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Listen to him pontificating now the fucking sancatamonious idiot. He's free he says from his Victorian prison, in isolation where he has shared in the sufferings of so many unfairly convicted prisoners around the world..
Grr why are people taken in by this self important, grandiose knob jockey?
He really grates me, I can't wait for someone to expose all of his shady deals and immoral activities, prick.
Yeah Assange is quite full of himself, he'll get his though.
He makes Tony Blair look humble.Quote:
Originally Posted by El Kabong
Imagine my shock when that fat worthless sack of shit Michael Moore said he would pay for part of Assange's bail. There's not enough bullets for those two bastards.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboHe makes Tony Blair look humble.Quote:
Originally Posted by El Kabong
:vd:
That is all I have to contribute to this thread.
You celebrate what this guy does and why? Because it makes America look bad and to you that is apparently something that vindicates your feelings all along. Well I'm not going to tell you how to feel about America, perhaps my view on politics is a bit too Machiavellian for you, but I live in the real world and shit happens and it's better that it happens to other people in other countries than to America.Quote:
Originally Posted by miles
Assange doesn't care, he just likes being the center of attention, he has no ties to one place or another, he just wants to wield what little power he has, make his money, and be a cult hero.....I don't see it ending well for him though.
How do you know so much about the personality of Assange? Perhaps you are right, but at the same time perhaps you are way off base. I would avoid such assertions as they are irrelevant and avoid the facts. And the facts that matter are what Wikileaks tells us about the abuse of power.Quote:
Originally Posted by El KabongYou celebrate what this guy does and why? Because it makes America look bad and to you that is apparently something that vindicates your feelings all along. Well I'm not going to tell you how to feel about America, perhaps my view on politics is a bit too Machiavellian for you, but I live in the real world and shit happens and it's better that it happens to other people in other countries than to America.Quote:
Originally Posted by miles
Assange doesn't care, he just likes being the center of attention, he has no ties to one place or another, he just wants to wield what little power he has, make his money, and be a cult hero.....I don't see it ending well for him though.
You say I 'celebrate' Assange. I don't think I do. I make no pretence at knowing who he is, but like Chomsky and your friend Michael Moore, he is not afraid to release facts that show the extent of the corruption that is so blatantly apparent in your country. If the facts didn't exist then there would be nothing to reveal. It is the secrecy and lies that kill people, not the release of facts about the powers that be that commit such acts.
Sure, you live in the real world and the real world of your politics is savage and unjust. It isn't the real world of a lot of other far more civilised nations. I would much rather America keep its own savagery within its own borders and leave the rest of the world alone. Maybe then you wouldn't need to be so concerned about an organisation like Wikileaks.
Again, I ask you to please tell me what facts you have learnt as to America's abuse of power from the 250,000 cables released?Quote:
Originally Posted by milesHow do you know so much about the personality of Assange? Perhaps you are right, but at the same time perhaps you are way off base. I would avoid such assertions as they are irrelevant and avoid the facts. And the facts that matter are what Wikileaks tells us about the abuse of power.Quote:
Originally Posted by El KabongYou celebrate what this guy does and why? Because it makes America look bad and to you that is apparently something that vindicates your feelings all along. Well I'm not going to tell you how to feel about America, perhaps my view on politics is a bit too Machiavellian for you, but I live in the real world and shit happens and it's better that it happens to other people in other countries than to America.Quote:
Originally Posted by miles
Assange doesn't care, he just likes being the center of attention, he has no ties to one place or another, he just wants to wield what little power he has, make his money, and be a cult hero.....I don't see it ending well for him though.
You say I 'celebrate' Assange. I don't think I do. I make no pretence at knowing who he is, but like Chomsky and your friend Michael Moore, he is not afraid to release facts that show the extent of the corruption that is so blatantly apparent in your country. If the facts didn't exist then there would be nothing to reveal. It is the secrecy and lies that kill people, not the release of facts about the powers that be that commit such acts.
