Was Tommy Kimmons being unfair to Quintana?

Now the fight ended in a KO, so it really doesn't matter that much, but it seemed like Quintana was fighting Berto and Referee Tommy Kimmons.

First he knocked Berto down, and Kimmons did not give him credit for it.

Then Berto kept putting his head down, essentially causing Quintana to hit him on the side of the head. WHen Berto complained (which he often did) Kimmons seemed to take him at his word and continually warn Quintana. Thus throwing him off his game plan.


With all of the complaining, I think Berto acted a bit like a bitch. I will be sure to root against him next time.

As much as I wanted Quintana to win, I felt he didn't do crap in there. Sure... Berto complained a bit too much, and the ref seemed a bit trigger happy with Quintana. But Quintana didn't show me squat. Berto was going to win a one-sided decision if he didn't knock Quintana out. Berto would be massacred by any of the elite WW's, but against Quintana he looked world class. I was horribly disappointed in Quintana's performance.

Berto for all his frustrating flaws, was too much for Quintana. It didn't matter who was reffing in there.

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Originally Posted by TitoFan

As much as I wanted Quintana to win, I felt he didn't do crap in there. Sure... Berto complained a bit too much, and the ref seemed a bit trigger happy with Quintana. But Quintana didn't show me squat. Berto was going to win a one-sided decision if he didn't knock Quintana out. Berto would be massacred by any of the elite WW's, but against Quintana he looked world class. I was horribly disappointed in Quintana's performance.

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he actually started out decent, i had him winning the first two rounds, cause he kept jabbing and turning Berto, and well was landing the better shots, but then he chose to stand in front of Berto and well trade, but Berto got the best of it due to speed, but yea he whined like a bitch and held for no reason, and yes the ref sucked ass

Kimmons did an awful job, but it had no real bearing on the outcome of the fight. Berto was always going to beat Quintana because he is a superior fighter.

Berto was playing up from the off and the ref seemed to be right in his pocket. Awful job by the ref.

The old ref was clearly on Berto's side.

Berto complains, Quintana gets told off.
Quintana complains, Quintana gets ignored.

Didn't really affect the outcome though. Not worth raising your blood pressure about.

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Originally Posted by CFH

Kimmons did an awful job, but it had no real bearing on the outcome of the fight. Berto was always going to beat Quintana because he is a superior fighter.

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Your right CFH, refs performance was never gonna help change the outcome, Berto had too much for Quintana, no more no less. But, and the BUT definately stands for me, that only one or two of those shots were on the back of the head and Quintana was jumped on by the ref way quick. Then Berto, who held on the inside almost every single time he got in there. I was shocked when he took a point off Quinatana for hitting behind the head, yet only a couple of rounds ealier I found myself shouting at the screen telling Berto to stop holding, he wasn't warned once for excessive holding, its looks horrible when he does it. If he can't fight on the inside atall, he should either work on improving it or use his ability and speed to be in and out and keep a better range. He stinks with all that holding IMO.

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Originally Posted by themacmagician

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Originally Posted by CFH

Kimmons did an awful job, but it had no real bearing on the outcome of the fight. Berto was always going to beat Quintana because he is a superior fighter.

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Your right CFH, refs performance was never gonna help change the outcome, Berto had too much for Quintana, no more no less. But, and the BUT definately stands for me, that only one or two of those shots were on the back of the head and Quintana was jumped on by the ref way quick. Then Berto, who held on the inside almost every single time he got in there. I was shocked when he took a point off Quinatana for hitting behind the head, yet only a couple of rounds ealier I found myself shouting at the screen telling Berto to stop holding, he wasn't warned once for excessive holding, its looks horrible when he does it. If he can't fight on the inside atall, he should either work on improving it or use his ability and speed to be in and out and keep a better range. He stinks with all that holding IMO.

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He seems to do that ALL the time. Against Urango it was like he took the Hatton blueprint and multiplied it by 3 and did it the entire fight. It's awful to watch. I'm convinced that Berto is a league below the elite in the division. He doesn't show anything new in any of his fights and it's going to show before too long. He's lucky he didn't go through with the Mosley fight.

