to Roy in speed, but Roy had more power, better technique, better boxing mind,better combination puncher etc.....Roy was head and shoulder a better fighter than Andre but if you just look at speed Andre is pretty fast......
They have very similar speed and athletic ability, but Roy JOnes had so much more composure in the ring, and I think thats because he stepped up the competition a lot earlier in his career. The biggest problem I have with all these prospects coming up is that they don't get their defining fight until their in the second half of their twenties.
Look how young Leonard fought for the title against Benitez, How young Floyd was when he beat G. Hernandez or even Corales. Or ROy Jones Jr when he fought James Toney, that was when he was like 24-25, and he already was dominating one of the best fighters in the world. I think James Toney would win this tournament, and that Roy wouldn't have too many problems with any of these guys except maybe Ward because he sort of reminds me of Montell Griffin stylewise.
I also guarantee Roy would have complained about what Froch did as well, Froch was being a cheap bastard in there and that was the only time he was effective was when he was hitting DIrrell illegally(well he did land a few jabs 2 big punches, but that was it).
In terms of power I think Dirrell has a lot of power, its just he doesn't sit down on his punches the way he should. He is too nervous and doesn't always get the leverage to go along with his body's follow through. That being said I still think Roy was one of the hardest punches to ever grace 160/168, and I think that gave him huge advantages because he was able to earn respect from his opponents very quickly. One other thing I notice is that Dirrell doesn't counter like Roy, Roy Jones would counter right as the other guy was punching, and he would make them feel like if they ever threw punches they would get hit hard, Dirrell has the speed, but he doesn't make opponents pay the way they should for throwing punches.
Jones at 25 in the Super 6 would just eliminate the whole tourney all togethter....at 25 Jones was beating the hell out of guys like Vinny Pax, Thomas Tate etc. As a Super Middleweight Jones was a phenom who could do things never seen to this day with his speed and his power that came from it blinded opponents.
To compare Dirrel to Jones at 25 is not accurate, They should compare him to Jones at 21 or 22 because by 25 there was no doubt on what Jones was.
Roy wouldn't have needed to complain Froch would have been sparked out inside 6 minutes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
Nah - he would've lasted longer than Clinton imoQuote:
Originally Posted by FensterRoy wouldn't have needed to complain Froch would have been sparked out inside 6 minutes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
25 year-old supermiddle Roy?Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG HNah - he would've lasted longer than Clinton imoQuote:
Originally Posted by FensterRoy wouldn't have needed to complain Froch would have been sparked out inside 6 minutes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
Taylor had Froch over in the third round. Roy would have surely destroyed someone as slow and open as Froch. Quick.
I think people are blending two things. Separate overall skill and athleticism. If you do that you will see that Dirrell is very similar athletically to RJJ. Look at Dirrell's speed, ability to dodge punches, and and agility. A young RJJ was a much better fighter because he had one punch knockout power, willingness to trade, heart of a champion, better timing, and utmost confidence. Probably even a few more things that I didn't mention also but athletically Dirrell is a phenom. He just doesn't know it yet. Even Allan Green, who never credits anyone but himself, was saying that Dirrell's talent is the best he just doesn't know how to use it.
And of course a 25 year old RJJ would walk through this tournament. Anybody in this tournament.
Roy Jones is so good, and I think he definitely wins a competition like this one, but he doesn't walk through it, I think a tall, fast, skilled guy like Kessler gives him problems, so does Ward and so would DIrrell for sure.
Often, and people forget, that Roy would back off in fights as they went along, if he hurt Froch, but couldn't close the show quickly, he would back off, and Froch delt with Dirrell's speed very well considering how blisteringly fast Dirrell is, and don't get it twisted, Dirrell has really good accuracy as well, its just Froch is an awkward guy to hit until you get comfortable with him, and I think his mental ability to fight is a little bit faster than his physical speed which throws guys off.
I am going to say this though, Dirrell isn't just physical talent. THe ability to slip punches to counter well, and to throw combinations like he does comes from many hours in the gym and a lot of practice. He throws punches very well, he goes to the body very well, but I think he jumped too far a little too quickly. Had the fight been in the states he would have won and Froch wouldn't have been able to fight that way. That being said Roy was way further into his career by the time he was 25, he beat a lot of contenders before he fought Hopkins, and after that fight a lot of people had questions about how good Jones was, but he was really able to show his skills once he learned to calm down and trust his physical abilities more.
Roy would toy with Dirrell badly.Jones had sharp shot fight changing type power off the backfoot w/ all angles.His offense matched his early defense,dont see that in Dirrell.Roy closed quarters on a Castro,Tate,Malinga & Hopkins....HOPKINS lol.I dont see it at all...I think Dirrell should enjoy this moment in comparison because thats as close as he'll realize.
I've thought that from what I've seen of Ward actually, he does have that look of Griffin but look what Roy did to him in the second fight because he was focused. He hurt him badly every time he hit him. I'd give my right arm to see that Roy back, especially if he fights Hopkins again.Quote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
Hard to say really. Roy could have a lot more KO's on his record but he used to toy with his opponents. In a tournament like this where you get extra points for a KO we could see the Roy that fought Griffin second time round in every fight in which case i'd back him to KO pretty much everyone in it early with the exception of maybe Abraham and Kessler, but his speed and skill would be so much more clear that I think both would be stopped late on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Taeth