Sure, you live in the real world and the real world of your politics is savage and unjust. It isn't the real world of a lot of other far more civilised nations. I would much rather America keep its own savagery within its own borders and leave the rest of the world alone. Maybe then you wouldn't need to be so concerned about an organisation like Wikileaks.
#1 Let's just say I know of the type of people who would do what Assange does....I do not think highly of them and I am certain that he has nefarious motivesQuote:
Originally Posted by miles
#2 Well first off Michael Moore is what you accuse Fox News of being, he's a liar and he twists and manipulates the truth until it fits his contorted derranged idea of truth. Chomsky is just a fucking nutjob liberal. So yeah I expect you to hold Assange in the same regard as those guys because you buy what they are selling, that's fine that's a personal choice do as you like.
#3 The US could be a lot more savage...compared to many other nations we're tame and I think we do what we do just to survive and protect our citizens and our standing in the world.
#4 There are weapons that can destroy all the human life on earth...we're bound with other countries in what is at times a very shakey peace, I fail to see how releasing secrets which may hurt us but definently won't help us makes the world a better safer place miles...is that impractical? Is that jumping to conclusions? and does releasing secrets knowing and understanding what I have just mentioned seem like something that will help the world become a better place? I'm trying to place my line of logic in your hands miles....I'm saying Assange COULD release cables that endanger not only America but the entire world we're talking nuclear apocalypse. How does he know that what he releases won't cause any friction between the US and China or Russia or North Korea or Iran etc. As World War I taught us, all it takes is for 2 countries to decide to duke it out and then bang it's World War 3 and it will be a doozy
1. Okay, I will have to take your word on that. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by El Kabong#1 Let's just say I know of the type of people who would do what Assange does....I do not think highly of them and I am certain that he has nefarious motivesQuote:
Originally Posted by miles
#2 Well first off Michael Moore is what you accuse Fox News of being, he's a liar and he twists and manipulates the truth until it fits his contorted derranged idea of truth. Chomsky is just a fucking nutjob liberal. So yeah I expect you to hold Assange in the same regard as those guys because you buy what they are selling, that's fine that's a personal choice do as you like.
#3 The US could be a lot more savage...compared to many other nations we're tame and I think we do what we do just to survive and protect our citizens and our standing in the world.
#4 There are weapons that can destroy all the human life on earth...we're bound with other countries in what is at times a very shakey peace, I fail to see how releasing secrets which may hurt us but definently won't help us makes the world a better safer place miles...is that impractical? Is that jumping to conclusions? and does releasing secrets knowing and understanding what I have just mentioned seem like something that will help the world become a better place? I'm trying to place my line of logic in your hands miles....I'm saying Assange COULD release cables that endanger not only America but the entire world we're talking nuclear apocalypse. How does he know that what he releases won't cause any friction between the US and China or Russia or North Korea or Iran etc. As World War I taught us, all it takes is for 2 countries to decide to duke it out and then bang it's World War 3 and it will be a doozy
2. Okay, so Chomsky is a 'nutjob liberal'. Would you care to explain why?
3. The US could be "a lot more savage"? Well, I'm sure it could. You are the only nation I have known to use nuclear weapons to vaporise people and have killed millions of people the world over and tortured far more through economic deprivation, but sure you could be a lot more savage.
4. If governments didn't try to cover things up, were more open and the media did it's job, there would be no need for an organisation to reveal supposedly secret documents. Government should be about transparency and working in the interests of it population. What we currently have is the opposite. I'm all for any organisation that forces governments to think carefully about what they are doing. Unchecked power is the problem, not Wikileaks. Wars kill hundreds of thousands, these documents simply shed a little light. That's a big difference.
