http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_zwCiGEl44#ws
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Nice video, good to see Floyd get some props. Good point on how his bob and weave throws opponents off balance.
Yeah, Andre Ward has a more obvious version of it.
Nice video.
He rolls that shoulder and deflects shots with his forearm better than anyone of this generation.
I enjoyed the breakdown of his style. A professional who is a friend of mine and loves Mayweather commented on this video, "I love Floyd but he never commits to his punches anymore". I think there is truth in that. Here is Pacquiao's imitation of Floyd, kind of funny:
http://youtu.be/clKb1scva0Y
Yeah that videos about a year old. Manny's imitation of Floyd.. give me a break. Funny in an I'm ignorant kind of way. Who's this friend? Floyd with brittle hands. Same song and dance since he fought at 135.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gocougars3
I'd seen this vid a while back and the first thing I thought was Manny must realises that Mayweather 'having his legs' is the single biggest thread to Manny.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gocougars3
Quite revealing. Manny is STRONG on his feet and so the last thing Manny want's is a Mayweather who can break off anytime he fees like.
I think there is are more subtle differences between Floyd at these other guys. Sure he changes his guard, and can roll around punches, but it's his ability to move and roll that really separates him from a guy like James Toney. Even Hopkins who isn't as slick as Toney, nor as athletic is harder to hit because he learned to move while rolling that front shoulder. Mayweather also likes to have one punch that dictates the range, he really uses his jab against orthodox fighters to keep his opponent on the defensive and to control space, while he uses his right hand vs southpaws and it was especially evident against Judah. Floyd doesn't try to outspeed fast opponents, he simply tries to bottle them up. He puts enough pressure that they feel pressed, but that he is still defensively in tact.
As for his punching power, I think Floyd has actually been hitting harder as of late. Recently he stunned a much larger Oscar on multiple occasions, he stopped Hatton before anyone else did, he knocked down Marquez and took his heart away, and he also stunned iron chinned Mosley multiple times. A few reasons why Floyd isn't going to stop guys regularly at welterweight.
1. He isn't a real welterweight, he is still much smaller than a real welterweight, Victor Ortiz is evidence of this. Floyd barely weighs over 150 pounds when he steps in the ring at this point in his career. He roughly had the same weight disadvantage against OScar that Pacquiao had against MArgarito. For a guy that isn't a huge puncher, that is big factor.
2. He doesn't have flowing combinations. Sure they are quick, but every punch he throws has specific intent on it. Even in combinations every punch is thrown with the same technique as if it was by itself. This takes a little speed off his combinations, and it doesn't allow for the same power transfer from one punch to another. It also gives the opponent a split second more to adjust to the next punch coming. THey may not block it, but they can prepare for it. Whereas a Pacquiao is punching so fluidily and always changing angles that many of his punches catch opponents blind, while Floyd uses strategic angles, he doesn't often throw punches that an opponent won't see coming.
3. He falls in behind his right hand. I really wish he would find a way to follow up after the right hand, but Floyd kind of leaps in, to a) close a larger gap b) fall into the opponent and stop them from throwing back. Now that works in terms of winning a fight and not getting it, but if he stepped in a little more confidently then pushed off his back foot for counter balance while twisting to his left hip, he would stay in balance and still be able to get shots off after he landed a big right hand. Against De La Hoya he kind of pot shotted because Oscar jab was stuffing his cross lane, but against Marquez and Mosley he couldn't follow up his rights hand because he falls into the opponent and he needs to regain balance with his right foot. Guys like Andre Ward and Pacquiao in particular have learned how to throw their jab after the right hand, further propelling that back leg forward, also allowing them to continue closing the distance on opponents while still throwing pnches. Now there are much better ways of doign this, but it's a start and would allow Floyd to keep his combinations going, while staying in better balance. Against Mosley he was commiting so well to his cross that he didn't need to worry about immediate retaliation, if he throws the cross through his opponent enough, they won't be able to get out of its way and counter over it, but that doesn't mean he should continue to fall in. He needs to step in more in the first place.
Anyways, there are so many pros and cons to his style like anyone elses, All in all he is the a best fighter I've ever seen, but there are a lot of things he could learn from other fighters who mix things up a little more offensively. He will have a very hard time trying to stand and time Pacquiao or Amir Khan, their styles are built to counter that specifically. They commit like I was saying with everything and that doesn't allow you the time to counter or set up because of they are in such good condition they just come in continual waves.
Nice.
