Will Khan be able to handle Marquez?

I watched the fight this weekend and so far Khan has been impressive since he got KTFO. I wasnt sure how that would have effected his career, and to be honest I thought the worst of it. But well to done to Amir who has pushed himself to the limit mentally to come back from that defeat. I think the fact so many people paid for the Prescott fight and he got KTFO so fast would have been very hard for him to take and thats why i respect Khan because he has kept going and won a world title on the way.

I think his defence has improved a lot and with such speed and power I think he is going to be a force at 140. He did well against Salita although it was difficult to judge if he has improved a lot because it was over so fast. But he took the KO came and he finished well and that was impressive to see.

I have read that a possible fight for him is JMM, is it just me or is this too much of a step up for Khan? I think technically JMM is supreme and he would be able to give Khan all sorts of problems. I still think JMM has power as shown in his fight against Diaz and Casamayor. I know he got schooled by Mayweather, but Mayweather is Mayweather and Khan is Khan, a totally different class IMO. I think Khan needs a tough top 10 fighter, but JMM is one of the best fighters in the world and I think he would be too good for Khan at the momment. He has a lot of experience which Khan doesnt have at that level, JMM knows how to dig deep and have a war, but does Khan? I still think there is a question mark on that chin to be honest and JMM would be able to catch him if they fought.

Im not saying Khan shouldnt be chasing a fighter of JMM level and I do respect him for doing that. I personally think Khan needs a tough 12 rounder against a solid 140 pound fighter before chasing JMM. I also think Ricky Hatton by late 2010 would be a good fight for him to have. What do you think though??

Maybe in a year.

At 140 I think he has a good chance, styles make fights and I think with Khan's skills and a gemplan he follows I think he has everychance of beating Marquez, much better chance than Hatton has of beating Marquez.

I think a fight with JMM would be too soon if it were his next fight. He needs to get in with a top 10 contender that can bang. Maybe late 2010 Khan will be able to take him, but not in his next fight

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skel1983

At 140 I think he has a good chance, styles make fights and I think with Khan's skills and a gemplan he follows I think he has everychance of beating Marquez, much better chance than Hatton has of beating Marquez.

---

I agree with you on those points.

I think Amir is too big for Juan, and simply put, this fight will be bad for JMM, simply because of the disparity in size.

Skill wise, it is an easy technical fight for Khan provided his chin does not get exposed. The combined factors of size with speed is too much of an advantage, that I am afraid, regardless of how great Juan Manuel's overall skill surely is, it is not within by its' means to overcome it.

However if anyone can expose 'em weak chin of Amir, surely, Juan's precision laser counters are more than up for that task. So JMM has a chance a much greater against Amir's, than to that which he had at fight night against "a PBF" in his last outing.

Lastly, the poise in Amir Khan's game as of late, distinctly upgraded since he came over to Roach's tutelage, will need futher reinforcement as bouts with future HOF require.


There will be fireworks for sure, a good fight overall.

Khan will possibly come away with a UD win, and only JMM's ring savvy prevents an abbreviated result for the young man from Bolton.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KananKrus

I think Amir is too big for Juan, and simply put, this fight will be bad for JMM, simply because of the disparity in size.

Skill wise, it is an easy technical fight for Khan provided his chin does not get exposed. The combined factors of size with speed is too much of an advantage, that I am afraid, regardless of how great Juan Manuel's overall skill surely is, it is not within by its' means to overcome it.

However if anyone can expose 'em weak chin of Amir, surely, Juan's precision laser counters are more than up for that task. So JMM has a chance a much greater against Amir's, than to that which he had at fight night against "a PBF" in his last outing.

Lastly, the poise in Amir Khan's game as of late, distinctly upgraded since he came over to Roach's tutelage, will need futher reinforcement as bouts with future HOF require.


There will be fireworks for sure, a good fight overall.

Khan will possibly come away with a UD win, and only JMM's ring savvy prevents an abbreviated result for the young man from Bolton.

---

couldnt agree more..

Amazing turnaround. I posted in March of this year that Amir could be capable of taking on Juan Manuel Marquez in around a year or so's time and nobody agreed.

Now it seem momentum is swinging his way.

I don't think he needs Marquez just yet. He needs at least one solid, world level opponent first to give him that experience, and also the inner confidence needed.

My guess is that if he beats his March opponent on the Pacquaio Floyd undercard and looks good he may well get one summer fight in before a big showdown with Marquez this time next year.

He could well go into that fight the bookies favourite.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bilbo

Amazing turnaround. I posted in March of this year that Amir could be capable of taking on Juan Manuel Marquez in around a year or so's time and nobody agreed.

Now it seem momentum is swinging his way.

I don't think he needs Marquez just yet. He needs at least one solid, world level opponent first to give him that experience, and also the inner confidence needed.

My guess is that if he beats his March opponent on the Pacquaio Floyd undercard and looks good he may well get one summer fight in before a big showdown with Marquez this time next year.

He could well go into that fight the bookies favourite.