I gave a response in the other thread. My contribution to this thread is officially done. I want to watch the cricket. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboAgain, I ask you to please tell me what facts you have learnt as to America's abuse of power from the 250,000 cables released?Quote:
Originally Posted by milesHow do you know so much about the personality of Assange? Perhaps you are right, but at the same time perhaps you are way off base. I would avoid such assertions as they are irrelevant and avoid the facts. And the facts that matter are what Wikileaks tells us about the abuse of power.Quote:
Originally Posted by El KabongYou celebrate what this guy does and why? Because it makes America look bad and to you that is apparently something that vindicates your feelings all along. Well I'm not going to tell you how to feel about America, perhaps my view on politics is a bit too Machiavellian for you, but I live in the real world and shit happens and it's better that it happens to other people in other countries than to America.Quote:
Originally Posted by miles
Assange doesn't care, he just likes being the center of attention, he has no ties to one place or another, he just wants to wield what little power he has, make his money, and be a cult hero.....I don't see it ending well for him though.
You say I 'celebrate' Assange. I don't think I do. I make no pretence at knowing who he is, but like Chomsky and your friend Michael Moore, he is not afraid to release facts that show the extent of the corruption that is so blatantly apparent in your country. If the facts didn't exist then there would be nothing to reveal. It is the secrecy and lies that kill people, not the release of facts about the powers that be that commit such acts.
Sure, you live in the real world and the real world of your politics is savage and unjust. It isn't the real world of a lot of other far more civilised nations. I would much rather America keep its own savagery within its own borders and leave the rest of the world alone. Maybe then you wouldn't need to be so concerned about an organisation like Wikileaks.
I don't really have an opinion yet. I have the luxury of waiting to determine how I feel.
However, the victorian prison comment sounded so prick-like. Too bad he wasn't in a Somalian prison. :cool:
Besides all that though, the guy is seriously creepy....
I think their could be truth to the charges against him assaulting women...
The dude is like 30 and already has completely silver hair...
My theory is he's some sort of weird Pinocchio type mythological creature who's hair goes more gray each time he assaults a girl in the dark... Like these dark evil deeds turn him weirder and creepier until he's 35 and looking like Golum up there at press conferences saying he's a savior to truth and doesn't do any nasty acts to women....
Well miles I think Chomsky clinches the "nutjob liberal" tag by describing himself as an anarcho-syndicalist and libertarian socialist.
Dizaster, I think Assange is Crispen Glover's long lost brother
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rH6b_lSQst0
...I think I'm going to have nightmares
haha that's funny! That entire video clip has a whole creepy Assange feel to it...Quote:
Originally Posted by El Kabong
I wonder if it's his superhero theme music that he plays right before he hits the upload on one of his Earth shattering leaks...
(and in the background while he touches women)
You cad Sir!Quote:
Originally Posted by El Kabong#1 Let's just say I know of the type of people who would do what Assange does....I do not think highly of them and I am certain that he has nefarious motivesQuote:
Originally Posted by miles
#2 Well first off Michael Moore is what you accuse Fox News of being, he's a liar and he twists and manipulates the truth until it fits his contorted derranged idea of truth. Chomsky is just a fucking nutjob liberal. So yeah I expect you to hold Assange in the same regard as those guys because you buy what they are selling, that's fine that's a personal choice do as you like.
#3 The US could be a lot more savage...compared to many other nations we're tame and I think we do what we do just to survive and protect our citizens and our standing in the world.
#4 There are weapons that can destroy all the human life on earth...we're bound with other countries in what is at times a very shakey peace, I fail to see how releasing secrets which may hurt us but definently won't help us makes the world a better safer place miles...is that impractical? Is that jumping to conclusions? and does releasing secrets knowing and understanding what I have just mentioned seem like something that will help the world become a better place? I'm trying to place my line of logic in your hands miles....I'm saying Assange COULD release cables that endanger not only America but the entire world we're talking nuclear apocalypse. How does he know that what he releases won't cause any friction between the US and China or Russia or North Korea or Iran etc. As World War I taught us, all it takes is for 2 countries to decide to duke it out and then bang it's World War 3 and it will be a doozy
You forced me into visiting Wicki house to look up nefarious.
I try not to look too much into the character of this Assange guy as it bares no influence on what wiki leaks is doing/ providing/ exposing etc.
It's not like he is running for prime minister or some shit. He's on the other side of the fence, he can be who ever the fuck he wants to be. Doesn't change the validity or content of the cables ay?
