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Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
I have just finished watching the HBO documentary "Assault in the Ring" and I am having difficulty in pin pointing the blame for the tragedy of the death of Billy Collins Jnr. Was it Panama Lewis and his crew who messed with Resto's gloves, was it Luis Resto who could have stopped punching the swollen face of Billy knowing his mitts were rigged or was it Billy's dad who stopped his son fighting and gambling his son's future so he could sue the the boxing authorities.
Very good documentary.....Panama Lewis is a cockroach and feel some sympathy towards Resto who was simply a pawn in the murky waters of boxing corruption at its lowest level.....Resto eventually admitted his guilt and hope he can forgive himself and move forward.
Tragedy....which boxing needs to learn from....Margarito v Cotto is a bad example of boxing moving forward and I hope this never happens again but some how I don't think it will.
Job Biscuit (Billy Collins Jnr....RIP)!!!!
eh eh!!!
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
Billy Collins Jr. He the one who drove his car into a ditch.
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
his death was no doubt in part atleast a result of what happened to him in the ring against resto. anyone who cannot connect those dots simply doesnt want to. having said that, resto and lewis DID NOT KILL him, he definitely drove his car all by himself off the road. what happened to him was 1 of the ugliest tragedies i know of in boxing, and i believe lewis and resto should both have served time for that....i beleieve i remember they DID in fact serve time. not only that i believe they both lost their licenses to do what they do. this i think is the proper punishment. i also think resto should have been given the right to box again after a certain time. i see lewis is still minimally involved in boxing. if anything lewis should have been banned for life in every way from boxing, not resto so much.
that story makes me really sick man, like physically nauseous. well dont we have a more modern version of this in margarito vs cotto??? why isnt margarito banned for life? and his trainer too? anybody have any news on that?
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
brocktonblockbust
his death was no doubt in part atleast a result of what happened to him in the ring against resto. anyone who cannot connect those dots simply doesnt want to. having said that, resto and lewis DID NOT KILL him, he definitely drove his car all by himself off the road. what happened to him was 1 of the ugliest tragedies i know of in boxing, and i believe lewis and resto should both have served time for that....i beleieve i remember they DID in fact serve time. not only that i believe they both lost their licenses to do what they do. this i think is the proper punishment. i also think resto should have been given the right to box again after a certain time. i see lewis is still minimally involved in boxing. if anything lewis should have been banned for life in every way from boxing, not resto so much.
that story makes me really sick man, like physically nauseous. well dont we have a more modern version of this in margarito vs cotto??? why isnt margarito banned for life? and his trainer too? anybody have any news on that?
Cuz except for beating Cotto's ass they did nothing wrong
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Cuz except for beating Cotto's ass they did nothing wrong
A little correction here...they were only caught trying to load wraps vs Mosley. Since that is the only proof admisable in the court of law that is why their sentences were so soft because it was based more on "attempt" rather than the actual assault that happened. I like many Cotto fans point to how Margarito has responded since being caught by the authorities and hell you can look at Luis Resto and he lost by KO 3 times in his career and lost 8 times overall and I think the KO's he lost were to fighters of equal or lesser stature as Billy Collins Jr.
I think Antonio Margarito as a boer is 100% finished, I don't want Cotto to fight him again just because of the money Margarito would be making, he's a despicable person and a disgrace to the sport.
As for Billy Collins Jr., his death was due to a number of things #1 He had an addictive personality #2 His father treated him as a prodigy (from Mozart to Pistol Pete Maravich to Todd Marinovich they are RARELY happy) #3 The injuries sustained in the fight with Resto.....that was the icing on the cake. His father's attitude, the beating he took, the prolonged time outside of the ring, that allowed him to drink more and there you have it. It was "the perfect storm" for tragedy.
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
i hope thats true, i havent seen any proof of plaster of paris or there woulda been a lawsuit by now.
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Cuz except for beating Cotto's ass they did nothing wrong
A little correction here...they were only caught trying to load wraps vs Mosley. Since that is the only proof admisable in the court of law that is why their sentences were so soft because it was based more on "attempt" rather than the actual assault that happened. I like many Cotto fans point to how Margarito has responded since being caught by the authorities and hell you can look at Luis Resto and he lost by KO 3 times in his career and lost 8 times overall and I think the KO's he lost were to fighters of equal or lesser stature as Billy Collins Jr.