I still see Floyd being able to adapt distance and disrupt their shots on the way in or their balance on the withdraw to give himself more time to deal with them; more than other straight fighters or counter punchers can do.
Some people specially as you get older you just cant outgun, so you disrupt their patterns and timing and shoot at your distance not theirs in between the off beat you just created.
I think he is till nimble enough and sharp of mind enough to break their styles up into sections and adjust it into his own fight and win on points.
Ah thats a great vid :cool:.Thnaks Jim hadnt seen that before,going to have to watch that a few times to read what he's saying,instead of being fixed on the action.
Wish I knew Spanish.
Love the way he utilizes his elbows and stays put so he is dealing with the storm from within the eye.
Also those little disruptive taps he places onto others arms during combos to pull the power out of them when he is caught on the ropes.
A minimalist master.
the vid was funny hahaha...
There is another vid that highlights Floyd's use of head inside to keep his opponent off balance. Need to find that one...
*** Edit***
Can this be moved on the the main board?
Just gonna ask why you posted it in that board
In terms of the sweet science, I don't think it gets any better than Floyd. A true sports virtuoso.
As for Manny, hindsight is 20/20. Maybe he should have looked into some of that defense. I've never seen Floyd layed out on the canvas for a 10 count before, let alone 3 times like Manny.
Manny is a different person. Manny never had the unique privileges that Floyd enjoyed growing up around boxers, practically in the gym, under his father and uncle's tutelage. Pacquiao came to boxing later and fights with the same hunger that got him off the street. It may not be as pretty but it has taken him a long way. As for Floyd not losing or never having been knocked down that is a testament to his defensive skills but also a product of what is often a safety first style. There are fighters better than Floyd with losses and KO's on their record and every time somebody tries to pull that out like a trump card it kind of cheapens their logic for me. Floyd has 26 KO's in 46 fights, Manny has 38 in 61 so at a KO percentage of 61 and 64% there does not seem to be a huge difference between them but Styles will dictate that Pacquiao has always put himself in more precarious and dangerous situations than Floyd. If either changed their styles drastically they would not be as successful, it's what makes them the fighters they are.Quote:
Originally Posted by Beanflicker
Great video
Shame manny didnt use that shoulder roll against marquez fist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gocougars3
Name them. I'm sure Duran is one of them. The guy who quit in the middle of a championship fight because he had a tummy ache and he was getting made to look foolish by a superior boxer. Or Tommy Hearns, the guy with no chin and had NO IDEA what to do when he got rocked. Yeah, those guys were much better than Mayweather.Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenbeanz
Not forgetting his embarrassing loss to Kirkland Laing.Quote:
Originally Posted by BeanflickerName them. I'm sure Duran is one of them. The guy who quit in the middle of a championship fight because he had a tummy ache and he was getting made to look foolish by a superior boxer. Or Tommy Hearns, the guy with no chin and had NO IDEA what to do when he got rocked. Yeah, those guys were much better than Mayweather.Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenbeanz
Hey that give's me an idea :D
Honestly, i dont know who is better or worse than floyd.
I know he is the best of THIS era but comparing to other past legends has tired me out as guys like leonard and hearns were great in other ways, never quit and have cemented themselves in history.
If floyd looses to canelo does that make what he has achieved any better or worse.?
He is just fighting whoever that gets in front of him and winning..what more can he do.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeanflickerName them. I'm sure Duran is one of them. The guy who quit in the middle of a championship fight because he had a tummy ache and he was getting made to look foolish by a superior boxer. Or Tommy Hearns, the guy with no chin and had NO IDEA what to do when he got rocked. Yeah, those guys were much better than Mayweather.Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenbeanz
If you are SURE Duran is one of them then there is no point in me naming them. That is the crux of the Problem with some people. You can admire Floyd's ability and style but unless you agree he is the greatest boxer of all time you are classed as a hater. He is not Jesus ffs grow up.
Jesus lost to some journeymen to, and his claims were a lot more deluded than Floyds. Yet nobody ever picks his resume apart the same way. Maybe since he wasn't American he gets a pass. It's pathetic.