But for what it's worth, the guy is remarkably weird!
Did any one see his statement upon being released from Bail? He was like ''oh how I have missed the smell of London Air''... And then went to carry on speaking but suddenly realised he hadn't actually demonstrated his love for sniffing the air of London in to his nostrils and so he stopped dead in his tracks. Thought about it and then looked up at the sky and pulled a face like my Cat does when it's trying to ninja-sniff my dinner from a distance. Plonker!
The guy is a fucking bellend in my eyes. 'As I sat in isolation in a Victorian prison I thought about all those other persecuted people languishing in dungeons.....' 'FUCK OFF YOU HUBRISTIC WANKER!!!'.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Grinch
Have you listened to any of the other interviews he has given since? The man doesn't shut up. He takes at least 5 minutes to answer and clearly positively relishes in his role as some kind of bold, heroic destroyer of corruption and proclaimer of the truth.
Looking at him he was obviously a weird, loathed kid who was bullied at school and could have gone one of two way. He could have become some weird, stalker rapist type or serial killer or he could get his feeling of power by trying to take over the world. Either way he's just indulging the kind of childhood fantasies he probably held whilst being forced to eat dogshit off of his fellow pupil's shoes.
Didn't everyone like this guy a few weeks ago?
NoQuote:
Originally Posted by ono
I must admit, I never disapproved of the first big leak they did, that American gunship civilain massacre. I did feel that that was in the public interest for us to at least know about. When you consider the international furore caused by the Israeli's killing Turkish 'peace activist's' in that flotilla incident, this seemed like it should at least merit some discussion and investigation.Quote:
Originally Posted by ono
The trouble with Assange as I see it is that he is not trying to expose a particular corruption or cover ups. Rather he is just on a mission tear back the veil revealing how governments work in private, and showing us any and every discussion and correspondence he can get his hands on.
Nothing is off limits to him, he will just put everything on show whether it details corruption or not, or is in the public interest or not.
I cannot see how a supposedly moral man like Miles can endorse him. If the American government acted this way he would be absolutely disgusted.
I mean didn't he create a thread saying America had 'lost it's mind' because of the x-ray scanners at airports now? He sees that as a gross invasion of privacy, even though no images are recorded, the only person who sees the footage is in a back room away from the check in and never sees the actual passengers, and the American government is responding to a clear and proven risk of terrorism.
He's so hypocritical on the issue.
If Assange was like Daniel Ellsberg, i.e a man of integrity trying to highlight blatent mistruths told to the American people regarding their entry into war with Vietnam, of which he himself had been part, and who was blowing the whistle on the corruption and lies in order to save lives I could get behind him.
But he's not. He has no moral agenda, just a belief that there should be nothing private and confidential or classified in government and that he has the right to steal, or at least be an acomplice to the theft of such classified documents for theft's sake.
What corruption was he trying to unroot and expose when he released these 250,000 cables? As we have seen so far, even Miles admits there is none. So it's not whistle blowing, it's just theft and espionage and in my opinion an act of terrorism purely to satisfy some power trip that he has.
Thanks to him the American government will tighten up its security now, and will exert a more iron grip on the internet much like China does. He has only made things worse, and for what? America actually looks pretty good so far thanks to his releases, which rather hilariously has prompted those who need to slam America at all costs to claim that he was obviously being unwittingly fed information by the CIA who ensured that only cables that were showing America in a good light would be exposed.
So what he has done is the equivilent of police breaking into a house with no search warrant, of an occupant on no charges, and photographed, categorised, itemised all of his household contents, computer and telephone activity etc and publicly revealed it to the world, only for him to have no incriminating evidence against him at all.
Miles would most definitely not approve of police acting in such an unlawful manner yet Assange to his blinkered eyes is acting in an entirely appropriate and moral way.
He is even angry that they are trying to press Bradley Manning to confirm him as an accomplice as if this shows more corruption in America. What does he seriously expect, that America should react positively to a man stealing classified informtion and listen carefully to his admonishments?
Assange is the law breaker here, and he deserves to be treated as such.