I think Antonio Margarito as a boer is 100% finished, I don't want Cotto to fight him again just because of the money Margarito would be making, he's a despicable person and a disgrace to the sport.
As for Billy Collins Jr., his death was due to a number of things #1 He had an addictive personality #2 His father treated him as a prodigy (from Mozart to Pistol Pete Maravich to Todd Marinovich they are RARELY happy) #3 The injuries sustained in the fight with Resto.....that was the icing on the cake. His father's attitude, the beating he took, the prolonged time outside of the ring, that allowed him to drink more and there you have it. It was "the perfect storm" for tragedy.
http://www.thescubasite.com/smile/sad/sad0020.gif Sad that you would hate on your fellow American. The man should be allowed to earn a living
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Cuz except for beating Cotto's ass they did nothing wrong
A little correction here...they were only caught trying to load wraps vs Mosley. Since that is the only proof admisable in the court of law that is why their sentences were so soft because it was based more on "attempt" rather than the actual assault that happened. I like many Cotto fans point to how Margarito has responded since being caught by the authorities and hell you can look at Luis Resto and he lost by KO 3 times in his career and lost 8 times overall and I think the KO's he lost were to fighters of equal or lesser stature as Billy Collins Jr.
I think Antonio Margarito as a boer is 100% finished, I don't want Cotto to fight him again just because of the money Margarito would be making, he's a despicable person and a disgrace to the sport.
As for Billy Collins Jr., his death was due to a number of things #1 He had an addictive personality #2 His father treated him as a prodigy (from Mozart to Pistol Pete Maravich to Todd Marinovich they are RARELY happy) #3 The injuries sustained in the fight with Resto.....that was the icing on the cake. His father's attitude, the beating he took, the prolonged time outside of the ring, that allowed him to drink more and there you have it. It was "the perfect storm" for tragedy.
http://www.thescubasite.com/smile/sad/sad0020.gif Sad that you would hate on your fellow American.
The man should be allowed to earn a living
True - just not in a boxing ring.
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bcollins
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Cuz except for beating Cotto's ass they did nothing wrong
A little correction here...they were only caught trying to load wraps vs Mosley. Since that is the only proof admisable in the court of law that is why their sentences were so soft because it was based more on "attempt" rather than the actual assault that happened. I like many Cotto fans point to how Margarito has responded since being caught by the authorities and hell you can look at Luis Resto and he lost by KO 3 times in his career and lost 8 times overall and I think the KO's he lost were to fighters of equal or lesser stature as Billy Collins Jr.
I think Antonio Margarito as a boer is 100% finished, I don't want Cotto to fight him again just because of the money Margarito would be making, he's a despicable person and a disgrace to the sport.
As for Billy Collins Jr., his death was due to a number of things #1 He had an addictive personality #2 His father treated him as a prodigy (from Mozart to Pistol Pete Maravich to Todd Marinovich they are RARELY happy) #3 The injuries sustained in the fight with Resto.....that was the icing on the cake. His father's attitude, the beating he took, the prolonged time outside of the ring, that allowed him to drink more and there you have it. It was "the perfect storm" for tragedy.
http://www.thescubasite.com/smile/sad/sad0020.gif Sad that you would hate on your fellow American.
The man should be allowed to earn a living
True - just not in a boxing ring.
The man should be allowed to earn a living in his skilled profession
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bcollins
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Cuz except for beating Cotto's ass they did nothing wrong
A little correction here...they were only caught trying to load wraps vs Mosley. Since that is the only proof admisable in the court of law that is why their sentences were so soft because it was based more on "attempt" rather than the actual assault that happened. I like many Cotto fans point to how Margarito has responded since being caught by the authorities and hell you can look at Luis Resto and he lost by KO 3 times in his career and lost 8 times overall and I think the KO's he lost were to fighters of equal or lesser stature as Billy Collins Jr.
I think Antonio Margarito as a boer is 100% finished, I don't want Cotto to fight him again just because of the money Margarito would be making, he's a despicable person and a disgrace to the sport.