Classic Example. Even the idea that somebody could consider someone to be better than Floyd is greeted with derision. Thinking there are better fighters who may have losses on their record has nothing to do with picking apart Floyd's resume. It is a subjective opinion. The fact that fighters from other eras are considered by many to be better than Floyd is not evidence that all those people are bitter Floyd haters but rather that those people have been more impressed by the all round ability, styles and resumes of others. Floyd is fighting now and they are not so it is not a quantifiable judgement it is an opinion that people are entitled to have. Your right it really is pathetic that not worshipping at the altar of FMJ is seen as boxing blasphemy. :-\Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Oh my bad, I thought you meant Jesus Chavez :vd:Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenbeanzClassic Example. Even the idea that somebody could consider someone to be better than Floyd is greeted with derision. Thinking there are better fighters who may have losses on their record has nothing to do with picking apart Floyd's resume. It is a subjective opinion. The fact that fighters from other eras are considered by many to be better than Floyd is not evidence that all those people are bitter Floyd haters but rather that those people have been more impressed by the all round ability, styles and resumes of others. Floyd is fighting now and they are not so it is not a quantifiable judgement it is an opinion that people are entitled to have. Your right it really is pathetic that not worshipping at the altar of FMJ is seen as boxing blasphemy. :-\Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
I think there are two reasons why FLoyd doesn't always commit to his punches. 1) His hands are brittleQuote:
Originally Posted by Gocougars3
2) he always has defense in mind..
If you throw punches with conviction and miss, you leave yourself that much more vulnerable to counter shots and we would probably see Floyd getting hit alot more ..
By not putting alot into your punch, you have more time to react to counters and this is where hit without getting hit comes into play
Floyd is probably the most defensive minded fighter out there so him pulling punches is totally understandable and that's what makes his style so effective..
You've got to admit though.. If Floyd doesn't accept that Jesus christ is better than him, you'd think most of his opponents would have a big edge over him. Unless Jesus is over rated just like all the other old timers around here. All I was saying.
Jesus christ is the p4p greatest of all time and floyd wouldnt last ten seconds against the true "gods son"Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Complete mismatch.
Andre Ward would kick your arses for this blasphemy! :mad:
I kinda miss Taeth. Always went super deep on boxing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
tbe!!!!!
^Unlike this guy.Quote:
Originally Posted by ruthless rocco
I'd bet all the Mayweathers studied this man and quite literally molded Floyd around his style.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7_LVLmOnLM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tx0oAdtSXi8
Any clue why Benton liked to catch the left hook then hook himself while Floyd prefers to roll with the right and shoot the right? I often wonder why each doesn't do more of the other.Quote:
Originally Posted by IamInuit
I think rolling a right and countering gives more access to in-built defence, therfore making it safer. I think catching left hooks makes you vulnerable to head body hooks, you know, Hatton style.
Floyd uses a wider stance and tries to maintain distance. It is hard to roll inside a hook and hook back with wide feet because it takes to long.
When you think about the hand operations early on,you can see when and where he got more careful then smarter and against the opposition over those weights for this long really you got him the nod of approval.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gocougars3
Good observation and I wish I could find another great vid of Benton that I used to have where he most definitely does both. You know I dont see anyone ever getting any better with that style then Floyd. I actually think he's perfected it to the point where nobody could get anymore out of it unless the species grew another limb. I always thought Floyd fought more similar to Toney then Benton and Sweet Pea more like Benton. Interesting that George trained them both. Its as if the Mayweathers took the best of all those guys and created a unique style. But that Philly shell as its often referred to was most definitely brought to prominence by Mr. Benton RIP.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Swanson
Makes sence. Like the hook is effective but also a risk so pass on opportunity to avoid the risk knowing you have enough without taking that chance. It makes me wonder about the "plan B" that is always mentioned from the gym. Everyone says he opens up more, perhaps this is an attack left in the gym. I hope some day the gym footage is released. I'm probably a sucker but I'd pay to see an aggressive Mayweather.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimanuel Boogustus
Sometimes I picture the Mayweathers slipping into a quiet room and their speech patterns changing, suddenly each is eloquent and sophisticated. In this image they laugh about the trick they have pulled, that they are all so clever but everyone thinks they are crackheads. I know they are as awful as they seem but they clearly know boxing inside and out. I can't rationalize educated men studying the sport for a lifetime and not "getting it" but these dopes understanding every nuance. It's easier for me to imagine it is prestige.Quote:
Originally Posted by IamInuitGood observation and I wish I could find another great vid of Benton that I used to have where he most definitely does both. You know I dont see anyone ever getting any better with that style then Floyd. I actually think he's perfected it to the point where nobody could get anymore out of it unless the species grew another limb. I always thought Floyd fought more similar to Toney then Benton and Sweet Pea more like Benton. Interesting that George trained them both. Its as if the Mayweathers took the best of all those guys and created a unique style. But that Philly shell as its often referred to was most definitely brought to prominence by Mr. Benton RIP.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Swanson
you don't have to understand it... but you can surely recognize it as TBE!!!!