I heard somebody hacked into Assange's email and apparently the guy is a sexual deviant...apparently he stalked that 19 year old girl he raped. Of course I haven't seen any of those emails, but I'll check on them.
Well they weren't emails to the girl he allegedly raped, but they were to a 19 year old girl and ....well apparently we've found a guy creepier than Clubber.Quote:
Originally Posted by El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by El KabongWell they weren't emails to the girl he allegedly raped, but they were to a 19 year old girl and ....well apparently we've found a guy creepier than Clubber.Quote:
Originally Posted by El Kabong
haha have you read them! Fuck me, I can't really have a go at him for flirting with near jailbait as for myself it is the dream also, but damn his emails are weird.
He sounds exactly like that weird freak who did the infamous phonecall lecturing some poor girl on how she was passive aggressive for not responding to his advances.
Here's a couple of them.
WikiLeaks boss Julian Assange's 'stalker-style' emails to 19-year-old girl exposed | Mail Online
He does sound like a real knob to fair. I much prefer the Amir Khan seduction technique of 'here's a pic of my knob, wish I wuz inside u baby' approach.
We have a word for guys like Assange in the US.....
NERD!!!!!
The evident cringeworthy awkwardness of the man makes me wonder if he has spent far to long on Internet forums and not enough time socializing in the real world.
If only he knew about boxing, he'd probably be an Old Guard member with 15,000 posts ^-^
No way would a rebel like that be part of the Old Guard. He'd want into the Baggins Clan, where he could play the role he was born to play, Grimer Wormtongue.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Grinch
I would love for Assange to join the Baggin's clan. We could unite together and find all of Sauron's saucy emails to young Orcs.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboNo way would a rebel like that be part of the Old Guard. He'd want into the Baggins Clan, where he could play the role he was born to play, Grimer Wormtongue.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Grinch
I'm really glad as well that the judge completely ignored all of the "celebs" which came out to support Assange...
It was stupid because he wasn't on trial for his Wikileaks stuff, he's on trial for sexual assault...
The judge said it perfectly,,, that none of these celebs even know him personally and would have no idea of his nature and character... Let alone the possibility that he could be a rapist or deviant...
All they supported him for was because they supported Wikileaks and what he does with that...
And that did not impress the judge... He said he could only question their motives because their support for him had nothing to do with the actual case...
It seems judges are getting a little bit harder on celebrities these days... Back 10 - 15 years ago stars would really get looked after... But these days I think judges have little tollerence for stars and their influence,,, and they don't feel they should go easy on these people just because they are celebrities...
Floyd Mayweather the latest one I can think of... Paris how she was let out of jail for home detention, but then a judge overruled it and put her behind bars... I think that's good...
But with Assange, I really hated how our Prime Minister said that they would offer him the utmost support because of him being an Australian Citizen.. And they will make sure he has a laptop to fight his case while in jail...
Well that's bullshit because there have been a tonne of high profile cases of Australians being arrested or jailed overseas and our Government has completely wiped their hands of them and left them for dead... Zero support....
I think whether you agree with Wikileaks or not as a good idea, I think for the right of freedoms if Assange comes up on charges for that, he deserves a tonne of support from a lot of places...
But being charged for rape, he should be given the same support from our government which equals that of any normal Australian citizen being charged for rape overseas.... ZERO...
Bilbo, a government should exist and operate in the interests of the voters who elected them. Take that footage of the helicopter guy shooting dead the Iraqi's and the Reuter's reporters. When you have a war that has already been built upon lies and then show actual footage of actual war crimes being commited, then that is simply revealing to the public the truth of a situation. The media should have been against the war from the start and then when you factor in that the war is not only immoral, but that innocent people are being blown up everyday, well that changes the picture and public sentiment changes. Do you really think that this particular footage should have been allowed to stay hidden by the US government? Bradley Manning did a lot of public good in doing what he did. What he did was undoubtedly criminal, but to reveal truth which the government would much rather conceal? That is a noble and brave act. I am against governments that distort, lie and and ultimately do not act in the interests of their populations. Invading Iraq and murdering civilians has done nothing to protect US citizens. What it has done though is extend the influence of the US elite in the region and it has all been paid for with taxpayer money. That is quite terrible.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboI must admit, I never disapproved of the first big leak they did, that American gunship civilain massacre. I did feel that that was in the public interest for us to at least know about. When you consider the international furore caused by the Israeli's killing Turkish 'peace activist's' in that flotilla incident, this seemed like it should at least merit some discussion and investigation.Quote:
Originally Posted by ono
The trouble with Assange as I see it is that he is not trying to expose a particular corruption or cover ups. Rather he is just on a mission tear back the veil revealing how governments work in private, and showing us any and every discussion and correspondence he can get his hands on.