As for Billy Collins Jr., his death was due to a number of things #1 He had an addictive personality #2 His father treated him as a prodigy (from Mozart to Pistol Pete Maravich to Todd Marinovich they are RARELY happy) #3 The injuries sustained in the fight with Resto.....that was the icing on the cake. His father's attitude, the beating he took, the prolonged time outside of the ring, that allowed him to drink more and there you have it. It was "the perfect storm" for tragedy.
http://www.thescubasite.com/smile/sad/sad0020.gif Sad that you would hate on your fellow American.
The man should be allowed to earn a living
True - just not in a boxing ring.
The man should be allowed to earn a living in his skilled profession
So by your rational Bernard Madoff should have been allowed to continue what he was doing? Margarito cheated, it not only could have cost a fighter their livelihood as a boxer but their LIFE...no sir, Antonio Margarito does not belong in a boxing ring anymore.
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I think all parties should be guilty for the demise of Billy....also why didn't the ref stop the fight when the war was already lost...i mean the kids face was messed up...but i do believe nobody was to blame for the car accident...nobody forced Billy to get drunk and drive that day, it was Billy's final destiny
Job Biscuit (u cannot change the fortune of someones path...it's just the way it goes)!!!
eh eh!!!
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
It has always been interesting to me, the damage done and the resulting furor over padding being removed from the gloves. In the early days, of cousre, there were no gloves, and for years everybody fought with 4oz. gloves. A friend of mine told me that when he made his pro debut in 1969, everybody on the card used the same pair of gloves and they had no padding at all. As late as the early 90s there was a flyweight title fight, with four ounce gloves, and the winner required reconstructive facial surgery and numerous stitches and the loser- an African fighter, tall for the weight but I cannot recall his name- ended up with brain damage and later died, possibly by suicide.
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bcollins
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Cuz except for beating Cotto's ass they did nothing wrong
A little correction here...they were only caught trying to load wraps vs Mosley. Since that is the only proof admisable in the court of law that is why their sentences were so soft because it was based more on "attempt" rather than the actual assault that happened. I like many Cotto fans point to how Margarito has responded since being caught by the authorities and hell you can look at Luis Resto and he lost by KO 3 times in his career and lost 8 times overall and I think the KO's he lost were to fighters of equal or lesser stature as Billy Collins Jr.
I think Antonio Margarito as a boer is 100% finished, I don't want Cotto to fight him again just because of the money Margarito would be making, he's a despicable person and a disgrace to the sport.
As for Billy Collins Jr., his death was due to a number of things #1 He had an addictive personality #2 His father treated him as a prodigy (from Mozart to Pistol Pete Maravich to Todd Marinovich they are RARELY happy) #3 The injuries sustained in the fight with Resto.....that was the icing on the cake. His father's attitude, the beating he took, the prolonged time outside of the ring, that allowed him to drink more and there you have it. It was "the perfect storm" for tragedy.
http://www.thescubasite.com/smile/sad/sad0020.gif Sad that you would hate on your fellow American.
The man should be allowed to earn a living
True - just not in a boxing ring.
The man should be allowed to earn a living in his skilled profession
So by your rational Bernard Madoff should have been allowed to continue what he was doing?
Margarito cheated, it not only could have cost a fighter their livelihood as a boxer but their LIFE...no sir, Antonio Margarito does not belong in a boxing ring anymore.
When?
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bcollins
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Cuz except for beating Cotto's ass they did nothing wrong
A little correction here...they were only caught trying to load wraps vs Mosley. Since that is the only proof admisable in the court of law that is why their sentences were so soft because it was based more on "attempt" rather than the actual assault that happened. I like many Cotto fans point to how Margarito has responded since being caught by the authorities and hell you can look at Luis Resto and he lost by KO 3 times in his career and lost 8 times overall and I think the KO's he lost were to fighters of equal or lesser stature as Billy Collins Jr.
I think Antonio Margarito as a boer is 100% finished, I don't want Cotto to fight him again just because of the money Margarito would be making, he's a despicable person and a disgrace to the sport.
As for Billy Collins Jr., his death was due to a number of things #1 He had an addictive personality #2 His father treated him as a prodigy (from Mozart to Pistol Pete Maravich to Todd Marinovich they are RARELY happy) #3 The injuries sustained in the fight with Resto.....that was the icing on the cake. His father's attitude, the beating he took, the prolonged time outside of the ring, that allowed him to drink more and there you have it. It was "the perfect storm" for tragedy.
http://www.thescubasite.com/smile/sad/sad0020.gif Sad that you would hate on your fellow American.