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Originally Posted by miles

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Originally Posted by themacmagician

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Originally Posted by CFH

Kimmons did an awful job, but it had no real bearing on the outcome of the fight. Berto was always going to beat Quintana because he is a superior fighter.

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Your right CFH, refs performance was never gonna help change the outcome, Berto had too much for Quintana, no more no less. But, and the BUT definately stands for me, that only one or two of those shots were on the back of the head and Quintana was jumped on by the ref way quick. Then Berto, who held on the inside almost every single time he got in there. I was shocked when he took a point off Quinatana for hitting behind the head, yet only a couple of rounds ealier I found myself shouting at the screen telling Berto to stop holding, he wasn't warned once for excessive holding, its looks horrible when he does it. If he can't fight on the inside atall, he should either work on improving it or use his ability and speed to be in and out and keep a better range. He stinks with all that holding IMO.

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He seems to do that ALL the time. Against Urango it was like he took the Hatton blueprint and multiplied it by 3 and did it the entire fight. It's awful to watch. I'm convinced that Berto is a league below the elite in the division. He doesn't show anything new in any of his fights and it's going to show before too long. He's lucky he didn't go through with the Mosley fight.

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I definately agree Miles, and I find it kind of annoying because sometimes he looks like he has all the gifts necessary to be at the top, but the holding, strangely wide stance sometimes, the ease with which he can be hit and his horrible inside work lead me to believe that he also got lucky not facing Mosley.

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Originally Posted by themacmagician

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Originally Posted by miles

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Originally Posted by themacmagician

Your right CFH, refs performance was never gonna help change the outcome, Berto had too much for Quintana, no more no less. But, and the BUT definately stands for me, that only one or two of those shots were on the back of the head and Quintana was jumped on by the ref way quick. Then Berto, who held on the inside almost every single time he got in there. I was shocked when he took a point off Quinatana for hitting behind the head, yet only a couple of rounds ealier I found myself shouting at the screen telling Berto to stop holding, he wasn't warned once for excessive holding, its looks horrible when he does it. If he can't fight on the inside atall, he should either work on improving it or use his ability and speed to be in and out and keep a better range. He stinks with all that holding IMO.

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He seems to do that ALL the time. Against Urango it was like he took the Hatton blueprint and multiplied it by 3 and did it the entire fight. It's awful to watch. I'm convinced that Berto is a league below the elite in the division. He doesn't show anything new in any of his fights and it's going to show before too long. He's lucky he didn't go through with the Mosley fight.

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I definately agree Miles, and I find it kind of annoying because sometimes he looks like he has all the gifts necessary to be at the top, but the holding, strangely wide stance sometimes, the ease with which he can be hit and his horrible inside work lead me to believe that he also got lucky not facing Mosley.

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It's exactly because of his gifts that he hasn't improved on the rest of his game. His handspeed has been the be all, end all solution.....so far. We'll see what happens with someone that can time him effectively.

Back to the original topic. Quintana should have had a knockdown and should not have had a point deduction. If this would have gone to the cards that right there would have been a 2 point swing. It's hard to say if anything further would have happened as the ref because surprisingly uninvolved once Berto took over.

Yeah the ref was bought by the berto camp..but berto would have won anyway..And I agree with Miles..Berto is lucky the earthquakes got him out of the fight with shane because he's not ready for those guys..he should give collazo a rematch before he thinks about SMM PBF PAC..

He also has serious stamina issues. 4th round he was already breathing with his mouth open.

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Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweather

Yeah the ref was bought by the berto camp..but berto would have won anyway..And I agree with Miles..Berto is lucky the earthquakes got him out of the fight with shane because he's not ready for those guys..he should give collazo a rematch before he thinks about SMM PBF PAC..

He also has serious stamina issues. 4th round he was already breathing with his mouth open.

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He looked completely gassed in the middle rounds against Collazo too and got a second wind to finish strong. I have a feeling Berto is gonna be one of those guys that gets old over night, once his physicality slows just a bit he immediately becomes a mediocre fighter in one of the strongest divisions in boxing history.