Nothing is off limits to him, he will just put everything on show whether it details corruption or not, or is in the public interest or not.
I cannot see how a supposedly moral man like Miles can endorse him. If the American government acted this way he would be absolutely disgusted.
I mean didn't he create a thread saying America had 'lost it's mind' because of the x-ray scanners at airports now? He sees that as a gross invasion of privacy, even though no images are recorded, the only person who sees the footage is in a back room away from the check in and never sees the actual passengers, and the American government is responding to a clear and proven risk of terrorism.
He's so hypocritical on the issue.
If Assange was like Daniel Ellsberg, i.e a man of integrity trying to highlight blatent mistruths told to the American people regarding their entry into war with Vietnam, of which he himself had been part, and who was blowing the whistle on the corruption and lies in order to save lives I could get behind him.
But he's not. He has no moral agenda, just a belief that there should be nothing private and confidential or classified in government and that he has the right to steal, or at least be an acomplice to the theft of such classified documents for theft's sake.
What corruption was he trying to unroot and expose when he released these 250,000 cables? As we have seen so far, even Miles admits there is none. So it's not whistle blowing, it's just theft and espionage and in my opinion an act of terrorism purely to satisfy some power trip that he has.
Thanks to him the American government will tighten up its security now, and will exert a more iron grip on the internet much like China does. He has only made things worse, and for what? America actually looks pretty good so far thanks to his releases, which rather hilariously has prompted those who need to slam America at all costs to claim that he was obviously being unwittingly fed information by the CIA who ensured that only cables that were showing America in a good light would be exposed.
So what he has done is the equivilent of police breaking into a house with no search warrant, of an occupant on no charges, and photographed, categorised, itemised all of his household contents, computer and telephone activity etc and publicly revealed it to the world, only for him to have no incriminating evidence against him at all.
Miles would most definitely not approve of police acting in such an unlawful manner yet Assange to his blinkered eyes is acting in an entirely appropriate and moral way.
He is even angry that they are trying to press Bradley Manning to confirm him as an accomplice as if this shows more corruption in America. What does he seriously expect, that America should react positively to a man stealing classified informtion and listen carefully to his admonishments?
Assange is the law breaker here, and he deserves to be treated as such.
And yes, I am against body scanners being used at airports. They violate an individual and presuppose that he/she is a potential terrorist. I am all for individuals maintaining their privacy and being able to live life free of spying and government prying. However, if someone has footage of a friend raping someone and hands it over to the authorities, then that is perfectly justified. What isn't justified is to then have a camera in every home and for the government to tell us that it is for the national good and that it is for our own protection. Bradley Manning commited a crime here, but the US goverment tried to cover up a much bigger crime. It was in the public interest to reveal that footage, just as it is in the public footage to reveal to the police that your friend raped someone.
Bradley Manning did what he did and will pay the penalty for it. He is a criminal, but are those people who shot dead those Iraqi's also suffering the same fate? I bet you the answer is a resounding no. I have absolutely no qualms with moral people deciding to blow the whistle on government corruption, but I do have issues with private citizens being spied on by governments. I do not think spying on Joe Bloggs is in the national interest, but to reveal war crimes certainly is.
It is important to realise that a government is not an individual, but is a vast concentration of power. It needs to be checked. Individuals need protection, governments need accountability.
Well said.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dizaster