---

To be fair though mate at the time Khan was still at 135 and Marquez had just blasted out Diaz now Khan seems to be bigger and stronger at 140 and Marquez looked a bit soft and way above his natural weight at 145, I think at 135 Marquez wins.

But I suppose what has happened recently and the progress Khan has made with Roach makes it very possible Khan can use his physical advantages to win this fight.

I think it could well happen especially if Marquez fights Hatton which I think he wins it would make sense to make the fight.

I still think no. Possibly if he was able to stay on the outside like he did Kotelnik and hope Marquez was able to fight out on the outside but to me he is still raw and unpolished. He still has been caught and I'm just not sure he's disciplined enough to bang with someone like Marquez. I don't think just because he got 12-0'd by the best pure boxer on the planet that Marquez loses. He's still one of the games top counter punchers and I'm not sure Khan is ready for a surgeon like Marquez. Just youth and athleticism isn't going to get him by and I'm not sold on any of these huge changes of his.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skel1983

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bilbo

Amazing turnaround. I posted in March of this year that Amir could be capable of taking on Juan Manuel Marquez in around a year or so's time and nobody agreed.

Now it seem momentum is swinging his way.

I don't think he needs Marquez just yet. He needs at least one solid, world level opponent first to give him that experience, and also the inner confidence needed.

My guess is that if he beats his March opponent on the Pacquaio Floyd undercard and looks good he may well get one summer fight in before a big showdown with Marquez this time next year.

He could well go into that fight the bookies favourite.

---

To be fair though mate at the time Khan was still at 135 and Marquez had just blasted out Diaz now Khan seems to be bigger and stronger at 140 and Marquez looked a bit soft and way above his natural weight at 145, I think at 135 Marquez wins.

But I suppose what has happened recently and the progress Khan has made with Roach makes it very possible Khan can use his physical advantages to win this fight.

I think it could well happen especially if Marquez fights Hatton which I think he wins it would make sense to make the fight.

---

Exactly, which is why I should have more respect on these boards. Bilbo knows the truth. I told them all Mijares was overrated and about to be exposed, he was exposed. I'm saying the same about Nonito Donaire now, along with Lucian Bute.

Khan will be better than them all. :cool:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skel1983

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bilbo

Amazing turnaround. I posted in March of this year that Amir could be capable of taking on Juan Manuel Marquez in around a year or so's time and nobody agreed.

Now it seem momentum is swinging his way.

I don't think he needs Marquez just yet. He needs at least one solid, world level opponent first to give him that experience, and also the inner confidence needed.

My guess is that if he beats his March opponent on the Pacquaio Floyd undercard and looks good he may well get one summer fight in before a big showdown with Marquez this time next year.

He could well go into that fight the bookies favourite.

---

To be fair though mate at the time Khan was still at 135 and Marquez had just blasted out Diaz now Khan seems to be bigger and stronger at 140 and Marquez looked a bit soft and way above his natural weight at 145, I think at 135 Marquez wins.

But I suppose what has happened recently and the progress Khan has made with Roach makes it very possible Khan can use his physical advantages to win this fight.

I think it could well happen especially if Marquez fights Hatton which I think he wins it would make sense to make the fight.

---

Agreeing with ya skel1983,

Khan beats JMM for me at 140, but i also think Hatton beats JMM at 140, guess the question is does Khan beat Hatton at 140, personally as a Hatton fan it's not a fight i would want him to take, IMHO Khan beats Hatton.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KananKrus

I think Amir is too big for Juan, and simply put, this fight will be bad for JMM, simply because of the disparity in size.

Skill wise, it is an easy technical fight for Khan provided his chin does not get exposed. The combined factors of size with speed is too much of an advantage, that I am afraid, regardless of how great Juan Manuel's overall skill surely is, it is not within by its' means to overcome it.

However if anyone can expose 'em weak chin of Amir, surely, Juan's precision laser counters are more than up for that task. So JMM has a chance a much greater against Amir's, than to that which he had at fight night against "a PBF" in his last outing.

Lastly, the poise in Amir Khan's game as of late, distinctly upgraded since he came over to Roach's tutelage, will need futher reinforcement as bouts with future HOF require.


There will be fireworks for sure, a good fight overall.

Khan will possibly come away with a UD win, and only JMM's ring savvy prevents an abbreviated result for the young man from Bolton.

---

Are you kidding me ? an easy technical fight for Amir Khan ? JMM is far more technically skilled than Amir Khan, as for speed ? well didn't he deal well with a faster fighter in Manny Pacquiao ? who hits harder and is alot better than Amir Khan ? or what about Joel Casamayor ?

Bilbo talks about overrated fighters like Lucian Bute, well atleast he's beaten some good opposition, who the hell has Amir Khan beaten that leads anyone to believe Amir Khan is ready for someone like JMM ? even at 140.

Not that long ago Amir Khan was getting dropped, by domestic level fighters and was also brutally KO'ed, by a fighter with pretty much no skill. Amir Khan has beaten not one good/live opponent, he's also ever only fought one puncher whom destroyed him.