The man should be allowed to earn a living
True - just not in a boxing ring.
The man should be allowed to earn a living in his skilled profession
So by your rational Bernard Madoff should have been allowed to continue what he was doing?
Margarito cheated, it not only could have cost a fighter their livelihood as a boxer but their LIFE...no sir, Antonio Margarito does not belong in a boxing ring anymore.
When?
He attempted to cheat vs Mosley and was caught.
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bcollins
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Cuz except for beating Cotto's ass they did nothing wrong
A little correction here...they were only caught trying to load wraps vs Mosley. Since that is the only proof admisable in the court of law that is why their sentences were so soft because it was based more on "attempt" rather than the actual assault that happened. I like many Cotto fans point to how Margarito has responded since being caught by the authorities and hell you can look at Luis Resto and he lost by KO 3 times in his career and lost 8 times overall and I think the KO's he lost were to fighters of equal or lesser stature as Billy Collins Jr.
I think Antonio Margarito as a boer is 100% finished, I don't want Cotto to fight him again just because of the money Margarito would be making, he's a despicable person and a disgrace to the sport.
As for Billy Collins Jr., his death was due to a number of things #1 He had an addictive personality #2 His father treated him as a prodigy (from Mozart to Pistol Pete Maravich to Todd Marinovich they are RARELY happy) #3 The injuries sustained in the fight with Resto.....that was the icing on the cake. His father's attitude, the beating he took, the prolonged time outside of the ring, that allowed him to drink more and there you have it. It was "the perfect storm" for tragedy.
http://www.thescubasite.com/smile/sad/sad0020.gif Sad that you would hate on your fellow American.
The man should be allowed to earn a living
True - just not in a boxing ring.
The man should be allowed to earn a living in his skilled profession
So by your rational Bernard Madoff should have been allowed to continue what he was doing?
Margarito cheated, it not only could have cost a fighter their livelihood as a boxer but their LIFE...no sir, Antonio Margarito does not belong in a boxing ring anymore.
When?
He attempted to cheat vs Mosley and was caught.
Big difference between murder and attempted murder. A guy who tried to kill someone but failed can't be called a murderer. Cuz he never succeeded. To call Margarito a cheater is nothing but slander on the mans name. He's never cheated
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Big difference between murder and attempted murder. A guy who tried to kill someone but failed can't be called a murderer. Cuz he never succeeded. To call Margarito a cheater is nothing but slander on the mans name. He's never cheated
When people are caught cheating, it is rarely the first time they have done it. It's just the first time that they have been caught...
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
Simple answer, haven't read the thread or any of the posts in it.
Panama Lewis
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Big difference between murder and attempted murder. A guy who tried to kill someone but failed can't be called a murderer. Cuz he never succeeded. To call Margarito a cheater is nothing but slander on the mans name. He's never cheated
OK so by that rational then the Collins-Resto fight was the first and ONLY time Panama Lewis #1 Applied plaster of paris to his boxer's wraps and #2 Mixed drugs in his fighter's water to help them gain an advantage? I mean it's not like he was officially caught in the Arguello-Pryor match where he asked for the black water bottle "the one I mixed"
In my opinion in BOXING where life is already on the line even when every single safety measure is adhered to, the simple ATTEMPT to cheat by loading wraps should be punishable with a lifetime ban.
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
I'm pretty sure that Panama Lewis removed padding from the gloves, not that he used plaster wraps. He got caught when Coliins Sr. shook hands with Resto and felt that there was no padding in the gloves and he alerted a ringside official.
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
greynotsoold
I'm pretty sure that Panama Lewis removed padding from the gloves, not that he used plaster wraps. He got caught when Coliins Sr. shook hands with Resto and felt that there was no padding in the gloves and he alerted a ringside official.
yep can see that pretty clearly in the vid i posted ;)
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
greynotsoold
I'm pretty sure that Panama Lewis removed padding from the gloves, not that he used plaster wraps. He got caught when Coliins Sr. shook hands with Resto and felt that there was no padding in the gloves and he alerted a ringside official.