The knockdown should have been counted and the punches to the side ofthe head were part Bertos fault. That being said, the ones were he got penalized weren't borderline, because Quintana spun Berto and landed a a tap from directly behind. While Berto gets credit for not rolling around on the floor for half an hour like B-hop... He was still making a bigger deal than it needed to be. Seems like he wanted a stage to showcase his skills without risk or objection. If that was the case, he shouldn't have picked a fight with a guy thats a known spoiler. Has he learned nothing from the Collazo fight?
He's above average with physical gifts but as a boxing talent, hes still in the mediocre category. He needs to be coddled by the rules and refs to put on a truly dominant performance. By the middle of the fight, some of the life had already gone out of Quintana by an over active ref and the wrestling and inside fight withe Berto. The thing that stood out to me the most is Quintana got on his bike and started flicking jabs, Berto seemed confused like he didnt have an answer. Berto only tried to counter once Quintana was on his last legs.

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Originally Posted by killersheep

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Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweather

Yeah the ref was bought by the berto camp..but berto would have won anyway..And I agree with Miles..Berto is lucky the earthquakes got him out of the fight with shane because he's not ready for those guys..he should give collazo a rematch before he thinks about SMM PBF PAC..

He also has serious stamina issues. 4th round he was already breathing with his mouth open.

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He looked completely gassed in the middle rounds against Collazo too and got a second wind to finish strong. I have a feeling Berto is gonna be one of those guys that gets old over night, once his physicality slows just a bit he immediately becomes a mediocre fighter in one of the strongest divisions in boxing history.

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I see a Lacy-esque demise for him too. The explosive bursts have become all too predictable.

I didn't think it was a KD, I thought it was behind the ear which as far as I'm concerned is back of the head. However, some of the punches to the back of the head were Berto's fault, but on the same token Quintana deserved to lose the point because he'd been warned twice for it & then threw a petty punch to the back of his head when the ref had told them to break.

As far as the whining, it was annoying, but they were both at it. Kimmons was favouring Berto a bit, but I don't think it was as bad as people are making out. He certainly gave Quintana every opportunity before the stoppage. I think we will see an improvement from Berto from here on out, he had almost a year of ring rust to get rid of, as well as a bicep injury, hence why he stopped throwing the left hook over Quintana's jab which was working well in the 3rd. He looked a much better fighter once he relaxed after the 6th round. Those rounds demonstrated a substantial improvement in technique from the Urango & Collazo fights.

He's actually lucky that he'll be locked out of the upper WW picture for the next year or so. Mayweather, Mosley & Pacquiao will all be fighting each other. I can't see Arum putting Pac in with Berto when he's got a financially more attractive option in Margarito, whilst Mayweather & Mosley will either be fighting each other twice or the winner faces Pacquiao. I think a fight with Clottey, Cotto or the Collazo/Aydin winner would be a good option.

I agree and sorta disagree, it's like the whole floyd elbow, hopkins, whoever cheating that get's complained about. The ref can only see so much. Berto fought that fight the way he's fought all of them and will fight the one's in the future. What he does is wrong but there is no one who's watched boxing more than a week that doesn't expect it. Berto will punch punch then hug you like he's in love, bradley should have a glove on his head cause he uses it like a fist and hopkins just plain cheats.......we already know that, so they gotta figure out another way to win in spite of it. On berto's side quintana was grabbing his arm and punching like crazy too. They could have been broken up a lot more but hey berto still found a way to win quintana could have too.

i saw a knock down in the first round and it is of significant consequence to the fight. quintana is not going to over power or out finess berto. he's the kind of fighter that relies on being awkward, difficult, tough and stubborn enough to throw their better skilled opponent off their game plan with the hope of being able to capitalize on that loss of focus. so berto going down and complaining like a baby WHILE having it called a knock down could start that little chain reaction that could lead to quintana getting lucky and getting the win.

i thought that the ref sucked in general, thank god that it wasn't a more significant fight for example if he would have been the ref in Berto Vs. Mosley

compeltley off topic, but i am scared for berto, i he steps in the ring with anyone names shane, floyd or manny, he makes way to many ametuer mistakes that they would make him pay for in the first two rounds