Now im not saying that Amir Khan hasn't got skill, but come on im a bit sick of seeing, well Amir Khan has dramatically improved since being Freddie Roach, that is total BS how the hell can anyone tell anything really ?

Because he beat Andriy Kotelnik, the most mediocre title holder in modern day history ? and even he went the distance winning 4 rounds, and clocking Amir Khan quite a few times late on, even with Amir Khan's supposedly improved "defense".

Now just imagine if that was someone like JMM catching him, or any of the other punchers at 140. Lets actually wait and see Amir Khan beat someone who can punch, or atleast someone who's known.

Im sorry Bilbo i've listened to your reasoning, but to me your just totally biased. As hitman said a few days ago you take anything Amir Khan says with a pinch of salt, yet a fighter you dislike for example David Haye, you never miss a chance to hate on him.

Whenever he says anything but yet you don't take that with a pinch of salt, in all honesty i think Amir Khan's up his own ass. His talented no one i don't think has ever denied that.

But im sorry he has come out with some total crap, and he hasn't even beaten one elite fighter yet. And again im not saying he's not capable of it, but lets actually wait and see if he can do it.

Rather than overrating him which you clearly are, despite saying you don't but you clearly do. Why not fight the winner of the Timothy Bradley fight, or fight a puncher like Marcos Rene Maidana to prove he can beat a puncher, why fight a fighter who's clearly undersized at 140.

Even though i think JMM beats Amir Khan. And is x2 the fighter he will ever be. Why don't he beat an elite/prime 140 fighter then people might not stop hating on him, and might start respecting him.

And one last thing you can't improve a weak chin, and i don't believe it has anything to do with the weight either. He's had a weak chin since the Amateur's.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ICB

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KananKrus

I think Amir is too big for Juan, and simply put, this fight will be bad for JMM, simply because of the disparity in size.

Skill wise, it is an easy technical fight for Khan provided his chin does not get exposed. The combined factors of size with speed is too much of an advantage, that I am afraid, regardless of how great Juan Manuel's overall skill surely is, it is not within by its' means to overcome it.

However if anyone can expose 'em weak chin of Amir, surely, Juan's precision laser counters are more than up for that task. So JMM has a chance a much greater against Amir's, than to that which he had at fight night against "a PBF" in his last outing.

Lastly, the poise in Amir Khan's game as of late, distinctly upgraded since he came over to Roach's tutelage, will need futher reinforcement as bouts with future HOF require.


There will be fireworks for sure, a good fight overall.

Khan will possibly come away with a UD win, and only JMM's ring savvy prevents an abbreviated result for the young man from Bolton.

---

Are you kidding me ? an easy technical fight for Amir Khan ? JMM is far more technically skilled than Amir Khan, as for speed ? well didn't he deal well with a faster fighter in Manny Pacquiao ? who hits harder and is alot better than Amir Khan ? or what about Joel Casamayor ?

Bilbo talks about overrated fighters like Lucian Bute, well atleast he's beaten some good opposition, who the hell has Amir Khan beaten that leads anyone to believe Amir Khan is ready for someone like JMM ? even at 140.

Not that long ago Amir Khan was getting dropped, by domestic level fighters and was also brutally KO'ed, by a fighter with pretty much no skill. Amir Khan has beaten not one good/live opponent, he's also ever only fought one puncher whom destroyed him.

Now im not saying that Amir Khan hasn't got skill, but come on im a bit sick of seeing, well Amir Khan has dramatically improved since being Freddie Roach, that is total BS how the hell can anyone tell anything really ?

Because he beat Andriy Kotelnik, the most mediocre title holder in modern day history ? and even he went the distance winning 4 rounds, and clocking Amir Khan quite a few times late on, even with Amir Khan's supposedly improved "defense".

Now just imagine if that was someone like JMM catching him, or any of the other punchers at 140. Lets actually wait and see Amir Khan beat someone who can punch, or atleast someone who's known.

Im sorry Bilbo i've listened to your reasoning, but to me your just totally biased. As hitman said a few days ago you take anything Amir Khan says with a pinch of salt, yet a fighter you dislike for example David Haye, you never miss a chance to hate on him.

Whenever he says anything but yet you don't take that with a pinch of salt, in all honesty i think Amir Khan's up his own ass. His talented no one i don't think has ever denied that.

But im sorry he has come out with some total crap, and he hasn't even beaten one elite fighter yet. And again im not saying he's not capable of it, but lets actually wait and see if he can do it.

Rather than overrating him which you clearly are, despite saying you don't but you clearly do. Why not fight the winner of the Timothy Bradley fight, or fight a puncher like Marcos Rene Maidana to prove he can beat a puncher, why fight a fighter who's clearly undersized at 140.

Even though i think JMM beats Amir Khan. And is x2 the fighter he will ever be. Why don't he beat an elite/prime 140 fighter then people might not stop hating on him, and might start respecting him.

And one last thing you can't improve a weak chin, and i don't believe it has anything to do with the weight either. He's had a weak chin since the Amateur's.