And I'm pretty sure Luis Resto said Panama also put plaster of paris wraps on his hands.
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bcollins
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Cuz except for beating Cotto's ass they did nothing wrong
A little correction here...they were only caught trying to load wraps vs Mosley. Since that is the only proof admisable in the court of law that is why their sentences were so soft because it was based more on "attempt" rather than the actual assault that happened. I like many Cotto fans point to how Margarito has responded since being caught by the authorities and hell you can look at Luis Resto and he lost by KO 3 times in his career and lost 8 times overall and I think the KO's he lost were to fighters of equal or lesser stature as Billy Collins Jr.
I think Antonio Margarito as a boer is 100% finished, I don't want Cotto to fight him again just because of the money Margarito would be making, he's a despicable person and a disgrace to the sport.
As for Billy Collins Jr., his death was due to a number of things #1 He had an addictive personality #2 His father treated him as a prodigy (from Mozart to Pistol Pete Maravich to Todd Marinovich they are RARELY happy) #3 The injuries sustained in the fight with Resto.....that was the icing on the cake. His father's attitude, the beating he took, the prolonged time outside of the ring, that allowed him to drink more and there you have it. It was "the perfect storm" for tragedy.
http://www.thescubasite.com/smile/sad/sad0020.gif Sad that you would hate on your fellow American.
The man should be allowed to earn a living
True - just not in a boxing ring.
The man should be allowed to earn a living in his skilled profession
So by your rational Bernard Madoff should have been allowed to continue what he was doing?
Margarito cheated, it not only could have cost a fighter their livelihood as a boxer but their LIFE...no sir, Antonio Margarito does not belong in a boxing ring anymore.
When?
He attempted to cheat vs Mosley and was caught.
Big difference between murder and attempted murder. A guy who tried to kill someone but failed can't be called a murderer. Cuz he never succeeded. To call Margarito a cheater is nothing but slander on the mans name. He's never cheated
He got caught in his own locker room. His hands were already wrapped illegaly. That right there, is presently cheating. And the past tense of "cheating" is CHEATED.
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Re: Who was to blame for Billy Collins Jnr's Death?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bcollins
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Violent Demise
Cuz except for beating Cotto's ass they did nothing wrong
A little correction here...they were only caught trying to load wraps vs Mosley. Since that is the only proof admisable in the court of law that is why their sentences were so soft because it was based more on "attempt" rather than the actual assault that happened. I like many Cotto fans point to how Margarito has responded since being caught by the authorities and hell you can look at Luis Resto and he lost by KO 3 times in his career and lost 8 times overall and I think the KO's he lost were to fighters of equal or lesser stature as Billy Collins Jr.
I think Antonio Margarito as a boer is 100% finished, I don't want Cotto to fight him again just because of the money Margarito would be making, he's a despicable person and a disgrace to the sport.
As for Billy Collins Jr., his death was due to a number of things #1 He had an addictive personality #2 His father treated him as a prodigy (from Mozart to Pistol Pete Maravich to Todd Marinovich they are RARELY happy) #3 The injuries sustained in the fight with Resto.....that was the icing on the cake. His father's attitude, the beating he took, the prolonged time outside of the ring, that allowed him to drink more and there you have it. It was "the perfect storm" for tragedy.
http://www.thescubasite.com/smile/sad/sad0020.gif Sad that you would hate on your fellow American.
The man should be allowed to earn a living
True - just not in a boxing ring.
The man should be allowed to earn a living in his skilled profession
So by your rational Bernard Madoff should have been allowed to continue what he was doing?
Margarito cheated, it not only could have cost a fighter their livelihood as a boxer but their LIFE...no sir, Antonio Margarito does not belong in a boxing ring anymore.
When?
He attempted to cheat vs Mosley and was caught.
Big difference between murder and attempted murder. A guy who tried to kill someone but failed can't be called a murderer. Cuz he never succeeded. To call Margarito a cheater is nothing but slander on the mans name. He's never cheated
Coz he would be much more likely to have chosen to tamper with his gloves for the 1st time against a 38 year old Mosely rather than a 32-0 Cotto :confused: Nothing is proven, but highly unlikely that after 42 fights and having fought Willaims, Cintron and Cotto that he would then chose to start playing with wraps.