---

Couldn't have agreed more. It doesn't really matter if Khan has improved ten fold he still has a very suspect chin and Marquez is not the guy you want to test it again with. Especially with Marquez's countering abilities.

Some people are seriously underating Marquez since his loss to Mayweather if they think Khan can beat him.

Marquez was outclassed by Mayweather who was naturally bigger, faster, stronger and........better.

Khan is nothing like Floyd expect in the speed department.

Khan has improved over his last four fights but has he improved enough to deal with someone of Marquez's skill level ? hell no imo.

Marquez has proved he can deal with fighters faster and naturally bigger than him (Pacquiao) so why would he have trouble with Khan who is a level or two below Pacquiao ?

Marquez stops Khan imo.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Pugilistic

Some people are seriously underating Marquez since his loss to Mayweather if they think Khan can beat him.

Marquez was outclassed by Mayweather who was naturally bigger, faster, stronger and........better.

Khan is nothing like Floyd expect in the speed department.

Khan has improved over his last four fights but has he improved enough to deal with someone of Marquez's skill level ? hell no imo.

Marquez has proved he can deal with fighters faster and naturally bigger than him (Pacquiao) so why would he have trouble with Khan who is a level or two below Pacquiao ?

Marquez stops Khan imo.

---

Have to disagree with a few things there mate first off the adavntages Mayweather had over Marquez are more or less the same advantages Khan has you like speed, power, naturally bigger and stronger all them apply to Khan.

Marquez has fought above 130 three times and only once over 135 and is or will be 37 years old he isnt improving Khan is, Marquez is an amazing fighter and someone I love to watch but imo Khan if he sticks to the gamplan can beat Marquez at 140 which is not natural at all to Marquez who had never been near 135 until he was 35.

Also you say he has dealt with bigger guys in the past like Pac?? Bigger in what way?? Marquez is 1/2 an inch bigger in height and only an inch shorter in reach so hows Pac a bigger man?????

http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/6...cquiao1qk5.jpg

My views as stated earlier, were more on the handicap of which I consider quite severe to overcome, facing JMM in a bout against Amir Khan.

Amir has size that seemingly is being way overlooked here by some.

How tall is Amir, 5'11"? That is an imposing stature at light-welter, 140, by any means of imagination. Goodness, Khan is even being groomed, or in the process of, by the Wildcard Group, to compete for belts at jr middleweight in the not so distant future.

We can put blinders but it'd still be a blunder, to proclaim JMM can hurdle this "Amir obstacle", just by our sheer memory of the fighting qualities of the HOF fighter, in Juan Manuel.

Seriously though, with proper perspective, that is quite a bit of "size" for Juan to deal with while being out of his most competitive division at 130-135lbs. To expect JMM to handily win might just be a case of too much optimism? Maybe.

If the fight is at 130-135, my money is on Juan Manuel Marquez, regardless....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skel1983

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Pugilistic

Some people are seriously underating Marquez since his loss to Mayweather if they think Khan can beat him.

Marquez was outclassed by Mayweather who was naturally bigger, faster, stronger and........better.

Khan is nothing like Floyd expect in the speed department.

Khan has improved over his last four fights but has he improved enough to deal with someone of Marquez's skill level ? hell no imo.

Marquez has proved he can deal with fighters faster and naturally bigger than him (Pacquiao) so why would he have trouble with Khan who is a level or two below Pacquiao ?

Marquez stops Khan imo.

---

Have to disagree with a few things there mate first off the adavntages Mayweather had over Marquez are more or less the same advantages Khan has you like speed, power, naturally bigger and stronger all them apply to Khan.

Marquez has fought above 130 three times and only once over 135 and is or will be 37 years old he isnt improving Khan is, Marquez is an amazing fighter and someone I love to watch but imo Khan if he sticks to the gamplan can beat Marquez at 140 which is not natural at all to Marquez who had never been near 135 until he was 35.

Also you say he has dealt with bigger guys in the past like Pac?? Bigger in what way?? Marquez is 1/2 an inch bigger in height and only an inch shorter in reach so hows Pac a bigger man?????

http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/6...cquiao1qk5.jpg

---

The main problem for Marquez against Mayweather wasn't just weight, it was the fact that Mayweather was the superior counter puncher and took Marquez apart because of it.

Khan doesn't possess the counter punching ability or defense, all he has that is comparable is handspeed and footwork.

Obviously the move up in weight will make Marquez slower which was clear against Floyd but, one thing Marquez has showed while moving up in weight is that he carries power and with Khan's leaky defense and glass chin, i think even a tiny Marquez can take advantage of it.

If Marquez was to land a few of these:

http://www.fightreport.net/wp-conten...el-marquez.gif

Ignore the fact Mayweather lands also :), i can't see Khan being able to take alot of them.

Regarding my opinion on Pacquiao being bigger, height and reach aren't the only factors.

Look at the difference in success both fighters have had while moving up in weight.

Pacquiao is grinding down natural welterweights.

Marquez was struggling with lightweights.

Pacquiao has been more effective because he has been able to fill out more and maintain his speed, power, etc while the smaller Marquez could only move up so much before his speed took a hit.

I think Pacquiao could even be effective at 154 where Marquez's limit at the moment appears to be 135.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Pugilistic

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skel1983

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Pugilistic

Some people are seriously underating Marquez since his loss to Mayweather if they think Khan can beat him.

Marquez was outclassed by Mayweather who was naturally bigger, faster, stronger and........better.

Khan is nothing like Floyd expect in the speed department.

Khan has improved over his last four fights but has he improved enough to deal with someone of Marquez's skill level ? hell no imo.

Marquez has proved he can deal with fighters faster and naturally bigger than him (Pacquiao) so why would he have trouble with Khan who is a level or two below Pacquiao ?

Marquez stops Khan imo.

---

Have to disagree with a few things there mate first off the adavntages Mayweather had over Marquez are more or less the same advantages Khan has you like speed, power, naturally bigger and stronger all them apply to Khan.

Marquez has fought above 130 three times and only once over 135 and is or will be 37 years old he isnt improving Khan is, Marquez is an amazing fighter and someone I love to watch but imo Khan if he sticks to the gamplan can beat Marquez at 140 which is not natural at all to Marquez who had never been near 135 until he was 35.

Also you say he has dealt with bigger guys in the past like Pac?? Bigger in what way?? Marquez is 1/2 an inch bigger in height and only an inch shorter in reach so hows Pac a bigger man?????

http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/6...cquiao1qk5.jpg

---

The main problem for Marquez against Mayweather wasn't just weight, it was the fact that Mayweather was the superior counter puncher and took Marquez apart because of it.

Khan doesn't possess the counter punching ability or defense, all he has that is comparable is handspeed and footwork.

Obviously the move up in weight will make Marquez slower which was clear against Floyd but, one thing Marquez has showed while moving up in weight is that he carries power and with Khan's leaky defense and glass chin, i think even a tiny Marquez can take advantage of it.

If Marquez was to land a few of these:

http://www.fightreport.net/wp-conten...el-marquez.gif

Ignore the fact Mayweather lands also :), i can't see Khan being able to take alot of them.

Regarding Pacquiao being bigger, height and reach aren't the only factors.

Look at the difference in success both fighters have had while moving up in weight.

Pacquiao is grinding down natural welterweights.

Marquez was struggling with lightweights.

Pacquiao has been more effective because he has been able to fill out more and maintain his speed, power, etc while the smaller Marquez could only move up so much before his speed took a hit.

I think Pacquiao could even be effective at 154 where Marquez's limit at the moment appears to be 135.

---

What relevance has Pac adapting to the higher wieghts got to do with when Pac/Marquez met at 125 and 130? You said Marquez has shown he can deal with bigger guys when he fought Pac??

I dont understand how the hell Pac moving up and copeing at the higher weights means Marquez dealt with a bigger man at 125/130? Marquez was more or less the same size when they met?

Khan is 3/4 inches bigger than Marquez with a 5 inch reach advantage he is much bigger, we will have to see how the fight pans out but to say Marquez has shown he can deal with bigger guys than use Pac as an example is very confusing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skel1983

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Pugilistic

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skel1983

Have to disagree with a few things there mate first off the adavntages Mayweather had over Marquez are more or less the same advantages Khan has you like speed, power, naturally bigger and stronger all them apply to Khan.

Marquez has fought above 130 three times and only once over 135 and is or will be 37 years old he isnt improving Khan is, Marquez is an amazing fighter and someone I love to watch but imo Khan if he sticks to the gamplan can beat Marquez at 140 which is not natural at all to Marquez who had never been near 135 until he was 35.

Also you say he has dealt with bigger guys in the past like Pac?? Bigger in what way?? Marquez is 1/2 an inch bigger in height and only an inch shorter in reach so hows Pac a bigger man?????

http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/6...cquiao1qk5.jpg

---

The main problem for Marquez against Mayweather wasn't just weight, it was the fact that Mayweather was the superior counter puncher and took Marquez apart because of it.

Khan doesn't possess the counter punching ability or defense, all he has that is comparable is handspeed and footwork.

Obviously the move up in weight will make Marquez slower which was clear against Floyd but, one thing Marquez has showed while moving up in weight is that he carries power and with Khan's leaky defense and glass chin, i think even a tiny Marquez can take advantage of it.

If Marquez was to land a few of these:

http://www.fightreport.net/wp-conten...el-marquez.gif

Ignore the fact Mayweather lands also :), i can't see Khan being able to take alot of them.

Regarding Pacquiao being bigger, height and reach aren't the only factors.

Look at the difference in success both fighters have had while moving up in weight.

Pacquiao is grinding down natural welterweights.

Marquez was struggling with lightweights.

Pacquiao has been more effective because he has been able to fill out more and maintain his speed, power, etc while the smaller Marquez could only move up so much before his speed took a hit.

I think Pacquiao could even be effective at 154 where Marquez's limit at the moment appears to be 135.

---

What relevance has Pac adapting to the higher wieghts got to do with when Pac/Marquez met at 125 and 130? You said Marquez has shown he can deal with bigger guys when he fought Pac??

I dont understand how the hell Pac moving up and copeing at the higher weights means Marquez dealt with a bigger man at 125/130? Marquez was more or less the same size when they met?

Khan is 3/4 inches bigger than Marquez with a 5 inch reach advantage he is much bigger, we will have to see how the fight pans out but to say Marquez has shown he can deal with bigger guys than use Pac as an example is very confusing.

---

I was using Pacquiao as an example based more on his speed than size.

Marquez was able to deal with the bigger Casamayor and Diaz. Are those better examples for you ? :)

You also never gave me your opinion on the first half of my post ?

Don't you think Marquez has the ability to catch Khan like he was able to do with Mayweather there ?

The thing with Khan though is that he is easier to hit than Floyd plus i doubt Khan could take a shot as well as Floyd did there.

Kotelnik was able to catch Khan a few times but lacked the power to make a difference, I think Marquez's power could and would make the difference between the two.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bilbo

Amazing turnaround. I posted in March of this year that Amir could be capable of taking on Juan Manuel Marquez in around a year or so's time and nobody agreed.

Now it seem momentum is swinging his way.

I don't think he needs Marquez just yet. He needs at least one solid, world level opponent first to give him that experience, and also the inner confidence needed.

My guess is that if he beats his March opponent on the Pacquaio Floyd undercard and looks good he may well get one summer fight in before a big showdown with Marquez this time next year.

He could well go into that fight the bookies favourite.

---

I have been agreeing with Bilbo over Khan, I reckon that the KO was something he should not be solely judged on, I am not convinced it proves him Chiny. The Kid had a great work rate which alone can trouble a lot of people, and if he does fight JMM or Hatton down the line his style could be too much,I reckon that's why he is in the camp he's in, does have some things in common with Pac in terms of speed and volume of work.

Ignoring the fact he can be a cock sometimes then I like him for moving on and proving people wrong.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ICB

Because he beat Andriy Kotelnik, the most mediocre title holder in modern day history ? and even he went the distance winning 4 rounds, and clocking Amir Khan quite a few times late on, even with Amir Khan's supposedly improved "defense".

---

See, this is what annoys me, and it's not just you who does it, but...

This is what you said before the fight...

"I think Andriy Kotelnik may have the experience and toughness, to maybe drag Amir Khan into deep waters and maybe stop him late on. In the MAB fight i still see the same flaws in Amir Khan."

and this is what you said during the fight...

"But Andriy Kotelnik is no mug either, he's a solid opponent with a decent boxing brain. I didn't think he would get caught with much silly punches. Overall a decent win for Amir Khan."

This is exactly why i don't think he'd get credit for beating the likes of Maidana, Holt, Paulie, D-Hop etc...

It's too easy to use hindsight. If you think a fighter is going to lose a fight and he wins, you should give him credit for it.

I can see it now...If he beats Maidana it's because Maidana is slow and sloppy (which ICB has already said), If he beats Holt, then it's no big deal because Holt hasn't really beaten anyone of note. If he beats Paulie, he'll get stick for not fighting a puncher. He can't win, and it's been like that pretty much since he turned pro, on here.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ono

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ICB

Because he beat Andriy Kotelnik, the most mediocre title holder in modern day history ? and even he went the distance winning 4 rounds, and clocking Amir Khan quite a few times late on, even with Amir Khan's supposedly improved "defense".

---

See, this is what annoys me, and it's not just you who does it, but...

This is what you said before the fight...

"I think Andriy Kotelnik may have the experience and toughness, to maybe drag Amir Khan into deep waters and maybe stop him late on. In the MAB fight i still see the same flaws in Amir Khan."

and this is what you said during the fight...

"But Andriy Kotelnik is no mug either, he's a solid opponent with a decent boxing brain. I didn't think he would get caught with much silly punches. Overall a decent win for Amir Khan."

This is exactly why i don't think he'd get credit for beating the likes of Maidana, Holt, Paulie, D-Hop etc...

It's too easy to use hindsight. If you think a fighter is going to lose a fight and he wins, you should give him credit for it.

I can see it now...If he beats Maidana it's because Maidana is slow and sloppy (which ICB has already said), If he beats Holt, then it's no big deal because Holt hasn't really beaten anyone of note. If he beats Paulie, he'll get stick for not fighting a puncher. He can't win, and it's been like that pretty much since he turned pro, on here.

---

This was just after the Breidis Prescott fight, and not long after he was getting dropped by fighters like Michael Gomez. So yes i wasn't sure how Amir Khan would react.

And as i said it was a decent win for Amir Khan, im suprised you went back that long. And tried to disprove me yet you missed the thread, where i gave Amir Khan credit for the win just after the fight.

I've never said Andriy Kotelnik is a bad fighter, i do think he is pretty mediocre. He's a decent boxer as i've always said, but he is pretty basic and mediocre.

And he doesn't do any one thing that well, and my prediction wasn't too far off. He did drag Amir Khan into deep waters in the later rounds, and did catch Amir Khan late on. But Amir Khan was able to be cautious enough to survive some hairy moments late on. And Andriy Kotelnik did hit hard enough which pretty much sums it up.

Because at that time no one really knew of Amir Khan's improved defense, as you said its easy to say this and that with hindsight. Just like its easy for you too pull old comments from my posts, but i don't think i've said anything different have i ?

I've always said Andriy Kotelnik is decent, but again he is pretty much one of the worst title holders in modern history. But i've said it was a decent win for Amir Khan and thats it, decent now its time to move on and see if he can beat some of the big boys.

He needs to beat a puncher for a start, he's only ever fought 1 opponent who can punch and he was layed out. Or he needs to fight an American fighter with a name, someone like Devon Alexander or Timothy Bradley would be good wins for him.

No, it was after the MAB fight. If you're saying that he's the most mediocre titleist in modern day history, then yes, in a way you are saying he's shite. It's quite a statement to make.Especially after you predicted he'd knock Khan out - yes that was after the MAB fight aswell.I don't get how you don't think the Kotelnik fight means anything, yet you was so excited you had to start a thread about Mitchell beating Prescott.

Iv'e already seen how Marquez superior boxing skill is nullified by someone who can box moving backwards.

If anyone can, check out Marquez' fight with Julian Wheeler.

I know it was a 10th round stoppage but trust me, Wheeler was giving Marquez a bit of a boxing lesson before the ref brought on a pretty horrible premature stoppage.

I don't know if Marquez has fought someone who can fight in reverse gear as well since ???

I would say no. Marquez just needs to land a couple of pearls and Khan is scrabbling around like a man on queer street.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jimboogie

Iv'e already seen how Marquez superior boxing skill is nullified by someone who can box moving backwards.

If anyone can, check out Marquez' fight with Julian Wheeler.

I know it was a 10th round stoppage but trust me, Wheeler was giving Marquez a bit of a boxing lesson before the ref brought on a pretty horrible premature stoppage.

I don't know if Marquez has fought someone who can fight in reverse gear as well since ???

---

JMM had only been a pro for 2 years and was nowhere near the fighter, he become. He was actually an aggressive come forward fighter, are you actually using that as an example ? come on mate that is seriously reaching for straws.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ono

No, it was after the MAB fight. If you're saying that he's the most mediocre titleist in modern day history, then yes, in a way you are saying he's shite. It's quite a statement to make.Especially after you predicted he'd knock Khan out - yes that was after the MAB fight aswell.I don't get how you don't think the Kotelnik fight means anything, yet you was so excited you had to start a thread about Mitchell beating Prescott.

---

I never said he would KO Amir Khan, i said maybe he can. I never ever made a comment where i thought Andriy Kotelnik was the favorite, i was just pointing out if he can take the early storm of Amir Khan, maybe he can get to him late, because at that point i'd never seen Amir Khan go 12 rounds.

Come on mate are you honestly picking me up on a comment, i made that long ago ? to be honest i don't think i said anything real different than im saying now, i said Andriy Kotelnik is decent but he is mediocre, there isn't many worst title holders than him in the last decade.

That doesn't mean he's shite that just means, he's not world championship calibre, and he won his title off again one of the worst title holders in the last decade. But i did give Amir Khan credit for going 12 rounds and winning, do you want me to show you that thread ? i don't see whats so wrong about me giving Kevin Mitchell credit.

He hasn't been in the spotlight like Amir Khan, has for quite awhile. And he moved up in weight comeback from injuries, and got a dominant win over a dangerous puncher, who destroyed the fighter you and Bilbo rate highly, so why wouldn't i give him credit ? i don't really know what your getting at.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ICB

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jimboogie

Iv'e already seen how Marquez superior boxing skill is nullified by someone who can box moving backwards.

If anyone can, check out Marquez' fight with Julian Wheeler.

I know it was a 10th round stoppage but trust me, Wheeler was giving Marquez a bit of a boxing lesson before the ref brought on a pretty horrible premature stoppage.

I don't know if Marquez has fought someone who can fight in reverse gear as well since ???

---

JMM had only been a pro for 2 years and was nowhere near the fighter, he become. He was actually an aggressive come forward fighter, are you actually using that as an example ? come on mate that is seriously reaching for straws.

---

Reaching for straws lol Clutching at straws dont you mean mate.

khan handled barrera very well. khan will be able to give marquez a tough fight.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by zbolt

khan handled barrera very well. khan will be able to give marquez a tough fight.

---

A one eyed MAB...

If Marquez gets butted and splits his eye where it makes him one eyed, well then I favor Khan as well. Otherwise Khan will get picked apart. If this fight was to be made it is tailor made for Marquez a masterful counter puncher. Khan is no where ready for that big of a step up.

If Khan was to win it would shut me up and I would never say anything negative about him again only if this fight happens soon, Marquez isnt getting any younger so maybe thats what they are waiting for.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by markb018

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by zbolt

khan handled barrera very well. khan will be able to give marquez a tough fight.

---

A one eyed MAB...

If Marquez gets butted and splits his eye where it makes him one eyed, well then I favor Khan as well. Otherwise Khan will get picked apart. If this fight was to be made it is tailor made for Marquez a masterful counter puncher. Khan is no where ready for that big of a step up.

If Khan was to win it would shut me up and I would never say anything negative about him again only if this fight happens soon, Marquez isnt getting any younger so maybe thats what they are waiting for.

---

you got a point about the age gap. a 23 year old vs. a 36 year old.

Marquez is clearly a more skilled and poised fighter ...even at this stage of his career. That being said...not sure if his "pay day" fight against Floyd was his last hurrah. I am not sold on Khan at all...so until he steps up and fights much better competition (a past prime, one eyed Barrera doesn't count)...he will remain one of those "potential" fighters.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ICB

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ono

No, it was after the MAB fight. If you're saying that he's the most mediocre titleist in modern day history, then yes, in a way you are saying he's shite. It's quite a statement to make.Especially after you predicted he'd knock Khan out - yes that was after the MAB fight aswell.I don't get how you don't think the Kotelnik fight means anything, yet you was so excited you had to start a thread about Mitchell beating Prescott.

---

I never said he would KO Amir Khan, i said maybe he can. I never ever made a comment where i thought Andriy Kotelnik was the favorite, i was just pointing out if he can take the early storm of Amir Khan, maybe he can get to him late, because at that point i'd never seen Amir Khan go 12 rounds.

Come on mate are you honestly picking me up on a comment, i made that long ago ? to be honest i don't think i said anything real different than im saying now, i said Andriy Kotelnik is decent but he is mediocre, there isn't many worst title holders than him in the last decade.

That doesn't mean he's shite that just means, he's not world championship calibre, and he won his title off again one of the worst title holders in the last decade. But i did give Amir Khan credit for going 12 rounds and winning, do you want me to show you that thread ? i don't see whats so wrong about me giving Kevin Mitchell credit.

He hasn't been in the spotlight like Amir Khan, has for quite awhile. And he moved up in weight comeback from injuries, and got a dominant win over a dangerous puncher, who destroyed the fighter you and Bilbo rate highly, so why wouldn't i give him credit ? i don't really know what your getting at.

---

Sorry mate my point wasn't to pick on you specifically. It was more a point of showing how people change their peception of an opponent after Khan beats them. It only relates to you because you said you'd give Khan credit for fighting Maidana (who you've admitted isn't that good - and i agree), Paulie, Holt, etc. I personally don't feel he'd get credit for beating some of them. The 3 main fighters he's get credit for beating would be Bradley, Alexander and Peterson. The rest, it would be too easy to pick out their faults and claim it's not surprising Amir beat them.

It's always been the case with Kahn.

At light Welter, ofcourse.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ICB

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jimboogie

Iv'e already seen how Marquez superior boxing skill is nullified by someone who can box moving backwards.

If anyone can, check out Marquez' fight with Julian Wheeler.

I know it was a 10th round stoppage but trust me, Wheeler was giving Marquez a bit of a boxing lesson before the ref brought on a pretty horrible premature stoppage.

I don't know if Marquez has fought someone who can fight in reverse gear as well since ???

---

JMM had only been a pro for 2 years and was nowhere near the fighter, he become. He was actually an aggressive come forward fighter, are you actually using that as an example ? come on mate that is seriously reaching for straws.

---

Rubbish! He was never an aggressive come forward fighter ???

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Grinch

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ICB

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jimboogie

Iv'e already seen how Marquez superior boxing skill is nullified by someone who can box moving backwards.

If anyone can, check out Marquez' fight with Julian Wheeler.

I know it was a 10th round stoppage but trust me, Wheeler was giving Marquez a bit of a boxing lesson before the ref brought on a pretty horrible premature stoppage.

I don't know if Marquez has fought someone who can fight in reverse gear as well since ???

---

JMM had only been a pro for 2 years and was nowhere near the fighter, he become. He was actually an aggressive come forward fighter, are you actually using that as an example ? come on mate that is seriously reaching for straws.

---

Rubbish! He was never an aggressive come forward fighter ???

---

Yes actually he was its not rubbish at all, i've seen most of his early fights and he was far more aggressive. Im not saying he was an overly aggressive fighter in the same league as someone like Erik Morales or ETC.

But he was alot more aggressive and he come forward far more, and you could see he wasn't nowhere the boxer that he eventually become. But really i don't see what your trying to prove.

JMM had only been a pro for 2 years, and i don't see how thats any type of argument to be honest. JMM in his peak would of clearly had beaten Julian Wheeler, and JMM has clearly beaten some very good boxers. And boxers with movement for example Joel Casamayor.

How many times has a great fighter not looked good, or lost to opponents he would of beaten at his peak ? Henry Armstrong, Manny Pacquiao, Alexis Arguello, ETC.

And to use that fight to say, thats why Amir Khan will beat JMM. Is as Skel picked me up on because i was tired, clutching at straws.